In this episode of The Kim Munson Show, Kim dives deep into the intricacies of epistemic capture and the relationship between true science and misleading narratives. Joined by Dr. James Lyons-Weiler, founder of IPAC, they explore the vital role his institution plays in providing accessible education for the intellectually curious. As they discuss the power dynamics affecting societies today, this episode challenges listeners to open their minds to new ideas and independent thought.
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It’s the Kim Munson Show, analyzing the most important stories.
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The socialization of transportation, education, energy, housing, and water. What it means is that government controls it through rules and regulations.
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The latest in politics and world affairs.
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Under this guise of bipartisanship and nonpartisanship, it’s actually tapping down the truth.
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Today’s current opinions and ideas.
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On an equal field in the battle of ideas, mistruths and misconceptions is getting us into a world of hurt.
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Is it freedom or is it force? Let’s have a conversation.
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Indeed. And welcome to the Kim Munson Show. Thank you so much for joining us. You’re each treasured. You’re valued. You have purpose today. Strive for excellence. Take care of your heart, your soul, your mind and your body. My friends, we were made for this moment in history. And thank you to the team. That’s producer Joe, Luke, Rachel, Zach, Echo, Charlie, Mike, Teresa, Amanda. and all the people here at Crawford Broadcasting. Check out my website. That is kimmunson, M-O-N-S-O-N.com. Sign up for our weekly email newsletter. It goes out on Sundays. You’ll get first look at our upcoming guests as well as our most recent essays. You can email me at kim at kimmunson.com. That’s M-O-N-S-O-N.com. We’ll see you next time. And you hear the show 6 to 8 a.m. Monday through Friday. First hour is rebroadcast 1 to 2 in the afternoon. Second hour is rebroadcast 10 to 11 at night. And that is on all KLZ 560 platforms, which is KLZ 560 AM, 100.7 FM, anywhere in the world on the website or the app. And if you say play KLZ Alexa, that apparently comes in loud and clear as well. We are prerecording for most of the shows during Holy Week and very pleased to be talking with Dr. James Lyons-Weiler. He is a scientist. He’s the founder of IPAC-EDU. IPAC stands for the Institute for Pure and Applied Knowledge. And during COVID, he realized that we needed to have an opportunity, if we’re intellectually curious, to learn about a variety of different things. So he’s put together these amazing classes at an affordable price. And you can find that at IPAC-EDU.org, I think it is. Dr. Jack, welcome to the show.
SPEAKER 05 :
Kim, thank you so much. How have you been?
SPEAKER 12 :
I have been doing well, but my, oh my, there’s a lot that’s going on out there, Dr. Jack.
SPEAKER 05 :
Oh, there sure is. Whiplash. People have a hard time keeping up. I’m having a hard time keeping up, frankly.
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And you’ve really got your ear to the ground on all this stuff. So we’ll get into the issues out there. But before we do, I wanted to talk about IPAC-EDU.org. And I know that enrollment, as people were saying, staying at home a lot, they certainly were hungry for different things to learn about. But I think now that things have opened up a bit more, people are distracted. There’s so much noise out there. And how does IPAC-EDU.org percolate to the top?
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Oh, very simple. Thank you for that. We provide community of lifelong learners with a structured learning environment. We were all socialized to pay attention in class, to consume information, think about it, process it. And our participants get to ask questions and share their thoughts and ideas. So we helped make sense out of the mayhem. And that’s all that we’ve done. I mean, I’ve done that with the popular rationalism as well. You know, I had The most attention I received was when the public’s jobs were under threat from the Biden administration. I was getting 30 or 40 or 50, 60,000 reads a day for about four months. That was incredible. But adpac-edu.org is where you go and you’ll find amazing courses. Right now we’re just in the second lecture of what we’re calling a mega course. And the mega course is Power and Social Change. In this course, we’re making sense of different forces that are at play and how they interact in civilization, whether those forces are major forces or minor forces, and how to tell. We’re taking a somewhat quantitative look at some of these things that I think people will appreciate. And if you’re curious about this, it kind of falls under the moniker of mathematical sociology. But we’re just talking about these things. And these factors are things like national identity erosion, centralization of power, bureaucratic bloat. We talk about social stratification, the epistemic capture where what the government’s telling you is backed by science is not really backed by science. It’s narrative enforcement. And then the effects of external forces like the threats from other countries and arms races, reliance on mercenaries at the end of civilization before sudden military defeat. There are so many topics on how they all interact with each other, and they interact in various ways at different times. But among these, some of the most important factors are the epistemic capture. How do you know that the information that you’re being presented with through the media or online is not just another layer of propaganda? You’re taught to respect doctors and scientists, but if the scientists are… not doing science, what are they doing? They’re conducting something else. It’s a subversive act, actually, called epistemic capture. So we provide people with mind frameworks that they can carry in their brain, and they can say, oh, I see the difference. When Fauci is lying, that’s epistemic capture. So they don’t have to be angry at science. They don’t have to defund science out of the terror that somehow scientists everywhere are evil. They can see the difference between fraud and science. And I’ve said this for years. Everywhere I go, please don’t throw the baby out with the bathwater. Science is a way of knowing. It’s a valid way of knowing things. Scientists are not your enemy. True scientists are not your enemy. Bureaucrats that have hijacked science and corrupted it and made it look like science, but it’s not science. What is that? We need language. So, yeah, I have an article on this recently on my sub stack, Popular Rationalism. where I actually take a quantitative approach due to the tariffs that are happening, and I say, okay, out of all these social things that are happening, can we come to some estimate about how close the United States of America is to collapse, you know, with all these factors pushing us? And this is a dramatic regime change between the Biden oligarchy, where Biden was president to name only, apparently, and the Trump administration, that has the backing of many people who are dissatisfied with large government. And there’s this idea that there’s a lowered return on investment as you build a complex society. So the more complex a society becomes, the more friction there are among the parts, and that friction takes energy away from the civilization’s progress. And that friction itself is wasteful. There’s an analogy to this in physics. It’s wasteful in that different pieces of the puzzle take bigger and bigger parts. A great analogy would be the insurance industry in how health care is funded. There’s a huge amount of financial friction where the You know, insurance companies are making money telling us what we can and cannot do with money. By definition, that’s a non-revenue-generating faction that actually has a parasitic relationship on the system. And so we give people the tools to be able to think like this and to be able to speak like this when they’re with their friends and families and neighbors. And it’s backed by some really smart people. We have the best instructors. You know, we work for ourselves. We are truly just independent Americans making it in this world. We’re not backed by some social program, anti-globalist, pro-right, pro-left, independent. We are literally just academics that came together and said the flame of objective thought, independent objective thought, without fear of retribution from authority, has to survive. And we made it through the Biden administration. We made it through COVID. We’re empowering people to, you know, be able to participate in their own governance. You know, we have just course after course after course where you can spend between 10 and 15 weeks meeting with the same people, digging deep into topics that really matter. And, you know, by the way, the probability that the United States is going to collapse, we’re only 63% of the way there. That doesn’t mean there’s a 63% chance, but we’re not like 95%. It’s not the end of the world, you know, this kind of thing. There’s resilience that’s built into how you structure societies, and that resilience is another aspect of this course. What are the things that we can do individually to contribute to resilience in our society? And a lot of it involves being prepared to mix your own personal discovered political position on independent issues separate from what your party might say is the most important. You have to be able to do that. We have to have dissent. Right. New leadership after a society collapses or a regime change usually comes from the outside or the fringe, as it’s called by sociologists. It doesn’t mean that we’re weird, but that new leadership has ways of thinking about things that are different than what caused society to go through the gyrations of things like allowing Fauci to become so powerful in the NIH as as director of the NIAID. to be able to call the university and say, unless you shut this guy down, he’s saying things that he shouldn’t say, we’re going to cut all of your funding, which is, you know, just like a shakedown. It’s just like a mafioso shakedown. So, yeah, this particular entity, IPAC-EDU.org, It’s for the people. We don’t have any agenda other than understanding. We don’t have to agree with each other. We have people from all walks of life, all political backgrounds. You know, the homogenization of thought is a is a very, very, very real risk factor. And so, yeah, we’re here to teach the basics as well, from biology to genetics to immunology. so that when you see the technocracy barking at you that you now have to do this to yourself or do that to your kids, you have a better vocabulary to be able to ask important questions.
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Okay, and Dr. Jack, what is the name of that particular course again?
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Yeah, that particular course is Power and Social Change. Okay. Yeah, Power and Social Change. You can find it. at ipec-edu.org under the registration page. We’re looking at exponential forces and civilization and governance.
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And it’s not too late for people to sign up for that.
SPEAKER 05 :
Oh, no. Registration’s open. It’s going to be probably an eight-week course. We’re only two weeks in. We have the first two class meetings, the first one class meeting videotaped, and the second class meeting is this week. at 11 a.m. Eastern Time. I’m in the Eastern time zone. We meet every Thursday, and it’ll go for maybe an hour, hour and a half, depending on how the discussion goes.
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And you’re teaching that, or do you have other instructors as well?
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Yeah, it’s co-taught by myself, and the other two co-instructors are Brad Miller and who was the former lieutenant colonel, lieutenant commander, sorry, that refused to vaccinate. He was an American hero. He’d served his time in the Middle East, came under fire, came back to the States. All of a sudden, you’re nothing if you don’t vaccinate. And he stood up. So Brad Miller is there. He has a suite of other courses that he teaches with us. And then a brilliant woman by the name of Dr. Tori Alexander. You can look her up on the web, VN Alexander. But, yeah, look up Brad Miller on Twitter and Tori Alexander. And we take turns commenting. I’ll be doing most of the presenting of the material, but, you know, diversity of insight and opinion. Then we open it up for general discussion at the end.
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And that’s what’s so unique is it’s relational as well. It’s not just sitting on one side of your computer with a lecture coming at you. It is relational and commentary on that. And so you can find that at IPAC-EDU.org. We are going to continue the discussion with Dr. James Lyons-Weiler on a variety of other issues as well. We’re pre-recording. for holy week and all this happens because of our sponsors i know them all personally they all strive for excellence and the roger bang at state farm insurance team’s been in business for 48 years taking care of his family serving his customers giving back to the community and can help with all your insurance needs so give them a call at 303-795 for a complimentary appointment that’s 303-795-8855 because like a good neighbor the roger mangan insurance team is there
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And welcome back to The Kim Munson Show. Be sure and check out our website. That is KimMunson, M-O-N-S-O-N.com. Sign up for our weekly email newsletter. You can email me at Kim at KimMunson.com as well. Thank you to all of you who support us. We’re an independent voice. We search for truth and clarity by looking at these issues through the lens of freedom versus force, force versus freedom. If something’s a good idea, you should not have to force people to do it. And Hooters Restaurants has been a great sponsor of both my shows, The Kim Munson Show and and America’s veteran stories for many years. How I got to know them is a really important story about freedom and free markets and capitalism and how those pesky PBIs, politicians and bureaucrats and interested parties want to control our lives. So you can find that story at KimMunson.com. But they do have five locations, Loveland, Aurora, Lone Tree, Westminster, and Colorado Springs, and great specials for lunch and happy hour Monday through Friday. So check all that out there. I’m talking with Dr. James Lyons Weiler, and he is the creator of IPAC, the Institute for Pure and Applied Knowledge. And then moving into COVID, he created IPAC-EDU.org with all of these great educational programs. In particular, you can still sign up for this one, Power and Social Change. that I think is super interesting. And also you can find his essays, his writings, his articles at Substack under Popular Rationalism. Dr. Jack, you are personal friends with RFK Jr., And he’s confirmed as the Secretary of Health and Human Services, a very tall order. It seems like there are a lot of different factions that have opinions about where he should be going on things. What’s your update on Maha, Make America Healthy Again?
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Well, just like we spoke in the last segment, it’s very difficult to keep up. There has been so much that’s been done, and so much is ongoing. I mean, we’ve all heard of Doge and the budget cuts and the people being exited from government. You think about all the broken institutions. This administration is taking a wrecking ball. to all these broken institutions and knock it down so that we can rebuild in a way that reflects American values. It reflects the goals of the institutions. Many of these institutions were not even doing anything remotely close to what their charter was. We’ve seen the exodus of some people who were clearly, in my opinion, bad actors, unfaithful actors at that, who were tasked with protecting the public health. Peter Marks, for instance, is gone. He was a high-ranking official at the FDA who absolutely abrogated the contract, the social contract with the American public to look after our safety in a number of ways. He looked after fast-tracking drugs, and what happens with fast-tracking drugs and things like gene therapies, you end up with patients that are put at risk and dying. There was a young man who died under a gene therapy clinical trial that was fast-tracked. And years ago, all gene therapy trials were stopped after a young man died. And so it seems as though the banality of evil is that, well, you know, you get some deaths from time to time. And we’re not quite where we need to be on the ethics, the balance of ethics on that. But more importantly, I think history is going to hold Peter Marks, you know, equally culpable, as it will Anthony Fauci. You know, early on when they first came out with the commercial RT-PCR tests. I wrote to Peter Marks in his then capacity at FDA. And I said, listen, the FDA just put out a call to make sure that people that are marketing tests, companies that are marketing tests, RT-PCR tests for COVID have to be able to show that they can determine when the virus is present. And I wrote to him and I said, you’re setting this up where there’s going to be an epidemic of false positives because you have not also required them to be able to show evidence to the FDA for emergency use authorization that their test does not show the virus to be present when it is in fact absent. And so he ignored that, so far as I can tell. The false positives were a result of arbitrary settings on the number of cycles that… you use to determine that the virus is present or not they don’t have time to get in the technical weeds but i was on that early right after the pcr test came out i was not happy and so it’s good to see this kind of change you know robert kennedy jr you say he’s my friend i’m also a close professional advisor those those two things are true and i’m very proud of that affiliation he um He is staying true to his roots on his personal ethics and ethos with respect to telling the truth, with respect to environmental concerns. There’s going to be actions against more than just food dyes. There’s going to be actions against pesticides. I see forthcoming actions against pharmaceutical companies. to clean up their act with respect to the toxicants that we inject kind of routinely into newborns and infants and toddlers and children. The fact is there are a number of people that are a little impatient with the secretary, and I want to remind them that the paint is still – wet on his door were only five weeks and and it took thirty years for the pharmaceutical companies to destroy the health of america i think we need to give secretary kennedy the due respect not just as a man but of the office uh… and uh… the reality is that he needs our support he needs us to echo What we agree with when he makes an announcement, he needs to be amplified so people can hear everything that he’s doing. And when we disagree with him, he also needs us to let him know that too. And that’s one of the things about Bobby that I really love and I respect and I trust him because there have been times when he and I have disagreed and voices have been raised out of passion for the truth. And when he’s wrong, when he says, show me where I’m wrong, I’ll admit it. He absolutely means it. So this means he’s a lifelong learner. He’s capable of taking criticism without taking it personally. He doesn’t see it as a personal attack. uh… uh… on the on his character if he’s misinformed and that’s where we need to be as americans we need to be that to the point where somebody is misinformed it doesn’t mean that they’re not intelligent or stupid or something but rather they’ve just don’t have the right information at the present time We need to lower our expectations that everyone’s going to have everything on recall, especially the older we get. Right, Kim? But, you know, think about everybody’s being fed so much misinformation and disinformation by by entities that hire people. Our media, the mainstream media is a wholly-owned subsidiary of the pharmaceutical companies, as far as I can tell, with direct-to-consumer marketing. Bobby’s taking that on. He’s helping Americans face their demons head-on and taking care of business. And I’ve never been prouder of him. I think his family will see, in the long run, the detractors within his family will see, in the long run, Not that he was right. That’s kind of a grade school mentality. But that he had the wherewithal, the temerity to stand up against the storm of lies. He had the courage to take action and to speak the truth when he had a far easier path than to take all of this on. It is daunting. I don’t know how he keeps up with it. I try to help out when I can. to the extent that I can. And, yeah, I think America could not do better with an HHS director. You know, recently he said that the best way to get, you know, to avoid getting the measles is the MMR shot. And there’s a couple of caveats that he didn’t necessarily throw in there, but thinking people will realize that just being the best way doesn’t mean that it’s a safe way. Just being the best way doesn’t mean that it’s very good either. among all the options if the measles virus is around it’s highly contagious it’s very difficult not to get um infected if you already have natural immunity you’re going to get infected too and you’ll get a booster on your immune system that way from a secondary infection but it’ll be asymptomatic and he didn’t have time really to go into all the details but i kind of People who are vaccinated absolutely can get a measles infection, and they make up a huge portion of the transmissions. Asymptomatic infection and transmission from people who are up-to-date on their MMRs absolutely is known in the scientific literature, and I have articles on that as well. But he’s not giving up on things like Vaccine safety. He’s not giving up on natural and allopathic treatments. He’s got people, aerosolized budesonide is one of them. He’s got people delivering cod liver oil and making it clear that, you know, if you have vitamin A deficiency, which most Americans do not, but if you do, then you’re at risk of complications from the measles infection. And then, of course, all the other side can do is try to make hay out of the fact that two children now have died following measles. And neither of those deaths, however, can be strongly attributed to measles as a disease. And so it’s likely that iatrogenic or medical error caused the death of the first girl who died while she was in medical care. under hydrated you know dehydrated and not given you know the penalty of different types of treatments that we know or therapies that we know can mitigate she wasn’t given the antivirals for instance and so on and then we have this Second death, and this person, a young boy, I think it was, who got measles, recovered from measles, and then came up with a secondary bacterial infection, probably in the hospital. So both of those are likely iatrogenic disease. And when you ask me to speak about Maha, I want to remind everyone that there’s something like 225,000 deaths every year from iatrogenic disease. That includes medical errors, but it also includes medicine that was delivered to the right person for the right reason under current best practice, and the medicines themselves had adverse reactions, caused adverse reactions. And so, you know, with the prioritization of—reprioritization of making America healthy again, we’re also— You know, making America survive again by looking at, you know, what are the number one, two, three, four cause of death? And can we focus our energy and effort on reducing those causes of death and iatrogenic illness? That is something that happened to you because of medicine that otherwise wouldn’t have happened without that interaction. without intervention that’s one of the top priorities i think that the nih should take on we don’t have for instance nih funded centers for excellence in iatrogenic disease prevention they don’t exist you know mainstream medicine doesn’t want to take it on because of the liability but you know we we could say for 10 years there’s a 10-year moratorium on liability if it’s under study any institution that’s actually studying it can enjoy liability from this um then they would study it. I’m sure they would study it, especially if we hung out $100 million. It’s worth putting these research programs together and putting out calls for proposals to make sure that this type of research gets done as well. We have to deal with diabetes. We have to deal with the fact that The morbidity and mortality associated with metabolic disorder is real, and I don’t think it’s just diet by any means. I think that we probably have a severe autoimmunity component to this, even beyond that, which we know is in the autoimmune type of it. The reversible type of diabetes and insulin resistance and all of that, that definitely can be addressed. People should just pick up a weight a day, even if it’s a one-pound weight, a five-pound weight. Move your body, increase your muscle mass somehow so that your body can actually then avoid developing insulin resistance. It doesn’t matter what shape you’re in. If you put on more muscle, you’re going to have lower insulin resistance. Every medical doctor should tell every diabetic patient to get into the gym.
SPEAKER 12 :
So get to moving. I think that is good advice for everyone. And I know Thomas Jefferson recommended walking. There’s a very successful businessman out here in Florida. Colorado founder of American Furniture Warehouse, Jake Jabs. He’s in his 90s. He says he walks every day, walks several miles every day. Just yeah, just move a little bit. You might even go into the pantry. I’ve been doing this and grabbing a couple of jars of pasta sauce and doing some curls. And I can tell that that’s even helping Dr. Jack.
SPEAKER 05 :
Yeah, absolutely. Walking is great. However, remember that human beings were migratory, you know, were migratory for the most of our or hunters and gatherers for most of our history. And so we are very efficient walkers. We basically, walking is about the same as sitting on a chair in reality in terms of its muscle building capacity. But if you want to actually build muscle, hitting the gym and having the wherewithal to do it two or three times a week You don’t have to become a super muscle man type thing. One, two, three, four pounds, 20 reps, do everything that you can do in the gym, and you’ll be amazed at what happens to your blood sugar levels. And because you end up burning sugar when you are sitting down, muscles will help you burn sugar. Okay.
SPEAKER 12 :
Boy, I tell you, great information, of course, from Dr. James Linesweiler, who is the founder of IPAC-EDU.org. We have these important discussions because we have amazing sponsors. And one of those great sponsors is Karen Levine for Everything Residential Real Estate.
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All of Kim’s sponsors are an inclusive partnership with Kim and are not affiliated with or in partnership with KLZ or Crawford Broadcasting. If you would like to support the work of The Kim Munson Show and grow your business, contact Kim at her website, kimmunson.com. That’s kimmunson, M-O-N-S-O-N dot com.
SPEAKER 07 :
And welcome back to The Kim Munson Show.
SPEAKER 12 :
Check out our website. That is kimmunson.com. Sign up for our weekly email newsletter. You can email me at kim at kimmunson.com as well. Thank you to all of you who support us. We’re an independent voice, and we search for truth and clarity by looking at these issues through the lens of freedom versus force, force versus freedom. If something’s a good idea, you should not have to force people to do it. And as you all know, one of the nonprofits I dearly love is the Center for American Values, which is located in Pueblo. They’re nonpartisan. They’re nonpolitical. They just focus on these values of honor, integrity, and patriotism through their educational programs, their on values presentations. and honoring our Medal of Honor recipients. It should be on your bucket list to get down to the Center for American Values, and you can get more information by going to AmericanValueCenter.org. That is AmericanValueCenter.org. I’m talking with Dr. James Linesweiler, and Dr. Jack is the founder of IPAC, which is the Institute for Pure and Applied Knowledge. That happened before COVID. During COVID, he founded this great IPAC-EDU.org. Great instructors coming together with those of us that are intellectually curious and at a very affordable price, creating these great courses on a variety of different things. We had talked about in the first segment his class on power and social change, and it’s not too late to sign up for that at IPAC-EDU.org. And the phone number’s on there if you have questions as well. Dr. Jack, I am questioning this whole thing regarding measles. It seems like that’s been the go-to narrative for those that want to have forced vaccinations on our kids is measles. And there’s stories or there’s headlines out there that two children have died from measles. That puts the fear of God basically in parents’ hearts. What can parents do, perhaps, with their children to maybe prevent measles or help make it be a milder case? And I’m going to date myself. I had measles, mumps, and chickenpox as a child. So I have all this natural immunity to all of this stuff, Dr. Jack.
SPEAKER 05 :
Yeah, well, that’s wonderful, and congratulations. That’s important. First, I want to say this idea that measles is a deadly disease. You know, they’re amplifying the deaths to try to use fear to encourage vaccination. Well, we know where that ended up with SARS-CoV-2, you know, COVID, it backfired. They don’t also then tell you about the deaths that are present in the VAERS database ever. There’s hundreds of deaths over, you know, the past, say, 10 or 20 years. children that have had adverse reactions, and that’s going to be debated. There’s going to say, well, there’s no proof that those vaccines caused the death. But it’s really funny, you know, if someone has evidence of a measles virus infection or any virus infection, for that matter, causality is assumed with very little other evidence. If If somebody says, well, my child had the vaccine, they were fine before, and then they died, all of a sudden the great sliding scale of evidence demands that you have to basically be able to write a treatise that is worthy of a Nobel Prize to prove causality and the great sliding scale of evidence. You see, the deaths from measles had actually dropped approximately 13 per 100,000 in 1900 to about 0.2 per 100,000 by 1960 before the vaccine came on board. And that was due to increased sanitation, refrigeration, medical care, general nutrition. And so, you know, taking a look at the risk benefit of this, even the CDC website claimed, reported that the vaccines often get too much credit for reducing infection. What vaccines do is, like I said in the earlier segment, you’ll get a measles infection. It might be asymptomatic, just like the chickenpox. There’s a lot of kids that get chickenpox, but they only have a single pock. It might be on their scalp, and they have asymptomatic chickenpox. So the vaccine is pretty good at helping reduce severity of the symptoms, but you have to be vaccinated first. I think it’s a mistake for doctors to try to vaccinate a child who’s being who has measles. Second, the data on hospitalization are amplified. The number of cases is really low, but they’re hospitalizing kids for the sake of isolating them, which is not a standard of care, and you think about it, it’s dangerous. It’s dangerous to bring children to a hospital if they have an active measles infection. They might spread it to the staff or to other children who are immunocompromised. It’s quite remarkable that they’re using hospitals this way um and it makes you wonder why why they want to do that but you’re right natural infection induces you know robust lifelong immunity i’m not saying that people should throw measles parties again but you know say that there’s a benefit to having measles in fact uh there’s a good amount of science that shows that that children who um are vaccinated but who get and people who are vaccinated but get measles subclinical measles can still transmit and that transmission then can provide natural subclinical boosting so you know the reality is that keeping kids out of school because they’re not vaccinated as if they’re the only ones that can possibly transmit that is just absolutely not based on science there’s no scientific basis for that it’s just another point of coercion so with asymptomatic flips the narrative that way but what can children what can children experience that would reduce their risk of serious measles infection i would say that the science is pretty strong that they should have a well-balanced diet they should take their vitamins contrary to what peter hotez says vitamins do matter in terms of health as to cofactors and minerals. And just citing science here, not giving medical advice, but elderberry seems to help. Grapeseed oil can help. Cod liver oil seems to help. Sorry, doctors working with Robert F. Kennedy Jr. have informed him that aerosolized budesonide can help. And so, yeah, there are things that people can do, and I would encourage them to talk with their doctor, especially if – find a naturopathic doctor. And, you know, take their time to do a little bit of research on this. And don’t do anything crazy. Just follow the advice of people who – No, what will help mitigate the severity of it, there are some ways of reducing fever that do not involve acetaminophen. Acetaminophen is a bad idea. It actually depletes glutathione in the blood. It’s an over-the-counter, so you don’t need a script for it. But even Paul Offit from Children’s Hospital, when he finally saw the data on the association between having a A high fever treated by acetaminophen after the MMR shot said maybe we’re treating post-vaccination fever too aggressively. So, yeah, you can take a look at herbal remedies for fever, not just from, you know, an herbalist book, but talk to your naturopathic doctor who has clinical experience with these things. And they’ll take your telemedicine is legal now, still legal. So they’ll take your case by phone. They don’t have to bring the kid with measles to the doctor’s office. And, yeah, so I would say the more informed you are as a parent as well, the better off your child will be. And, yeah, talk to other parents and see how it’s going for them.
SPEAKER 12 :
Well, and we’ve got just a little bit of time on this. We interviewed, now that we’re prerecording for this particular show, last week we talked with a couple of – Let’s see, a holopathic nutritionist. Hopefully I’m saying that correctly. And out here in Colorado, there is a piece of legislation. It has bipartisan sponsorship on it that basically would require licensure for – it’s holistic. That’s what it is, holistic nutritionists. And that you would have to have a license, such as a dietician, to – to basically give advice regarding nutrition. And it is punishable if you give that advice via penalties of misdemeanor and jail time. And so we are shedding light on this because this licensure is i don’t think necessary but when we had two of these holistic nutritionists on they said that there was legislation like this in eight other states as well and uh so i’m i’m very concerned about that uh dr jack and i know i’m just kind of throwing this out at you you weren’t aware of it but i’m very concerned about this piece of legislation
SPEAKER 05 :
Well, doesn’t that mean that nutrition is a very fundamental part of our health and we’re over the target when we talk about making sure you have proper nutrition and what proper nutrition is. You know, the FDA is under new leadership and we’re going to see some moms who are fed up with, you know, the old food pyramid, really petitioning, working and maybe going in and getting office positions in the FDA to help reconstruct the dietary plan for all of America. So listen, there’s all this argument and debate about what’s the right diet. There isn’t a right diet. There’s a right diet for the same people at different times, and there’s a right diet for different people at the same time. And so talking to a nutritionist is a good idea, but if they follow the FDA guidelines, you’re going to be eating far too many carbs. You’re not going to have the bulk of what we know is what our bodies need. You have to have oils, healthy oils. You have to have Protein from meat. You have to have vegetables for vitamins and cofactors. We really don’t want simplified carbs like rice and potatoes and sugars. We don’t want white bread. We try to eat complex carbs. It’s fine, but they shouldn’t be organic. The fact is you’re going to see that glyphosate and other pesticides are probably key to a lot of the chronic illness that we see, a lot of the problems that we see neurodevelopmentally as well as immunologically. And people go over to Italy and they eat food over there that they can’t eat in the United States and they don’t feel like garbage after eating them. Well, that’s the pesticides and the dyes and the artificial chemicals. There’s 85 pesticides that are banned in Europe that are not banned in the United States. And that issue is going to be taken head on by organizations like Moms Across America. Okay. By the FDA and under Bobby’s leadership, we’re going to see great discussions about this and great action, I think.
SPEAKER 12 :
Well, stay tuned on this. And I wonder if that’s why we’re seeing some of this legislation at these local levels. And we’re going to go to break. I’m talking with Dr. James Lyons-Weiler. We’re pre-recording the show for Holy Week. And the show comes to you because of our amazing sponsors. For everything mortgages, reach out to Lauren Levy.
SPEAKER 19 :
That’s 303-880-8881 Call now.
SPEAKER 14 :
You’d like to get in touch with one of the sponsors of The Kim Monson Show, but you can’t remember their phone contact or website information. Find a full list of advertising partners on Kim’s website, kimmonson.com. That’s Kim, M-O-N-S-O-N dot com.
SPEAKER 13 :
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SPEAKER 12 :
And welcome back to The Kim Munson Show. Be sure and check out our website. That is KimMunson, M-O-N-S-O-N.com. Sign up for our weekly email newsletter and you’ll get first look at our upcoming guests as well as our most recent essays. I did want to say thank you to Laramie Energy for their goal sponsorship of the show because it is reliable, efficient, and affordable. and abundant energy sources from coal, natural gas, and oil that helps power our lives, fuels our hopes and dreams, and empowers us to change our own personal climate. Also wanted to mention the U.S. MC Memorial Foundation, and they are having their second annual golf tournament in mid-May. And you can make your reservation for that. It’s a limited number of golfers. And you can do that by going to usmcmemorialfoundation.org. And I’m talking with Dr. James Zines-Weiler. You can find him at Substack under Popular Rationalism and also the creator of ipac-edu.org, these amazing educational programs. And in particular, you might check out this power and social change that is going on right now. Dr. Jack, we’ve got a few minutes left, and you’ve got a piece that is published, I think, in between the time we’ve recorded this and when this interview broadcasts, and that is regarding third-dose toxicity on the COVID jab. So let’s talk a little bit about that.
SPEAKER 05 :
Yeah, there’s a growing body of scientific evidence that shows that the toxicity in terms of adverse events and deaths following the COVID-19 vaccines is highest, about seven-fold higher. in the third dose than in the prior doses, which doesn’t make any sense whatsoever. Usually you would think that, you know, the first and second dose would take out the people that, you know, were susceptible, so they would stop vaccinating or die. And this is bad. This means that people that came through dose one and dose two, you know, the series of double doses, really, boosters, they have seven times the risk of a serious adverse event or death, including cancers and things like that, following the third dose. of mRNA-based vaccines. So we’re looking at excess mortality. Everybody sees the data. For some reason, post-COVID, there’s excess mortality. In April of 2020, I predicted that this kind of thing could happen because of pathogenic priming. The more exposure you have to the spike protein, the more likely it is that your body’s going to die. suffer the consequences of that exposure, whether it’s due to infection or due to injection. Since we know the vaccine doesn’t protect you against getting infected again, you’re simply repeatedly exposing yourself to spike protein from both sources, infection and injection. And so taking a really good look at the data here, using the data from Thailand’s Ministry of Public Health, Dr. Michael Northcott recently published a preprint They showed that there’s correlations among all age groups of excess higher deaths, particularly those age 15 to 59. And the association that is the correlation is very strong. And the more vaccinated provinces have higher, excuse me, higher all cause mortality. So that’s just one study. But there are there are other studies and other reports that cause us to take pause on the medical ethics about what’s going on here. You know, regardless of which part of the country or the world that people are looking at, Australia, New Zealand, Thailand, Europe, we see that the larger the number of doses a person has, the more likely they are to have death from any cause. And, you know, this is not just a correlation. 30% of breakthrough infections followed the third or the fourth dose, according to a study that we published in my journal, Science, Public Health Policy, and the Law. And that was by Dr. Jessica Rose. This virus and this vaccine have a particularly nasty effect on our immune system, the spike protein in particular. I want to talk about the toxicity of the spike protein. Since you can’t escape the toxicity of the spike protein by vaccinating, you’re really just repeatedly exposing yourself to one of the most potent toxicants, the spike protein, that the world has ever seen. And remember, it’s most likely, almost certainly, as I concluded in January of 2020, first scientist in North America to say it, second scientist in the world, the first scientist was in Italy. This virus came from the lab. So we’re looking at possible repeated exposure to something that was studied as a potential bioweapon, even if it’s in a response program where people were developing it out of concern about whether we could protect people from it with a vaccine or not. All data sources are pointing to this. So Jessica Rose has papers that are studied. Jibo has a paper that was published and retracted from Japan. Nick Holscher and Peter McCullough have found autopsy findings. The highest rate of deaths follow, you know, in autopsies is third dose. So the more boosters, the more death and the more disease. And now we have… Cleveland Clinic data from 2023 showed that the most serious events happened after the third dose. And so the data now from Thailand are just another, hopefully, nail in the coffin of the vaccine. And so from all around the world, we see all kinds of data pointing this out. But if you see no explanation of excess mortality, other than… exposure to the spike protein, then why in the world would anybody want to expose themselves willfully to the spike protein? You know, when we have protocols for recovery from spike that, you know, can be very helpful. So I’m going to be publishing this article this week, and the look for pathogenic priming is real, and it is killing people. By any measure, boosters are a threat to public health.
SPEAKER 12 :
Okay, and they can find that at Popular Rationalism on Substack?
SPEAKER 05 :
Yes, ocularationalism.substack.com.
SPEAKER 12 :
Okay, Dr. Jack, thank you so much. I wish you and yours a very happy Easter, and thank you for making this interview happen.
SPEAKER 05 :
Happy Easter, and I hope everyone finds blessings in every day.
SPEAKER 12 :
And our quote for the end of the show is Marcus Tullius Cicero, and he said this, It is not enough to acquire wisdom. It is necessary to employ it. So today, be grateful, read great books, think good thoughts, listen to beautiful music, communicate and listen well, live honestly and authentically, strive for high ideals, and like Superman, stand for truth, justice, and the American way. My friends, you are not alone. God bless you. God bless America. Stay tuned for our number two.
SPEAKER 08 :
Young like a new moon rising fierce. Through the rain and lightning. Wandering out into this great unknown. I don’t want no one to cry. But tell them if I don’t survive.
SPEAKER 17 :
The views and opinions expressed on KLZ 560 are those of the speaker, commentators, hosts, their guests, and callers. They are not necessarily the views and opinions of Crawford Broadcasting or KLZ management, employees, associates, or advertisers. KLZ 560 is a Crawford Broadcasting God and country station.
SPEAKER 03 :
It’s the Kim Munson Show, analyzing the most important stories.
SPEAKER 12 :
The socialization of transportation, education, energy, housing, and water, what it means is that government controls it through rules and regulations.
SPEAKER 03 :
The latest in politics and world affairs.
SPEAKER 12 :
Under this guise of bipartisanship and nonpartisanship, it’s actually tapping down the truth.
SPEAKER 03 :
Today’s current opinions and ideas.
SPEAKER 12 :
On an equal field in the battle of ideas, mistruths and misconceptions is getting us into a world of hurt.
SPEAKER 03 :
Is it freedom or is it force? Let’s have a conversation.
SPEAKER 12 :
And welcome to our number two of the Kim Munson Show. Be sure and check out our website. That is KimMunson, M-O-N-S-O-N.com. Sign up for our weekly email newsletter. You can email me at Kim at KimMunson.com as well. Thank you to all of you who support us. We’re an independent voice, and we search for truth and clarity by looking at these issues through the lens of freedom versus force, force versus freedom. If something’s a good idea, you should not have to force people to do it. I want to say thank you to the team I get to work with. That’s Producer Joe, Luke, Rachel, Zach, Echo, Charlie, Mike, Teresa, Amanda. Thank you so much for having me. We are pre-recording for this week, for most of the days here of Holy Week of Easter. And our regular guest, second hour on Wednesdays, is Trent Luce. And you know him, sixth generation farmer and rancher, hails from Nebraska. And as you and I both agree, we don’t want hail to occur in Nebraska. You just hail from Nebraska, Trent Luce.
SPEAKER 06 :
Did you say we’ve already done an hour? I don’t remember doing an hour just before this. Are you sure? Are you sure this is the second hour?
SPEAKER 12 :
This is the second hour. I prerecorded the first hour earlier today with a friend of yours, Dr. James Linesweiler.
SPEAKER 06 :
Oh, I haven’t seen Jack for a long time. And I wonder, too, are you trying out for like a remake of MASH or something? You go through that Echo Charlie thing so fast, it’s like you’re talking on a radio in South Korea.
SPEAKER 12 :
I sound like Radar, huh?
SPEAKER 06 :
You do sound like Radar. You don’t look like Radar, but your tendencies are kind of like Radar. Echo Charlie.
SPEAKER 12 :
I know. But that is actually the names of all these people that I work with, which is pretty amazing. And so Trent Luce, we’re going to talk about something that maybe I don’t understand. It’s a bit out of my comfort zone. We talked a little bit about it this last week. And it precipitated from something that you brought up regarding the Maude family, which is apparently a couple. They’re in their 30s. They’ve been farming 25 acres. The family’s been farming them that acreage for since like 1952. And now what the forest department says that that’s not their land and they want to put them in jail. Am I getting the gist of this correct? Yes.
SPEAKER 06 :
You got the gist 100%. The only thing that I want to add is that this stems back to last fall. So I got my first phone call. I believe it was August. And so this did not just happen, but the indictment occurred last fall. And it’s clear to say that this was not under the current administration. It was under the last administration. But because there’s a trial is set to start, it’s getting a renewed attention and, uh, Fortunately, more people are putting some sunlight on what’s really going on here.
SPEAKER 12 :
Well, and so for people that haven’t heard, let’s go ahead and set this up of what we talked about last week.
SPEAKER 06 :
The Maude family, and we’re talking right now about Charles and Heather, have been farming. Charles’ family has been farming in Custer County area. The Badlands, right on the south side of the Badlands of South Dakota, and that ranges over west towards Custer State Park. It is in Custer County. And last spring, someone, this is the reported story, a hunter saw that there was a fence out of place and that the mods were farming 25 acres that wasn’t rightfully theirs. They reported it to the U.S. Forest Service. The Forest Service said… that you are farming land that is actually belonging to the U.S. Forest Service, not to you. And they had not moved a fence. The fence had been there since 1952. And the family’s been doing this, been farming and grazing. And immediately, Charles, once he was notified of this, he said, well, tell me what to do. We’ll fix it. They did not give them any grace whatsoever. They said, we’re not going to tell you what to do. We’re going to come and arrest you. And he and his wife, Heather, were both indicted on separate charges so that they have to defend each other separately. And as I mentioned earlier, this has now come to a head where the trial is set to start this week. And so where it’s going to go from here, we don’t really know. But that really brings back this whole What we call the checkerboard, you know, Kim, we’ve been talking more lately about the land that is owned by the federal government compared to the land that is owned by the individual citizens of this country through what we call deeded property. Thirty three percent, one in three acres is owned either by federal or state government. The breakdown is actually twenty eight point four percent is owned by the federal government. The balance of four point eight percent is owned by four point six percent is owned by deeded property and individual owners. And that has led us to this point where there’s a lot of uncertainty. Now, I can tell you in the past week, I’ve been very proud to be a part of a group with many South Dakota state legislators who are bringing this to the attention of the federal government and Senator John Thune, Senator Mike Rounds. Senator Mike Rounds, former governor of South Dakota, has been the only federal representative of the state of South Dakota that has stepped up to do anything. And so we’re in a position where this family is 40 years old, two young children continuing to do what it is they do, take care of land and livestock to improve opportunity for a life of human beings, producing food and fiber, are now facing charges of stealing property.
SPEAKER 12 :
So, Trent. Federal charges. Federal charges. I have to ask this. It doesn’t seem reasonable that this could escalate from Hunter reports, goes to the Forest Service, Forest Service, that the mods, a couple that they say, what can we do? And they immediately go to arrest you. That’s pretty daunting. There wasn’t any – I mean, I could see how emotions could get pretty whipped up on this. So was there any emotions between the Maude family and the Forest Service that would escalate this to this point?
SPEAKER 06 :
Zero. Really? And, Kim, because I’ve been in this trench for 25 years, this is – it’s rare – But it’s not uncommon. I’ve personally dealt with six situations similar to this. The very first one was a gentleman by the name of Kit Laney in New Mexico. And he had almost identical situation take place. They ended up putting Kit Laney in prison, a rancher in New Mexico, because they came to round up his cattle and get him off of the federal land that he said he had no right to. He had proof that it was his land. as part of a lease with the U.S. Forest Service. They arrested Kit Laney and put him in prison for threatening an officer with a deadly weapon. You know what that weapon was?
SPEAKER 12 :
A shovel? What?
SPEAKER 06 :
Spurs on his boots. Anybody can go look this up. And this was like my first introduction to what was really taking place. And then probably the most prominent individual who took the federal government on in terms of the leases they had for the land, was Wayne Hage in Nevada, the late Wayne Hage. By the way, Kit Laney served his time in prison, then he just was so fed up with it, he moved to Brazil. I think he’s moved back to New Mexico. Wayne Hage has a son and daughters who continue the fight, and they were fighting the federal government, but his ranch is now no longer in the family, generational ranch. The one that I was also personally involved with, on a daily basis for two years, happened to the Hammond family in Oregon, in Harney County, Oregon. And it became a public, the public became aware of what had happened to the Hammond family because on my Monday radio program called Rural Route Radio, for the past 19 years, I’ve had Hank Vogler on the air with me. Hank Vogler, we talk about these issues all the time and how this is just commonplace. If you’re dealing with the federal government, they try to squash you and put you down. Do I need to pause, Kim?
SPEAKER 12 :
Yeah, let’s do pause. I’m talking with Trent Luce, and this is about farmers and ranchers and their dealings with the federal government and land that they may have leases to. They’ve been farming for a while, and this is of great concern because we’re hearing the word fines and prison issues. And so we need to unpack this even more. We’re doing this and we get to do this because of our great sponsors. One of those is the Roger Mangan State Farm Insurance Team. And Roger knows there are a lot of unknowns, obviously, that could keep you up at night. But your insurance coverage should not be one of those. So give them a call at 303-795-8855. Like a good neighbor, the Roger Mangan team is there. And it is Holy Week, which is springtime, Passover. So many things are occurring right now. We are pre-recording most of the shows for this week. And I’m so pleased to have on the line with me one of our great sponsors of both the Kim Munson Show and America’s Veterans Stories. And that is Lauren Levy. Lauren Levy, welcome to the show. Hey, good morning, Kim. It’s good to have you. And Lauren, we’ve become friends over all these years. And the service that you provide for your clients is above and beyond as what I see. And you strive for excellence in the mortgage arena. There’s so much going on out there for people. And I think there are people that are looking maybe for a new home or maybe a reverse mortgage with all the crazy stuff that’s going on. And I look at this time as new beginnings, new ways to address challenges in our family, a new home, new mortgage, all those things. And you really are great about helping people with that.
SPEAKER 04 :
Well, we try to be. Thank you. It’s the largest decision that most people will ever be involved in in their life. And it’s their biggest investment, typically. And, you know, real estate agents help them find a home, but we try to help them get their financing in line so that it doesn’t put them in an untenable position where, you know, they have regrets or, you know, they can’t afford it and have to make a change or something. So it’s really important to work with people both on the real estate side and the financing side to make sure that things go the right way and that you don’t end up in any type of position you didn’t want to be in.
SPEAKER 12 :
Okay. And… Lauren, it seems like I saw a report recently that inflation was cooling. Am I dreaming that or did I see that kind of a report recently?
SPEAKER 04 :
Yeah, I think we just saw we’ve seen a couple. We’ve seen like PPI and CPI numbers just the last couple of days, even this morning. And I think part of it is that. it is cooling. And the question is always Kim is why? And so you’d want it to happen naturally just with a good economy, but price is still coming down versus the question is, is it happening for that? Is it happening? Cause people are nervous with what’s going on with the market uncertainty, the whole tariff issue, uncertainty about their job, things like that. And so we are seeing a little pullback in the, uh, inflation numbers, but we’re also starting to see some people say, you know, are we heading to a recession now or not? And that’s the question, right? Why are things doing what they’re doing?
SPEAKER 12 :
It seems like people can’t be happy. But I know it’s a little rocky. It’s a little tenuous, as you mentioned, untenable in some ways. But I really feel positive about this. And so what do you think about that, Lorne?
SPEAKER 04 :
I think I agree. You know, I think there’s always going to be something right. And that’s why you and I talk constantly about, you know, if you’re buying a home, being comfortable with it, working with people that are that you trust, that are credible, that won’t put you in a bad position. Right. Because, you know, it could be something different another day. Right now it could be inflation or the tariffs. Next it could be, you know, something with terrorism or, you know, politics geopolitically. It tends to always be something going on. And so, you know, if a payment that you’re looking at to buy a home is affordable to you and it’s something you can manage, it can’t get any worse than that. That’s the highest payment you’ll have. And so it can only get better if rates drop and there’s an opportunity to refinance. And people like my company will always help you and try to absorb some of the fees while doing it. So, you know, that’s what I say always to you when we talk is, you know, if you can afford to do it now and the payment fits your budget and you find a home that you love, I would do it. And then we can always react, you know. The only wild card in that is if someone’s not comfortable in their job or not certain of it. That would cause someone to take a pause.
SPEAKER 12 :
Well, I think there’s a great opportunity. And you can help people in 49 of the 50 states, just not New York. And you work with a lot of different companies. And the other thing that I love is that for Kim Munson Show listeners, you will pay for their appraisal if that is needed. So what is the best way for people to reach you, Lorne Levy?
SPEAKER 04 :
The best way is always just give us a call at 303-880-8881. That’s Lorne Levy for Everything Mortgages, 303-880-8881. Lorne Levy, we will talk with you next week.
SPEAKER 18 :
Awesome. Thank you so much, Kim. It seems like we are getting squeezed everywhere. Inflation, high taxes, at the gas pump. Where can you save money? Well, when you bundle your insurance coverage with the Roger Mangan State Farm Insurance Team, you may save money on your insurance premiums. The Roger Mangan Team will help you with a personalized plan to cover all your insurance needs. For your home, auto, boat, and renter’s coverage. For a complimentary appointment, call the Roger Mangan team now at 303-795-8855. That number again is 303-795-8855. Like a good neighbor, the Roger Mangan team is there.
SPEAKER 11 :
Property is surely a right of mankind as real as liberty, wrote founding father John Adams. Remax realtor Karen Levine has been working diligently at the local, county, state, and national levels to protect property rights and home ownership. Karen has navigated the often challenging Colorado metro real estate market for years. That’s 303-877-7516.
SPEAKER 14 :
You’d like to get in touch with one of the sponsors of The Kim Munson Show, but you can’t remember their phone contact or website information. Find a full list of advertising partners on Kim’s website, kimmunson.com. That’s Kim, M-O-N-S-O-N dot com.
SPEAKER 08 :
Salute the ones who died. And the ones that gave their lives so we don’t have to sacrifice.
SPEAKER 12 :
And welcome back to the Kim Munson Show. Be sure and check out our website. That is Kim Munson, M-O-N-S-O-N dot com. Sign up for our weekly email newsletter. You can email me at Kim at Kim Munson dot com as well. Thank you to all of you who support us. We’re an independent voice and we search for truth and clarity. by looking at these issues through the lens of freedom versus force, force versus freedom. If something’s a good idea, you should not have to force people to do it. And the show comes to you because of our sponsors. And I want to say thank you to Laramie Energy for their goal sponsorship of the show, because it’s reliable, efficient, affordable and abundant energy sources from oil, natural gas and coal that powers our lives, fuels our hopes and dreams and empowers us to change our own personal climate. And talking with Trent Liu, sixth-generation farmer and rancher, And so much of the land in the West is owned by the federal government. A lot of it’s owned by the state government. We actually see that there are counties and municipalities that own land. I don’t really think that’s the proper role of government. But we’re talking about federal land that has been leased to farmers or ranchers. And there seems to be then… I don’t know, a misunderstanding. How can this mix-up occur where then individual citizens are being fined and sent to prison? How can that happen, Trent Luce?
SPEAKER 06 :
Well, come back to it and finish my thought. Much of this is a result of what we call the checkerboard effect, where you have one section that is deeded property, another section right next to it, and a section of 640 acres one mile by one mile. You go between this land that you have a lease on, and most of these leases on federal land are tied to, it’s a permit, not a lease. Let me correct myself. It’s a permit, not a lease. They’re tied to vested water rights. Because the truth of the matter is, back in the day when the Homestead Act was put into play, the land we’re talking about here that the federal government ultimately owns, which is, by the way, unconstitutional. You said you don’t think it’s a good idea. It’s unconstitutional. But anybody who would lay claim to that and develop the water was then given title to use the property. And it’s very convoluted unless you look at it that way, because you literally own the property rights on the grass, but you don’t own the dirt. But you own the right to the water because you have a vested water right. And in most of the cases, that’s what we’re talking about in that discrepancy. But it becomes cloudy because you could be grazing 2,000 acres. And within that 2,000 acres, you could have a couple of sections which are owned by the U.S. Forest Service, which is part of the Department of Agriculture. And you could have deeded property. And then to really make matters even more confusing, you could have Bureau of Land Management land. in the same area which is part of the Department of Interior and the Department of Interior do not communicate with the folks at the Department of Agriculture and in Nevada it’s in the USDA handbook that says a government entity cannot own livestock on a permit and yet one of the largest livestock owners today is Southern Nevada Water Authority who is confiscating these permits so that they can get the vested water rights from people like Dean Baker, if you want to go search what Dean Baker lived through in Nevada, because we had this infinite wisdom of building this great big metropolitan area in the middle of a desert called Las Vegas. And so if you’ve got a million people in a desert, what do you need? You need water. So they come and, in many cases, you will remember – The Clive and Bundy situation, right?
SPEAKER 12 :
I do. I remember the headlines.
SPEAKER 06 :
This is what it’s all about. Right here, this is exactly what we’re talking about. And what they did to Clive and Bundy was they would go into his allotments and they would try to identify a particular endangered species turtle so that they would remove him from his allotments so that they could take his water to Las Vegas. That, in a nutshell, is what that was all about. Hmm. So… Fast forward to the one that I’m personally involved with up to my ears. In the fall of 2015, Hank Wilgler on one of my radio broadcasts says, and Trent, before we sign off here today, I want to give a shout out to my friend Dwight Hammond, who was my childhood friend. And Hank lived in a ranch in Nevada today, but he grew up in Harney County, neighboring to where the Hammonds were. And one day the families, the two families, Hank, his wife and kids, and Dwight and Susie and their kids, were at a picnic on a Sunday afternoon in Harney County, Oregon, by the Malheur National Wildlife Refuge. And Hank looked at Dwight Hammond and said, and we’re talking about like 1990, okay, so let me put this in context, 1990. Hank looked at Dwight Hammond and said, hey, Dwight, you know, that water, that spring right over there, You should be able to lay claim to that. That’s not government property. That’s your property. So he did. And the federal government took him to court. He beat the federal government to a claim on water. And so the Bureau of Land Management had this ax to grind against the Hammond family because he set a precedent on how water rights could be acquired in modern day instead of pre-1900 water rights. Fast forward to, I believe it was about 2012. I’m going to cut out a lot of stuff, and don’t hold me to the exact year, but I think it was 2012. There’s a fire. Lightning hits one of the Hammond allotments. It starts a fire. Stephen Hammond calls. and says we have a fire. This is normal protocol. We have a fire. If we don’t start a backfire, there’s potential of losing a hay crop plus maybe a million acres of federal land to a fire. They said, yes, start the fire to do a backburn. The best way to control fires was fire. They did that. Got it out. No problem. Problem solved. Only then they came and arrested him for lighting fire to federal property. And there’s a lot of things happening here, but what Hank brought to our attention in the fall of 2015 on the radio is that his friends were going to be tried for a crime that was in no way, shape, or form a crime. And because of the Patriot Act, this fire on federal land was considered an act of terrorism. And they were ultimately convicted. By a jury, and there’s a lot of stories I could tell you about how this jury was put together and the judge that Obama specifically assigned to this case. So, Barack Obama specifically put a judge in on this case.
SPEAKER 12 :
There couldn’t be any lawfare, could there?
SPEAKER 06 :
What do you mean?
SPEAKER 12 :
You know, this lawfare that’s going on all the time with different parts of government.
SPEAKER 06 :
I have no idea that that would never happen.
SPEAKER 12 :
No, okay. Continue on.
SPEAKER 06 :
So… Okay, first of all, let me back up. I misspoke. I spoke out of turn. The original judge had to issue a sentence, and the law states that if you’re convicted of an act of terrorism on federal property in violation of the Patriot Act, you have a minimum mandatory of five years. The original judge said… There is no intent. This law we’re talking about with the Patriot Act does not in any way, shape or form apply here. I am not going to sentence to what they tell me that I have to do a sentence. Dwight Hammond, the father to one year and the son, Stephen Hammond, to three years. They served that time. Both of those served that time. And then when they got out, Barack Obama. brought the case, and his Department of Justice brought the case back after the two had served their time and said, these two did not serve the minimum mandatory of five years. We’re going to rehear the case. Well, everybody was yelling, you can’t do that. Well, they weren’t retrying them for conviction. They were retrying them for sentencing. And that’s when Barack Obama specifically put an appointed federal judge in there. Long story short, they sent them both Back to prison to fill the minimum mandatory five years for committing a federal act against the federal government, federal property.
SPEAKER 12 :
Did they serve that time?
SPEAKER 06 :
So that was at the end of Barack Obama’s term in 2016.
SPEAKER 12 :
Okay, we’re going to keep that as a cliffhanger. I’m talking with Trent Luce, sixth generation farmer and rancher. We’re talking about federal lands, leases, permits. How does that all work? And very important discussions. And all this happens because we have amazing sponsors. And one of those great sponsors, and that is Karen Levine for Everything Residential Real Estate.
SPEAKER 02 :
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SPEAKER 19 :
We’ll be right back. Knowledge is power and preparation leads to success. Call Lauren Levy at 303-880-8881 so that you are prepared for the opportunities in the mortgage market. That’s Lauren Levy at 303-880-8881.
SPEAKER 10 :
Focused and wise marketing is essential for your success, especially during tough economic times. If you love The Kim Munson Show, strive for excellence and understand the importance of engaging in the battle of ideas that is raging in America. Then talk with Kim about partnership, sponsorship opportunities. Email Kim at kimmunson.com. Kim focuses on creating relationships with individuals and businesses that are tops in their fields. So they are the trusted experts listeners turn to when looking for products or services. Kim personally endorses each of her sponsors. Again, reach out to Kim at Kim Munson dot com.
SPEAKER 08 :
I miss maybe sitting on the porch drinking ice.
SPEAKER 12 :
And welcome back to The Kim Munson Show. Check out our website. That is KimMunson, M-O-N-S-O-N.com. Sign up for our weekly email newsletter. You can email me at Kim at KimMunson.com as well. Thank you to all of you who support us. We’re an independent voice and we search for truth and clarity by looking at these issues through the lens of freedom versus force, force versus freedom. If something’s a good idea, you should not have to force people to do it. And do check out the Center for American Values located in Pueblo, Colorado. They are nonpartisan. They’re nonpolitical. But they’re focused on these foundational principles of honor, integrity, and patriotism. So more information, go to AmericanValueCenter.org. And we are prerecording for most of Holy Week this week between Palm Sunday and Easter. And Wednesday, second hour, our featured guest is Trent Liu, sixth-generation farmer and rancher. And we are talking with him about federal lands, individuals having permits for grazing, for farming. And we were talking about, let’s see, now which family is it? This was the Hammond family. Okay. And the father had, they were convicted of, they did a backburn. But they were convicted under the Patriot Act, which I will just make a comment. When the Patriot Act was proposed, Trent Luce, I looked at it and I wasn’t real involved in politics at the time. But I thought, hmm, I don’t know that I think this is a great, great idea. But it was sold to us as to protect the American people. But what we have found is it really opened up more and more government watching us. And I didn’t even know about this terrorism thing. So the Hammonds, the father and the son, were convicted of this backburn. They said that it was a terrorist act. And there was minimum sentencing of five years. The judge, the initial judge, said, well, that doesn’t make sense. Gave the father one year, the son three years. And then when Barack Obama was in office, gosh, you talk about, I think, wanting to be so onerous on this, brought them back for more sentencing. Am I getting that all correct?
SPEAKER 06 :
You got that all right, except the whole thing in terms of the court system happened during the Obama two terms.
SPEAKER 12 :
Okay, Obama two terms.
SPEAKER 06 :
So he was president for the entire time of what we’ve talked about so far. So then January 2nd, 2016, is the day they were to report back to prison, and they ended up going to Terminal Island outside of San Francisco. That’s where they spent the next couple of years. But we already talked about Bundy’s. Ammon Bundy, his brother Ryan Bundy, and LaVoy Finnegan, The town of Burns, Oregon, in Harney County, had a parade. They literally had a parade bringing awareness to this atrocity that was committed. And I also want to include a major failure in this case was the Harney County sheriff. He had the opportunity to take a stand and protect the citizens of his county as a constitutional sheriff would, and he failed to do so. And that was always a burr under a lot of people’s saddle. But there was a parade. On that weekend, on Saturday, and on Sunday morning, a group of 12 individuals went to Malheur National Wildlife Refuge, which is about 35 miles from Burns, the town itself. And they went there to occupy that refuge until the Hammonds were released and the justice was actually served. That was on Sunday that that occurred. On Wednesday, I got a phone call. And they said, and this was starting to be news. You couldn’t really get a lot about it, but I knew about it because I was wired in. And I was the reason people knew about the Hamlins to begin with, not because of me, but because of Hank Wilger and my program. But I got a call from a guy named Tim Smith, who’s still a friend today. They had put together a committee, a Harney County Committee for Safety Committee. And the Committee for Safety was like an extension of local government trying to help and bring about constitutional rights to the citizens of Harney County. And they said, Trent, we want you to emcee an event that we are going to bring to the forefront. He said, we’ve had six venues turn us down. We found a place that will host the event because nobody wanted any attention. Nobody wanted to be perceived as taking on the federal government. I said, I’ll be there. You tell me when, and I’ll be there. And so I got to Burns, checked into a hotel. And by the way, I then partnered with Protect the Harvest to walk through everything that we were doing. So from this moment on, I’m working individually, but partnering with the folks at Protect the Harvest who, full circle, brought you and I together, which is why I wanted to include that. This is the most interesting meeting that I’ve been a part of in my life, Kim. We had what I would estimate to be 400 people present in this room. 200 of the people, these are general terms, 200 of the people are locals. They’re all packing a pistol on their hip. The other 200 people are media. I’ve never in my life seen so many media folks in one room. You name a media outlet anywhere in the world, from Tokyo to London to Los Angeles, they were present in that room. And as the emcee, my job was to make sure that, and this is how I started the meeting, I said my job is to make sure that we have a productive environment. You can be as passionate and as convicted as you want to be. You will not be rude. You will say what you have to say. I’m going to have my clock on you. You have five minutes. I’m cutting you off no matter where you’re at in your discussion. But we are going to have a true community meeting, and you’re going to get the opportunity to say what you want to say. For two and a half hours, I moderated this meeting, and I had people one at a time come up, and they would speak for five minutes, and I’d cut them off. And at the end of this meeting, virtually every single person who spoke said the same exact thing in their own way, in their own words. They all said, we have no concern about what is happening at Malheur National Wildlife Refuge. Our concern, and I say that because all the media at this time, including NPR and the national media, was talking about how these guys have occupied Malheur National Wildlife Refuge and they’re causing a threat to the people of Burns and the people of Burns want them to go home. And instead, the meeting that I emceed, every single person, every single person said, we have no concern about what is happening at this refuge with Hammond Bundy, Ryan Bundy, and LaVoy Finnegan. We’re very concerned about what the federal government is doing to our town. They were terrorizing the school. They were terrorizing businesses in the community. They were causing the problems. I did interviews with people who were the FBI was setting up a check, a checkpoint. I interviewed one 75-year-old lady who almost had a complete anxiety attack when they stopped her, searched her vehicle, searched her. It was unbelievable what they were doing to these people of Harney County. And so the next morning, I went to the refuge. But before I went to the refuge, I couldn’t wait to get my laptop out and open up and to see how the media reported this particular event that I just had emceed the night before. I’ll never forget it. The first story I found was the Los Angeles Times. Los Angeles Times story went something like this. There was a meeting, a town hall meeting last night in Burns, Oregon, about the occupation of Maui National Wildlife Refuge. The folks of Burns, Oregon, are fed up with what is happening at that refuge. They wish for Ammon Bundy to go home. Not one person said that in that meeting, Kim. So then I started looking at other media, all of them. It was like there was one story written, and then all these media sources shared it. They all said the same thing, and it was a blatant lie. I emceed the meeting. That is not what happened. There was one guy who was an independent journalist who got a hold of me, and he said, I don’t know what just happened. I’ve been watching what everybody else has reported. That’s not what happened at that meeting. It was a very good education for me, and they will print. The article was already written before the meeting actually occurred. So the next day, I go out and I spend most of the day at the refuge. I did an interview. You can still find this interview with Ammon Bundy that first week. I had a good conversation with LaVoy Finicum, Ryan Bundy, the whole ball of wax. I fully understand what was going on. I went and talked to local neighbors, and everybody was unanimous. We just want one thing. We want the Hammonds to be released. They’re unjustly in prison. A lot of things happened. I came home. I was speaking in Atlanta, Georgia, and I told you last week, and I so clearly remember, I was at dinner with a friend, Chris Schutze. I got a phone call from Dave Duquette, who was with Protect the Harvest. It was January 26, 2016, and Dave said, Trent, they got LaVoye. And so I turned on my television, and there was the sheriff of Grant County, Oregon, which is the neighboring county. These guys were in a car going to a meeting in the neighboring county, and what was posed is that they’re going to the neighboring county because Grant County, and you can find keywords about this, Grant County is a UN-free county, so if they can just go have a meeting in Grant County, and explain this to the sheriff of Grant County, who actually now has become a friend of mine, everything will be okay. Well, you have a video, and anybody can watch this. There was a helicopter following the cars, car had a pickup, headed to that meeting. LaVoy Finnegan was driving his pickup. And it’s very clear to see in this video, if you really know what happened, LaVoy got out, kind of lost his temper because they were putting a roadblock on him. There was a specific spot where they had planned to stop them and ambush them. And all of a sudden, and everybody knew, Lavoie kept a firearm in a holster underneath of his left shoulder. He had a shoulder holster. He kept it right there. You can see that there was a rubber bullet that came and hit Lavoie right about his shoulder. He reached for his shoulder. The minute he reached for his shoulder, he was murdered on the spot right there. That’s all on the video that you can watch. And then also I shared with you, Kim, the Shauna Cox video. She was videoing inside that pickup, and you can hear the shots dinging on that pickup left and right. That pickup was confiscated and never returned to the Finnegan family. And I’ve been very close to the Finnegan family. Jeanette Finnegan, his widow, has been fantastic. He’s got daughters and son. It’s all daughters. And that situation is sacrificing a guy. And the governor, Kate Brown, had actually said, there’s a virus in Harney County. We need to eliminate the virus. Two days later, LaVoy Penicum was killed.
SPEAKER 12 :
So this sounds like stuff from a movie. And so as a novice on this, it would appear that he was shot with a rubber bullet. He reaches for that because it hurts. And because he has a holster underneath his arm, that would give whoever shot at him saying, oh, my gosh, this was he was going to draw his firearm. Hence, this shooting him would be warranted. Am I am I am I connecting the dot?
SPEAKER 06 :
Correct. You’re exactly right. There’s one other thing that I want to add before we go to this break. And this was a telltale sign for me and has shaped me forever. There were 27 people arrested that day because when this all went down and LaVoy was murdered, the FBI alongside the Oregon State Patrol went into the headquarters and they arrested 27 people. After the trial, we’ll talk about the trial, but what I want to get out here before we go to this break is that 15 of the 27 that were in that compound were actually undercover detectives. or informants for the FBI.
SPEAKER 12 :
Really? Okay. And the plot thickens on all of this. We’re talking with Trent Luce, and these are important discussions. And the show comes to you because of our great sponsors. One of those is John Bozen with Bozen Law.
SPEAKER 15 :
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SPEAKER 16 :
All of Kim’s sponsors are an inclusive partnership with Kim and are not affiliated with or in partnership with KLZ or Crawford Broadcasting. If you would like to support the work of The Kim Munson Show and grow your business, contact Kim at her website, kimmunson.com. That’s kimmunson, M-O-N-S-O-N dot com.
SPEAKER 13 :
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SPEAKER 08 :
And it’s a great day to be alive. I know the sun’s
SPEAKER 12 :
And welcome back to The Kim Munson Show. Be sure and check out our website. That is KimMunson, M-O-N-S-O-N.com. Sign up for our weekly email newsletter. You can email me at Kim at KimMunson.com as well. Thank you to all of you who support us. We’re an independent voice and we search for truth and clarity by looking at these issues through the lens of freedom versus force, force versus freedom. Something’s a good idea. You shouldn’t have to force people to do it. And did want to mention the USMC Memorial Foundation. As they are raising money for the remodel of the Marine Memorial, which is located right here in Golden, Colorado, you can help them by going to usmcmemorialfoundation.org. Talking with Trent Luce about some things that happened in 2016 in Oregon. The real pressure point seems to be the federal government permitting for grazing and for farming. Trent has had experience in this arena. And so I have to tell you, Trin, I’ve always been a little uncomfortable with these stories, although as we fast forward through our recent history, it seems to raise more questions for me, for sure, because I was watching these headlines. I guess that’s what I should say. I was watching these headlines, and I was uncomfortable with what the headlines were saying about these people in Oregon.
SPEAKER 06 :
I was really uncomfortable with what they were saying because I was there. I knew it was a blatant lie. So let me give you another reason to be uncomfortable. Burns, Oregon, which I talked about, I just looked at a population, 2,700. So it’s less than 3,000 people. When they shot LaVoy and actually Ryan Bundy in the pickup was shot as well. They took Ryan Bundy and LaVoy’s body to the Burns, Oregon hospital that night. It happened, it was about dusk. I believe it was about 5.30. They took them to the hospital that night. We later learned in the next six months, I’m doing a six-month time frame here. The guy, there was a guy who lived in a cabin within a quarter of a mile where this shooting took place on this highway. on the edge of Harney County, Grant County line. I’ve been to this spot. And the guy who lived closest in a log cabin committed suicide two months later. The emergency room and where the hospital in Burns, Oregon, there were three nurses that committed suicide within six months of this time frame. I wasn’t taking any of that lying down. Kim, I said, number one, this is bigger towns. Maybe you have some issues with this. This is a small community and three nurses in a hospital all commit suicide within six months of this incident. So I went to work. I wanted to know who these nurses were. I actually found the father of one of these nurses because I found out he was a county commissioner in a different county in Oregon. I sent him an email, and he responded to my email point blank. He said, Mr. Luce, I know your intentions are well. I’ve put this behind me. I suggest you do the same.
SPEAKER 09 :
Okay.
SPEAKER 06 :
That was a guy whose daughter committed suicide, and without a doubt, I don’t believe she committed suicide. So that particular situation occurred yesterday. In January, the last week of January, the trial, I believe it went – I think the trial, if I remember right, was in April or May. And most of the people – I’ve already told you that 27 were arrested. Over half of them were either informants or undercover, so they automatically just dispersed. They just disappeared. They were no longer part of the judicial system. And everybody else that did not cut a deal – and plead to some agreement. Ammon Bundy, Ryan Bundy, they all were found not guilty by the jury of their peers in Portland, Oregon. It was an extremely emotional time. But then Ammon did not get his freedom because at the same time, they had reinstated charges from his father’s situation In Nevada, so they literally took him from the prison where he was found not guilty in Oregon to Nevada. They retried him for other crimes that he supposedly committed at the Bundy standoff. He, again, was found not guilty. And, I mean, there’s so many things about this. I do want to share this one story because it kind of brought closure for all of us. On January, I don’t believe it was the 26th, even though the incident happened January 26th, In 2016, Jeanette Finnegan, LaVoy Finnegan’s widow, called me and said, Trent, we are going to have that meeting in Grant County at the Grant County Fairgrounds LaVoy was heading to, and we want you to emcee the event if you would. I said, you don’t have to ask me twice, Jeanette, I’ll be there. And this had a completely different feel because now we know you don’t know who you can trust, who you can’t trust. But we put 400 people, and there are quite a few videos of this event that are still there. It was the most patriotic Christian event that you can imagine. And I was just proud to be a part of it. And the Finnegan family displayed so much courage. And he has daughters that are now on speaking tours and talking about what actually took place. And this whole story is really about how one man is willing to take a stand for freedom. LaVoy Finnegan’s Ride for Freedom. And I have a picture of him in his office on a horse because he just set the standard and example. And there’s one other thing that I forgot to mention that we went through that I think is relevant to share. I interviewed so many people, Kim. I probably interviewed 50 people during this time frame and after just trying to continue to make sure everybody knew everything that was going on. Well, there was a guy in Burns, Oregon named Butch. And the day of the parade… Butch thought that it would be a fantastic idea to go with the Bundys and Lavoie Fendicum and occupy Malheur National Wildlife Refuge. And he did. And before dark, he went to Ammon. And I know this because he did an interview with me after the fact. He went home. He said, Ammon, I support your cause. I just don’t feel right being here. I feel like I’m supposed to be home with my family, not with you. Ammon said, We don’t think any less of you, Butch. We appreciate your support. Anything you can do, it would be fantastic. Please be safe. The next day, the FBI showed up at his house. They knew that he had left. They’re monitoring everything, right? The next day, the FBI showed up at his house. I still have this interview somewhere. I can find it. I should find it. But he said, Trent, the most interesting thing, when the FBI came to my house, they spent four hours questioning me about everything that was going on that led up to me leaving and coming back here. And he said, the interesting thing about their questioning is they didn’t ask me anything about Ammon Bundy or Ryan Bundy or anybody else. All they wanted to know is tell me about Lavoie Finnegan. And they would ask me question after question about Lavoie Finnegan, the guy that later they murdered.
SPEAKER 12 :
Now, those are strong statements to say that they murdered him, Trent Luce. I can tell that you feel strongly about that, but that’s really a strong statement to make.
SPEAKER 06 :
When the governor issues a proclamation that there’s a virus, we need to get rid of the virus. And within 48 hours, somebody’s dead. But I’m willing to make that strong statement.
SPEAKER 12 :
Oh, boy. I think this is going to be a controversial one, Trent Luce. I appreciate it. And we’re out of time. So our quote for the end of the show is from Cicero. He said this. It is not enough to acquire wisdom. It is necessary to employ it. So today, be grateful. Read great books. Think good thoughts. Listen to beautiful music. Communicate and listen well. Live honestly and authentically. Strive for high ideals. And like Superman, stand for truth, justice, and the American way. My friends, you are not alone. God bless you, and God bless America.
SPEAKER 08 :
And fast on a rough road Riding high Through the mountains Climbing, twisting Turning further From my home Young Like a new moon Rising fierce Through the rain and this great unknown I don’t want no one to cry but tell them if I don’t
SPEAKER 17 :
The views and opinions expressed on KLZ 560 are those of the speaker, commentators, hosts, their guests, and callers. They are not necessarily the views and opinions of Crawford Broadcasting or KLZ management, employees, associates, or advertisers. KLZ 560 is a Crawford Broadcasting God and country station.
