Step into history with ‘America’s Veteran Stories’ as Kim Munson takes you on a journey through time with firsthand accounts from World War II and Vietnam. Experience the undaunted spirit of America’s veterans, whose lives echo the trials of war and triumphs of survival. Learn about the dedicated efforts to preserve the memories of these warriors through initiatives like the Marine Memorial in Golden, Colorado. In this episode, Kim speaks with Tom Jacobs and C.R. Cusack, whose vivid recollections from Vietnam paint a picture of wartime courage and brotherhood. Tom’s harrowing experiences in the Marine Corps not only highlight
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and stand for liberty. We must never forget them. Welcome to America’s Veteran Stories with Kim Munson. These stories will touch your heart, inspire you, and give you courage. We stand on the shoulders of giants. Here’s Kim Munson.
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And welcome to America’s Veterans Stories with Kim Munson. Be sure and check out our website. That is AmericasVeteransStories.com. And this show precipitated from a trip that I took in 2016 with a group that accompanied four D-Day veterans back to Normandy, France, for the 72nd celebration of our anniversary of the D-Day landings, ultimately to free Europe from Hitler and the Nazis. returned back stateside realizing that each individual story is unique. It needs to be heard. It needs to be archived. It needs to be saved. Hence, America’s Veterans Stories. I am thrilled to have on the line with me Paula Sarles, who is a Vietnam-era Marine veteran. She’s a Gold Star wife, as well as Marine veteran Tom Jacobs. And we’re going through this book, Echoes of Our War, Vietnam Veterans Reflect 50 Years Later. Colonel Bob Fisher compiled this book and had 10 Vietnam veterans, uh, write a chapter. And we’re going through this and, and having each of these guys as our guests, but Paula Sarles, uh, you have on your heart to get this Marine Memorial remodeled out here in golden Colorado. Tell us how people can help you.
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Well, I’m very excited to say that the proceeds of the book will help us with the remodel project. And, um, the memorial was very prominent on the scene when it was built, but it’s been overbuilt around it, and we want to bring it back to its glory and be as prominent as it should be on the landscape and to make it the spectacular sight that Milling’s and the rest of our service members deserve.
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And people can buy a brick. Yeah, they can buy a brick that will be in the walkways there at the Marine Memorial, as well as if people take the Echoes Challenge and go to usmcmemorialfoundation.org. and contribute to the individual that contributes the most will receive a signed copy by all of the authors of the book echoes of our war and i tell you paula i really think every high schooler every college student every one of us should be reading this book one other quick thing i i think uh… buying your loved one your father A brick, whether or not they were a Marine, there is also the walk of service, is a great Father’s Day gift. And when you were in studio last week, I bought a brick for my father who served in the United States Air Force. And when I told him and when I told my mother, they were absolutely thrilled and honored. So I would highly recommend this as a Father’s Day gift. And if people purchase that by the end of May, they’ll have their certificate in time for Father’s Day, correct? Yes.
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Right, and it’s a beautiful certificate with a picture of the brick on it, and it’s suitable for framing as a gift or whatever.
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Very nice. And it’s important to help you with this work that you’re doing. And, Paula, I know the reason that you’re doing this or one of the reasons that you’re doing this is on the line with us right now, and that is Tom Jacobs, and he served in the United States Marine Corps. Tom, welcome to the show.
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Thank you very much.
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Now, your chapter, Chapter 9 in the book of Echoes of Our War, A Dance with Death. And you begin your chapter with Teddy Roosevelt’s famous, famous quote about being in the arena. So where should we start, Tom Jacobs?
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Okay. On the man in the arena? Is that what you’re speaking of?
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Well, I just said that you quoted Teddy Roosevelt and his quote on the man in the arena. You were in the arena. You were in the Vietnam War. Where do you want to start with listeners to understand your story?
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Well, just a brief statement about where I was born, when I was born, and how my generation viewed that war. I think I was born in 1946 and in Chicago. Had a wonderful life during the 50s and 60s. Went to college one semester in 1964. It just wasn’t for me at that time. And I joined the Marine Corps. My time in the Marine Corps, I loved. Sometimes, as an all-serviceman, you know, you wish you had never done anything. You know, you wish you were a civilian again. But overall, the Marine Corps made me the man I am today with values and justice. how human beings should treat human beings. It just made me a better man overall. I started out, went to MCRD in San Diego, and then I joined the 2nd Marine Division in Camp Lejeune in 1966 and was on a float, days to Cuba. I was in Cuba about five or six months. And what we did there was guard defense lines. I was on a reactionary team, which was four individuals, one NCO, usually a corporal, and one individual that spoke Spanish. a marine that spoke Spanish, and then two riflemen, myself and someone else. And what we did was set up in the mangrove swamps among the towers along the fence line. And if anyone tried to get across the fence line from Cuba into Guantanamo Bay, we were not allowed to help them. But once they came over, got over the fence, uh we uh protected them and took them back to s2 intelligent intelligence and so that’s what i did in cuba for five or six months and came back and then and just a question tom jacobs why were people trying to get to guantanamo bay well i’ll tell you one quick story that was uh We were set up, and someone spotted there was about a 200-yard DMZ between the Cuban fence and our fence. And this kind of brought reality to me as a young man. We got a call that two individuals were running through the mangroves to get to the fence. And we met with them, and while they were trying to get over this cyclone fence with some barbed wire on the top, one of the individuals was shot through the leg, but he got over. The funny thing about this was this kid was 17 years old, and he had fled a sugar cane prison camp north of Havana and made that trek which, gosh, I would think was maybe 600 miles to get down to Guantanamo to get into an American zone. He wanted so much to get out of Cuba, and he was 17. And I thought, my gosh, this guy, this kid is younger than my little brother and all the crap that he had gone through. And fortunately, we got debriefed and everything, and he was fine, and he made it through. That really kind of opened my mind to how people lived throughout the world. A lot of people think everyone lives like they do in the United States. And that time, as a 19-year-old, I realized, man, There are some terrible things going on in the world that I wasn’t fully aware of. And so anyway, got that.
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Yeah, those things still go on. And the quest for freedom is really, really strong. And that’s a remarkable story. So let’s continue on. Where do you go after Cuba?
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Well, I go back to Camp Lejeune, and then I got orders to Vietnam. Got to Vietnam in July of 1977 and joined the 1st Battalion, 4th Marines, 3rd Marine Division, which was located up on the – the 3rd Marine Division was up on the DMZ for the most part. And so I joined the 4th Marines, and I joined them in – in uh oh gosh i can’t remember the uh but anyway i joined bravo company first time fourth marines and and we were in the ashaw valley when i i joined them and um you know ran patrols you know in the in the jungle of ashaw valley i think the biggest change for me was uh We got sent to an operation called Operation Granite that was west of Fubai in a place called Camp Evans is where we set up. And this whole scenario changed my life and my way of thinking. We went on an operation of which there were three battalions, one Marine battalion, an Arvin group, and then our battalion. And we were the spearhead going up a mountain, Bill 674, and to make it short, we got ambushed. And unfortunately, or fortunately for everyone else, we were the lead, we were the point platoon of three battalions and we as it states in the book you know we came up a mountain trail which on our left was a 40-foot ravine and then about 12 12 feet uh the trail was about 12 feet and on the other side was the mountain going up and the nba caught us in a in a an L-shaped ambush, and three machine gunners on point, two A gunners and a machine gunner, and they turned this dogleg to the right and sensed something was wrong, and they started to recon by fire, and the MDA opened up down that dogleg with like a .30 caliber and killed all three guys on point. Well, right behind them was my squad, the Thunderbolts, and our main objective now that the ambush started, and there were NVA shooting from our left across this ravine. They were about 25 to 30 yards away from us, and we were caught on a trail where you couldn’t jump off the side because you’re now 40 feet, and you were backed up against a mountain. And it’s funny, there’s only one article that was ever written about this. But what had happened was we all knew that we had to gain the machine gun back for fire superiority to get out of the kill zone that we were in. And my lieutenant, myself, and two other men from my fire team took our packs off, and we were running. We were supposed to run up the trail and gain possession of the machine gun, the M60. Well, we got up and probably ran five feet, and they cut all of us down. They killed Merrick Pierce, and then the lieutenant was shot through the side of his canteen. And he went down, and I was next, and they missed me for some reason. And then Paul Betts behind me was just riddled with machine guns, and he was dead. So what happened was we had a…
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Tom, let’s go to break. This is so important. I need to take a break quickly on this, and we’ll be right back with Tom Jacobs. He’s a Marine veteran, Vietnam War, telling us this important story. Before we do that, though, Castle Cake Knife and Tool is one of the great sponsors that brings this show to you. They are located in Sedalia, Colorado. They are a family-owned business. And check out castlegate.com for more information. They have knives from the best blade makers from throughout the world. So whether or not you’re a chef, a collector, a sportsman, Castlegate Knife and Tool is the place for you. They do offer a 10% discount all day long, every day, to our military personnel, our veterans, and our first responders. We will be right back with Paula Sarles and Tom Jacobs.
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RE-MAX realtor Karen Levine helps bring to life the individual stories of our servicemen and women. With her sponsorship of America’s Veteran Stories with Kim Munson, Karen honors the sacrifices of our military and is grateful for our freedom. As a member of the National Association of Realtors Board of Directors, Karen works to protect private property rights for all of us. Karen has a heart for our active duty military and veterans and is honored to help you buy or sell your home. Call Karen Levine at 303-877-7516 to help you navigate buying or selling your home. That’s 303-877-7516.
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All of Kim’s sponsors are an inclusive partnership with Kim and are not affiliated with or in partnership with KLZ or Crawford Broadcasting. If you would like to support the work of The Kim Munson Show and grow your business, contact Kim at her website, kimmunson.com. That’s kimmunson, M-O-N-S-O-N dot com.
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Welcome back to America’s Veteran Stories with Kim Munson. Be sure and check out our website. That is AmericasVeteranStories.com. And we are talking with Paula Sarles. She is a Vietnam-era Marine veteran. She’s raising money to help remodel the memorial out here in Golden, Colorado. How can people help you out on that, Paula?
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Well, they can buy a brick, or they can participate in the Echoes Challenge for the Echoes of Our War book and make a donation at the site. And it’s usmcmemorialfoundation.org. If you buy a brick, you get a great certificate for your father’s day. It would be a great gift.
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It’s a great gift. I got one for my father. Okay, let’s continue on. Tom Jacobs is on the line, a Marine veteran, Vietnam veteran. and he contributed a chapter in the book, Echoes of Our War. Tom, continue on. You said that you were going to try to get the machine gun and actually, out of the four guys, two of them were killed and one of them was injured, and somehow they missed you. Do I have that correct?
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That’s correct.
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Okay, take it from there.
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Well, a fellow named Vincent Matthews, who was… Wasn’t really part of our platoon, but he was a rocket man assigned to us. In other words, he fired laws and kind of like little bazookas. Well, he came running up and through this kill zone and fired three laws into the emplacement that the North Vietnamese were. And he got the machine gun and started running back. And it gave us some time to try to move out of the kill zone. To make a long story short, it was about a 12-hour ambush, according to the historical documents that were written. Operation Granite, we finally got down to the bottom of the hill. There were only three people left from my squad. John Quinn, Sergeant John Estes, and myself. During that operation, there were, according to records, there was 103 Marines wounded, 26 or 27 that were killed, and three more that died later. It was a horrific day for me, for any 20-year-old kid. Anyway, we survived. I became a squad leader because I was a Lance Corporal. I was the highest ranking guy in my platoon that was left that wasn’t wounded or killed. And so I became a corporal and became a squad leader. And, you know, from November, December, January, it was just we were back up on the DMZ. patrolling, et cetera, et cetera. And then to make things short, in Tet of 68, on February 22nd, I was at a place called C2, which was just a little bit south of Can Thien and the border of North Vietnam. And I went out at like 2.30 in the morning and was checking my men in their fighting holes. And I was a rocket or artillery or something came in. And next thing I knew, I was up in the air and down in the ground. And I didn’t realize I was hit. I checked the man that I was checking on and he had been wounded. So adrenaline just rushed in and I jumped out of the hole. and started running for the command post to get a corpsman to help one of my members of my squad. And when I got to the bunker, I got shot and then fell in the knee. And my lieutenant and a corpsman pulled me down into the bunker. After that, for some reason, they couldn’t get me medevaced until the 25th of February, the morning of the 25th. And I was hit on the 22nd. I have no idea why I was medevaced quickly, because usually they get you out pretty good. But anyway… They flew me down to Da Nang, triage, because I’d been wounded like two and a half days earlier. My wounds started to become gangrenous. And they got me in a CH-34 helicopter and flew me out to the Repose hospital ship where I had my first operation. And then I was there. They saved my leg and other invaluable parts of my body. Uh, and then they sent me to, uh, Yokosuka, Japan. And I was in the hospital there for, uh, about four and a half, five months. And then, uh, on August 5th, they sent me back to, uh, the States. And the next, uh, nine months, I just did physical therapy. I mean, my, my career was over basically. And, uh, So I look back at it now as, you know, I’m glad I survived. I wish more of my friends would have survived because I only have two that are still alive now from my platoon, and that’s kind of sad for me. But I’m sure every veteran that’s in combat True combat, well, there is always true combat, but I mean like face-to-face, hand-to-hand stuff, goes through the same things I do. You know, in ending, the Marine Corps and my tour in Vietnam and my small tour in Cuba made me into the man I am today. It made me, I think, a much better human being. And even though I have some of my problems, I’ve always said that I’m never going to let anyone say that I’m one of those nerdy, well, drunken, drug-addicted veterans. So I always hold true to the Marine Corps code. And I’ve had a wonderful life since then. I went back to college, got my degree at the University of New Mexico. I started some businesses, which are still running, and my sons have taken over the businesses. And I’m really happy now. I mean, terrible times for everybody, but it certainly made an impression on me of human nature and how to act and react differently. in stressful conditions and just be a good human being. You know, that’s, that’s pretty much what I strive for since I got out of the court. Uh, and, uh, so then, you know, that was my time in court. I mean, there was a lot of, you know, firefights and stuff like that, but those were the two main things was that huge ambush, uh, uh, in, uh, October of 1967 and then being wounded and literally I was out of the Corps. I mean, all I did, I was in hospitals and rehab stuff. And then I, you know, I’m 100% disabled. I don’t think I’m 100% disabled, but the government does. And so I have a nice pension from them and I’m still very active with, you know, Cooper’s Troopers and the other fellows, the other nine fellows that wrote chapters in the book. We all, you know, the colonel did a great job in putting this all together. And, you know, all we did was write a chapter apiece. But I think it’s a great book. I think it opens eyes to people who, who really were not involved in that war. And I try not to, I’m not much of a joiner, but I do try to stay in contact, especially with, you know, our luncheons that we have twice a month and with other Marines and corpsmen. So I’m very fortunate, and I’m fortunate that I’m alive and I’m fortunate that the Marine Corps in Vietnam made me into a very good person, I think. I’d like to think so, at least.
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Well, I really think so, Tom Jacobs, that from the guys that I’ve met at Cooper’s Troopers, that you are accomplishing that. Very quickly, you have a business that I know people would love to check that out. What is your business?
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Well, after I graduated from college, I went into business. I owned restaurants. And right now, at the young age of 74, I actually don’t work too much in the restaurants, but my sons do. And the two restaurants here in Denver are called Tokabe, T-O-C-A-B-E, an American Indian eatery. I had married an Osage woman, and we were married for 40, I think about 43 years. We have Four beautiful children and all went to college, graduated, and two of my boys now run the business. And our northern store, which is on 44th and Lowell, has been open for almost 13 years. And then the southern store over on Arapahoe Road. It’s been open about five years, I think. And we specialize in American Indian food. Everything we make is basically Southern Plains dishes. We have our own buffalo herd now. And we’ve started a new packaging business because of corona where we package products and mail them out to people to buy them. And it’s – I don’t do too much anymore, but the boys do a wonderful job, and it’s a very successful business. In 19 – I don’t know, in 2018, we were awarded the American Indian Business of the Year, which was quite a feather. You know, there’s – it was quite a feather in our cap. And – We continue to strive to make better products, and we’re now registered to franchise in 35 states.
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Okay, well, Corona did a lot, didn’t it? Tom Jacobs, we are out of time, but thank you so much. Those restaurants are Takabe, right? Am I saying that correctly?
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Correct, yes.
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Okay. Tom Jacobs.
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Go ahead.
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Go ahead.
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No, I just said just type in Takabi on your computer, and it’ll show you menus and where they are and a little bit of history of the stores.
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Okay, very good. Tom Jacobs, thank you so much for joining us today.
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Thank you very much.
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And we’ll be right back with Paula Sarles and C.R. Cusack.
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In these tumultuous times, it is necessary that we each have a freedom library to know and understand our history. Bury Him! A Memoir of the Vietnam War by Captain Doug Chamberlain is a must for your personal library. In this honest and gripping memoir, Captain Chamberlain recounts the chilling events that took place during his command of a company of young Marines at the height of the Vietnam War. Chamberlain painfully recalls the unspeakable order he and his Marines were forced to obey and the cover up which followed. Purchase the book at MarineDougChamberlain.com. That’s MarineDougChamberlain.com so that you gain perspective on this time in our history.
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Eyes peeled and moving quickly, Lance Corporal Jack Swan led 164 of his fellow U.S. Marines from Mike Company 3rd Battalion 5th Marines over the face of a bare rocky knoll to rescue an isolated company of fellow Leathernecks besieged by the Communist North Vietnamese Army. Then all hell broke loose. Instead of rescuing their fellow comrades, the Marines now faced complete annihilation. Author Doyle Glass tells their story in Swift Sword, a true Vietnam War story of epic courage and brotherhood in the face of insurmountable odds. Order Swift Sword by Doyle Glass now. They never gave up. We should never forget.
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Land that I love Stand beside her and guide her Through the night with the light from above
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Welcome back to America’s Veteran Stories with Kim Munson. Be sure and check out our website. That is AmericasVeteranStories.com. This show comes to you because I have some great sponsors. Another one of them is Hooters Restaurants that are located right here in the metro area. There’s five locations, Aurora, Colorado Springs, Lone Tree, Westminster, and Loveland. They have all kinds of specials. Wednesdays are Wings Day where you can get 20 wings and 10 for free. Check out my website, kimmunson.com, for more information on that. And again, thank you to my great sponsors that bring this show to you. On the line with me is Paula Sarles. She is a Vietnam-era Marine veteran as well as a Gold Star wife. And C.R. Cusack, he was a pilot in the Vietnam War. And he also has a chapter in this important book, Echoes of Our War. We have Vietnam veterans reflect 50 years later. Paula, people can help you out with this great work that you’re doing to make sure that we honor the memory of our veterans as well as honoring these guys that we are interviewing for this series. How can people help you, Paula?
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They can donate at usmcmemorialfoundation.org and put book in the remarks section. And then they’ll be entered in a contest to receive a signed copy of a hardback book, which is a collector’s item.
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And whoever donates the most will get that book. And they can do that at usmcmemorialfoundation.org. That’s usmcmemorialfoundation.org. And then people can also buy a brick to honor their veteran or their military personnel. I bought a brick for my father for Father’s Day, and I think that is a great gift. So anybody that buys their Father’s Day gift in the month of May, they’ll get that really, really lovely certificate, correct, Paula? Yes. Yes, they’ll get it in time for Father’s Day to present. Okay. And before we get to C.R. Cusack, we talked with Tom Jacobs in the previous two segments, and you had a quick story that you wanted to share, and actually Tom had talked to us about this offline. Tell us about that story.
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Well, my brother-in-law, David Soros, was in Tom’s platoon, And he actually saved Tom’s life, carried him out of the jungle. And they were good friends. And so, and David was beloved by all of his team members. And they nicknamed him Animal because he’s a huge guy. He was six, two or three and just big and strong. Good Texas boy. And he saved Tom Jacobson. Him and my husband both went to Vietnam. My husband invoked the Sullivan Act to get David out of the jungles, and they thought it would help him. And they both died in 2009 from Agent Orange.
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Wow. Okay. I tell you, the sacrifices that have been given so that we have our freedom and our liberty, I so appreciate it. Let’s talk to Major C.R. Cusack, a United States Marine Corps retired. He was an F-4 Phantom pilot. C.R., thank you so much for joining us today.
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No problem. I’m glad to be here.
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And you contributed to this very important book, Echoes of Our War, Vietnam Veterans Reflect 50 Years Later. I think every American should read this book. I think every high schooler, every college student should read this book. Let’s talk about your chapter in here, C.R. What’s one of the first things you want our listeners to know about you?
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Well, being part of the aviation ring and military, Being a Marine on the ground were two different lives, but sometimes I don’t feel like I was a real Marine because my life was so different. But my fellow Marines on the ground said if it hadn’t been for me dropping ordnance when I did, that they may not be around. So I was very essential to their operation. I guess I can consider myself part of the Marine Corps, but sometimes I don’t.
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Well, I do think that you are part of the Marine Corps. Okay, C.R., so you were part of the aviation wing of the Marine Corps. How did you make that determination to get into the aviation wing?
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I had gone to two and a half years to the Colorado School of Mines, and was qualified for the cadet program in marine aviation. So I thought I would test for it and see if I could be able to apply for it. And I was, and I was accepted. And I figured that I should serve. I was drafted. So I figured I should serve my country the best way I possibly could. So being qualified, I thought everybody would be qualified for that program. So I figured I should go ahead and do it. So that’s the reason why I did it.
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Okay. And where did you grow up, C.R.?
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In the Arkansas Valley. I was born in La Jolla, went to grade school in Fowler and Rocky Ford. and high school in Pueblo, Colorado, and graduate from high school. And then in 57, went to the Colorado School of Mines. And from there, while I was off working, to get nobody to go back to school because we didn’t have student loans and I didn’t have a scholarship, I got drafted. So I decided to join the Marine Corps.
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Okay. And that was 1957, you said?
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I graduated from high school. I got drafted in 1963.
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Okay, you graduated high school in 1957 and drafted then in 1963. Correct. Okay, tell us what was Vietnam like once you got over to Vietnam? What was your days like there?
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They were… studying the missions we were to fly, the procedures we were to fly, studying different ordinance delivery systems, whatever pertained to the aircraft and what our job was in order to deliver the ordinance in the manner that we were prescribed to. So that was my mission. I spent a lot of time studying what the aircraft did and what its systems were and how they worked. So that took most of the time, and my collateral duties in the squadron as a para loft officer, helping with the parachutes and ejection seats and so forth in the squadron.
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Okay. Now, tell our listeners, what is an ordnance exactly?
SPEAKER 04 :
Which? Ordnance?
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Yeah, what is an ordnance? You said delivering your ordnance. So what is that exactly?
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It can be rockets. It can be bombs. It can be 20-millimeter machine gun, cannon, whatever you want to call it. It’s whatever the aircraft carries. In our case, it was mostly 500-pound bombs. and mostly rockets, 2.75-inch rockets, but it could include 750-pound napalm or 5-inch SUNY rockets or sometimes 250-pound bombs, sometimes 750-pound bombs, sometimes 1,000-pound bombs. And then we also had a pod you could attach to the airplane with the 20-millimeter Hughes uh cannon machine gun on it and it fired uh oh i think about 5 000 rounds a minute okay tell us about the f4 phantom okay the phantom uh during its uh Its period, it was the most spectacular aircraft in the air. It held records for time to climb. It held records for altitude. It was designed as an interceptor. It was designed, which is an aircraft that is launched when an enemy air threat is possible. It’s launched to intercept those air threats in a radar environment. It wasn’t designed… to dogfight, to have aerial combat. It was designed as an interceptor, but it also proved to be an excellent bomb delivery system. It worked very well as a bomb delivery system. It could carry a rather extensive load of bombs, and it worked out well as both an interceptor and a bomber.
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And what was the crew like? Was it just you or was there two people?
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Yes, there was a crew. In the Marine Corps and the Navy, the backseat guy was called the radar intercept operator. He operated the radar. He controlled in the intercept operation. He was the one that acquired the inbound targets, guided the aircraft. toward the targets, set up the shot to the target, and told the pilot distances and speeds to the target, and gave the pilot the signal to fire on the target. So he was a very important individual as far as the intercept, as far as the bombing mission goes. He was the communicator with all of the ground agencies required in order to get your aircraft where it was supposed to be to drop the ordnance to support the troops. Very important part of the program.
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Very, very important. I tell you what, CR, let’s go to break. I have a few more questions about that. And then also want to hear your story that you had to eject. And I find that I want to know more about that as well. So we’re going to go to break. This is Kim Munson. I’m talking with Paula Sarles and with Vietnam Marine pilot. And that is CR Cusack. These stories are so important that we hear them, understand them. And one of the reasons that we can do this is because of my great partners. And one of those great partners is Karen Levine. You know her. She’s an award-winning realtor with REMAX Alliance. And we’re in the spring selling season. And now is a time for people to reach out to you, Karen, because you really are helping people navigate this crazy market to buy or sell their home. So thank you for what you’re doing.
SPEAKER 07 :
Well, thank you, Kim. And yes, the spring season is upon us and lots of people are thinking about selling and buying housing. And I’m here to help them get settled in before the new school year starts in August.
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Which is right around the corner as fast as time’s going. I can’t believe it. And this series that we’re doing with these Vietnam veterans is so important, Karen, because it’s been 50 years. And these guys, the title of the book is Echoes of Our War, Vietnam Veterans Reflect 50 Years Later. And you and I were talking as kind of preparing for this interview that, I mean, we were both kids and kind of remember the Vietnam veterans coming home and coming We were living charmed lives. We didn’t realize what was happening with these guys over in Vietnam.
SPEAKER 07 :
Most definitely, Kim. I just, you know, you do the math, and I was probably in fifth, sixth, seventh grade, and life was very protected. We lived in middle America suburbia, and I didn’t understand the Vietnam War, and I know when our veterans returned from serving and protecting America that they weren’t received very graciously. That is an understatement. Yeah, as a children’s perspective.
SPEAKER 10 :
Yes, they were not. And it is time that we certainly recognize that. And certainly it’s a long time later. But that’s why this series is so important. And Karen Levine, I so appreciate your partnership on this.
SPEAKER 07 :
Well, and I think it’s just important for our young people today to understand the sacrifices that were made for the freedoms that they have in their day-to-day living.
SPEAKER 10 :
Most definitely. And Karen Levine, thank you so much. We’re going to go to break and we will be right back.
SPEAKER 12 :
We’ll be right back. If you’d like to explore what a reverse mortgage can do for you, call Lauren Levy at 303-880-8881. That’s 303-880-8881.
SPEAKER 13 :
Call now. You’d like to get in touch with one of the sponsors of The Kim Monson Show, but you can’t remember their phone contact or website information. Find a full list of advertising partners on Kim’s website, kimmonson.com. That’s Kim, M-O-N-S-O-N dot com.
SPEAKER 15 :
From the mountains, to the prairies, to the oceans wide with foam, God bless us.
SPEAKER 10 :
Welcome back to America’s Veteran Stories with Kim Munson. Be sure and check out our website. That is AmericasVeteranStories.com. And these shows, this is a series that we are doing based on this book that Colonel Bob Fisher compiled where we have 10 Vietnam veterans that each contributed a chapter. and as Vietnam veterans reflect 50 years later, echoes of our war. Paula Sarles is on the line with me. She is a Marine veteran, a Vietnam-era Marine veteran, and she is working diligently to remodel and refurbish the Marine Memorial here in Golden to honor our Marines, our military personnel. Paula, how can people help you?
SPEAKER 06 :
They can donate at usmcmemorialfoundation.org and put book in the remarks, and then they’ll be entered to get a copy of the book autographed by everyone. And it’s a hardback collector’s edition, so… That’s one way or they can buy a brick and Father’s Day is a great time to buy a brick for your father and his memory.
SPEAKER 10 :
Most definitely. Absolutely. To honor their service. And they can go to usmcmemorialfoundation.org, usmcmemorialfoundation.org. Paula, I know you are doing this work because of these guys that we are interviewing. Your husband, Tony, you’re a Gold Star wife. He passed on in 2009. But on the line with us is C.R. Cusack. He’s a Marine pilot, an F-4 Marine pilot during the Vietnam War. CR, in between breaks here, you mentioned that a lot of people don’t know that the Marines have an aviation wing, and people are alerting all the time. So it is kind of fascinating, isn’t it?
SPEAKER 04 :
Yes, it is. Now, the Marines have been flying as much as the Navy has. When the Navy started flying back in the teens, the Marines were right there alongside them flying.
SPEAKER 10 :
And now, when did you go into the Marines? What year?
SPEAKER 04 :
I joined in 1963.
SPEAKER 1 :
1963.
SPEAKER 10 :
And the F-4, you’ve given us a description of this, but I have interviewed a whole bunch, probably 160, 170 World War II veterans. And… So the F-4 wasn’t that long after, because it was primarily props, propellers in World War II. So this is pretty close, don’t you think, to, I mean, this is a big change in, you know, moving to these jets in the Vietnam War, correct?
SPEAKER 04 :
Well, yes, but the Marines also flew jets in Korea, which was very close after the Second World War.
SPEAKER 06 :
True, okay.
SPEAKER 04 :
They had Grumman fighters, the Panthers, the Cougars, and the Crusader came out late in the Korean War, and the Crusader was also a jet that was flown in the Vietnam War.
SPEAKER 10 :
Okay, and the F-4, though, that was really in the Vietnam War, correct? That came after Korea?
SPEAKER 04 :
Correct, correct. It came out shortly after Korea.
SPEAKER 10 :
Okay. Was this the jet that Tom Cruise flew in? Now I’m drawing a blank on the movie. No.
SPEAKER 04 :
He flew the F-14. It was also a Grumman aircraft. Well, the F-4 is not a Grumman aircraft. Excuse me. It’s a McDonnell Douglas aircraft. The F-14 Tomcat, it was a Grumman aircraft.
SPEAKER 10 :
Okay. Okay, great. Let’s talk a little bit more about your service. And in looking at your chapter in the book, you ended up having to eject. And first of all, you don’t practice ejecting from an aircraft, do you?
SPEAKER 04 :
To a certain extent. In pre-flight, we do what they call a double dunker. We get in a seat and get upside down under the water. We jump off the ledges and jump. and hang around in the harnesses and shroud lines, but we don’t actually get any experience jumping out of airplanes.
SPEAKER 10 :
Yeah, because you really don’t want to wreck those airplanes just for practice. Okay, tell us about that day.
SPEAKER 04 :
Well, we got a call off the hot pad to a site very near Da Nang, where the North Vietnamese had come down the Ho Chi Minh Trail and set up a site on a hill nine miles from Da Nang and were shooting rockets into the Da Nang Air Base. And this was a very good location for them to shoot rockets. So we had to get out there and clean them off so they could I THOUGHT THEY WERE GOING TO DO IT AGAIN. sending aircraft out there to bomb the targets. Our missions are usually two aircraft missions, a lead and a wing. The lead usually carries forward-firing rockets and bombs or just bombs, and the wing usually carries eight 750-pound napalm bombs. Well, I was flying a wing, and I had the eight 750-pound napalm bombs, so I was making my runs on this hill, and after the second run, I started pulling off, and I felt a big old thud in the airplane, and I knew that wasn’t a good sign, so I turned back towards Dunang and kept an eye on my instruments, and very soon, the fire warning lights came on, and the fuel gates started fluctuating, and things started falling apart. So I figured I’d been hit, so I went into my ejection procedures. It’s really not a big deal, but about the only thing you really have to worry about is how long your aircraft’s going to last before it quits. And your aim is to get out over the water. You don’t want to jump out over the land in Vietnam because then you have the risk of walking to Hanoi and to the prison camps. And I didn’t want to do that. So I got to proper at 10,000 foot altitude and headed towards the water. And I didn’t want to head towards Da Nang because the city of Da Nang because I didn’t know when it would quit and I didn’t want the plane to land in Da Nang. So I headed for the nearest body of water, which was the west end of Da Nang Bay. And I just rode it as long as I could until it quit. And it quit just as I was getting towards the mouth of Da Nang Bay. And that’s when I jumped out. And it was rather interesting that while I was floating down in my parachute… I noticed a little blue and white fiberglass boat circling down where I was going to land, and it turned out that there were some water skiers out on Da Nang Bay, and they stopped and picked me up.
SPEAKER 10 :
That is astonishing to me that there’s people out water skiing while you guys are actually engaged in war. I find that interesting.
SPEAKER 04 :
I just found it very interesting, too. And I imagine my lead, the aircraft circling above and watching, thought it was rather interesting that this small fiberglass aircraft picked me up.
SPEAKER 10 :
What about your co-pilot?
SPEAKER 04 :
He jumped out. Well, as soon as the aircraft quit, I push a little button that says eject, and he goes. And so he punched out, and then I punched out. I can’t punch out before he does, or the blast from my seat really does damage to him. So you have to wait until he goes first, and then you jump. So I punched the eject button. He was gone. He landed, oh, maybe 300 or 400 yards west of me, and he was picked up by the Air Force rescue helicopter, and then… Air Force and Marines in the fiberglass boat took me over to the beach, and the chopper came over and landed on the beach. I got in the chopper and went to sickbay.
SPEAKER 10 :
Wow. Did you do missions after that?
SPEAKER 04 :
Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. I was grounded for a while due to my injuries, but I was able to come back in about, I think it took me eight or nine days to recover and recover. and i was back back to live again how many missions yeah emissions to fly uh… total of a hundred and six which i should have had more but due to certain circumstances that uh… there was a couple of periods where i i would label i was out of the endowment wasn’t able to fly so i didn’t get as many as i should have that seems like an awful lot to me well it’s When you’re flying sometimes three missions a day, it’s not that much.
SPEAKER 10 :
It doesn’t take long. C.R. Cusack, I want to say thank you. We’re just about out of time. What’s kind of the final thought that you’d like to leave with our listeners today as we’re hearing your important story?
SPEAKER 04 :
Well, it’s just that I hope people understand what the duty of the young men of our country are as far as… serving their country and protecting the freedoms they have in this country. We have a very unusual constitution, very unusual freedoms, more so than I feel any other country in the world. And I think it’s important that, you know, I was drafted. I felt a responsibility. You know, I could have gone to Canada. I could have gone to prison. But I have a responsibility now. to serve my country. And I think that’s an important thing for everyone. Guys, gals, everybody to protect the freedoms they have in this country. I think that’s the primary importance. As they say on Star Trek, that’s the prime objective. Prime directive, I guess they say.
SPEAKER 10 :
Well, C.R. Cusack, I really appreciate my freedom, my liberty, and I thank you for that. Thank you so much.
SPEAKER 04 :
You’re quite welcome. Glad to be aboard.
SPEAKER 10 :
And Paula Sarles, thank you for all the work that you’re doing as well. Thank you, Kim. And my friends, as you hear these stories, you realize that we do indeed stand on the shoulders of giants. And my friends, God bless you and God bless America. Thank you.
SPEAKER 11 :
Thank you for listening to America’s Veteran Stories with Kim Munson. Be sure to tune in again next Sunday, 3 to 4 p.m., here on KLZ 560 and KLZ 100.7.
SPEAKER 08 :
The views and opinions expressed on KLZ 560 are those of the speaker, commentators, hosts, their guests, and callers. They are not necessarily the views and opinions of Crawford Broadcasting or KLZ management, employees, associates, or advertisers. KLZ 560 is a Crawford Broadcasting God and country station.
