Join Jody Heiss as he navigates through a myriad of pressing national and international issues in this engaging episode of Washington Watch. The crux of the discussion centers around the ongoing government shutdown, its impact on TSA operations, and the contentious debate over funding the Department of Homeland Security. Engage with top-tier insights as notable guests like Congressman Burgess Owens provide their perspectives on how these developments are shaping America’s future.
SPEAKER 22 :
from the heart of our nation’s capital in Washington, D.C., bringing compelling interviews, insightful analysis, taking you beyond the headlines and soundbites into conversations with our nation’s leaders and newsmakers, all from a biblical worldview. Sitting in for Tony is today’s host, Jody Heiss.
SPEAKER 09 :
Seems that Democrats have no interest in reaching an agreement. Many of them are perfectly willing to leave the Department of Homeland Security unfunded for the long term. They claim that they want to fund the department. They claim that they’re concerned about TSA officers and other working without pay. But Mr. President, talk is cheap. And their actions belie their words.
SPEAKER 12 :
That was Senate Majority Leader John Thune earlier today as the Senate remains now at an impasse over a deal to fund what is now the second longest government shutdown in U.S. history. Welcome to this March 26th edition of Washington Watch. I’m your guest host, Jody Heiss, filling in today for Tony, and thank you so much for joining us. All right, coming up today, we’ll discuss the latest on the battle to fund the Department of Homeland Security, as well as the challenges facing the aviation industry. We’ll be joined a little later in the program by Congressman Burgess Owens from Utah. He’s a member of the Transportation Committee. Plus, Finland’s Supreme Court has delivered a verdict in what has been known as the Bible Tweet case involving Finnish parliamentarian Paivi Roshanen. We’ll discuss the decision and its potential implications when we’re joined by Sean Nelson of Alliance Defending Freedom International. Also in that discussion, we’ll be joined by Texas Congressman Chip Roy. So all that and more is coming your way. Reports of long lines at airports certainly continue as nearly 500 TSA officers have now quit their jobs since the start of the partial government shutdown. Today is, in fact, day 41 that the DHS has gone without funding. And joining me now to discuss this further is Washington-Stan reporter Casey Harper. Casey, thanks for joining me. What’s the latest on the shutdown?
SPEAKER 23 :
Thanks, Jody. Well, 50,000 TSA officers are working without pay, and officers are, there’s an increase in quitting and just not showing up to work, which is leading to long lines at many airports. Now, some hard numbers here. Over 11% of TSA officers didn’t show up for work yesterday. That’s more than 3,100 agents. Tomorrow, things may get even worse because TSA employees are scheduled to miss their second paycheck. Right now, it’s even compounded because there’s a travel surge at airports because of spring break. Travel volume is up 5% from last year, even as TSA agents are walking off the job. Now, hundreds of ICE officers have been sent to help with security screenings at 14 different airports, and President Trump has even said he could deploy the National Guard to help with security. The president also says his administration will take, quote, very drastic measures if the DHS shutdown doesn’t end immediately. Here’s a clip of what he said during his cabinet meeting today.
SPEAKER 24 :
We’re now on day 41 of the disgraceful Democrat shutdown of Mark Wayne’s department. Congratulations. You came into a department that’s shut down. Shut down by the radical Democrats, right? but Democrats are really punishing the American people. They need to end the shutdown immediately or we’ll have to take some very drastic measures.
SPEAKER 23 :
We’re curious to see what those drastic measures are, Jody, but it’s not just TSA. FEMA, Border Patrol, and the U.S. Coast Guard are all funded by the Department of Homeland Security.
SPEAKER 12 :
All right, Casey, thank you for that update. And, you know, right here closer to home on Capitol Hill continues the battle over the Save America Act. It’s now in its second week of debate on the Senate floor. Any updates on what’s happening on that discussion?
SPEAKER 23 :
Well, some Senate Republicans are continuing to make their case on passing the Save America Act, which is, of course, a legislation that would require citizens to show a valid ID when showing up to vote at polling stations. It would clamp down on mail-in ballots, among other things. Now, Senator Mike Lee, he has been a leader on this. He’s vowed to continue debating over the bill as long as it takes. We’ve got a clip here.
SPEAKER 04 :
This is about the fact that when you allow non-citizens to vote, you are robbing something from the American people, from each individual American citizen, something which is distinctively, rightfully theirs. You cannot take that away. You are taking it away when you allow somebody else to cast a vote that will cancel out yours. That, Mr. President, is unfair. It is unacceptable. It is un-American. It is illegal. We must not tolerate it, and we will not.
SPEAKER 23 :
Now, Senate Majority Leader John Thune, Jody, he’s facing immense pressure to advance the act, even from the president, who is saying they should get rid of the filibuster. Now, they do have a deadline coming up here because the Senate is set to leave for a two-week recess at the end of this month. But some Republicans are pressuring Thune to cancel that and keep the Senate working, maybe even through Easter. But President Trump has said the Save America Act is a top priority, and he’s not going to pass or sign anything else until this gets done, Jody.
SPEAKER 12 :
It is a major piece of legislation, and boy, it does make it difficult to go on break when you have something of that magnitude before you. Casey, thank you so much for joining us as always. I want to go now to Capitol Hill and get a congressional perspective on some of the latest developments. both domestically as well as internationally and joining me now to discuss this congressman greg stuby he serves on the ways and means committee as well as the permanent select committee on intelligence he represents the 17th congressional district of florida congressman stuby great to see you welcome back to washington watch glad to have you yeah thanks for having me all right You bet. Let’s start off with a report, if we can, internationally coming out of Israel today that evidently all of the key commanders of the Islamic Revolutionary Guard Corps Navy have been killed in an airstrike, including the commander of the IRGC Navy. He was the one responsible for mining and blocking the Strait of Hormuz. What are we hearing right now? What do you think— Is Iran getting the message through all of this, do you think?
SPEAKER 07 :
Well, it doesn’t sound like they are because they’re not willing to come to the president with a deal with the parameters that the president and the administration has put in place, which is unfortunate for them because the hostilities will continue if they’re not willing to cut some type of deal that are in the parameters, like not having a nuclear warhead, not committing… terrorism across the globe, all these different things that the president and the administration and the Department of War has laid out. So I think you’re going to continue to see the upper echelons of the leadership targeted by the Israelis and targeted the military pieces targeted by the United States. And until either they’re taken out and the Iranian people rise up and take their country back or they’re willing to come to the table and actually talk about peace, I think you’re going to see those targets continue to be analyzed.
SPEAKER 12 :
Do you see any hope of them coming to the table to talk about peace? Is there any hope in your estimation from what you’re seeing for a diplomatic solution to this?
SPEAKER 07 :
I mean, the leaders of their theocracy are very hardline, you know, very entrenched in their positions. You know, these are the people that chant death to America and obviously don’t think that the state of Israel should even exist as a state. So I think that’s going to be very challenging, which is why obviously the Israelis have continued to target the upper echelons of their leadership, which now, I mean, I made a comment today. I’m not sure who… and the Trump’s administration, who they’re actually talking to over there, obviously through different diplomatic ties because each of their leaderships keep getting taken out. So I don’t think they will, but I think as you get down and their capabilities are debilitated to a point where they have no other choice, kind of what happened in Venezuela after Maduro was taken away and we had done a blockade on all of their oil experts, economic, economically, their economy was crippled. So I could see at some point they won’t have any other choice but to negotiate with us.
SPEAKER 12 :
Yeah, you would certainly think that. Let me shift over to some other international news. The International Olympic Committee, the IOC, announced today that it’s adopting a new policy that will ensure that only biological females compete in women’s competitions. I know this is an issue that you have been very vocal and involved with. What was your reaction to the news from the IOC today?
SPEAKER 07 :
Yeah, it’s great news. It took a president like President Trump to do executive orders on this issue. We passed my bill that I’ve championed that doesn’t allow biological men and women’s sports for years. We’ve passed that the last two years. It, of course, is sitting in the Senate because Thune refuses to do away with the filibuster. So you need seven Democrats to vote for it. And obviously that’s never going to happen. So it’s a great issue. decision, but that would not have happened but for the leadership of President Trump and the administration taking a very common sense stance. This is an 80% issue. I mean, if you poll Democratic moms, if they want biological men in their daughter’s locker rooms, they don’t agree with that. And it’s really good to see finally the international community coming around to the fact of reality and the fact of science.
SPEAKER 12 :
Absolutely. If I can bring our discussion back a little bit closer to Capitol Hill, we’ve got a couple of big fights to fund the DHS and also the effort to pass the Save America Act over in the Senate. Both of these seem to have become largely intertwined as there’s chatter about potentially advancing key provisions of the Save America Act in a second reconciliation bill. But I know there’s some that is not receiving that idea very well. But what do you make of that idea?
SPEAKER 07 :
Well, I think in order for it to actually pass, it’s going to have to be amended to something. But again, the only way that it passes is if John Thune, the leader of the Senate, nukes the filibuster and passes it with a majority vote. You will never get 60 senators to vote to only allow citizens to vote in our elections because Democrats aren’t going to allow that to happen. So the only way to pass it is to pass it through some sort of bill that only requires a majority. If you want to talk about reconciliation, Anything through reconciliation has to be budgetary in nature and has to pass what we call the birdbath over on the Senate side, which is a rules-based approach that the parliamentarian takes that looks at the bill to ensure that there’s no policy provisions in it. It’s only budgetary in nature. There is no way that a Harry Reid parliamentarian, she was appointed by Harry Reid, is going to agree that for a voting rights bill to be on a budgetary reconciliation bill in the Senate. It’s not going to pass the birdbath test over there. The parliamentarian is not going to allow it to be included. So for Thune to even give this kind of inclination that, oh, we’ll just, let’s go ahead and fund DHS now, part of it that we can, that the Democrats agreed to, that they’re holding hostage all of this, will do Save America under reconciliation, he knows darn well, just like I do, that the parliamentarian over there is not going to allow that to be attached to any type of reconciliation bill. The only way that these type of provisions become law is if he nukes the filibuster and passes all these great conservative reforms.
SPEAKER 12 :
Yeah, I think that’s the whole issue. There’s so much hesitation with the reconciliation bill with the Save America Act. The two just don’t fit. So putting the Save America Act aside from that, what do you think the likelihood is that we might see a second reconciliation bill?
SPEAKER 07 :
Well, first, I would say if I was Speaker Mike Johnson, that you Senate need to send us a bill first, because if we walk through this process on the House side, we have a very, very, very narrow margin. Massey’s probably going to be a no, which gives us one person, one vote margin to pass a very challenging bill. And if we were able to do that, it’s going to go to the Senate and get marked up into a thousand different pieces and cut up into a whole bunch of different pieces and sent back. And it won’t be something that will be palatable to conservatives. So the Senate, if they want to do it, they need to send a bill over. But it is a very challenging vote environment in the House with only a two vote majority.
SPEAKER 12 :
It certainly is. I tell you, Florida Congressman Greg Stubbe, you’ve got your hands full. And as I can say, many of us here at FRC and our audience from all across the country have each of you in prayers that God would grant you wisdom and favor as you’re dealing with so many critical issues. Thank you so much for joining us on Washington Watch. Always great to have you. Thank you. All right, coming up, we’ll go further into the fight to end the partial government shutdown and at the same time to fund the Department of Homeland Security, a major piece of legislation. Utah Congressman Burgess Owens will be joining me right after the break. So don’t go anywhere. We’ll be back.
SPEAKER 15 :
When in the course of human events it becomes necessary for one people to dissolve the political bands which have connected them with another and to assume among the powers of the earth the separate and equal station to which the laws of nature and of nature’s God entitle them.
SPEAKER 17 :
A decent respect to the opinions of mankind requires that they should declare the causes which impel them to the separation. We hold these truths to be self-evident that all men are created equal That they’re endowed by their Creator. With certain unalienable rights. That among these are life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness.
SPEAKER 15 :
That to secure these rights, governments are instituted among men. Deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed. Happy 250th. Happy 250th. Happy 250th. Happy 250th birthday, America. May God bless America.
SPEAKER 17 :
I think all people really need to have this type of education.
SPEAKER 03 :
Well, I can tell you that it’s been an amazing course, period.
SPEAKER 06 :
I think this course is a reminder that a biblical worldview should really impact everything. It impacts our government from the federal to the state to the local. It should impact what we’re doing with our families and with our work.
SPEAKER 14 :
God and Government is a video-driven, Bible-based training course from Family Research Council that explores the connection between biblical principles and American government. In this six-session video series, FRC President Tony Perkins equips participants with a practical understanding of civil government from a biblical worldview.
SPEAKER 03 :
I would encourage all people to take it. I almost wish I would have took it earlier that I could have taught my kids this.
SPEAKER 02 :
I wish I had known these things when we were homeschooling because I think children and my adults now would just greatly be influenced by that information.
SPEAKER 21 :
So I’m an attorney, and for me, it gives me some direct practical knowledge of what I can do to try to impact my legal community, to make better legislation, to try to encourage legislators to make choices that have a biblical worldview, which is what we really want.
SPEAKER 19 :
Any pastor would benefit from taking this course. Because we are dual citizens, right? We are citizens of the kingdom of God, but we’re also citizens of this great land, and that comes with responsibility.
SPEAKER 06 :
Even as someone who has been involved in these types of issues for a while, you’re learning little bits and pieces of new stuff all the time. But it’s also approachable enough that newer people, younger people, high school, college students, they can really glean something from this. So… I would encourage everybody to take this course, whether it’s the videos, whether it’s doing it in person, bring your Bible study group through it, bring your homeschool group through it and equip yourself for these challenging days ahead.
SPEAKER 14 :
View the course at frc.org slash God and government or on the Stand Firm app.
SPEAKER 12 :
All right, welcome back to Washington Watch. I’m Jody Heiss, an honor today to be filling in for Tony, and thank you so much for joining us. All right, as the shutdown of the Department of Homeland Security continues to drag on and on, no doubt pressure is mounting for lawmakers on Capitol Hill to reach a deal to put an end to what is now the second longest shutdown in government history, U.S. history. In fact, yesterday there was a coalition of nearly 50 air travel related companies and organizations that issued a statement. They sent it to Congress basically to say Congress needs to act now before our system breaks. Well, unfortunately, Congress did not act yesterday. In fact, Republicans and Democrats alike in the Senate each formally rejected each other’s latest proposals. So what does this mean? I mean, Congress is getting near what is a two-week recess just around the corner. Well, joining me now to discuss this and more is Congressman Burgess Owens. He’s a member of the House Transportation and Infrastructure Committee. including the committees on aviation, the subcommittee there. He represents the 4th Congressional District, the great state of Utah. Congressman Owens, welcome back to Washington Watts. Always good to see you, my friend.
SPEAKER 18 :
Dodie, thank you so much. I’m looking forward to chatting with you. Absolutely.
SPEAKER 12 :
Absolutely on this side, too. Listen, before I get into those things, the aviation issues, you serve on the House Education Workforce Committee as well, which had a hearing today regarding the threats posed by foreign actors on U.S. college campuses. Very interesting hearing. How serious are those threats?
SPEAKER 18 :
Well, they’re very, very serious because we have an enemy that knows no bounds. And I think the problem we’re having, Jody, is, you know, my dad was a World War II vet. They grew up, and I grew up in a time where the word traitor meant something, and we’ve kind of lost that meaning. So not only do we have a very aggressive enemy, and that’s China, that would love to do everything they can to disrupt and destroy our system, our system of freedom here, but we have people in our country that don’t mind for greed and prominence and power to allowing them to take advantage of our system, our school system here. So that’s what we’re really dealing with. And we’ve had a remarkable amount of attacks against our system during the Biden administration. I’m thankful now that we have a president who understands it. And this hearing was remarkable because we had a chance to really hear from colleges that are addressing it correctly, and some colleges are still lagging in that process. But this is where we have to draw a line. uh our colleges should be for americans and for those who love our system and those are those countries that do not abide by what we’re doing we need to start looking at maybe not having them come here at all for sure so it is a very good conversation glad we started off for sure
SPEAKER 12 :
I’m glad you started that conversation as well. And speaking of threats, be it on college campuses or whatever, I mean, the shutdown of DHS is certainly raising all sorts of alarms and potential threats here in our own country. During a hearing yesterday, the TSA’s acting administrator said that nearly 500 airport screeners have now quit since the shutdown started, and then she went on to warn that that officers of the agency and people that they hire in the coming months are not going to be ready to work checkpoint lanes during the upcoming FIFA World Cup this summer. You know, that’s just a small piece. I mean, how vulnerable has this shutdown made America?
SPEAKER 18 :
It’s made us vulnerable, but I think it also, it really helps to define the two parties. And I want to bring a little bit of different context. I just, I saw Greg Subbione a few minutes ago. He had some remarkable speakers of people that are talking about this issue in different ways. My experience is very simple is, I know how the Democratic Party works. I’ve been dealing with these people, this party, for 60 years. I grew up in a time where the Black community that was segregated was just like every other community in terms of pride of what they were doing, strong business ownership, very faithful families. And that was what I grew up in. So I know it’s not hypothetical, the greatness of my race and our country. But what’s happened the last 60 years is we have a party that does not believe in loyalty. It does not believe in love for anyone that believes in them. They’re very transactional. And they deal with painful power. Now, what’s happening right now is, they have worked a long, long time to get to this point where they have invaded our country. They feel they have a way now of changing the… everything that we can do in terms of people voting and sending people to Congress. They understand that. And what President Trump did is, they were on the five-yard line, and were pushing them back the other way. This is an existential threat for them, what we’re doing right now. everything from the SAVE Act to right now making sure we can deport bad people. This to them is the end of their power if they can’t stop it. So we’re not talking about common sense. And unfortunately, we’re sitting with people trying to find a win-win situation. It’d be a totally different process. We’re dealing with a party that does not mind destroying our country because they want to keep their power at all means.
SPEAKER 12 :
Wow. Well said. So, look, according to reports, at least 40 different airports across the United States are seeing extremely long lines. And all this now is the second longest line. shutdown that we’ve ever had. So what do you think? I mean, yesterday we had 50 different air travel companies and organizations basically saying, Congress, you’ve got to fix this or our entire system is going to break. Is the message making any ground in Congress?
SPEAKER 18 :
Well, you know, what’s interesting, Jody, is what we’re seeing is what’s very visible and what people feel every single day. You see these long lines. Just keep in mind, with this shutdown, they’re also dealing with the Coast Guard. They’re dealing with Secret Service, FEMA. I mean, so the things that we don’t see are impacted just as much or more than things we do see. Just understand that this is the iceberg, the tip of the iceberg we’re seeing right now at these airports. And the Democratic Party does not care. Just like I, as a congressman, understand the threat, the things that we’re up against, the pain that people are going through, so do Democratic senators and congresspeople. But yet they will not move, because at the end of the day, again, I mentioned, this is there’s an existential threat that if they cannot stop ICE, if they cannot stop the voting of their folks and illegals at these polls, then they’re going to have an issue with American people not voting for them. And they can’t see that as a way that’s reasonable for them.
SPEAKER 12 :
Wow. Strong words. And we just got literally second. Any prediction as to how long this thing’s going to continue to carry out?
SPEAKER 18 :
I’ll say this. The most important things American people can do is stand up. This is their time. And remember, Democrats and Republicans are being hurt at this point. It doesn’t matter what party you’re part of. So put as much pressure. The American people have to step up at this point because the things we cannot sway here in Congress. It’s going to be the threat of them losing their seat. The only thing they can do, if they lose their seats, then they might come to the plate and act like they have some common sense.
SPEAKER 12 :
Utah Congressman Burgess Owens, thank you so much as always. Great to have you on with us. And you heard him just say we’ve got to put pressure on these folks. You can let your voice be heard as well. Text DHS to 67742. All right. News on abortion coming up after the break. Stay with us.
SPEAKER 16 :
For over 4,000 years, the Jewish people have had legal, historical, and biblical ties to the land of Israel, especially the heartland of Israel, Judea and Samaria, which much of the world still calls the West Bank. To Israelis, Judea and Samaria is far more than a name. It’s the center of their ancestral homeland where nearly 80% of the Bible’s events took place. Abraham purchased property in Hebron, Jacob in Shechem, Joshua made an altar on Mount Ebal and led the Israelites into a covenant before God. On Mount Gerizim, overlooking Shechem, Jesus talked to the Samaritan woman at the well about worshiping neither on Mount Gerizim nor in Jerusalem, but in spirit and in truth. Judea and Samaria is nearly a quarter of Israel’s current land mass, not a small strip of land on the Jordan River, but a vital and strategic part of the nation’s identity. The October 7th massacre, launched from Gaza, shattered the illusion that giving away territory brings peace. Gaza, which was once seen as the cornerstone of a two-state solution, became a launchpad for terror. Today, only 21% of Israelis support a Palestinian state. Trust in a two-state solution has all but collapsed. The Middle East is changing. Iran’s grip is weakening. New alliances are forming. But Western countries and some U.S. officials still chase the mirage of a two-state solution. History speaks clearly. The 2005 Gaza withdrawal, backed by the U.S., led not to peace, but to a terrorist regime. Judea and Samaria are 24 times larger than Gaza, deeply woven into Israel’s geographic and spiritual fabric. To surrender them would not bring peace. It would invite conflict and existential danger. Family Research Council stands with Israel’s rightful claim to sovereignty. It’s time for America to do the same for history, for justice, and for lasting security in the Middle East.
SPEAKER 12 :
Welcome back to Washington Watch. Again, I’m Jody Heiss, your guest host for the day, filling in for Tony. So glad to have you on board with us. All right, new data shows that abortions in the U.S. are on the rise, and that being especially abortions by male. According to the Guttmacher study, there was a slight increase in abortions nationwide from 2024 to 2025, and But although fewer women were traveling across state lines to have an abortion, there has been a surge in abortions by male. In fact, there was a 26% increase in the number of women living in states with pro-life laws who had abortions via virtual appointments like this. So what is driving this rise in abortions and what, if anything, can be done to reverse it? Well, joining me now to discuss this is Dr. Michael New. He’s a senior associate scholar at the Charlotte Lozier Institute and assistant professor of practice at the Catholic University of America. He researches and writes about the social science of pro-life issues. Dr. New, welcome back to Washington Watch. It’s always great to have you.
SPEAKER 10 :
Thanks for having me. Much appreciated.
SPEAKER 12 :
All right, so what do you make of this rise in abortions and the findings that we see coming from this study?
SPEAKER 10 :
Sure. The Guttmacher Institute earlier this week released new abortion data from 2025. Sadly, tragically, they found over 1.1 million abortions took place. It was a very slight increase of 2024, an increase of less than two-tenths of one percentage point. But the main lesson I draw from this is that pro-lifers really need to put a clamp and stop telehealth abortions. They found that there were over 91,000 abortions done by telehealth, done to women, or obtained by women, I should say, in states with strong pro-life laws. So these 91,000 telehealth abortions, that’s a 26% increase from the previous year. And that’s really driving these numbers up. So if we really want to get abortion numbers down, we really need to do something and stop telehealth abortions.
SPEAKER 12 :
All right, so what’s driving this? Especially the mail-order abortion pills, what’s behind all this?
SPEAKER 10 :
Well, sadly, it’s the FDA’s policy that for a long time, up until 2020, women who wanted to obtain a chemical abortion had to have an in-person medical exam. And that was, at least even though abortion is tragic, that at least, you know, was a good safeguard. If a woman has an ectopic pregnancy and obtains a chemical abortion, that can be fatal. If she’s further along in gestation, she realizes has chemical abortion, that gives some very negative serious health consequences. But as a temporary measure during the pandemic, the FDA waived this in-person requirement and allowed women to obtain these chemical abortion pills through the mail without an in-person medical exam. Now, unfortunately, the Biden administration continued this unwise policy after the pandemic. And sadly, the Trump administration has continued this unwise policy as well. The Trump administration has the power to end child abortions tomorrow. They can restore the old rules, the previous rules, and see that the women who obtain these chemical abortions at least have to have an in-person medical exam. So it’s part of the fault of Biden, but sadly also part of the fault of the Trump administration.
SPEAKER 12 :
Wow. Yeah, I’m sure you’ve seen it as well, but national polls, I know there’s one by CRC Research, but they found that in the ballpark of 70% of Americans support requiring a doctor’s visit in order for a woman to be prescribed an abortion drug. If this is something that most Americans, most voters are behind, then why hasn’t the in-person dispensing requirement been reinstated?
SPEAKER 10 :
Yeah, the poll that came out this week was very good. It said that 67% of Americans think there should be an in-person requirement with a health professional before a woman gets a chemical abortion. Even 62% of Democrats favor an in-person visit with a health professional before taking a chemical abortion. So I really don’t know why the Trump administration and the Trump appointees to FDA are so scared of this issue. It’s just good public health. It’s common sense. I don’t know what polls they’re seeing or who they’re getting advice from at this point. But I think that, again, limits on telehealth abortion are good politics, good policy. And I really don’t know why the Trump administration is waiting on this issue.
SPEAKER 12 :
So what is it going to take to reverse this trend? What’s it going to take to get the attention of the administration? Given where we are, how do we reverse this trend?
SPEAKER 10 :
I mean, there’s several things. I mean, the Trump administration has promised a study on this issue. They’re taking their time. A lot of speculation is that they’re not going to do anything until after the midterm election. There are other things that can be done legislatively. There’s legislation that’s been introduced at the federal level and in many states that would make these companies that send chemical abortion posts with the mail liable for damages that, you know, or any health damages that women incur as a result of these chemical abortions. That’s one thing. There are some state attorneys general, you know, they’re suing the FDA, arguing that they’re paying increased Medicaid costs because women are getting these chemical abortions and suffering and needing medical attention, and that’s putting a strain on Medicaid programs. So there are some actions being taken place, both at the federal and state level, that are fruitful. Again, the easiest thing would just be for the FDA to show up and reimpose the old rules, which they could do tomorrow.
SPEAKER 12 :
All right, when you say they could do it tomorrow, is that literal? I mean, what needs to be done for the FDA to change these rules?
SPEAKER 10 :
Absolutely. I mean, the FDA basically has set the rules on chemical abortions and they’ve loosened the rules in years past. They used to be like three in-person visits up until 2017. They reduced to one in-person visit. So they have changed the rules in the past. And again, what happened was in 2020, this would be temporary. During the pandemic when people had to stay indoors and, you know, there’s concerns about, you know, the COVID-19, you know. The virus, again, allowed women to obtain these chemical abortion pills through the mail. It’s meant to be temporary. But again, the Trump administration, FDA, continued this policy. So did the Biden administration, I should say, continued this policy, as did the Trump administration. So again, the FDA could change this tomorrow. I am not exaggerating.
SPEAKER 12 :
We hope they will. Thank you, Dr. Michael New, Senior Associate Scholar at the Charlotte Lozier Institute and Assistant Professor of Practice at the Catholic University of America. All right, coming up, we’ve got some important religious freedom news out of Finland. Stick around. We’ll be back after the break.
SPEAKER 11 :
The family is the oldest, most tested, and most reliable unit of society. It is divinely created and sustained. And yet, there are those who are always tampering with its values and structure. That’s why we need organizations like the Family Research Council that can effectively defend and strengthen the family.
SPEAKER 22 :
Family Research Council began over 40 years ago, like all great movements of God, with prayer. Today, rooted in the heart of the nation’s capital, FRC continues to champion faith, family, and freedom in public policy and the culture from a biblical worldview. FRC is one of those bright lights that helps us focus on true north.
SPEAKER 12 :
And I shudder to think, had they not been here, that it could have been worse, worse, worse.
SPEAKER 01 :
The Family Research Council is key. It’s one of a handful of groups that I think will determine whether our children live in a country that enjoyed all of the freedom and all the opportunity that we enjoyed in this great land.
SPEAKER 08 :
It’s just a wonderful parachurch organization that doesn’t seek to take the place of the church, but it seeks to assist the family and the church as we try to move forward successfully, not in a defensive mode, but in an offensive mode as we seek to live our lives according to the Holy Scriptures.
SPEAKER 13 :
FRC is not going to be whooped. You know, we’re going to fight. We’re going to take a stand. And again, we don’t retreat.
SPEAKER 16 :
You will never see in front of this building here in Washington, D.C., a white flag flying. We will never step back. We will never surrender. And we will never be silent.
SPEAKER 14 :
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SPEAKER 12 :
So glad to have you joining us today on Washington Watch. Welcome back. I am Jody Heiss filling in today for Tony. Thank you so much for joining us. Before I get into this next segment, I do want to encourage you to come aboard with our last discussion that the FDA can make a difference. They can make a difference and they need to hear from us. We want to encourage you to let your voice be known, to encourage the FDA to restore previous standards for the abortion drug and so forth. Simply text the word LIFE. to 677-42. That’s LIFE to 677-42. All right, over the past few years, we’ve discussed the ongoing case of Dr. Paivi Russonen of Finland. She is a Christian. She’s a medical doctor, and she’s a member of the Finnish parliament. She was prosecuted in June of 2019 under hate speech laws for merely expressing a biblical understanding of marriage and sexuality on social media, also in a radio interview, and in a pamphlet. And that pamphlet was printed more than 20 years ago. This has been a long-running case. It’s come to be known as the Bible Tweet case. It finally reached the Supreme Court of Finland last fall, and a verdict was announced just today. Here to unpack all of that for us is Shawn Nelson, who’s Senior Counsel for Global Religious Freedom. at ADF International, which is headquartered in Vienna, Austria. But ADF International has been coordinating PIVI’s legal defense. And so, Sean, thank you for joining us today on Washington Watch. Glad to have you with us.
SPEAKER 05 :
Great. Thank you for having me, Jody.
SPEAKER 12 :
All right, I didn’t get into it really in the introduction, but this trial involves not only Pivey, but Bishop Johanna Poiola also, who is charged for publishing that pamphlet that I referenced a little while ago, really just explaining and describing the Christian understanding of marriage and sexuality. So before we get into the decision of today, can you first just give us a brief summary of the case for those who may not be familiar with it?
SPEAKER 05 :
Yeah, absolutely. And as you said, it’s been known as the Bible trial worldwide at this point. Back in 2019, Paivi, longstanding member of the Finnish parliament, a very well-regarded person who’s been in the public eye for many, many years. She’s also a faithful and devout Lutheran. And so she had seen her church, the Finnish Lutheran Church, which is a national Church of Finland, had posted that they were going to be sponsoring a pride parade in Helsinki. Well, she didn’t like that. She didn’t think that accorded with her faith or with the faith of what the church was supposed to be. And so she posted on then Twitter… posted a tweet that you can go look at right now, saying that she disagreed with that, that she didn’t think the Bible taught that pride was a good thing, that it was a sinful thing. And she posted a verse from her family Bible, and that was it. But this caused outrage within some elite circles because they took it as statements contrary to prevailing views at that point of human sexuality that many Christians, including Pivy, disagreed with. So for that, the prosecutor there in Finland launched an investigation that ended up taking years and dug back through all of these different kinds of materials, almost everything that she had ever published or spoken, and they found a pamphlet. written in 2004 called Male and Female, He Created Them, which was a pamphlet at the time in Finland, like in a lot of places around the world, they were debating whether same-sex marriage should be legal or not. And this was a pamphlet designed to help people who are Christians, even some people who are not Christians, look at that with interesting eyes and informed eyes from a Christian perspective and given her perspective as a doctor. And so you fast forward for a couple of years. They also find this radio interview. They find just a handful of things from somebody who’s always in the public eye, and they decide to charge her with hate crimes. And now in Finland, these hate crimes are found in the war crimes database. and crimes against humanity statute. They’re extremely expansive. They say basically that even if you insult somebody based on a number of different protected characteristics that you could be and should be criminally charged and criminally liable. The law that she was charged under was actually passed in the legislature there in the parliament after she had made the pamphlet. So the pamphlet is published in 2004. The law comes in in 2011. People aren’t reading this. It’s just hosted on a Web site. And then, in 2019, she publishes her Bible tweet. So the prosecutors, they push this. It goes to the first trial. At the first trial, the prosecutors ask really outrageous questions to her, to Bishop Poyola. And all Bishop Poyola had done was host and publish the pamphlet from 2004. But they ask her, what does this Old Testament verse mean? Do you agree with this out of this book of the Bible? Really inappropriate things for a courtroom. Well, the judges in that first trial thought it was very inappropriate as well. And they found 3-0 in her favor and in Bishop Poyola’s favor, completely acquitting her. They said, the Bible is not illegal in Finland, and we’re not going to make it illegal to talk about your faith. Well, the prosecutor, this Finnish law is kind of strange in America. That would be it. If you lose a criminal case as a prosecutor, that’s it. You aren’t able to appeal that just because you lost. In Finland, though, the prosecutors were able to appeal that. So they appealed it. Went up to another three-judge panel. That panel agreed completely with the trial court. They said, we’re not going to make reading the Bible, showing the Bible, talking about it, sharing your faith illegal. That’s wrong. Well, the prosecutors continued. And, as you said, the case went up to the Supreme Court. There was a hearing this past fall. And, unfortunately, today, there was a very mixed decision. The Bible tweet, the one that’s been really famous, the court today said that that’s OK, that’s not hate speech. It’s pretty crazy that Pivey has had to go through six years to determine that a tweet that is still up on X is not hate speech. But that was the good news. The bad news was that the court said the pamphlet from 22 years ago was hate speech, that she is criminally liable, that Bishop Poyola is criminally liable for hosting this, continuing to host it even now, and that they have to remove the offensive content from the pamphlets immediately. We’re talking about very direct censorship, removing things from books. People are very concerned about book burning and book bans. This is what’s happening right now, simply because Pivy expressed her Christian faith and her own perspective, her informed perspective many years ago on human sexuality. It’s a real travesty, and it’s a very worrying precedent for the rest of Europe and the rest of the world.
SPEAKER 12 :
Wow. All right, Sean Nelson of Alliance Defending Freedom International. I want to thank you so much for breaking this down for us. We appreciate it a great deal. I want to turn now and get a reaction from a member of U.S. Congress who has been very active in speaking out in behalf of Pai V, the Finnish parliamentarian. that we’re talking about and joining us now is U.S. Representative Chip Roy. He’s a member of the Judiciary Committee and he represents the 21st Congressional District of Texas. Congressman Roy, welcome back to Washington Watch. Always great to have you.
SPEAKER 20 :
Great to be on with you, Jody. I’m coming to you from the cloakroom, a place you know well. I was just giving a speech on Islam down on the floor with my good friend Keith Self. Another one of those important issues to talk about, but obviously we’re really frustrated about what we saw unfold, directed at Pivey, and I appreciate you guys focusing on it today.
SPEAKER 12 :
Yes, well, just to say between you and Congressman Self, I would love to be there. You guys are great champions on so many issues. But yeah, let’s talk about this. You know, we’re watching the decline, a frightful decline of free speech and religious liberties across what at least once was known as the free world. 30,000-foot view, what’s your perspective of today’s decision?
SPEAKER 20 :
Well, it should be chilling to any American in particular, but any any person watching this, that you could have a member of the parliament prosecuted and dragged through the mud now for I don’t know how many years it’s been. What you guys just talked about it with five years or a long time. And going through this process through the course, and then have them settle on a conviction for a 20-year-old tweet, post, and about something that was hardly controversial to say for any Christian at the time, or frankly, even today. And that’s where we are. You know, you’ve got massive censorship in Europe. Thankfully, in the United States, we’ve been battling that back. Obviously, we’ve had to deal with censorship by big tech companies. Obviously, we had government collusion with big tech to censor speech in the United States under the previous administration. We’re fighting it off every which way we know how. But what happened to PIVI should be a a glimpse into the future and be very concerning for the average American. You know, if I say something about marriage being between man and a woman, and I’ve done it many times in my life, I’m a member of Congress, I’m the equivalent as she is in Finland. And 20 years from now, some leftists get in power, pass a law, and then they look backwards and they go and say, oh, well, this is somehow hate speech. You know, you got to wonder what’s coming if we don’t double down and preserve and protect our liberties. And I would note one last point on this. As we watch this unfold with the March of Islam across Europe, Notice how much deference is given to the Muslims that are infiltrating London and Paris and how much that you will get in trouble if you call them out, right? So you’re going to go to jail for hate speech if you say that you’ve got concerns about the Muslim Brotherhood waging jihad against the West. And so here in our country, we’re trying to preserve and protect religious liberty and freedom. You can believe what you want, free speech, you can say what you want. But what we also have to be mindful of is you’ve got a political ideology in Islam that is on the march through Europe and into the United States and very active in Texas. Now, again, we’re here to talk about PIVI, but all these things are interconnected. The organized left, the funding of all these things, the taxpayer funding, the United Nations funding, the world funding, and all of it is these groups that are pushing this nonsense. And if we don’t stand up for PIVI, then it’s coming here. And I think we need to have a loud voice. I’d encourage Secretary Rubio and others in the administration to call out fendling. This is an absolute travesty. And we should be screaming from the rooftops how horrid this is for religious liberty and just freedom generally.
SPEAKER 12 :
Yeah, so you see this as a certain warning for right here in the United States is with all the different things that you just mentioned, the different clashes of worldviews that are now marching across America, that this is something you believe could eventually be seen and witnessed right here in the United States.
SPEAKER 20 :
100%. I mean, it’s coming. It would already be here if we had had very much more time under the left, if President Trump hadn’t won, if we weren’t forcing some change as we speak. But if you look at some of the decisions of American judges, it would take no time at all. By the way, when we talk about the filibuster, You watch what Democrats do the next time they get control of the Senate and the House and the White House and how fast they act to move right around or nuke or otherwise change the filibuster. We’ve got to get busy deciding how we want to live. And are we going to defend our Judeo-Christian culture while maintaining Western values and maintaining the rights to free speech and freedom of religion and free expression? Or are we not? And I know a lot of people can say, well, Chip, you just contradicted yourself. You’re concerned about the march of Islam, but you’re saying religious expression and religious freedom. Look, I think it is consistent to say that I believe you can believe what you want to believe. But if you’re engaging and pushing a political ideology, then specifically to undermine our country, undermine the West. then that’s something that we can and should call out. But importantly, back to Pivy, this woman deserves our prayers. She deserves our support. She deserves the backing of this country. Finland deserves round condemnation. And we’ve got to be very vocal about this. You know, she testified in front of the Judiciary Committee as a witness. She came to my office. We visited not long ago, weeks ago, maybe a month or two ago. And she could not be a more kind and kind. just faithful and a devoted woman who is carrying out her faith in the face of persecution. God bless her for it. It reminds me of the book of Acts. It reminds me of the early apostles who stared down those that were persecuting them to the point of, as you well know, Jodi, beheadings and stonings and certain death or imprisonment.
SPEAKER 12 :
So what happens, what you’re describing is a potential change of American and Western culture, Western civilization, so much of which was based upon biblical principles. So what happens to the West when the Bible is labeled hate speech?
SPEAKER 20 :
The West will be destroyed and we will lose the West if we do not recenter our entire existence on our biblical values. And, you know, those things were inextricably intertwined. George Washington and his. various addresses, inaugural addresses, farewell address, the founding fathers generally, John Adams. There are many of the writings of our founders that talked about how central to our Republican form of government and self-rule that how instrumental the Bible and our Judeo-Christian values and principles were to the success of that. When you walk away from that, you know, you have no compass. You have no moorings. And, you know, we’ve got to get back to that centering. You know, when you ask how the United States of America is able to come together and win in World War II, it’s because whether you came from New York or from Georgia or from California or Illinois or Texas or anywhere in between, you know, you were united in a belief that this country was great. You were united in a belief in our values and our constitutional principles. But you were also united, generally speaking, as a people, in a round appreciation for God, the Bible, as a country, predominantly, if not almost entirely, Christian. And a strong cohort of Jewish population where we all came together and we fought in defense of our God-given rights and our country. We were united in purpose. And if we lose that, we don’t have anything left, Jody. That’s the whole thing.
SPEAKER 12 :
Yes. Well, Texas Congressman Chip Roy, as always, great to have you on the program. I want to encourage you to get back on the floor with Congressman Self and just let you know we love you. Thank God for you, both of you, and so many of you standing in the gap for us. All right, friends, that wraps up this edition of Washington Watch. Pray for this country, for our leaders. We’ll see you tomorrow.
SPEAKER 22 :
Washington Watch with Tony Perkins is brought to you by Family Research Council. To support our efforts to advance faith, family, and freedom, please text GIVE to 67742. That’s GIVE to 67742. Portions of the show discussing candidates are brought to you by Family Research Council Action. For more information, please visit TonyPerkins.com.
