[music] Welcome to Mobile Estate Planning with your host, Michael Bailey. Over a decade ago, attorney Michael Bailey turned his attention to a state law after he recognized the unacceptable number of adults without proper end-of-life planning. Michael recognizes that many of his clients have difficulty finding the time for making a proper estate plan. That’s why he became the “Mobile estate planner.” He will go to wherever you are to assist you with your estate planning, including writing wills, trusts, and giving you the information you need to avoid probate. Now ATX, ask the experts, presents Mobile Estate Planning with your host, Michael Bailey. [music] Welcome to Mobile Estate Planning with Michael Bailey. Here on 560KLZ, also heard on 100.7 FM, or the KLZ 560 radio apps, so we can do something besides just leave your family alone. Phone number to talk to me on the air is 303-4775-6000. And once again, that’s 303-4775-6000. And my direct line is 720-394-6887. Again, that’s 720-394-6887. So I’ve instructed this last week about how sometimes the simplest things to do become the most complex and the most difficult. As I’ve been calling through people who have started estate plans for, and trying to get them to, trying to get them to finish their estate plans. Like so they started with me. And just, you know, so it’s been several weeks or several months, and I haven’t heard back from them. I’ve sent out draft copies, and so I try to get them to call me back. And then they will be like, oh well, you know, what else do we need to do? And I’m like, well, you need to review the draft copies. And then we need to get them signed, witnessed and notarized. Oh well, I just thought that, you know, since you sent it to us, it everything was fine. I’m like, well, we did talk about how, how a, and a state plan is not going to be in effect until such time as it is signed witnessed and notarized properly. Now, a will has different things that need to be done from a power of attorney, from a trust, from a deed. You know, each document has slightly different standards of what, how they need to be done. You know, wills don’t technically need to be, you know, need to be witnessed. But if you have a will and you get that will witnessed, then the will can become self-proving. So, you know, it seems like one of the simplest things in the world, if you start a project, you should finish it. But apparently that’s not as simple as I would think it would be. So, you know, it seems like a fairly simple thing that if you want to get your state point done, I mean, I’ve actually had a couple of clients where I’ve chased them for a couple of years and this never seemed, you know, whether it’s that we don’t connect or they tell me they’ll get me whatever changes they want to make. And then I’ve had a couple of them over the years who have then passed away. And then the family calls me and says, well, you set up their state planning. I’m like, well, we never did actually get it signed. They’re like, well, but isn’t it just the same? I’m like, no, it’s not. Having a signed witness, notarized, completed, the state plan is not the same as you told me what your wishes are. And I almost, I almost wonder if people think that I’m more powerful than I am, that I’m some sort of a state planning wizard or ninja or something that once they’ve told me, I can magically implement things. And I’m just, I’m not that powerful, not that magic, you know, you’re just setting up your state plan really is what you want and you need to sign it witness and get it notarized. You can’t witness your own, sorry, you can’t witness your own document. It’s one of those weird things when you sign something you cannot also sign as the witness. You know, oddly enough, we don’t want you to be witnessing your things like, yes, I sign it. Ha ha, I saw myself sign it. And also, if you have to be a notarized, I can notarize my own state plan. Well, that doesn’t work. You have to, you want to have separate people who are the witnesses of the notary. But what would seem fairly simple and straightforward to me sometimes is not that simple and straightforward. And so, and I’m just not that powerful that I can take all of your stuff and suddenly turn it into an estate plan that will then be completely of valid unless we follow the proper protocols and the proper methodology. And once we’ve got it done, we’re excited. We got it signed witness, odorized, cool. Then I have people who call me and are like, oh, well, I just want to make a change to it. I’m like, okay. So like, well, you know, just just just go change this and like, well, okay, well, we need to get, I have to prepare. The trust amendment or will caught a soul and I’ll send out here for you and then you need to sign it. Well, can’t you just make the change? No, I can’t. Again, I’m just not that powerful. I wish I were that powerful. I wish I could make changes for everybody. But that doesn’t seem like the best idea to be able to just make changes for people even though I’m an attorney. I mean, there would be a very serious temptation there for attorneys to make changes that benefit themselves or their families. So, you know, if I have a client who has $3 million in assets, you’ve got a house and maybe a cabin up in the mountains and then, you know, a couple of nice cars and a retirement account, I’m like, yes, well, as the estate planning attorney, I can just go in and I’m going to say, maybe that vacation home, it might not come straight to me, but it’ll go to my three kids. And if I could make that change, I don’t think the person would like that unless they were able to know that that change were made or know that that change is happening. You know, it would be, there would be not that I would necessarily do it, but there would be a very large opportunity there for things to go wrong or things to go badly that we just doesn’t seem like it would be a good idea. You know, like suddenly the people die and like the kid, their kids are like, “Oh, we get the mountain kevans.” Suddenly the mountain kevans says it’s going to my three kids. They’re like, “Wait a minute, this doesn’t seem right.” Of course, it doesn’t seem right because it’s not right. It’s wrong as a matter of fact. And not that I would participate in such wrongs, but since it’s the 98% of lawyers that give the other 2% of us a bad name, I could see there being some difficulties there. And yes, if you were to do that in a one-state plan and, you know, siphon off a million dollars worth of property, I’m probably going to be pretty quick that the Board of Law examiners or the Supreme Court would come calling and say, “Hey, so we see that you’ve been doing things improperly. We see that that’s a bad idea. We’re going to go ahead and take your license so you can’t do this anymore.” But, you know, so there’s, there are protections in place and they’d probably want to, you know, go and pull the property out of the names of my kids, get it to the proper person. But you don’t even want to put yourself, we don’t even want to put people in position for that. So although people apparently think that I’m super powerful and super awesome and can make changes without… They’re consenter without their signing off on it. It’s just not how it works. When you create your state plan, we want to make sure that you are an in charge of your state plan. I can assist with getting it all done and making sure it’s all done properly and legally and, you know, I usually ask several questions that people are like, “Oh, I didn’t even think about that.” But preparing your state plan and changing your state plan is something that you should be in charge of and you want to sign off on. Now that would seem fairly basic and fairly straightforward to me. But sometimes, it’s not quite as straightforward and not quite as basic as people seem to think. And, or at least, you know, in my experience, I’ve run into people who don’t seem to quite grasp that what was very basic and straightforward to me isn’t necessarily basic and straightforward to everybody. And, you know, maybe partially that’s because I work in this field and I do it all the time. But I would think it would be, you know, fairly straightforward that you don’t want somebody who’s not you being able to make changes and be in charge of your state plan. It just seems like a good, you know, basic principle of things is that you should be in charge of your own life and what happens to your stuff after you’re gone. So, you know, those seem like pretty basic things. And, you know, there are other things that probably seem pretty basic that may or may not be. I mean, I have lots of people who say like, “Oh, you know, once we’re done with this, you’re going to file everything with a state, right?” And I’m like, “Well, what is there to file?” “Well, you know, you just file the will with a state and you file the powers of turning with the state.” Well, see, there’s not state agencies that have everything on file. Now, in other states there are. Like I hear in Pennsylvania, there’s like a state registry of powers of attorney. So, when you create a power of attorney, you would then take that power of attorney, speculating in Pennsylvania since I’m not licensed there, but you file it with whatever group there, whatever government entity there is. And then that government entity keeps track of who has powers of attorney on file and who’s authorized to act on their behalf. And so, you know, but that’s not how it is in Colorado. So, you are listening to a mobile state planning with Michael Bailey here on 560KLZ or 100.7FM, possibly the 560KLZ Radio App. Phone number to talk to me on the air is 303-4775-6000. And again, that’s 303-4775-6000. And my direct line is 720-3946-887. And again, that’s 720-3946-887. So, I can see the appeal of having a centralized location where all of the powers of attorney would be collected. And so, you go, okay, well, we’ve got a power of attorney here. We can, you know, we’ll put it on file. And then this government agency will hold onto that. And then when somebody’s like, oh, hey, I need to act on their behalf. There’s already a government agency out there who is ready and has all of that in place. And then, you know, when somebody’s like, oh, well, I’m going to go to the bank. The bank says, well, hold on a minute. We’ve got to check with the governmental entity that has the registry of all of this. So, they go and they look it up and they say, yep, indeed, in fact, you are the agent for this person. And I don’t know how it works since it’s not how Colorado works. I don’t know if they would then need some sort of proof that a person is incapacitated to be able to show that the agent can act. I mean, you’re hearing Colorado. If you’re trying to act on somebody’s behalf, you bring the power of attorney to a bank or to a financial institution or something like that. So, my experience with it is bringing it to the hospital and showing it to the hospital so that the doctors and nurses knew that they should be talking to me instead of to my mother who was non-responsive at the time. But I can see the appeal of having the centralized location for all of that. But I also, you can see the downside in that and that I don’t know that I’m one of those that as a general rule, if we can leave the government out of things, I think we should. And so, if we set up a power of attorney and then the power of attorney is there and in place and then when you need the power of attorney, you can take the power of attorney to the doctor or to the bank or to wherever. Then that information is not just all out there because there’s… partially I don’t 100% trust the government. Partially, I don’t really want the government to know every aspect of all of our lives all the time. You know, I don’t need the government to know who I want to have act on my behalf, especially in my case, the person who would act on my behalf, both of my wife is in first place. And then after that, it’s a brother-in-law who does not live in the state. So I’m like, well, then do we need to have an interstate registry? Are we giving this? There’s just… there’s a whole bunch of different things. Whereas a power of attorney, you know, because it’s not filed, there’s not something out there. And I can see that the appeal of having you send it to the registry and then they can… they can look at it. They can make sure that it meets the proper criteria and then show that it’s valid, sometimes. And that can be… that would be nice to have someone who might be slightly more familiar with the forums and familiar with the methodologies than some other people are. I’ve had many clients who will tell me, oh well, I tried to take the power of attorney to the bank and they didn’t like this or that. Whatever they thought that it should have been signed and witnessed. And you know, this one’s just notarized. And so it’s not witnessed. And so they won’t take it. And I’m like, well, the Colorado rules are that this has to be signed and notarized. You know, if they want it witnessed, I’m not entirely sure why that’s the case. But sometimes you get a person who isn’t really sure that they know how to deal with someone who’s an agent under a power of attorney. And so you start asking for different people. But sometimes the person you’re asking, you’re like, hey, it doesn’t seem like this is quite going the way. But then you run into human nature where people don’t want to be told that they don’t know what they’re doing. And so if you’ve got a person at a bank that’s like, no, I can’t take this power of attorney. Oh, could I please talk with somebody who’s more familiar with it? Well, I’m familiar with it. I know what I’m talking about is. And I’m like, well, now we have to have a fight about whether or not a power of attorney is worthwhile or not. So I do see how there could be an appeal in having a centralized location. But the decentralized location that I’m used to and that I work in here in Colorado, I’m kind of a in favor of that particular way of doing things just because I like it. I’m used to it. It works well. And it seems to accomplish. I would imagine that even with a centralized location there could be some sort of issue or some sort of problem. I see that with how things go sometimes with real estate transactions. And I had a client just the other day who was like, they’d prepared a beneficiary deed so that when they died ownership of transfer from them to their kids. And they went to record it and the person like, well, you know, you don’t actually own this property. It’s owned by these people who are the previous owners. And apparently there was some sort of issue. I don’t even know what it was with a transfer from the previous owners to this person who’s owned the property for the last five to seven years. And they’re like, oh, well, what do we do now? And I said, you know, I really don’t know. I’m not sure, you know, what the problem was. I don’t know how to go back and investigate and fix it. It’s just not part of what my practice is. Here’s a name and number of a friend of mine who’s a real estate attorney. But, you know, there’s a centralized location there of the County Clerk and Recorder’s Office where all of the deeds go and they’re all recorded. But the County Clerk and Recorder’s Office is going to just record things. They’re not going to carefully scrutinize everything and say, oh, well, every single thing on this deed was done properly. Oh, there was a problem here. You know, they, you know, if there is a problem with the deed, they may just, you know, made us record it. And then someone’s like, oh, but it was recorded. So it’s fine. I’m like, except that it doesn’t do what it says it’s supposed to do. And therein, you might run into problems because it’s not actually doing what you think it’s doing. And just because it got filed with the County and recorded with the County doesn’t mean that it’s going to. It’s not 100% guarantee that the County recorded it, that it’s all fine and ready and everything’s ready to go. So again, I see the appeal and having a central location, but I also think that sometimes people think that if it’s recorded with the central location that it will, that document will then be properly vetted, said it’s, you know, says it’s okay. And everybody else will be. A.O.K. with what it’s doing, even if that’s not what the government entity is doing, they’re just going ahead and, you know, they’re recording it, but they’re not just because they record it doesn’t mean they’ve endorsed it. And sometimes there’s a, there’s confusion between a government entity accepting something for recording and suddenly it being endorsed. And I think that’s part of what, you know, when people record something or they give it to the government, they assume that the government’s going to tell them if there’s something wrong with it. And if they don’t, then it’s all endorsed and fined by the government. Well, that may be a poor assumption that just because you’ve done something to and with the government that everything will be a.O.K. that’s not quite how it always works. I feel like that sometimes when I’m out driving and I’m like, well, all of these people have passed a driving test. And yet this person is going 20 over the speed limit, that person is going 15 under the speed limit, this person’s, weaving through traffic and cutting people off. That person is turning left from the right lane, that person is turning right from the left lane, that person is not using a turn indicator. And that person is stopping short every once in a while, apparently to break check people because they think they’re following too closely. Well, none of those things is endorsed by the government. None of those things is within the laws. Yet we see them happen all the time. So, you know, the, the government is supposed to issue a driver’s license to the person of minimal competence and ability to drive. But sometimes as we all see that may not be a 100% guarantee that the person knows how to drive and knows how to drive safely. And you know, there are times and I have had times. My, my daughter is pretty funny whenever she sees somebody speeding, weaving out of traffic, she’ll say, well, maybe their wife is in labor and they need to get to the hospital quickly. And I’m like, yeah, I’d like to believe that except for the number of times that I see people bleeding, I’m like, there’s not that many people who are late to getting to the hospital. It just doesn’t happen. You know, they may be late getting wherever they’re going or they may just think that they’re, you know, driving, weaving between in and out of traffic is going to get them where they’re going faster. But perhaps my daughter is a much kinder sold than I am. And so you are listening to mobile estate planning with Michael Bailey here on KLC 560, also heard on 100.7 FM or the KLC 560 radio app. The phone number to talk to me on the air is 303 47756000. And again, that’s 303 47756000. And my direct line is 720 3946887. And one more time, that’s 720 3946887. So if we have, you know, so they’re, you see like, in Pennsylvania, there’s a centralized directory of powers of attorney. You know, we don’t have that here in Colorado. And so I’m not 100% familiar with how that goes. You know, wills people like, oh, well, you know, didn’t the will get filed with the county. And I’m like, well, wills are only filed with the county court once you’ve passed away. Now, there have, there’s a concept of lodging a will with a court where you can, and you know, previously, I mean, most counties won’t take them. They just don’t have space anymore. You know, when, when Denver was a, you know, new city and there were like 50,000 residents, you know, like, God, there’s probably, there’s probably space to keep all the wills. But now that Denver has got several million residents, you just can’t, you know, I mean, I, I keep a copy of all of my, of the wills and the trust that I write for all of my clients. And I have a bunch of filing cabinets that just takes up room and time and space. And so the county just trying to keep all the space for everybody doesn’t necessarily have all of that space. And so they don’t necessarily take things prior to when a will is supposed to be executed after somebody has died. Now, I do have clients who are like, well, you know, how are my, my agents, how are the people who are carrying out my instructions supposed to know about the will? I’m like, you tell them. Now that is, that’s, that’s, I realize that is a very complex and, you know, really scary. How would somebody know you would tell them that you put them in charge of things and you would tell them where to find it. So you say, so like I would say, hey, to my, the person who would be in charge, hey, you’re in charge. And if you need to find what you need to find, it is in the filing cabinet that I keep in the loft of my house. I have a little filing cabinet where I keep important papers like, you know, car insurance or information and health insurance information and things like birth certificates for my kids and, you know, all those things that we didn’t necessarily need when the kids were young. But then we went to get passports so that we could go to Mexico on vacation and I’m like, oh, well, here they all are. We can find all of them and take them where they’re put them where they’re supposed to be. So in that filing cabinet is where I am keeping, I have kept my will and trust so that it’s ready for the next person and I’ve told them where to find it. Because I get calls probably once or twice a week from someone who’s like, oh, well, you know, my dad, mom or dad died and, you know, do you know where we can find a copy of it? I’m like, well, who is the attorney that prepared it? Well, wasn’t it you? Then I’ll pull up my computer files and I’m like, no, I don’t have no record of having prepared that for somebody. Like, oh, well, you know, I was hoping it was you. Isn’t there a way that you can go search for it and find it? And I’m like, well, you see, all of us attorneys, we don’t have some secret club and secret handshake where we can, you know, make a face and, you know, jump on one leg and, you know, say, Ugi, Ugi, and suddenly we have access to everybody’s files. There’s not one centralized file location. Part of what we do as attorneys is we have, we are required to have maintained client confidentiality and internally client privilege so that when people tell us things, I’m not allowed to reveal them to other people. So that’s one of the things that goes along with being an attorney is that we don’t just share information with each other. We don’t share information with unauthorized people. I had a financial planner call me the other day and said, oh, well, you know, we have a mutual client. You know, Mr. and Mrs. So and so. And I need you just to send me a copy of their trust. And I said, well, you know, as well as I do that I need them to tell me that I can share a copy of the trust you I can’t just believe you it’s not that I disbelieve you it’s not that I distrust you it’s that I disbelieve and distrust everybody pretty much. And so I’m not going to I can’t just give out that information to somebody who’s not an authorize the receiver of that information. Because, you know, most of what a lot of the times when I write something and like, oh, well, you know, if if somebody were to get a hold of your will they would know that you’re leaving stuff to your surviving spouse or to your children. I mean, these are the deep dark secrets that we’re going with. But we don’t need to tell the entire world of what we’re doing. We don’t need to tell the entire world of exactly what we own. And you know, I mean, I think of a when Iron Man in I think it was Iron Man 3 was taunting them. And it says, you know, this is my home address come find me. And then the next scene is that there’s a helicopter filing firing a missile at his house. I’m like, yeah, that might not have been the greatest idea. And not that anybody’s going to file or fire a missile at my house or at your house. But we don’t need to be just giving people information. I mean, there is one of the, you know, I think it was life lock where the guy on the commercial was like, this is my real social security number. And you know, nobody can come in take it from me and nobody can hack it. Nobody can use my identity right up to the point where people did. And then he’s like, oh, that might not have been the best idea. Huh, you don’t say. So as, as attorney is we’re trying to protect your information or trying to protect you. We’re trying to keep you safe so that your wishes can be carried out. This is that somebody including the attorney does not come and interrupt your wishes. And that all seems like that would be pretty simple and pretty straightforward and something that people would like. But we’ve got to do everything the right way so that your state plan is done the way that you want it. So thank you so much for listening to mobile estate planning with Michael Bailey here on 560 K LZ. Hope everybody has a wonderful independent day tomorrow. I’ll be back next week, but in the meantime stay tuned for John Russian Russian and I’ll see you next week. Thanks and bye. [Music] Mobile estate planning with Michael Bailey will return to ATX next Wednesday at 230 here on K LZ 560, AM 560, FM 100.7 and online at kelzradio.com.