In this episode, hear impactful discussions on the Supreme Court's examination of a major parental rights case from Montgomery County, Maryland. Guests like Meg Kilgannon provide a deep dive into what this could mean for religious freedoms and the rights of parents in public education. Additionally, explore the latest on Turkey’s strategic ambitions with insights from Dr. Michael Rubin, shedding light on what this means for regional stability and international alliances.
SPEAKER 15 :
From the heart of our nation's capital in Washington, D.C., bringing compelling interviews, insightful analysis, taking you beyond the headlines and soundbites into conversations with our nation's leaders and newsmakers, all from a biblical worldview, Washington Watch with Tony Perkins starts now.
SPEAKER 19 :
Critics have attacked my president, President Trump, for starting a trade war in an effort to bring back the jobs of the past, but nothing could be further from the truth. He seeks to rebalance global trade so that America, with friends like India, can build a future worth having for all of our people together.
SPEAKER 05 :
That was Vice President JD Vance speaking earlier today in India about U.S.-Indian trade relations. Welcome to Washington Watch. Thanks for tuning in. Vice President Vance's remarks come as China raises the stakes in the developing trade war with the U.S., threatening retaliation against countries that strike trade deals with the U.S. Asian expert Gordon Chang joins us with more on this unfolding story. And what about India? Does it make a good trade partner for the U.S.? Are its values aligned with the values of America, especially regarding religious freedom? Ohio Congressman Warren Davidson will join me for that discussion. Speaking of foreign affairs, concerns are growing about Turkey and its president.
SPEAKER 14 :
Turkey is a great concern in what is happening in Syria now. It's really concerning in particularly statements and discourse in regards to Jerusalem. These are declarations who are a red line in regards to Israel, but it shows their intention.
SPEAKER 05 :
That was Israeli Deputy Foreign Minister Sharon Haskell on CBN. We'll talk Turkey and what it means for regional stability with Michael Rubin, Senior Fellow at the American Enterprise Institute. And back here at home, the federal government may soon hit its debt limit earlier than previously projected. Raising the debt ceiling will now be part of the upcoming congressional reconciliation package, adding urgency to getting the measure to the president by Memorial Day. We'll hear more from North Carolina Congressman Chuck Edwards, a member of the House Budget Committee. And finally, as we discussed here on Washington Watch yesterday, the Supreme Court heard oral arguments today in a major parental rights case out of Maryland.
SPEAKER 17 :
Here, Montgomery County offers a free public education to parents only if their children use books featuring same-sex relationships and transgender issues. That burdens parents of multiple faiths whose religious duty is to shield their young children from such content.
SPEAKER 05 :
That was Principal Deputy Solicitor General Sarah Harris today before the Supreme Court. Meg Kilgannon will join us shortly with a quick update on the oral arguments. Also this week, we released Session 10 of our God and Government course, The Christian's Relationship to Civil Government. In this session, I discuss a Christian's responsibility to respect and obey civil government. because it's established by God. But then how do we respond when government steps outside of God's authority? What does that look like? Well, I encourage you to find out. If you don't have the Stand Firm app, I would encourage you to text the word COURSE to 67742. That's COURSE to 67742, because the God and Government course is exclusively on the Stand Firm app. Earlier today, the U.S. Supreme Court heard a case that has the potential to have a nationwide impact on the rights of parents and religious exercise, free religious freedom of religion when it comes to exercising that freedom as it pertains to children's education. This was brought by a group of parents in Montgomery County, Maryland, who are asking the court to decide on this question. Do public schools burden parents' religious exercise when they compel elementary school students to participate in instruction on gender and sexuality against their parents' religious convictions and without notice or opportunity to opt out? Joining us now with more on today's oral arguments is Meg Kilgannon, Senior Fellow for Education Studies here at the Family Research Council. Meg, thanks for joining me again.
SPEAKER 16 :
My pleasure.
SPEAKER 05 :
All right, give us the 30,000-foot view of today's oral arguments.
SPEAKER 16 :
Well, it was really encouraging. First of all, it was great that we played that clip of Sarah Harris as Solicitor General, because for the past four years, anybody listening to Supreme Court oral arguments was hearing a lot of disturbing arguments made by the Biden administration Solicitor General. So it was a big change, and one in support of these parents, which is so wonderful. So elections do have consequences. But the overall mood of the case and the mood of the justices seemed to me to be in the favor of the parents. I was very glad to hear that.
SPEAKER 05 :
Did it appear that as the court wrestled through this and asked questions that they're recognizing the complications that have been created by the redefinition of marriage in the Obergefell case?
SPEAKER 16 :
Well, I don't know what could make it more obvious than this kind of case being before them. They do seem to understand that some of the justices were really honing in on definitions. And I'm not a lawyer. I'm not really sure what all the cases were that they were talking about. But they all involve... religious liberty, and some of them involve parental rights. But what they really were honing in on was the fact that there is a health class that includes a sex education segment of it that's offered for the same age range of students, pre-K to grade six, and that class allows an opt-out, and that is not a burden for the school. So they were really asking the school system to defend the fact that they've refused to let these parents have an opt-out for very similar material being presented in, say, English class. So that part of it was very clear, and they don't seem to be buying Montgomery County's arguments.
SPEAKER 05 :
And this could have implications nationwide, could it not?
SPEAKER 16 :
Absolutely could. It absolutely could. And we're going to see more of this, Tony, because like you said, we haven't had this conversation. These are things that have been imposed by the courts in terms of Obergefell and his ramifications. And so we're going to have to work all of this out.
SPEAKER 05 :
Meg Kilgannon, always great to talk with you. Thanks for giving us an update.
SPEAKER 16 :
Thanks for having me.
SPEAKER 05 :
Absolutely. And folks, this is an issue to pray about because as the court takes these oral arguments later this week, they'll probably meet together on Friday. They'll kind of go through it and they'll make their decision, even though it won't be released until June or July. They could make their decision in terms of individual judges very soon. So it's something to pray about. All right, the Treasury Department is expected to give an update on the federal government's borrowing limit by next week. Current estimates say the limit will be exhausted as early as this summer, the first part of the summer, which could light a fire for Congress to quickly pass the budget reconciliation package because the debt ceiling increase is going to be in that package. Joining us now to talk more about this, Congressman Chuck Edwards, who serves on the House Budget Committee and the House Appropriations Committee. He represents the 11th Congressional District of North Carolina. Congressman Edwards, welcome back to Washington Watch. Thanks for taking time to join us today. Thanks for giving me a chance to visit today. But before we jump into the topic, I want to congratulate you as one of those members of Congress who earlier this month received FRC Actions 100% award for scoring perfect 100% on our scorecard during the 118th Congress. So I just want to say thank you for defending faith, family, and freedom.
SPEAKER 04 :
Well, thank you. What an honor to receive your award. And I certainly appreciate the work that you and your entire organization is doing to help keep Congress focused. and be a moral, a moral compass for us.
SPEAKER 05 :
Well, thank you. I appreciate that. Let's talk, let's talk dollars and cents. The Treasury Department announced, announcement next week will factor in the receipts for the tax year 2024. I was having a brief conversation with the House Speaker about this earlier this week, suggesting that the timetable may be moving up on us and it's, there's an urgency for Congress to act. Talk about that.
SPEAKER 04 :
Well, we've certainly seen the need to act. As you know, in the Fiscal Responsibility Act, we raised the debt ceiling to get us through, I believe it was January of this year. We've long passed that, and Treasury has been in this shell game that they call using extraordinary measures, which is essentially what we do at home when We've got more bills coming in than we have income to pay it. We sit down at the kitchen table and we lay them all out and start shuffling and rearranging and deciding what we're going to pay and when. We've been shuffling now for about six months and it's time to pay the piper. The bigger issue than that is Congress has got to recognize we are on an unsustainable path in terms of our spending. And I believe the budget resolution that we passed just a few weeks ago will take the first steps in curbing that thirst for debt.
SPEAKER 05 :
Yeah, so all of this is kind of in one package because in the Budget Reconciliation Act are the policies, the initiatives that actually dial back some of the spending. We also have some of the rescissions that will be waiting for Congress when they return. So that is being dealt with. But at the same time, This debt ceiling issue is something that has to be addressed so that the government doesn't default on its debt. Do you think this is going to create incentive for Republicans to come together? Because, I mean, the margins are very narrow. Do you think you'll be able to build unity in moving forward?
SPEAKER 04 :
I certainly believe that we're in a position right now where we'll be building unity. We have an opportunity. before us right now that we've not seen in several decades. Not only with the composition in the Congress, in the House, in the Senate, and President Trump occupying the White House, but we recognize that urgency is like never before. I have a great sense of optimism. I know that many of us are going to disagree on some of the smaller elements. in how we're going to approach this one big, beautiful bill. But we all recognize the need to get it done. And the time is now.
SPEAKER 05 :
Congressman, we just have about two and a half minutes left. I'm going to shift gears for just a moment because I want to ask you about a town hall that you hosted last month in your state, which featured a very vocal crowd. I mean, you've got some real issues going on in your district, hit hard by the hurricane, people wanting answers, wanting things done. But there's also there's some other stuff going on there. Tell us about your experience and why it's important to go forward with these town hall meetings.
SPEAKER 04 :
Well, there's many reasons that I've decided to go through with the town hall. One is, and you mentioned it, my district has been hit by its largest, most devastating natural disaster in our history. And that's a time to start pulling people together, talk about the plan moving forward. Another reason is I just want to be accountable to the folks in my district. They need to hear from their representatives in Congress, even though the crowd that was at my town hall was certainly not representative of the district that I served. But more importantly, we've got Republicans have a lot to brag about right now. And rather than shine away from those things, I want to embrace them. I want to get out in front of people and talk about the fact that we've got a plan to close the border, to get our American energy unleashed, to get our fiscal house in order, and to accomplish all the other things that the American people sent us to Washington, D.C. to do.
SPEAKER 05 :
You know, and Congressman, I think it's important, for the reasons you said, to stand and give an account. But I also think it exposes those who are coming in to create difficulty and are just there to cause problems when, you know, look, we treat them with respect. And, you know, I think they reveal their true motives when we do that. And I have found in my time in office when we had these is that the crowd actually polices itself, and they take care of some of these rebel rousers because they're there to hear, to get their questions answered, and they're really not looking for trouble. And so I commend you for continuing on that. in having these town hall meetings. And I do hope that other Republicans will follow your lead. Congressman Edwards, thanks so much for joining us today. And again, congratulations on being a 100 percenter.
SPEAKER 04 :
All right. Thank you. What an honor it is. Thanks.
SPEAKER 05 :
All right, folks. And look, if you get a chance to go to these town hall meetings, go. And maybe you're just praying for your member or something, but go. Don't go away. We're back after this.
SPEAKER 10 :
At Family Research Council, we believe religious freedom is a fundamental human right that all governments must protect. That's why FRC President Tony Perkins went to Capitol Hill to testify on behalf of persecuted Christians in Nigeria. Islamist terror groups target Christians and other religious minorities in Nigeria with brutal violence. Representative Chris Smith, who chaired the hearing, said 55,000 people have been killed and 21,000 abducted in the last five years alone. The congressman also stressed that 89% of Christians in the world who are martyred are from Nigeria.
SPEAKER 02 :
Yet the government of Nigeria has failed to make progress against religiously motivated persecution of Christians despite religious freedom being enshrined as an essential human right in their constitution.
SPEAKER 10 :
Tony Perkins called for the United States to send an unmistakable message.
SPEAKER 05 :
This is systematic religious violence. Nigeria must be redesignated a country of particular concern. The Biden administration's removal of this designation was a reckless mistake that emboldened the very terrorists who are slaughtering Christians.
SPEAKER 10 :
Redesignating Nigeria will enable the U.S. government to pressure Nigerian leaders to protect vulnerable Christians.
SPEAKER 05 :
These are not just numbers. These are fathers, their mothers, their children, their families.
SPEAKER 10 :
Bishop Wilfred Anagabe risked his life to speak out, sharing firsthand accounts of the danger faced in his church district in central Nigeria.
SPEAKER 01 :
We live in fear because at any point it can be our turn to be killed. But to remain silent is to die twice. So I have chosen to speak.
SPEAKER 10 :
FRC is calling on President Trump to act now to promote religious freedom around the globe and speak up on behalf of Christians in Nigeria.
SPEAKER 11 :
Download the new Stand Firm app for Apple and Android phones today and join a wonderful community of fellow believers. We've created a special place for you to access news from a biblical perspective, read and listen to daily devotionals, pray for current events and more. Share the Stand Firm app with your friends, family and church members and stand firm everywhere you go.
SPEAKER 07 :
Looking for a trusted source of news that shares your Christian values? Turn to The Washington Stand, your ultimate destination for informed, faith-centered reporting. Our dedicated team goes beyond the headlines, delivering stories that matter most to believers. From breaking events to cultural insights, we provide clear, compassionate coverage through a biblical lens. Discover news you can trust at The Washington Stand, where faith and facts meet every day.
SPEAKER 05 :
Welcome back to Washington Watch. Thanks for joining us. All right. China has been doubling down on its threats against the U.S. over the tariffs. I mean, it looks like we're in the midst of a pretty hot trade war. Now what they're doing is they're taking aim at other nations. On Monday, a spokesman for the Chinese Ministry of Commerce warned other countries to avoid making trade deals at the expense of China's interest. If they do, China will, quote, take countermeasures in a resolute and reciprocal manner, end quote. So what can we draw from China's latest threats? And is this an indication that President Trump's tariffs are working? Here to discuss this, Asian expert Gordon Chang, distinguished senior fellow at Gatestone Institute and author of several books on China and Chinese-U.S. relations, including his most recent, Plan Red, China's Project to Destroy America. You can follow him on X at Gordon G. Chang. Gordon, welcome back to Washington Watch. Thanks for joining us. Thank you so much, Tony. All right. Saber rattling. What do we make of this?
SPEAKER 06 :
Well, I think it is saber rattling and I think it is an indication that the Chinese are very worried that President Trump will reorder the global trading system because we've got the world's largest market. We've got a lot of leverage in our discussions with the Japanese, the South Koreans, the Vietnamese, Europeans, Italians. And so I think China is worried about being left out in the cold. So therefore, they're making threats against trade partners. now i don't think it's going to work because china is the trade surplus country in the world it last year its global trade surplus was 992.2 billion dollars so that means that there are a lot of reasons why countries around the world want to deal with us because we're a trade deficit country we got the world's largest market i think china's getting a little bit worried right now
SPEAKER 05 :
So what does that look like, these threats that they're making, these countermeasures to other countries? I mean, what could they do to them?
SPEAKER 06 :
You know, they can do minor things, but ultimately a trade surplus country is very just out of ammunition. And we can see that in our trade relations with what China's been saying to us recently. Like the embargo on rare earths really is more symbolic than anything else. China tried that in 2010 against Japan and the embargo collapsed in a couple of months. The Japanese found ways around it. We're doing the same things. Even Boeing. That's a really hollow threat just because of the way the global airplane market works. You know, you have backlogs of years and years and years. There's only so much production in the world. Whatever China doesn't buy from Boeing, Boeing will be able to sell to Airbus' customers who are not going to wait for 10 years to get an Airbus. Because, you know, if Airbus sells to China, it can't sell to somebody else. We'll sell to somebody else. So there's a lot of things that China's been huffing and puffing recently, but they really hurt China as much or more than it hurts us.
SPEAKER 05 :
So let's talk about the the adjusting of this trade imbalance is China. You know, they're there, as you said, they're they're the ones people are buying from. They're not necessarily buying from others. So, you know, they don't want to hurt their customers. I mean, that doesn't make sense. Could this cause others that have manufacturing capacity to increase that capacity to step in if China goes too far?
SPEAKER 06 :
I think yes. And clearly, countries around the world are worried about their own manufacturing, just as President Trump is worried about the state of the American manufacturing sector. So this is a global concern. I think countries around the world have had enough. They've got to protect themselves, and they are now starting to impose tariffs. So for instance, India just a day ago slapped 12% tariffs on Chinese steel, or steel in general, But that was really to prevent China from selling to India what it couldn't sell to the United States. And I think we're going to see this around the world as countries protect their local markets from what they anticipate to be a flood of Chinese goods.
SPEAKER 05 :
So in part, help me understand what China is doing at the bottom level here is that by threatening these other countries, are they trying to keep these other countries from striking trade deals from the U.S. to step in and provide some of the product that we're getting from China now, which would then lock China out in the future possibly?
SPEAKER 06 :
That's exactly what China is worried about, because the trade deals that President Trump is trying to put together probably do a couple of things. But one of them is it makes it more difficult for those countries to trade with China, removes the incentives to do that. And so China is worried that it will not be able it'll be locked out of markets or that their access to other markets will be reduced. So China is, I think, right now realizing that it's got to try to intimidate others not to do these deals with the U.S. or not to do deals with the U.S. with provisions of the type I just talked about. So this is now a struggle between Washington and Beijing. You know, we just heard from Treasury Secretary Besant, or at least we've heard reports that Besant is saying that there will be a de-escalation of the trade war. I think that's a little bit premature because we're not seeing Xi Jinping bending right now. And that's what's absolutely necessary for China to be more accommodating, not only with the United States, but with other countries around the world.
SPEAKER 05 :
So what would have been gained if we stopped right now? If the Trump administration said, all right, truce, nothing else. Well, I mean, what would have been gained? Anything?
SPEAKER 06 :
I don't think anything would be gained because, as Besant mentioned, negotiations with China over a trade deal are going to be a slog, is the term we've been hearing last few hours. And that's certainly true. China is not going to make commitments, and we've seen this in other trade deals, where it takes them a very long time to come around. And I think that's the case now, especially because apparently Besson talked about structural changes in China to increase the consumption sector of the Chinese economy. That's something Xi Jinping has been extremely reluctant to do. Yes, they'll make rhetorical flourishes that they'll do it, but they have not made changes. As a matter of fact, consumption share of the Chinese economy now about 38%. has been declining in recent years, not increasing. So what Besant wants to do with the Chinese economy is extremely hard and probably impossible as long as Xi Jinping is in charge.
SPEAKER 05 :
All right. Just about a minute, just a little less than a minute left. Long slog. I mean, what are we talking about? Is that a year, two years? I mean, how long of a process is that?
SPEAKER 06 :
Yeah, I wish I knew the answer to that, but it could very well be a year, especially because we're seeing renegotiation of trade relationships around the world, which means that there are only so many Treasury negotiators which means that we're going to be prioritizing trade agreements with our friends. We just saw the vice president announce in India where he is that there's new trade guidelines have been agreed with New Delhi. That's great news for the U.S.
SPEAKER 05 :
Well, yes, maybe we'll talk about that another day. Gordon, thanks for joining us. Always good to hear you.
SPEAKER 06 :
Thank you so much, Tony.
SPEAKER 05 :
All right, folks, don't go away. We're going to maybe talk a little bit about India on the other side of the break. Don't go away.
SPEAKER 08 :
Everything we do begins as an idea. Before there can be acts of courage, there must be the belief that some things are worth sacrificing for. Before there can be marriage, there is the idea that man should not be alone. Before there was freedom, there was the idea that individuals are created equal. It's true that all ideas have consequences, but we're less aware that all consequences are the fruit of ideas. Before there was murder, there was hate. Before there was a Holocaust, there was the belief by some people that other people are undesirable. Our beliefs determine our behavior, and our beliefs about life's biggest questions determine our worldview. Where did I come from? Who decides what is right and wrong? What happens when I die? Our answers to these questions explain why people see the world so differently. Debates about abortion are really disagreements about where life gets its value. Debates over sexuality and gender and marriage are really disagreements about whether the rules are made by us or for us. What we think of as political debates are often much more than that. They are disagreements about the purpose of our lives and the source of truth. As Christians, our goal must be to think biblically about everything. Our goal is to help you see beyond red and blue, left and right, to see the battle of ideas at the root of it all. Our goal is to equip Christians with a biblical worldview and help them advance and defend the faith in their families, communities, and the public square. Cultural renewal doesn't begin with campaigns and elections. It begins with individuals turning from lies to truth. But that won't happen if people can't recognize a lie and don't believe truth exists. We want to help you see the spiritual war behind the political war, the truth claims behind the press release, and the forest and the trees.
SPEAKER 05 :
This is Washington Watch. I'm Tony Perkins, your host. Good to have you with us. The website, TonyPerkins.com. Better yet, get the Stand Firm app, and you'll not only have Washington Watch, you'll have the Washington Stand and my daily devotional, Stand on the Word. You can find it in the App Store. Stand firm. Yesterday, four Democrat House members arrived in El Salvador's capital, San Salvador, and met with U.S. Embassy officials to advocate for the release of an illegal immigrant, Kilmar Garcia, who was deported there by the Trump administration. So why are Democrats going to such great lengths to advocate on behalf of someone who is living illegally in our country? So here to discuss this and a bit more, Congressman Warren Davidson. He serves on the House Financial Services Committee and the Foreign Affairs Committee. He represents Ohio's 8th Congressional District. Congressman Davidson, welcome back to Washington Watch. Always good to see you. Always an honor. Thank you, Tony. Hey, before we jump into the immigration issue, I want to I was just talking with Gordon Chang about China, the trade war there earlier today. The vice president, J.D. Vance, another Ohioan, was in India touting, you know, relationships, a good friendship with India in terms of trade and other aspects. I just want to throw this out there. I'm a bit concerned. I'm not sure that they're a great trade partner when we look at their human rights record. When I was on the U.S. Commission on International Religious Freedom, we constantly recommended them for a country of particular concern because of the tremendous threat that Christians have in that country. I mean, do they make a great trade partner when they have such a record, a dismal record on human rights?
SPEAKER 03 :
Human rights always used to feature prominently in our negotiations with countries. It was always part of our diplomacy. And I think with India, they are a close friend. We should build an alliance with them. Our interests are very closely aligned. And so they make a good prospect for an ally. But our cultures are pretty different. And part of our relationship should be, well, OK, you don't have to totally accept our culture, but you shouldn't be hostile to it. And religious freedom is central to what makes America America. We certainly would love to see that be more accepted in India. And I think their people would, too. I mean, there's a reason a lot of people leave India for the opportunities here in America. So there's a large Indian expat community here in America. They send a lot of money back home to India. And I think they stay in America for a lot of reasons. Part of that may be religious freedom.
SPEAKER 05 :
Well, we certainly shouldn't be hesitant, I think, to talk about those American values such as religious freedom. I think it's when we talk about doing business, being yoked with another country, we need to talk about all those issues. All right. I'm going to shift back to El Salvador. Why are Democrats there to advocate on behalf of someone who was living illegally here in our country?
SPEAKER 03 :
Yeah, I think they've picked this El Salvador man and described him as a Maryland man because they think, boy, here's a guy that was with a deportation order two separate times, living illegally in the country, aligned as an MS-13 member, not just here in the United States, but in El Salvador, which probably has a lot to do with why he left El Salvador. And in the first place, and why a citizen of El Salvador is locked up in Seacott. He's not locked up there because he's an American citizen. He's locked up there because he's an El Salvadoran and a known affiliate of MS-13, if not actual member of MS-13. They think that if they can win this case, if they can keep him here, well, then effectively they can keep anybody here. And, you know, they facilitated an invasion of our country, open borders. They want to treat non-citizens, even illegal residents, as criminals. You know, in the census, they want to draw congressional maps and everything, count them in the Senate, in the census, just like American citizens. They want birthright citizenship for their kids, even if neither parent is an American citizen. And just like in this case with this El Salvador citizen, they want adjudication, including years of appeals on a case-by-case basis. And if they can do that, they can essentially stop us from reversing the invasion they facilitated.
SPEAKER 05 :
So, Congressman, do they see their opening in pressing this case because the Supreme Court has stepped in and told the Trump administration to return this individual?
SPEAKER 03 :
Well, they saw the opening before that. That's how the case wound up before the court. It's just mind-blowing. I mean, even if you accept the premise that somehow it's constitutional for the Biden administration to facilitate an invasion of our country, it's constitutional to count non-citizens as residents for purposes of drawing congressional maps, that somehow it's constitutional to have birthright citizenship when neither parent's a citizen. And the Supreme Court's gonna hear that case on May 15th. I wanna be there for it. Somehow all that's constitutional. I mean, wouldn't you want to change it? And in fact, Democrats are down there in El Salvador lobbying to preserve that view of the law in America. They're fighting in every court they can to preserve that twisted view of our Constitution. I think the people of this country stand with people like President Trump. It was a big factor in the election to say, you have to be here legally. You're welcome to come, but you have to do it legally.
SPEAKER 05 :
Yeah, there's no question about it. This was, if not the number one issue, it was certainly among the top three issues driving voters in the presidential election. We just have about a minute left. Do you see a collision course coming between the administration and the Supreme Court on this?
SPEAKER 03 :
I hope not with the Supreme Court. I mean, clearly there's a collision course with the district courts. It's disappointing to see the Supreme Court's ruling. I think Alito might not have been blunt enough in rebuking some of his colleagues on the Supreme Court. Hopefully they land on the side of common sense. And look, I went to business school, not law school. But I mean, I think the basic premise has to be that there's a different expectation for American citizens than people that are here illegally and, you know, wanted essentially fugitives in El Salvador. I mean, there has to be a different standard of justice.
SPEAKER 05 :
Well, we will soon see. Congressman Warren Davidson, always great to have you on the program. Thanks so much for joining us today. Thank you, Tony. All right, folks, we're going to continue our conversation on international issues right now. We're going to talk about the coming up next. We're going to talk about concerns over Turkey and where they are setting their sights. So don't go away. More Washington Watch straight ahead when we return from this break.
SPEAKER 13 :
to transform your trials into triumphs? Dive into the book of Daniel with FRC's new study guide, Daniel, Visions and Valor. Perfect for those seeking courage and wisdom from one of the Bible's most faithful figures. This 13-day journey is ideal for small groups or individual study as part of our ongoing Stand on the Word Bible reading plan. It's a timeless resource ready to deepen your engagement with scripture. Explore how Daniel's life and God-given visions offer a blueprint for navigating challenges. Each day includes scriptures, reflection questions, and space for notes to enhance your understanding and application. Available in digital and physical formats, order your copy of Daniel, Visions and Valor today and start your journey of transformation. To order, text the word DANIEL to 67742. That's DANIEL to 67742.
SPEAKER 09 :
What is God's role in government? What does the separation of church and state really mean? And how does morality shape a nation? President John Adams said our Constitution was made only for moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other. Join Family Research Council for God and Government, a powerful 13-part series that equips you with biblical truth to engage in today's most pressing debates, from the Ten Commandments in classrooms to the immigration crisis of America. We'll uncover the foundations of our nation's history and why it's relevant for today. Defend God's plan for government because faith and freedom were never meant to be separate. New episodes available each Monday. To view the series on the Stand Firm app, text COURSE to 67742.
SPEAKER 12 :
How should Christians think about the thorny issues shaping our culture? How should Christians address deceitful ideas like transgenderism, critical theory, or assisted suicide? How can Christians navigate raising children in a broken culture, the war on gender roles, or rebuilding our once great nation? Outstanding is a podcast from The Washington Stand dedicated to these critical conversations. Outstanding seeks to tear down what our corrupt culture lifts up with an aim to take every thought and every idea captive to the obedience of Christ. Whether policies or partisan politics, whether conflict in America or conflict abroad, join us and our guests as we examine the headlines through the lens of Scripture and explore how Christians can faithfully exalt Christ in all of life follow outstanding on your favorite podcast app and look for new episodes each week
SPEAKER 05 :
All right, starting April 29th, we'll be in the book of Daniel in our journey through the Bible, Stand on the Word, our reading plan. And in anticipation of that, we have a new study guide, Daniel, Visions and Valor. It's a great resource. It's a great resource for anyone as they navigate through tough times, face pressures, challenges, and worries. Basically, it's great for life because life is filled with those challenges and pressures. So if you'd like to get a copy, text Daniel to 67742, Daniel to 67742 to order your copy of our new study guide. Speaking of the word. Our word for today comes from Ezekiel 43, where the prophet is given a glimpse of the future temple, the place where God's glory will dwell among his people. And he said, Son of man, this is the place of my throne and the place of the soles of my feet, where I will dwell in the midst of the children of Israel forever. No more shall the house of Israel defile my holy name, they nor their kings by their harlotry or with their carcasses of their kings on their high places. When they set their threshold by my threshold and their doorpost by my doorpost, with only a wall between me and them, they defile my holy name by the abominations they committed. Therefore, I consumed them in my anger. Now let them put away their harlotry and the carcasses of their kings far from me, and I will dwell in their midst forever." You see, idolatry erected a wall between God and his people. And to experience his abiding presence, the idols must be torn down and the false gods cast away. Only then can we truly dwell with him. For more on our journey through the Bible, text Bible to 67742. That's Bible to 67742. This past weekend, Turkey's intelligence chief, Ibrahim Kalin, met with Hamas leaders to discuss how to deliver aid to Gaza as the war that Hamas started on October the 7th continues to rage. And the talks were held as reports say Turkish President Erdogan has set his sights on Israel. What could this potentially mean for our nation's closest ally? Here to discuss this and more, Dr. Michael Rubin, Senior Fellow at the American Enterprise Institute and Director of Policy Analysis at the Middle East Forum. Dr. Rubin, welcome back to Washington Watch. Thanks for joining us.
SPEAKER 18 :
Hey, thanks for having me. It's always great to be here.
SPEAKER 05 :
So first, unpack for us why President Erdogan, his tenure in office has been so troubling on multiple fronts.
SPEAKER 18 :
Well, look, President Erdogan is already past the two-decade mark in his leadership of Turkey. When he came into office, people thought maybe he'd be a pragmatist, that he could combine Islamic democracy. Look, if you have to put an adjective before democracy, it's not a democracy. That was a mistake of the George W. Bush administration in which I played a minor role. At any rate, As he's consolidated power, his true ideology has come through. He's a Muslim Brotherhood acolyte through and through. And in that regard, he really wants nothing more than the defeat of the United States, the defeat of Europe, and the eradication of Israel.
SPEAKER 05 :
There are some that say that he would like to reestablish the Ottoman Empire. He's certainly reaching around the world and certainly in that region to reestablish his influence and the influence of Turkey.
SPEAKER 18 :
You're absolutely right. Look, some may say he wants to reestablish the Ottoman Empire because his own people, his own aides do. When you look at the maps in the Turkish Defense Ministry, for example, they include much of the former Ottoman Empire. The problem he has had so far is that the remembrance of the Ottoman Empire is much fonder inside Turkey than among its subject peoples in the Arab world and broader. And so you're starting to get a reaction in Greece, in Cyprus, in the Balkans, even in places like Syria, which are now a de facto Turkish proxy of people pushing back on Turkey trying to almost establish a colonial presence. But, you know, this is what we're up against. And you can't beat back this threat if we refuse to acknowledge it.
SPEAKER 05 :
What do you say in terms of his comments to suggest that he's eyeing Jerusalem, when you look at him and those around him making these comments about Israel?
SPEAKER 18 :
Look, I'm not as worried about Recep Tayyip Erdogan's rhetoric. as I am about his action. And the fact of the matter is, his actions are far more disturbing than even his words are. He's just saying what he's doing, but so many of the recent Hamas attacks on Israel, both before and after October 7th, 2023, were actually planned or financed from Istanbul, Turkey, from the former seat of the Ottoman Caliphate. And so that is something that has really raised the concern in counter-terrorism circles, not only in the United States and in Israel, but throughout much of the Arab world as well.
SPEAKER 05 :
Well, Dr. Rubin, speaking of that, I mean, they had the meeting I mentioned with Hamas this past weekend. We last time I was in Israel just a couple of months ago, speaking with officials that Turkey is smuggling weapons, advanced weapons into Judea and Samaria to be utilized there by a Palestinian activist. How can we, on one hand, be in relationship with Turkey through NATO, and then them actually targeting and undermining our closest ally?
SPEAKER 18 :
Let me unpack that a little bit, because there's a lot of issues you just touched upon. When it comes to Judea and Samaria or the West Bank, the reason why so much is in play right now is Mahmoud Abbas, the chairman of the Palestinian Authority, is 89 years old, and he's in his 20th year of his four-year presidential term. So everyone is jockeying for control after he passes away. and Turkey first and foremost among them, supporting Hamas and other factions in the West Bank that would mirror what exists in the Gaza Strip.
SPEAKER 05 :
So let me stop you right there. So is this another Syria-type undertaking by Turkey? As they were helping undermine Assad, are they going to move in a vacuum once we see the death of the Palestinian leader?
SPEAKER 18 :
That's an astute observation. I think it's correct. The difference is the world, or at least Israel, is much more aware now, even if they had let their guard down on October 7th, 2023. They're not foolish about Turkey. And this goes to your previous question. How can Turkey be a NATO ally and act like this? And the problem we have in Washington across administrations is too often we want to calibrate our policy towards the way things used to be or towards the wishful thinking of what we wish they would be rather than calibrate our policies towards reality. You know, Tony, the statistic I always give to let people know how much Turkey has changed actually comes from Turkey's own interior ministry. And that is, since Recep Tayyip Erdogan came to power in Turkey, the murder rate of women inside Turkey has increased 1,400%, and that's because of the sense of impunity that religious conservatives have now as they conduct honor crimes and so forth inside Turkey.
SPEAKER 05 :
That brings me to my next point that I was going to ask you, the next question I was going to ask is, When we look at that, thinking we want to reestablish what used to be, there's a different ideology driving Turkey when we thought they were moving toward a more secular democracy. And they were for a time. But they're now, I think, digging deep into those ideological roots of Islam. For some reason, the West has a hard time understanding what is unfolding before our very eyes.
SPEAKER 18 :
Well, I think there's also a psychological component here on the part of Turkey's leader, Recep Tayyip Erdogan, which in my view is somewhat similar to what we see inside Iran with Supreme Leader Ali Khamenei. And that is when you have dedicated your whole life to this noxious form of Islamism, and you want to see nothing more than the destruction of Israel, and you realize that your own mortality is looming, then you want to put your plans into action now. You realize you don't have time to wait. And so what I see in both Iran and in Turkey is a sense of impatience, which is making the situation far more dangerous.
SPEAKER 05 :
Okay, so let me circle back around to what I asked before. NATO. Turkey is a part of NATO. We're a part of NATO. I mean, that's a close relationship. We come to one another's aid. Israel's our closest ally. It is clear, it's not a secret, that Turkey is undermining the security and the well-being of Israel.
SPEAKER 18 :
Okay, here's the problem. NATO, which Turkey joined in 1952, is governed by consensus. So Turkey can be the Trojan horse inside NATO. Why don't we just kick Turkey out? Because there's no mechanism inside NATO in order to kick someone out. In the past, France has removed itself. Greece has removed itself. But in those cases, it was voluntary. What I believe is happening right now is Turkey sees that it can do more for our enemies and for its own noxious ideology by remaining inside NATO to do two things. One is to block consensus and therefore basically paralyze the organization. The second actually is even scarier, and that has to do with its nuclear program. Turkey is opening a Russian-built nuclear reactor this year. Now, when you had Iraq try to build a nuclear reactor in 1981, Israel took that out and thank God they did. In 2007, Israel eliminated Syria's North Korean-built plutonium processing plant. But now we have Turkey doing basically what Iran has done. But the difference is with Turkey is that they can hide behind NATO's Article 5. They can hide behind the sense that if they are attacked, all NATO members have to respond as if they themselves were attacked. And so what I'm afraid is happening is Turkey is using its NATO membership in order to develop a nuclear weapon. And it's going to remain in NATO until it becomes its own nuclear power. And then all bets are off because, again, Erdogan is acting on almost apocalyptic ideology. He's no longer grounded in reality.
SPEAKER 05 :
Dr. Rubin, what you've just laid out there when Israel, their intelligence, generally speaking, obviously there were some failures on October the 7th. But as it pertains to Iran, they've been tracking every move. They've been able to keep their nuclear program bottled up by taking it out here and there and setting them back five years, 10 years. Of course, now we're at this critical point once again. But what you've laid out there is Turkey pursuing the same thing, but they can't be touched by Israel because Israel could then suffer the wrath of all of the allied NATO countries. Do you think that would happen if Israel acted to protect themselves against Turkey and their nuclear plan? Do you think it would trigger a NATO reaction?
SPEAKER 18 :
Well, here are the two things. if you will, points that could actually undermine Turkey's gamble. Number one, Article 5 only comes into play within NATO if you know who actually took the action. So if Israel doesn't leak like the United States does, and you have an assassination here or an assassination there of a Turkish nuclear scientist, then Turkey may not be able to gather enough consensus within NATO in order to enact Article 5. And when you actually read the legal document, the legal article, Article 5, you also have to get NATO agreeing that there has been a threat that is an attack. And so it gives NATO sort of other members like the United States, like Germany, like France, a way out to say, you know what, we don't actually think that this qualifies for Article 5. So Turkey's taking a gamble that we are going to come to their assistance. I think we should make clear to Turkey that we are not going to do that in advance.
SPEAKER 05 :
All right, Dr. Rubin, we've got about three minutes left. I have two questions I want to ask to wrap up. Number one, by Turkey remaining in NATO, is that not devaluing NATO for the purposes of the U.S.?
SPEAKER 18 :
I think it is. And you know what? A lot of Turks say and a lot of Turkey's cheerleaders say, is, hey, look, Turkey has the second largest army within NATO after the United States. Therefore, it's too valuable to kick out. But that's the wrong metric. When you have a conflict with NATO, you have a meeting in Brussels, and each country decides how much they're going to contribute. What matters is how much each country is going to contribute, not how big their army is on paper. If Turkey only decides to contribute 37 people, it's not an important country. So we've got to stop using this false metric and recognize Turkey is not an asset to NATO. It's a liability.
SPEAKER 05 :
All right, I'm going to go back to your theory of them using NATO to allow them to advance their nuclear plan or program and to do other things to put themselves in a position of strength. Might that also be, when you look at where Turkey is located geographically, they're surrounded by basically Islamic nations. There has been a lot of outreach. Are they building their own kind of coalition of Islamic nations?
SPEAKER 18 :
Right now, Turkey is, but it's less of a coalition than almost like a Chinese style, we are on top and you are our proxies, that you listen to us. So when you look at what Turkey is doing, for example, in Libya or in Somalia or in Syria, they're not approaching these states as equals. They're approaching these states as their proxies, and they expect in true Muslim Brotherhood fashion that Turkey speaks and these other countries will listen. But again, we are woefully blind if we don't recognize and counter what Turkey is now doing.
SPEAKER 05 :
Dr. Michael Rubin, fascinating conversation. I want to thank you for taking time to join us today and unpack this. This is something I've been watching, will continue to watch, and I look forward to having future conversations with you about what is happening in the Middle East, in particular with Turkey.
SPEAKER 18 :
Thank you so much.
SPEAKER 05 :
All right, folks, another thing to add to your prayer list. I am very concerned about Turkey and what they're doing there, primarily as it pertains to Israel. But that has implications globally. In fact, I'm going to be over there next week in Israel. So be praying for us as we're over there. All right, until next time, I'm going to leave you once again with the encouraging words of the Apostle Paul, found in Ephesians 6, where he says, when you've done everything you can do, when you've prayed, when you've prepared, and when you have taken your stand, you know what to do. By all means, just keep standing.
SPEAKER 15 :
Washington Watch with Tony Perkins is brought to you by Family Research Council and is entirely listener supported. Portions of the show discussing candidates are brought to you by Family Research Council Action. For more information on anything you heard today or to find out how you can partner with us in our ongoing efforts to promote faith, family, and freedom, visit TonyPerkins.com.
In this episode, we delve into the controversial lawsuit between Harvard University and the Trump administration over billions of dollars in taxpayer funding. With Harvard's substantial endowment rivaling the GDPs of small countries, we discuss the implications of such funding and explore whether these funds could better serve other needs. Our team breaks down the legal arguments, analyzing how academic freedom and financial ethics come into play in this high-stakes case. Moreover, our conversation extends to the critical legal procedures the Trump administration might need to address as this battle unfolds in Massachusetts, a jurisdiction with substantial implications for federal policy. We also highlight the ACLJ's ongoing commitment to defending the rights of students and tackling challenges posed by powerful institutions. The episode further features perspectives on government funding priorities, raising essential questions about societal values and prudent use of public money. We engage with listeners calling in from across the nation to share their views, ensuring a comprehensive debate about this pressing issue.
SPEAKER 08 :
Harvard sues demanding they get their taxpayer dollars.
SPEAKER 10 :
Keeping you informed and engaged now more than ever. This is Seculo. We want to hear from you. Share and post your comments or call 1-800-684-3110.
SPEAKER 08 :
And now your host, Logan Sekula. Welcome to Sekula. We will be taking your calls at 1-800-684-3110. We also have Harry Hutchinson and CeCe Heil joining us a little bit later in the broadcast. And it's going to be packed because we've got a lot to go over, including right now, Harvard University. You may remember, Will, to the tune of what? $2.2 billion. Billion dollars! $2.2 billion they had their funding struck. And of course now, they've decided, we demand our funding. And we are going to be suing the Trump administration, and the Trump administration is fighting back, but also saying, hey, we may hold out another billion. Which again, let's just get back to that reality. That there are up to nine... billion dollars of taxpayer funding going to Harvard University Harvard of course is saying hey I uh we deserve it it doesn't matter if we're violating what you're saying this is essentially contractual you have to give us this funding we're going to break all that down legally later on in the show but let's just start with the obvious facts which is we are funding these elite universities that are training people in ways that a lot of the American people do not like to the tune of billions, to the tune of nearly 10 billion for just this one institute, which means a lot of the others that you're familiar with are also getting similar treatment. Again, billions of dollars. And we know also that their endowment is, Will, what was it, 50? 53 billion dollars.
SPEAKER 11 :
And as you said, that is more than some countries' GDP. That's right. Yeah, when you talk about how large the endowment, this is the wealthiest country. university in the world but it has a an endowment that is larger than the gdp of dozens of countries estonia iceland botswana georgia jamaica armenia mongolia north macedonia moldova i mean you go on and on you realize that there are countries that their annual product of the entire nation is
SPEAKER 08 :
is smaller than the endowment of Harvard yes but yet Harvard is saying you can't take away the funding you give us that's unconstitutional and look with the Trump administration there's always a lot of issues that come out with this because they want to act fast they want to get stuff done they want the American people to be happy with the things that they're doing But sometimes we know that the government doesn't necessarily work that way. We're going to break that down because look, it's not a guaranteed win here. I would say for the Trump administration, you may look at this and say, this is ridiculous, but that doesn't mean they are going to be on the right side of the law that the government, especially the state governments aren't going to side with their own interests here. So phone lines are open for you. I want to hear from you. How do you feel when you hear that there is 10 billion ish funding just going to one university? One university that we know has billions and billions and 50 plus billion dollar endowment don't necessarily need that extra few billion. And again, like I said last time we discussed this, I think you have to break down what a billion is because a billion is it's easy to go million billion. But you have to think about the reality of a billion, a billion dollars now times nine. is an unfathomable amount of money. Like you said, more money when you take the $50 billion than some nations have in general that they ever make that exists. I want to hear from you. How do you feel that your taxpayer dollars are going to that? We also have an update on our fight for life currently in the state of Washington, which we know we actually have a lot of supporters in the state of Washington. A lot of you call in. I'd love to hear from you too. Not just Washington, but if you want to call in. 1-800-684- I want to get your voice heard on the air today. Again, we're going to keep this conversation going about Harvard. We're also going to talk about some of the work of the ACLJ and specifically on our fight for life as this is the countdown to the end. of our life and liberty drive and you may be saying logan thank goodness you've been talking about this life and liberty drive for the last eight weeks well you know what you got a couple more weeks been six weeks two more weeks or so left in the life and liberty drive i need you to be a part of it right now all your donations are doubled that's why we're able to do this and there's only eight days left to give to have your gift doubled right now give now aclj.org scan the qr code you see on your screen we'll break down what those resources are going to coming up Welcome back to Secular. Phone lines are lighting up for you right now. 1-800-684-3110. Still two lines open if you want to get your voice heard on the air. If you're watching on YouTube right now, look, we encourage more people to see this and to find out what we're talking about. And that helps if you comment, and it really helps if you share, and of course, if you hit that thumbs up. So right now, that's what I'm going to ask you to do. If you're watching on YouTube... Hit the thumbs up. I see it right now. A hundred or so of you have done it so far, but nearly a thousand of you are watching live right this second. You do that. It gets into more people's algorithms, get more people into the feed. So hopefully we can have more people joining us. Will, let's restate some of what's going on for those people who are just joining us right now. Harvard is going to court. That's right. Harvard University is going to court against the Trump administration. Your own U.S. government right now say you have no right to take away our funding. to the tune of billions of dollars. We know at least $2 billion, and now the administration has said, hey, we may hold out for a third billion. And then we find out it's upwards of $9 billion that's currently going to Harvard. And I think that's as egregious as this lawsuit is to find out. And I think this is why you had Doge and Elon Musk and those kind of people involved, because when we find out where government spending is going to this extreme. Now, I assume we all knew that there was probably some federal funding going to most universities. Most public and private universities receive some sort of public funding. I got no problem with that. It doesn't necessarily bother me. But when you start hearing that B word, that billions and billions is where you go, okay, I think we probably can be using this a little bit better. Have you walked around your city? Have you seen the homeless crisis that's happening all over the world and are all over the country? Maybe that could help out. Some of those billions could help that out. I think they probably could.
SPEAKER 11 :
Right, and I think there's so many layers to this story because, once again, you talk about when you start to realize how much of our taxpayer dollars are going to so many places. And it's not just like this is government aid to help this problem here or to help this nation here that many fight over, whether those things are beneficial or help the national interest. But when you're talking about the most wealthy people University in the world, the largest endowment, the storied history of Harvard, the elite University of America. I mean, it is it is a brand in and of itself. And you're thinking about this and you're like, they're getting that much in grants. that they are a private university and now they're crying foul saying you can't take away government money because that violates our first amendment rights that violates academic freedom this is illegal for you to do this and so they sue to make sure that the taxpayer dollars keep going to their university through these grants but you break this down About one, there is the issue of the protecting of Jewish students on campus, having it be a place where people can learn and be safe and not have anti-Semitism rampant and taking over Harvard Yard like we saw just last year. But you start to think about this and you're like, man, I work. Very hard in my life. I work 40 hours a week. A lot of you work more than 40 hours a week. And you are diligent. You provide for your family. You pay your taxes. You're a good, patriotic American. And where does this money go? Going to the most elite... Most wealthy university is receiving billions and billions of your dollars that you work hard for, where the average salary of a professor there is over $150,000. That this is where your taxpayer money is going. And they're saying, you can't take that from us. You can't take this government funding away, and we're going to sue you to make sure you don't. And now we're going to get into it, and we're going to get into it with Professor Hutchison about where this can go, the many paths it could take. But Harvard's actually being very clever here. They're trying to get a coalition of other universities to kind of stand with them on this academic freedom platform. They've hired Robert Herr as one of the attorneys to defend them in this lawsuit. You're like, where do I know that name? That name sounds familiar. That was the special counsel that kind of unraveled the facade that many people saw in President Biden, right? when his report came out and said, I can't try him because he's not fit to stand trial, essentially. So that name is very familiar within conservative circles because he was at the top of the news. Now he's in private practice. He's no longer the special counsel. And that's who Harvard hires to defend them in this lawsuit. So they're doing this very smart. Because they at the end of the day want to keep this taxpayer funding. But it shows so many different layers of how entrenched these private universities are to the government checkbook.
SPEAKER 08 :
Yeah, and they also have government regulations. There have been a lot of Christian schools and those that have gotten some of this funding and then being nervous about whether their funding will be kept or not based on an administration. So we've got to be careful there as well. A lot of great places. Let's go ahead and take a phone call. Let's go to Daniel who's calling in Connecticut on line one. He's watching on ACLJ.org. You're on the air.
SPEAKER 13 :
Hi, thank you. Would you provide a bit of a history lesson? I mean, obviously here we are today, but what was the genesis of all this? Where did the funding first begin? And can you give us a little background?
SPEAKER 11 :
Well, I mean, how deep do you want to go?
SPEAKER 08 :
I think this is part of the things with the Department of Education they're even talking about right now. When you start hearing about the pullback of that, sure, we can find the history of government funding for universities. I'm sure it's been around for quite some time. But when you start talking about these giant dollar figures, it's a little bit different.
SPEAKER 11 :
Well, and the American government pays for research. They fund a lot of research that they think would benefit the American public and the world. And so when you look at actually the... That's an interesting, you know, that argument can be made. When you look at the defendants on the lawsuit, it's not just United States of America or President Donald Trump. Actually, I don't see President Donald Trump listed as one of the defendants. It's actually Robert F. Kennedy Jr. as the Department of Health and Human Services secretary, the DOJ and Pam Bondi, Department of Education and Linda McMahon, the United States General Services Administration and that administrator. the Department of Energy, National Science Foundation, United States Department of Defense. Pete Hegseth is mentioned there as a defendant. Oh, shocker. Pile on right now, yeah. And NASA is actually. And so a lot of this funding, that's why when you look at uh the 2.2 billion dollars it's not like this was a singular grant these are canceling multiple agencies grants for research so whether it be space research or aeronautical research through nasa or or science and medicine research through the hhs that's where when you're a big research university you can apply for grants and get this funding from the government now Everyone should know, and I think the courts have even given this, that funding can have strings attached. And if you're not doing things up to the government standards, then they can pull that funding. And there are ways that this can be done, and that's also part of this lawsuit. But there's a reason why colleges like Hillsdale... Their entire history.
SPEAKER 08 :
They're refusing it.
SPEAKER 11 :
They refuse to take any federal funding. Why?
SPEAKER 08 :
So that there's no strings attached. No strings attached. Look, it's part of even what we do here on a very basic level with the ACLJ. I always say that we are funded by you, the individual who gives that $30, $50, $70, $100. We are not funded by these major corporations or even these major donors. Sure, we have some major donors, but we always usually tell them, up front, unless it's for a specific project. Hey, we want to buy a new building or a headquarters or redo this, something like that, that we approach. If they come to us and say, hey, we want you to do this and here's a dollar figure, it's probably not going to happen because you don't want those strings attached. You don't want other people being able to dictate how you run your business, your school, your job, whatever it is. And it can get very muddy very quick. I have a call I want to take real quick before we head to break. In the next segment, also, we're going to be talking about our fight for life and some of the updates that are happening in the ACLJ. And as Will said, later on, Harry Hutchins is going to be joining us to go through the legalities of all this. And look, the truth is it could be an uphill battle for the Trump administration. We'll see about that. Let's go first, though, to David in Arizona, who's on line four. David, you're on the air.
SPEAKER 15 :
Hi, I wanted to share my comment. I do agree with you about, I think that while I had mixed feelings about President Trump's administration, I think I do agree with this point about the issues about funding big, giant universities. And I guess I wanted to ask you as well, a little comment, a question on it. Why do you think maybe the president doesn't do more of this and share more about how he is helping the American people. Sometimes it just seems like he doesn't share this information of why It's really beneficial and helpful for people. Thank you.
SPEAKER 08 :
Yeah, David, thank you. I appreciate you calling in. I have a friend who is on probably the most opposite side of the political spectrum from me. And we both could at least agree on one thing, and that was that billions and billions and billions of dollars do not need to be going from your taxpayer funding to this, to Harvard. That there are so many things that are needed in this country right now. There's so many people truly in need and they have 50 plus billion dollars in endowment. And whether you are a consumer conservative who just feels like, you know, we need to always be pushing that or you are a communist socialist, we could probably all agree on that. Now, why does it not get more attention? I'm not sure, David. I think this is honestly a glaring issue that's happened with the Trump administration over the first term and it's happening again, which is the attention gets put on the wrong place because everyone can look at this and say, this should not be how we're doing things right now. When we know how much debt we're in, we know everything that we're in, this needs to be taken care of. Unfortunately, it doesn't necessarily make the headlines. And when it doesn't make the headlines, it feels like the Trump administration decides to divert and put their time in somewhere else. I wish they would spend more time on this, just like I had wished they had spent more time on the Middle East eight years ago. And talking about the successes they had, that they can get caught up with themselves. Phone lines are open for you at 1-800-684-3110. We need your support, though. Like I said, we are funded by individuals like you. Scan that QR code. There's only eight days left to give to have your gift doubled. Please give now if you can. Scan that QR code. We'll be right back. Welcome back to Secular. We are going to continue your calls in just a little bit about the situation going on as Harvard is suing the Trump administration saying, we need our money. need our billions of dollars but i did want to take a second as i do most days to divert our attention a little bit to some important things that are happening around the country and of course this is our life in liberty drive we're wrapping up here in just eight days we need your support because we are currently battling for the lives of the unborn all across this country and around the world we have an update out of the state of washington and you may say logan if you're not in washington You know, is that really a state that matters, a state that's going to actually help us here and be supportive? One of the biggest states that supports the ACLJ is Washington. We know that's true with California as well. States that you may think are well gone, there are a lot of great people there ready to fight back. But there are interesting moments, there are loopholes that happen in the law, they get pushed forward that are to not to protect the life of the unborn or even the life of the born. And CeCe Hiles joining a senior attorney here at the ACLJ to break down what we're doing right now as we have sent demand to Washington State to hopefully stop what they're about to do.
SPEAKER 02 :
Yeah, there was a bill in Washington that has passed the legislature and is actually now sitting on the governor's desk. And it's a bill that concerns really protecting the life of unborn or born babies. And so we sent a letter to the governor to say, please, Do not sign this bill. You need to veto this bill because it does not protect the lives of babies and it does not protect the lives of pregnant mothers. And it's basically a bill that has repealed a law that made it a gross misdemeanor to conceal the birth of a child by disposing of the dead body. So no longer is it a crime to conceal the birth of a child by disposing of the dead body. And they try to spin this to make this like it's protecting women.
SPEAKER 08 :
Yeah, I just want to pause for one second because I understand that usually I give a disclaimer and I didn't this time. And I apologize to those who are listening who maybe have small children in the car or anything like that. Because I know when you hear this kind of story, it's disturbing. These are disturbing facts. It's really gut churning in sense of how this stuff should make you feel. But I do want to say we're going to only talk about this for about the next six minutes. So if those who are listening right now, if you feel like, hey, this is not what I want right now or I'm with my kids, tune back in in six minutes. I don't encourage anyone to ever leave, but I know that this is a very intense topic. And when you hear about this, all right, we're going to get back into it. When you hear about this topic and you start hearing about who gets control over bodily remains of children, you start to question even why... These laws are being passed in the first place. Why is this even coming up? And it feels like it's always for some sort of scooting around a law for nefarious reasons. And this could be for trafficking. This could be for so much that's happening. It's not just about straight up abortions at this point.
SPEAKER 02 :
Right. If there's any death of a child that happens for any kind of suspicious means or anything, if you tie the word abortion to it, all of a sudden it becomes hands off. So this bill even goes further to take from what the coroner's jurisdiction over bodies is. So the coroner has jurisdiction to take on bodies. It literally takes out of the coroner's jurisdiction abortion. any death that results from a known or suspected abortion or any death that's due to premature birth or stillbirth. Whether it's suspicious or not, the coroner no longer has jurisdiction over those bodies. So again, this does open the door for a baby's death Again, whether that's pre-born or born, for a baby's death to be completely concealed and there's no way to investigate it, there's no way to prosecute it if that death occurred by illegal means.
SPEAKER 11 :
is similar, not exactly the same, because those that are trying to promote abortion freely throughout the country have gotten a little smart, and they took that word perinatal out that we've seen pop up in California, in Maryland, and that was where there was a series of bills that were trying to extend the period of when an abortion could take place that would have included time after the birth of the child and that was something that we were able to push back in some areas we even got some democrats in states that were like wait a second that word in this bill may not mean what we thought it meant and maybe that could have some bad repercussions so Although they were pro-choice, if you want to call it that, pro-abortion, even they recognize that could be problematic. But what you're seeing here is another attempt. And at the very end of the day, Washington has very open, wide abortion laws. So when Roe v. Wade was returned to the states, they took it upon themselves to make sure that it was something that was protected in their state, that what they consider the right to abortion. What we're fighting here, is so much beyond just saying that there is a right to abortion within a state. Even the states that say up to birth, there are no term limit, no gestational limit on this. This is now... opening up a Pandora's box of nefarious activity, of criminal activity that should be, and just putting up an obfuscation completely at looking at what could be very real evil criminal acts, not that abortion is not, but outside of even that debate, by them trying to make it easier for abortion to take place in their state.
SPEAKER 02 :
Right. And abortion, even in Washington, I think there's a point that it is illegal. But again, you're not able to. You've taken out any investigation and any right to criminally prosecute anyone who causes the death of a child if it's tied to abortion or a premature birth or stillbirth. And so we see this, you know, Washington, again, if you're thinking, why do we care about Washington? We see that this kind of legislation jumps from state to state to state. And like you said, we've defeated it before in other states that had similar legislation and used the perinatal, which allowed for the death of babies after their birth. But it's very important for us. And we do this at the ACLJ. We not only watch ballot initiatives that come on the ballot that might make a state more pro-abortion, but we also just look at and track real legislation. This actually passed the House and the Senate, and it's sitting on the desk for the governor to sign. We track that legislation. We are taking action to veto it because we stand for life and we will continue to do that.
SPEAKER 08 :
That's right. And the ACLJ is always going to be involved in this front because it's so important to not only us, but to all of you out there. And I see that in the comments right now. I do want to encourage you as we head to the break. Some of you lose us right now. You only get a first half hour on your local radio station. Well, if you only are hearing us right now, you're missing half the fun. Go to ACLJ.org, go to YouTube, go to Rumble. You can find us, see us. We have full television-style production going on right now, so you can see what we look like. You can have these conversations. You can actually engage. So make sure you check out the second half hour of the show. If you're listening to this later on, not live, we're live from 12 to 1 p.m. Eastern time. You can work your way back from there. You can find us later on archived on our YouTube channel, on the ACLJ website, on the podcast feed. It's all there on ACLJ.org and through the ACLJ app. So I want to encourage you to do that. But now we only got one minute. You just heard about our fight for life that's going on right now. And those are tuning in right back, coming right back now. I see the numbers going up. I understand that now you're done with that conversation. I'm not going to go into any more graphic details. What I'm going to encourage you, though, is the power of your donations are keeping us in this fight to save the unborn, whether that's here, whether that's in Washington State, whether you heard in around the world, what you heard about our cases in Massachusetts. I encourage you to go to ACLJ.org. Have your gifts doubled today. Time's running out. There's only eight days left. have your gifts doubled so please as we head into this half hour there's gonna be less than a minute break so right now if you're watching scan the qr code that you see on your screen right now or go to aclj.org if you're on youtube hit that like button you know that really helps us out a lot because we have launched so many new fights for life As we know, the battle continues. Be a part of it. And also, you can give us a call. Be a part of the show today. We'll be right back with more. Again, I just want to give you this opportunity. Go to ACLJ.org. Be right back.
SPEAKER 10 :
Keeping you informed and engaged. Now more than ever. This is Sekulow. And now your host, Logan Sekulow.
SPEAKER 08 :
Welcome to the second half hour of Sekulow. Will Haines joining me in studio. This is Logan Sekulow, by the way. And we also have Professor Harry Hutchinson, one of the senior attorneys here at the ACLJ, coming up in the next segment to break down the news that Harvard is suing the Trump administration. That's right. Harvard University saying we want our money. demanding their grants get put back because they don't like the idea that two billion dollars two plus billion dollars has been said nope we're not abiding by your rules but we still want your money now look they're taking it to court and there's a lot that can be done and that we obviously think that billions and billions and billions shouldn't be going to universities like harvard when they have an endowment of over 50 billion dollars But that put aside, they're in court. It's going to happen in Massachusetts. What's that going to look like when Harry Hutchinson joins us in the next segment? We're going to discuss that further because you know what? It's going to be an uphill battle as all cases are with the Trump administration. And look, I think you got to be, you know, call it like you see it. Sometimes they jump into this a little too headfirst. Let's go ahead, though, and take a phone call. Let's go to Patty. Patty's calling in Illinois, and hey, there's some phone lines open for you after Harry, or even when Harry's on, we're going to take some calls, and I want to take some more calls after that, because I want to hear from you, the most important voice in the room, at 1-800-684-3110. Patty, you're on the air.
SPEAKER 12 :
Isn't it insincere and hypocritical to accept money from an entity that does not share your values?
SPEAKER 08 :
Yeah, Patty, I think probably a lot of people feel that way. If you have such a problem with this Trump administration, why do you want to take their money? Now, they're going to say... They're going to say, we've had these deals for decades. Of course, we deserve this money. We haven't changed. Nothing we've changed. Harvard hasn't changed. The administration's changed. Of course, we still need our money. But yeah, that's how it is, though, in Washington, D.C. It's how it is with lobbyists. There's always money changing hands, whether that's for a party you like, the party you don't like. Sadly, it's part of the game. I think that part of the game needs some big changes.
SPEAKER 11 :
don't think harvard uh is thinking too much about their hypocrisy i mean they they are trying to say it's about academic freedom while at the same time we saw the encampment uh that took over their campus that was stopping people from getting their education out of fear uh i mean that's kind of blatant hypocrisy right there is that the the students didn't have the freedom to go to class to get their education uh however i also think this is a much broader issue this shows You see AOC and Bernie Sanders out there saying, you know, fight the oligarchy like that's their big thing right now. But I think what is kind of like an oligarchy is when you have these elite universities that are just getting so much money from the government that should be able to stand on their own saying you can't survive without us. I mean, that is basically the tone they're taking. They were in their letter rejecting oligarchy. And the Trump administration's question, you know, saying we need you to reform in this area. They were saying, no, we will not. And if you take our money away, people will die. They always take it to that extreme. They're saying that, you know, this is so essential that you have to keep funding us. And I think that there are actual people dying.
SPEAKER 08 :
Where there's actual people, human beings dying on the streets of our cities right now from starvation, from the homeless crisis that's happening around the country. If you can go to some of your most popular cities in the country right now and tell me you don't think that there's some major crisis happening and there are ways to solve that. And some of that ways is with some cash. There are ways to work on this. There's ways to handle this. You may not like to hear that, but it's just the truth. You may say, Logan, I don't want to fund that either. That's fine if you just want to say, hey, government needs to get out of that stuff. That's where charities need to get involved. That's where Christian churches need to get involved. That's fine, too. But if we're going to be spending tens of billions of dollars to fund elite universities, we'll set oligarchy like it's a bad thing. Just kidding. Just kidding. When did they take the word oligarchy from us? No.
SPEAKER 11 :
Sorry. Let's go ahead. I don't even get it.
SPEAKER 08 :
I don't either. Look, we're getting back. Harry Hutchins is going to join us because we need to talk about the law, what it's going to look like in the court. Because you know what? It's not as easy, as common sense as you think it is. It's unfortunate this is sometimes how we end up in this country, where it's going to go to the court and we kind of can already see some of the path they're going. And look, Trump administration, sometimes they make some unenforced errors. We're going to talk about that coming up. Doesn't mean they're not in the right, but it may not mean that they're in the right legally by the courtroom and by the courtroom's expectations, specifically in a state like Massachusetts. We're battling in the state of Massachusetts right now because they're trying to shut down pro-life pregnancy resource centers with government funding. Okay? Think they want their money still going to Harvard? I think so. I think so. Scan the QR code. Go to ACLJ.org right now. Make your donation today. Harry Hudson, join us in just a second. Seculo, Harry Hutchinson joining us in studio, senior attorney here at the ACLJ to talk about what's going on at Harvard. Harvard's obviously taking the Trump administration to court. We'll list it off the people that are on that list. And it's a hefty list to say the least. All the heavy hitters are on there, whether it's Pete Hegseth or whether it's... Pam Boddy, Linda McMahon, RFK Jr. Linda McMahon just trying to enjoy the WWE Hall of Fame ceremonies as her son, Paul Triple H Levesque, was put in the Hall of Fame this weekend. I watched it. She was there front row, smiling ear to ear. You know, let Linda McMahon do what she needs to do. Okay? Don't put her in court. Not over this. Send her to wrestler court. The Undertaker used to preside over that. I digress. Okay. Let's get back to the topic here, because Professor Hutchinson, one of the things that we've brought up with this billions and billions that are going to Harvard and they're suing saying, hey, we deserve it. It's our money. It's our grant money. There may be some validity to the agreement. And this could cause some trouble for the Trump administration when they jump into these kind of topics headfirst without thinking about. I mean, they may be thinking about the ramifications, but they know that their audience, if you want to say the American people. what results quickly. And that's not necessarily the best way to get a victory, unfortunately.
SPEAKER 09 :
Absolutely. And in fact, the rules are designed to impede quick action by the president. And so one of the things that the Trump administration needs to do is to be aware of these rules and to think proactively about when and how to attack these institutions who have engaged in anti-Semitic activity. And one of the things that the Trump administration I think needs to do is to comply with the Administrative Procedures Act. Now, most of our audience is not going to be excited about the Administrative Procedures Act. But as a lawyer, you have to comply with those rules. And the failure to comply with those rules means that the Trump administration will be tripped up in court because the judges love those rules.
SPEAKER 08 :
Yeah, and it's an uphill battle. It becomes an uphill battle because of that. Look, you say that your audience may not like it. Some of the audience got very offended when I said you have to start picturing what a billion dollars looks like. They're like, Logan, we can count. Our audience is very intelligent. They understand. They understand what's happening here. But if you were to count to a billion, it takes you 31 years.
SPEAKER 11 :
Yeah. 31 years, no breaks, closer to 48 with sleep and mealtimes. We wouldn't even be here right now. I mean, I can use a calculator, but I cannot count to a billion. I can count to a million.
SPEAKER 08 :
You don't have to.
SPEAKER 11 :
You can't count to a billion.
SPEAKER 08 :
You don't have to full send endorse me. It's okay. You can just say the audience is right. The audience is always right.
SPEAKER 11 :
They are always right.
SPEAKER 08 :
I learned this. You got something, though.
SPEAKER 11 :
Well, and these are kind of the three claims that are in this lawsuit that Harvard is bringing to restore their funding. They're trying to get a permanent injunction on this funding freeze, as well as several other things that they have in their prayers for relief. They're arguing a constitutional issue and a statutory issue. The Constitution issue, they're saying it's a violation of the First Amendment with academic freedom being a subset of the freedom of speech and freedom of association and things of that nature. And that by trying to get them to dictate... academic policies whether it be with governance structure or dei curriculum etc that they're violating that and that this is ideologically motivated and then second that there is retaliation against them for them exercising their constitutional right to free speech and academic freedom so that's kind of the first part which is uh i mean that one is probably a little bit more heady more law school paper kind of exercise thought exercise but then this one is probably the easier claim I think for Harvard to win on in court which is what you already brought up is that The government alleges that because of them not protecting the students on campus, that they are violating Title VI of the Civil Rights Act of 1964. So that's the government's partially their claim for being able to take this funding away. And Harvard's using that against the government by saying that, well... If we're violating this... And remember, Harvard actually lost at the Supreme Court just a year or so back because their admissions process was discriminatory as ruled by the Supreme Court. So this wouldn't be a novel idea that Harvard is doing something discriminatory. But... In that Civil Rights Act, the Title VI, there are provisions of how you then start to remove funding, take this away because of this civil rights violation. And what Harvard is arguing is not necessarily against the claim of title six violation but saying that if you're going to use this you have to do it the proper way there's a time period there's a time to engage the party to try and get them to no longer discriminate as it were and that's where it goes the administrative procedures act and that brings up a larger question too about has the regulatory state And the bureaucratic state made it so difficult for the government to do anything to change because of how much these procedures get put in place, how long it can take to actually see real change. And it actually gives plaintiffs like Harvard in this situation a real opportunity to stop the Trump administration from carrying out this funding freeze.
SPEAKER 09 :
I think your analysis is spot on. So essentially what the federal government has done is it's set up a number of procedures which do what? The procedures entrench the existing policy. And so what Harvard has also done skillfully with the help of good lawyers is that they are using the law against the federal government. And so if I were to fault the Trump administration, I would fault them for not thinking proactively. What is Harvard likely to do? So what the Trump administration should have done is comply with those procedures first, anticipate that Harvard would bring a suit. And where did Harvard bring its lawsuit? In Massachusetts. That is a favorable jurisdiction. And what the Trump administration should have done is that they should have set up a crisis team that would go through each and every procedure ahead of time before announcing a public campaign against Harvard and these other universities. Harvard has huge resources. Many of these resources have been given to them by the taxpayers. And now Harvard is using its wealth against the American people. And I think the Trump administration should have anticipated that.
SPEAKER 08 :
I'd like to take a call that's coming in right now. Hopefully this spurs you to call in as well, because we've got a few lines open at 1-800-684-3110. Beverly has some thoughts in Maryland. Beverly, you're on the air.
SPEAKER 03 :
Yes. Hello. Can you hear me?
SPEAKER 08 :
I can.
SPEAKER 03 :
Okay. So here are my thoughts. Taxpayer money should not fund elite prestigious institutions, but I feel that Harvard should have the right to academic freedom without strings attached to the government. I don't think Harvard should sue for funds, but sue for academic freedom. They have the right to free speech. I do not think that Harvard is an anti-Semitic institution. I don't think that they do not care about...
SPEAKER 08 :
Jewish students and the Jewish student body I understand that some of this Beverly is they're caving to the agenda that's happening through the media so yes I don't think everyone who works at Harvard every student there is sitting there being a anti-Semite now do I think there are other ways they could do it like we talked about with Hillsdale where you don't have to take government funding no one's forcing these non-profit organizations to take government funding but they've decided to to the tune of billions of dollars
SPEAKER 11 :
Well, and I think Professor Hutchison to that point as well is one, they are receiving the money and they are required to protect the civil rights of their student body, especially if they are receiving government funding under the Civil Rights Act. And what we did see, while... It's true, Beverly. The administration of Harvard may not be anti-Semitic, but what they have allowed to fester on their campus is a place where students do not feel safe. They have been attacked. They have been blocked from their academic freedom of being able to attend class without fear of assault. And those things are very serious. So while yes, Harvard itself, the institution may not be anti-Semitic, they have allowed that rot on their campus to fester. And that is very serious and can actually have repercussions as far as losing funding.
SPEAKER 09 :
We only got about 40 seconds. Absolutely. And Harvard wants to have it both ways. It wants to have government funds and claim freedom of speech. If you want complete freedom of speech, then they should adopt the Hillsdale model.
SPEAKER 08 :
Yep. All right. Thank you, Professor Hutchinson, for joining us. Look, we've got one more segment coming up, and I always like to hear from the most important voice in the room, and that's you. And right now... You've got a lot of opportunities to call in. There's a lot of you watching, but not a lot of you calling. So give me a call at 1-800-684-3110. If you do that in the next couple minutes, you'll most likely make it on the air today. So 1-800-684-3110. Whether you're listening on the radio, watching on TV, watching on the Salem News Channel, or on ACLJ.org or YouTube, you can always call in. You can always support the work. We'll be right back. Welcome back to Seculo. There are some calls coming in. We're going to get to you at 1-800-684-3110. I do think we should flash back a little bit. Well, there was a moment with Elise Stefanik and at the time was Harvard's, I guess, the head of Harvard, the president of Harvard. And they had this conversation. It's one of those ones that really, really punches you in the gut when you hear someone talk about it now. this head of Harvard no longer there, correct?
SPEAKER 11 :
Correct. She resigned after one, this, but then also, speaking of academic freedom, it turned out that she had a history of plagiarism. Yeah. So there was also some plagiarism accusations as well as this wonderful performance that she put on before Congress, you know, really standing up for the students of Harvard that she was the president of at that time.
SPEAKER 08 :
It was this. We need to set the record here. This was after the attacks. of october 7th this was after sort of the big protests that have happened so again this is in the last couple years this was when everything was really rising was at a peak if you will in this moment i don't know the exact date but we'll find it back in december of 2023 so just a couple months after the october 7th attacks but uh but really remember we had that kind of two-week period where people were supportive supportive of israel was out there talking and then
SPEAKER 11 :
All of a sudden, you saw the campuses around the United States absolutely going berserk with these encampments and threats and violence against Jewish students.
SPEAKER 08 :
Let's take a listen again. This is a bit of a throwback to remember where we started here with Harvard.
SPEAKER 07 :
And Dr. Gay, at Harvard, does calling for the genocide of Jews violate Harvard's rules of bullying and harassment? Yes or no?
SPEAKER 06 :
It can be, depending on the context. What's the context? Targeted as an individual? Targeted at an individual?
SPEAKER 07 :
It's targeted at Jewish students, Jewish individuals. Do you understand your testimony is dehumanizing them? Do you understand that dehumanization is part of antisemitism? I will ask you one more time, does calling for the genocide of Jews violate Harvard's rules of bullying and harassment, yes or no?
SPEAKER 06 :
Antisemitic rhetoric when it crosses into conduct that amounts to bullying, harassment, intimidation, That is actionable conduct, and we do take action.
SPEAKER 08 :
It's actionable when anti-Semitic rhetoric goes beyond rhetoric. But anti-Semitic rhetoric on itself, totally fine.
SPEAKER 11 :
So what she's saying here is that, you know, you can call for genocide, fine. You can hate your Jewish students. If you do genocide, then you're going to get suspended from Harvard and there'll be actions. That's the ridiculousness of what the president of Harvard said. And now she had to resign in disgrace because of this. But it wasn't this alone. It also took people that started diving into her record, finding that she also didn't have the highest academic standards when she was accused of lifting entire paragraphs from other people's work and using it in her own. So plagiarism, something that typically gets you suspended or kicked out of college pretty quick is,
SPEAKER 08 :
especially at an elite university if you are found to be doing but it wasn't just the protection of anti-semites it also took another layer yeah absolutely i also want to for you to hear from our president from donald trump who spoke about this just a couple weeks ago uh this happened again this president donald trump take a listen
SPEAKER 01 :
I think Harvard's a disgrace. I think what they did was a disgrace. They're obviously anti-Semitic, and all of a sudden they're starting to behave. But when you see where they, what they were saying, what they were doing, when you see the way they took care of events, when you watch that woman, that horrendous president that ruined the image of Harvard, maybe permanently, in Congress, in the halls of Congress, when you take a look at what happened there, It was horrific.
SPEAKER 08 :
And again, that was actually just yesterday that President Trump is out there talking about it. So again, it's on the minds of a lot of people right now as they head to court. Let's go ahead and take a couple calls real quick before we wrap up the show for the day. Let's go to Kathy, who's calling in California, who is watching on Rumble, one of our favorite free speech platforms, speaking of free speech. Kathy, you're on the air.
SPEAKER 05 :
Yeah, hi. I just was thinking that people have civil rights people have constitutional rights but Harvard is an institution and what's going on is they are violating the civil rights of some of their students Because they're responsible for what other students are doing in their institution. And they seem to be saying okay to these people who are violating the civil rights of the other students. So I don't see how they can sue the government and say you're violating our civil rights. Because they're not a person. They don't have civil rights.
SPEAKER 08 :
Kathy, why you got to be so rational? But unfortunately in our country, it's a little bit different. As Mitt Romney once said, corporations are people too.
SPEAKER 11 :
What? He said my friend at the end. He said corporations are people too, my friend. I gave the full quote. You gave it, you know, edited.
SPEAKER 08 :
That's fine. Kathy though, I understand your thoughts on this. Now look, there are agreements that are set in place. There are things that they're going to have to look into because whether you like it or not, whether I like it or not, certainly I have been pretty clear. I do not care for it. Uh, They have the right to also fight and say, hey, this is unconstitutional that you're taking away our funding because of a certain belief or certain things we would or wouldn't do or wouldn't say. You know what? It's going to be for the court to decide. And unfortunately, I think it's going to be a bit of an uphill battle for the Trump administration. But what I hope is that you actually are exposed to the truth here. And that is that tens of billions of dollars are being spent on these elite universities. And we need to make sure that that gets cleaned up as well. Let's go ahead and hit .california.com. who's watching on Salem News Channel, which we're available there live. Great lineup of people there. Dot, you're on the air.
SPEAKER 04 :
Hi, thanks for taking my call. I was just wondering, Harry Hutchins said all the things that the president and the administration should have done, but I didn't hear what they can do now to fight it in court.
SPEAKER 11 :
Well, Dot, well, it is in court now. So there will be some sort of briefing schedule put out. The administration will respond to this lawsuit with their own brief arguing why they are within their rights to suspend this funding, to freeze this funding. And then it will continue on from there. It is federal court. So the judge will be involved. I assume there will be an oral argument potentially on this at some point. There could be a temporary injunction put in place on this freeze. There's a lot of different angles that could come out of this. But as of right now, it is in court. the Department of Justice and the lawyers for the government, as well as probably counsel at these individual agencies that are enumerated as well, will all be involved in fighting back on this. So there is still a fight in court to happen. I mean, this could even get to the stage where we're talking about constitutional rights that there are amicus briefs brought in by organizations like the American Center for Law and Justice. We need to see what that plays out in the court as we go forward. But as of right now, This is just the very first step because they filed the lawsuit. So now there will be a response from the government. And really, it's what we were breaking down is kind of Professor Hutchison's analysis on the three claims, the two First Amendment claims and the Civil Rights Act Title VI claim.
SPEAKER 08 :
Go back and listen to that if you didn't. Harry Hutchison was on earlier in the broadcast, really kind of broke down the legalities of it. But I want to take this last minute here. tell you the work of the aclj continues we're gonna figure out how we can get involved in this look we've been fighting for the rights of our friends our jewish and christian students on these campuses throughout the country for the last nearly two years of course we've been doing it for decades and decades but the last few years when it really got heated after the october 7th attack we have been there for them wherever we can we'll continue to do that We'll also continue our fight for the unborn. I want to encourage you right now, let's throw that QR code up on the screen. It's not that I don't want you to see my pretty face. Of course I do. But right now, I need you to go to aclj.org, scan the QR code that's on your screen. There's only eight days left to have your gifts doubled. You need to do it right now. Okay, this is the time to do it. aclj.org or scan that QR code you see on the screen. We have so much going on, even in the next few hours, and we need your support. We'll be right back tomorrow with more on Seculo.
This episode shines a light on the plight of widows in India—a demographic so marginalized that they're excluded from receiving basic aid. Angie Austin reunites with Margie and Don Cook, who share transformative stories of faith, resilience, and the incredible impact of their nonprofit, Hands On Houses. Learn how this family-led mission has changed lives in multiple countries, all while strengthening their own.
SPEAKER 02 :
Welcome to The Good News with Angie Austin. Now, with The Good News, here's Angie.
SPEAKER 06 :
Hello, friend. Angie Austin here with the good news. Well, I'm really excited about my next two guests because they were on my show, I don't know, 10, 12 years ago. It's been a long time. Their organization, their nonprofit is called Hands On Houses, and it's Margie and Don Cook. And after they retired many years ago, they started a nonprofit building houses. And you'll find out exactly who they're building them for. It's such a wonderful organization. Welcome, Margie and Don.
SPEAKER 05 :
Thank you, Angie. So nice to reconnect with you.
SPEAKER 04 :
Thank you to all the people listening, too.
SPEAKER 06 :
Well, you know, Don and Margie, I've been following you over a decade now, ever since you came on the show. So, Margie, why don't you start and tell us about your journey after retirement and about this organization you started. And then Don will move to you and get into the specifics of how you've gone about doing this. So go ahead, Margie.
SPEAKER 05 :
Well, I'm 75 now and Don's 78, and we're never going to retire. So in 2007, we felt the Lord calling us to go out to build houses for widows in Southeast India. And we started just with going out with two suitcases each, not knowing where we personally would stay, but knowing that we had a pastor to work with. And we started building suitcases. slowly in the very, very poor villages, mainly for widows. And our organization didn't even have a name in those days, but now it's called Hands on Houses. And up to date, we have built just under four, about 460 houses, mainly for widows all over India. Now we've expanded. God has opened many doors to us. We're building in Nepal and Sri Lanka. We're building in Zambia and Africa and El Salvador in South America. And we just keep walking through the doors that God opens for us. And he's so faithful. He's just continue to expand the work. And there are more and more widows who are so grateful to have a home that they thought they would never, ever have.
SPEAKER 06 :
And I want to talk to people a little bit about the circumstances in which they live. So handsonhouses.com if you want to donate, get more info. And I know, Don, you've improved the process and how you build these little homes. And can you talk to me, Don, a little bit about how widows live or are treated, what happens to them in society when they do lose their husband, and how many of these women were living before you built them a house?
SPEAKER 04 :
Yeah, Angie, it's quite shocking in the way that widows have had to survive in India. There was a time probably about 300 years ago when widows were required to die with their husbands, you know, when their husband was cremated, they would, they would be put on the funeral pyre with him. Um, so there's a, there's, there's just a real antagonism towards widows in India and in many other parts of the world too, but in India has been the worst. Um, the, uh, they're seen as carriers of bad luck and, um, people don't really welcome them in their communities they're sort of required to stay out of sight and wear clothes that represent the mourning you know that they're mourning for their husbands so it's really it's a very sad tale what has happened though is that Christianity has been spreading through India for many years and that whole attitude has been moderated but the The widows are still not expected to remarry. In the 17 years that we've been involved in India, we've come across two ladies who were well-educated and were in a position to get remarried. But generally, the system in India is that I think 90% at least of the marriages are arranged. And the arranged marriages usually have to fit in with the caste system, which is a very I don't know whether that whether I should discuss that a bit more, but not really. But it's just in a nutshell, widows have really, really had a hard time in India for a long time. And so we felt sorry.
SPEAKER 06 :
No, no, no, no. You carry on, Don.
SPEAKER 04 :
So when we went out to India in 2007, we actually thought we would build houses for people that had lost houses during the tsunami that had hit Banda Aceh and Indonesia and a lot of that area. But somebody, I don't even remember who it was, could have called me almost anonymously and advised me not to get involved with the disaster relief in the tsunami hit areas. And a friend of ours who was showing us around took me to some of the villages and he told me that he'd been trying to help the tsunami victims by giving them rice and helping them in whatever way he could. And he found that they were not giving any rice to the widows in their communities. Oh, my goodness. And when he asked them, he said, yeah, he said, they said, the leaders have said, look, we just don't really want them here. We wish they'd leave and go and stay somewhere else. So that's been, that was what triggered our decision to focus on widows as far as possible. So I'd been working, I'd actually, I taught chemical engineering for 20 years and then sort of took an early retirement to get involved in a project in a way but i was impressed by a indonesian man who'd found that by using appropriate technology opened doors to villages where he'd previously been warned to get out and stay away and don't come back sort of thing but he'd worked out how to use biogas and a few other sort of pumping systems and found that people were just begging him to come to the villages and help so that's what sort of inspired me I thought well I've got a technical background my father had been in construction so I thought well Maybe we could start making cement out of seawater, which is quite a long story. But a friend of mine said, look, you know, there's just been the tsunami. People are going to need houses. Stop talking about cement. Get out there and start building houses. So that's really what we ended up doing.
SPEAKER 06 :
You know, it's so shocking to me. Like, I knew that they were treated poorly from our interview, you know, over a decade ago. And I've been following your journey and over 400 houses built now. But I didn't realize you started because you found out after the tsunami that they didn't want to even give rice to the widows. and that i know they were living outside or under like they'd make you know some kind of a makeshift lean-to with you know leaves on top and you know of course there's a lot of rain and so they'd have to rebuild their little lean-to and they basically were just living in a manner which was not healthy or at all comfortable and you know basically dangerous that these women were barely surviving And so, you know, following some of the stories, I'm sure both of you have some, you know, special ones. But Margie, do you want to tell me one or two stories about some of the women you help? And by the way, again, these aren't big, fancy houses. It might be as big as your walk-in closet at home. But to these widows, it is life-changing. So tell us about some of the people you've helped. They all, of course, are special stories, but any that really stuck in your mind?
SPEAKER 05 :
Yes, it is amazing because so many of them are living in a car shed or they don't have proper walls and they go to sleep at night. We had one woman who we built a house for. And when we went to see the house that had been built, she was there praising God and saying, thank you, thank you, thank you, Jesus, for giving me a house. Because I used to have to go to sleep in a car shed at night. And there were no doors that could be closed. This was all through translation. And she was constantly afraid of snakes coming in and biting her during the night because she didn't have a house where she could close the door and know that she could sleep safely. So that was one story that touched my heart because I just felt, I can't imagine going to bed at night and not being able to rest peacefully. And she couldn't do that. And she's one of many widows like that. We've built for young widows. You know, there's a high proportion of suicide rates amongst husbands. And I remember one widow we built for a few years back. She was pregnant with her third child and her husband committed suicide. And she had these two little children together. and we were introduced to her and the pastor we were working with at the time wanted to build her a house. She was 23. She's probably never going to get married again because of the culture and she had these two children and another one on the way and we've subsequently seen her and seen her house and she's just so grateful because her children will grow up in a safe environment. They'll probably do better academically at school and then when she's In her old age, they'll probably care for her because there's no insurance there for people in villages. They live from day to day, and their children are their insurance that will look after them when they're older. So it goes from one generation to the next, Angie. It's quite amazing. It's not just something that's going to look after a widow for. a few years, you know, can affect her life and her children.
SPEAKER 06 :
Yeah, from 23 on, her whole life, like you said, probably not remarrying, which is unheard of in, you know, in the States and where you're from as well. Now, a car shed, is that like a carport in America where it's just a roof with like, you know, four sticks to balance the roof and it's not enclosed?
SPEAKER 1 :
No.
SPEAKER 05 :
Angie, that's my accent. It's a cow. K-C-R-W. Cow.
SPEAKER 06 :
Oh, shit. Okay. Sorry. I thought it was like a carport. Oh, goodness. No. Margie and Don, your whole family has gotten involved with you. Your kids are also Christians. Tell us about that. Before we take a break, we have about two minutes. Tell us about your family getting involved.
SPEAKER 05 :
Yes, our oldest son Andy and his wife Carla joined our team about 12 years ago, lived in India with us for three years and they're now living, they've been in Hawaii for a while, they're now living on the US mainland with their three children and Andy does a lot of the work, he manages the different projects, he's our accountant, Carla is a graphic designer, she designs all our books that we send out and cards that we do and our website and so they've been part of our team for as I said 12 years and it's wonderful to have them on board and then our other children have introduced us to partners in different parts of the world Zambia came through one younger daughter's recently after teaching in South Korea for 10 years she and her family have relocated to Kenya and we will be visiting them in February and hoping to find some partners in Kenya, East Africa, Central East Africa. And our youngest son has also done a lot of introducing. So our family has all been involved at different levels.
SPEAKER 04 :
We started off with us. Go ahead, Don. No, you carry on. Okay, thanks, Angie. So when we started off, our youngest son decided he was going to bring three or four of his friends to come and help us and he came out and spent time with us and our two daughters have also been out with their husbands. And so it's been a, it's been a very sort of, we've been very encouraged by our children. Our children have been incredibly, uh, supportive of what we've done. And we're, you know, uh, in looking back, it's, it's amazing what they've done to help us. And, how so many people have helped us. It's really been a sort of a journey of seeing the body of Christ come to life and just to where we've just been so blessed by so many people and helped and guided. And so it's been a wonderful story, Angie. Yeah.
SPEAKER 06 :
I want to hear more. Hold on. Keep that thought last year, Margie. The website is handsonhouses.com. We're going to take a break. Again, it's handsonhouses.com. If you can get there to their locations, you can help volunteer. But there's also a donation button there and a lot more about the work they do. We'll be right back with Margie and Don Cook. And the nonprofit is handsonhouses.com. We'll be right back.
SPEAKER 01 :
It's that time of year to start cleaning out your closets, basement, and garage by donating to Ark Thrift. With 34 thrift stores and 15 donation centers across the Front Range, you have almost 50 different locations to donate your gently used clothing and items you don't need anymore or are taking up space in your home. Ark will also take large furniture off your hands by scheduling a pickup through the Ark website. Any soft goods you choose to donate, you can just put in bags, while hard goods need to go into boxes. This helps ARC turn their 5,000 weekly donations per store into resellable items immediately. With spring around the corner, donate the spring and Easter clothing that is too small or just sitting in a closet to help out another family. And while you're there, get your Easter decorations and clothing. To schedule your large furniture pickup or to find the nearest ARC Thrift Donation Center or store location near you, go to arcthrift.com.
SPEAKER 03 :
You're tuned to AM670, KLTT, Commerce City, Denver, KLTT HD, and streaming worldwide at 670KLTT.com.
SPEAKER 06 :
Welcome back to The Good News. Angie Austin here with Margie and Don Cook, and we are talking about their nonprofit Hands on Houses. After they retired, well over a decade ago, they started building houses for widows. They were in India at that time, and they wanted to help out people after the tsunami, but they heard that widows weren't even getting rice when the rice was being handed out to people in need. And then they found out that they were really left behind, that Many of them didn't have homes that the majority of them don't remarry and that they're really living in an extreme situation of poverty. And so, Margie, let's pick up where we left off. You were saying?
SPEAKER 05 :
We were just talking about how our whole family has been involved with us, our four children, our children-in-law. And then last year, we had the wonderful opportunity and privilege of having our oldest grandchild, Max, come out. And he helped paint a house and watched a house being built. And he was with us with his father, Andy, for two weeks. And he was eight at the time. He's now 10. He was nearly nine, actually. But it was just such a joy to have one of the next generation come out and actually see what we're doing and be part of it. So, you know, it's been a family affair, Angie.
SPEAKER 06 :
Don, I remember asking you and Margie, like, you know, you could be like you mentioned one of your kids moving to Hawaii after they worked with you and now living on the mainland U.S. And I said you could be sitting on the beach in Hawaii. But you really felt led after your retirement to start building these homes across the world for these widows who've been, you know, just really set off to die. And so explain what led you to feel, you know, what was the calling all about for you and Margie?
SPEAKER 04 :
As I said, I taught engineering for 20 years, and I really felt that, you know, I should use my technical knowledge as a way to reach people with the love of Jesus, you know. So I I had these plans for, as I said earlier, making cement, but then I've also had plans for making a type of house that could go up quickly. Um, and that would, you know, hopefully start meeting the needs of so many people as quickly as we could. So that, that was what sort of encouraged us to go out and use, to use the gift of a house as a platform for presenting the love of Jesus to people who need to know about that. And so, um, So our motivation is really to spread the gospel, but it's just using technology and the gift of a house as a way of opening the door to people asking the questions, you know, the sort of questions, why are we doing this? And. And there's some other questions that we've had difficulty answering. We were watching a house being built once, and one of the neighbors came up to me and said, so tell me, what can Jesus do for me? So those are the sort of things we've had to deal with. And it's been very interesting just communicating. Having some sort of idea of what the culture is like and what people have, you know, what their sort of impression of Jesus is and that sort of thing. But the purpose is to use technology, to use some sort of ability that we have to reach people with the love of Jesus.
SPEAKER 06 :
And the process, I know, even back when I talked to you like 10 years or more ago, you mentioned that your process had improved from maybe a wooden lean-to kind of structure. And again, these are not fancy houses. They're like an oversized closet in some cases. But your techniques improve and you are building more and building them quickly and less expensively. Talk a little bit about that because I know your engineering mind can't wait to tell me about that.
SPEAKER 04 :
Yeah, Angie, it's interesting. When we started off, I had this design that involved making concrete panels and tipping them up and then putting a cement roof on top of that. But I found that just through a whole lot of trial and error that we actually ended up with houses that we felt... were not as good as the houses that people would have preferred to get. And so most of our houses towards, you know, in the last 10 years that we were in India, were built out of cinder blocks with a sheet metal roof that was guaranteed to last at least 20 years. So I had to sort of, what actually happened was when our son Andrew decided to join us, he said to us, looked at, You know, you're experimenting with all these different houses, but we're only building about 10 houses a year. So why don't you consider sort of laying your research and development aside for a while and let's focus on production. So that's what we did. We ended up going from 10 houses a year to 30 houses a year just using the normal construction techniques that the local people knew. um what we discovered or what we sort of realized after a while was that we didn't really want to build our houses quickly um initially we thought well you know be great if we could build a house that could go up in a day or a week and then uh you know we'd be able to build so many more houses that way but our our purpose is really to use that time that we have where the people that are receiving the houses and the neighbors who are receiving houses or watching going on can interact with the people who are doing the construction who are all Christians and some of them are using their construction jobs as tent making to keep themselves going while they focus on developing little churches in the area. It's interesting that we decided, we realized that we actually want to spend a bit more time on the construction than just to go in there, build a house and get out.
SPEAKER 06 :
So you can kind of spread the word of the Lord while they're building.
SPEAKER 04 :
Exactly. Yeah, exactly.
SPEAKER 06 :
That is so neat. Now, Margie, I want you to tell me, that's interesting that it went to now more labor intensive so you could talk about Jesus. Margie, tell me how people have volunteered with you. You mentioned how your kids got involved. And so tell me a little bit about that.
SPEAKER 05 :
Well, initially we had a team that came out with our younger sons. from his university and they helped us for the first month and got the project going really quickly, which we were so grateful for. And then subsequently, we've had teams come up from mainly from YWAM. Are you familiar with YWAM, Angie?
SPEAKER 06 :
No, no, no, I'm not.
SPEAKER 05 :
It's a very big missions organization internationally. They train young people. to go out and take the gospel using different methods. They use all sorts of things. It might be health-orientated. It might be creative arts. It might be all sorts of different ways, and they're constantly training up people. And their main university is the University of the Nations in Hawaii, and that's what we were connected with. And so we have many friends there, and they've sent teams of about 12 or 13 young people to us In the early days, we had quite a lot of teams coming out. We've had volunteers over the years. We've had young people come. We've had older people come. And so that's what people have done as they've come out. Sometimes they've spent a week. Sometimes they've spent a month. It just depends. In fact, we had one young man who came out for a couple of months, and we rented a house next door for him. So that's how people have helped us on the ground. And otherwise, I have a team of prayer people who pray constantly for us. And I know that without prayer, we could never do what we're doing. And then we have people who don't want to come, but they're happy to donate. So, you know, it's a sort of... many-faceted support group all around.
SPEAKER 04 :
Just an interesting story. We had a young guy, a Polish lad, who heard our radio interview in Dublin, Ireland, and asked if he could come out. And then we discovered that it was part of his honeymoon where he and his wife came and painted a house in one of the villages. Quite interesting. And then afterwards, they said it was the highlight of their honeymoon.
SPEAKER 06 :
Oh, that is so neat. Yeah, what do they say? The best way to get out of yourself if you're not feeling so great, or if you are feeling great, is to do something for others. So how has this impacted you? Your life, Margie or Don, whoever wants to answer this one or both of you, how has this impacted your, and I'm using air quotes, retirement? That's pretty funny. You never really retired.
SPEAKER 05 :
It's funny, Angie. You know, we were just such a normal, ordinary South African couple living in the Cape Town area at the tip of Africa. We never think we would ever move. And so I think God just called us out of our easy environment, and we spent 10 years in Hawaii, and then it's been 17 years in India. And it's just given us such a greater perception, I think, of who God is and what he does and how he wants to use you if you're open to that. And the world is one's oyster. You know, if you prepare to go, you know, there's that scripture in Isaiah, about who will I send, who will go. And we used to sing that song back in South Africa, not really knowing that we were opening ourselves up to God sending us somewhere. And just the fact that we've had the opportunity to go and to do and to be what God's wanting us to be has just enriched our lives incredibly. We've met so many amazing, wonderful people. And we've just had so much interface with all sorts of people all over this world. And we would never have ever imagined that when we were young, living, as I said, in an easy life, just raising our kids in the local community and church and greater family, you know. So we're just so grateful that, you know, God has just opened doors to us and held our hand as we walked through. You're so faithful, Andy.
SPEAKER 04 :
Go ahead, Don, go ahead. I just look back and think whether the last 17 years haven't been the most exciting years of our lives so far, you know, because people have often said to us, oh, it must have been terrible having to sacrifice so much and go out and work in the villages there, but It's been an incredible time. It's just been exciting. It's been just full of the Lord. It's just been one of those things where there's never been a dull moment. And we've just seen so many amazing ways in which the Lord's faithfulness and the Lord's Your presence has just been, you know, sort of addictive. So we've been having fun and we, you know, it's been great.
SPEAKER 06 :
You know, and in following you, you didn't, you know, you had a place to live, but there were times when it was also rather makeshift as well. You weren't living high on the hog while you were building these houses for widows in these towns. you know little villages so you know you've made sacrifices too you didn't have that quote-unquote comfortable life maybe that you had when you were in south africa raising your family and don was working as an engineer but what a great thing to do um you know for the lord as a team you know the two of you together and then joining your family in and i want to make sure that people can get information the website is hands on houses.com hands on houses.com And as Margie and Don Cook mentioned, they're building houses in other locations as well. You can find out more about them and their family and their support staff, the builders and what they're doing for the widows. God bless you both. And what a privilege to have you on the program again.
SPEAKER 04 :
Thank you, Angie. It's so wonderful to talk to you again, Angie. Yes, wonderful.
SPEAKER 06 :
You too, Angie. God bless you too. HandsOnHouses.com. Thanks, guys.
SPEAKER 02 :
Thank you for listening to The Good News with Angie Austin on AM670 KLTT.
Uncover the strategic intricacies behind American corporate moves as Bill Gundersen explores the impact of tariffs and interest rates on various industries. From gold's ascension to market predictions, join us on a journey through the complexities of economics under a Trump-led administration. Gain insights on navigating investments through Bill’s expert analysis and future economic outlook.
SPEAKER 01 :
He's been seen on CNBC, the Fox News Channel, and the Fox Business Channel. His articles can be found on MarketWatch, Seeking Alpha, TheStreet.com, and many other places. He's the author of the weekly Best Stocks Now newsletter and the inventor of the Best Stocks Now app. He's president of Gundersen Capital Management. Here is professional money manager Bill Gundersen.
SPEAKER 03 :
And welcome to the Tuesday. A better day than yesterday for sure in the market. This is Bill Gunderson. It's The Best Stocks Now. And you're here with Barry Cotter, Chartered Financial Analyst. We've got a rip-roaring rally coming out of the gate here this morning with the Dow up 578 points right now. That makes back some of the 900 we lost yesterday. The Dow is at 38,748. The NASDAQ is up 305 points. That's getting about everything back that we lost yesterday. Not quite, but almost. It's up 1.92% right now. The S&P is up 80 points at 1.56 gain today. The small caps are up 1.75% so far here today. There's a little buying going on in the bond market after some selling yesterday. The 10-year is down several basis points here this morning. And we have the gold markets hitting another new high. Trump has been good for gold. You know, the VIX and gold have been very good. Have responded very good to the tumultuous Trump presidency. So far, crude oil is up 1.2% to $63.85. And we have Bitcoin is back in rally mode. Bitcoin is over $90,000 again. at 90,107. It's up 2,800 points today. So welcome to today's Best Stocks Now show with professional money manager Bill Gunderson, president of Gunderson Capital Management. And I'm here with Barry Kite. Our chartered financial analyst, we had a strange day yesterday. You know, it didn't seem to me like that was enough reason for a big sell-off, Trump's public spat with Jerome Powell, which, you know, he should kind of keep that private. Calling your Treasury secretary a loser is probably not a good thing. in the public airwaves, Barry. The market, I think nobody could disagree with the fact that the market wants an independent Fed. And it spoke loudly yesterday. On that public spat, because you had a big sell-off in the markets, and I really didn't see any other reason. I think you could add in that there has not been any progress made between us and China. And if anything, China has upped the ante and dug in their heels. And the question is, how long can they maintain that stance? without really hurting their economy. So nobody knows the answer to that. But the Dow was down 972 yesterday. Trump publicly feuding with Fed Chairman Powell, calling Powell a loser, Mr. Too Late, this and that. You know, Mr. Too Late.
SPEAKER 04 :
I mean, so we'll do go back to, I mean, you can... You know, you can certainly make arguments on both sides. But, you know, I do think, you know, there was at one point, remember, I mean, Powell did kind of make a mistake in terms of raising rates. It was kind of in, I think it was around 2000. It was the reason we went to that bear market, remember, towards the end of 2018. I mean, of course, during Trump's presidency and he was raising rates and essentially they went from raising to the next meeting, reducing rates, which means you went the wrong way. And then, of course, we had a big rally in 2019. But, you know, he's he's made some missteps. And that's probably some of the things, obviously, that, you know, Trump is anchored to in terms of previous missteps. And then, of course, in this instance, he wouldn't like it.
SPEAKER 03 :
rates to be lower so yeah i mean every president uh would prefer lower rates right exactly but you know i mean it's obvious that the markets around the world now europe didn't participate yesterday europe took the day off yesterday in honor of the pope's passing so you didn't have them uh you know in the market that that creates more volatility because you've got less volume uh... playing into but you know it it's obvious to me the market was an independent fed is a quarter of a point really gonna make that big of a difference whether it's today or two months from now i just think trump needs to be careful with picking his fights you know he likes to do that the public fights uh... picking on somebody and all of a sudden you know it turns into a big brouhaha but you know the markets don't like that and uh... The dollar got whacked yesterday. The bond market got whacked. Tech had a horrible day. And you're almost back testing those old lows once again. Do you realize, Barry, that from the recent high, the S&P has been down as low as 21% from its high within the last six weeks? That's a bear market, right? And the NASDAQ has been down as much as 26.8%. Those are no small numbers. And guess what's dropping along with the market is Trump's approval ratings, especially on the economy.
SPEAKER 04 :
Well, I've seen, I mean, I saw some, you know, in terms of actual, you know, numbers where the Dow Jones essentially, you know, after yesterday, it's worst April performance since 1932. And the S&P's performance since Inauguration Day is now the worst for any president up to this point with data going back to 1928.
SPEAKER 03 :
Yes, and you could say, well, you know what? He is a disruptor. Okay. Disruptors come along for good or bad. And the jury's still out whether or not, you know, this disruption that is taking place in the world trades. and markets will end up being to America's benefit. I do think it's eventually going to work. But in the meantime, there's a lot of disruption that the market has to deal with. And then you throw in the Fed on top of that. And, you know, look, we had a huge sell-off. It was really depressing yesterday just to watch everything selling off and getting hit. And I hope the people around Trump, and he is surrounded by a lot of stock market people. You've got the Cantor Fitzgerald guy. You've got Besson, who was a hedge fund manager for years, and others around him. They've got to be saying, you know, you've got to be careful what you say. The markets are listening to everything.
SPEAKER 04 :
Well, and that's why I think it'll shake out in the end, right? And I think that's what, you know, part of your article, right, was kind of tied to was the fact, you know, at some point, right, we know that, you know, these tariffs aren't going to be in place for an extended period of time, you know, likely, not at least to the punitive space, maybe on China, but not on the rest of the world, you know. And so a lot of this is going to play out. But I feel like when you start seeing some of these numbers, like reading this piece for April and since the inauguration, those kind of things, to me I feel like that stat might end up in front of the president's desk, right? And he may have a conversation and talk the market back up before the end of April.
SPEAKER 03 :
I don't know. On the other hand, you know, Powell made the infamous transitory call in 2021. He got it totally wrong. He said that the inflation was transitory. No, it wasn't transitory. And you can also make the argument, and I didn't know this, I found out that Europe has already lowered their earnings or their interest rates seven times.
SPEAKER 04 :
Yeah, and Europe's really not a good, I don't think it's a good barometer given the fact that they've got poor growth and have had it. We've talked about as much slow growth as they've had.
SPEAKER 03 :
Maybe they need to lighten up on the regulations a little bit. Probably, for sure. The seven rate cuts don't seem to be helping. Now, today, brace yourself because five Fed governors are speaking today. Okay, the two biggest winners. Five of them are speaking today?
SPEAKER 01 :
Five.
SPEAKER 03 :
Yeah, I saw the calendar today. So if you see some swings in the market today, it's those people speaking in the background. Commodity Roundup. Gold hits $3,500 an ounce. It's been the big winner. since the Trump inauguration. And the VIX, obviously, has been off the charts. The VIX measures volatility. So we should have just sold everything and bought the VIX and bought gold, and we'd be sitting here, you know, fat and happy right now. But, you know, we're expecting and the markets are expecting good results down the road. I think we all knew that it was going to be tumultuous. We knew what we were getting into. I mean, tremendous upheaval. But the mouth doesn't help. I was quoting a proverb yesterday. I can't remember which one. Something about the wise man holds his tongue a little bit. And Trump does have a problem with that. Okay, let's focus on earnings. Earnings. Earnings, earnings. That's what the market's all about. Real estate is location, location, location. The market is all about earnings and we've got a bunch of them coming in today. But prepare for Tesla after the close. Tesla just got slaughtered yesterday. They've had a rough go of it. We've heard from GE this morning. We've heard from Verizon. 3M is helping the Dow big time. We've heard from Lockheed. We've heard from Raytheon. We've heard from Halliburton, Kimberly-Clark, Northrop Grumman, and Baker Hughes. Tomorrow, AT&T, Boeing, IBM, Texas Instruments, ServiceNow. Let's focus on earnings. earnings, earnings, earnings. We'll be right back. And welcome back here to the second quarter of today's Best Stocks Now show. You know, a day like yesterday, I looked at 600, 700 charts yesterday. They all looked horrible. I said, you know, maybe it's a good day to buy some of this stuff. But, you know, I just hate to buy a bad chart. I like to see it at least firm up and start drawing a sideways trend. And then you might say, well... How come you don't have any inverse funds right now? Man, that's a deadly game because this is a news driven market. This is not a normal market at all. I mean, as you slowly slide into a recession or whatnot. It's a very gradual process, but you can see it developing. This is a news-driven. That's all that has to happen is, oh, we've got a new trade deal with India, or we've worked things out. And the market's going to just explode to the upside. So it's a very dangerous market to try and get into inverse funds. I mean, the most consistent inverse funds have been on tech. For whatever reason, tech has not done well at all. The fabulous seven, especially during the early days here of the Trump presidency. And the small caps have not done well either. They've been the most reliable inverse funds. But then you had that day a couple weeks ago where the market was up 3,000 points in one day.
SPEAKER 04 :
And NASDAQ up 12% in a day.
SPEAKER 03 :
So that's what you're playing with here. It's just... Which is why I look at gold. We've been talking about gold. Gold has been the most consistent performer of all. Touched 3,500 earlier today, I think, at some point. I just think white knuckles is the best strategy right now in good stocks. Even though yesterday was not a lot of fun at all, it's best to just do nothing. Most days, the answer to most of your questions are nothing as you look at all of your holdings. Okay, just a few others on tap as we look at the earnings. Boeing tomorrow, Texas, Chipotle, ServiceNow. And then on Thursday, you're going to get Google, which has had more legal problems than anything recently. Intel's going to report on Thursday. Merck, Procter & Gamble, Pepsi, Union Pacific, T-Mobile, Schlumberger on Friday. So we still have a lot of really important earnings. And we're going to get a good feel by this Saturday. I picked a good day not to do a newsletter because earnings season really now is heating up and we'll have a much better feel. It will be nine days of earnings since the last newsletter. I'm going to have a much better feel for where we're headed. I would just say that so far... Seventy percent of companies are beating their earnings, which is a pretty normal number. And we seem to be getting more split guidance. But some companies that are directly in the line of the tariffs are definitely. lowering expectations now yesterday trump met with walmart ceo target home depot other big ceos talking about the tariffs lows getting their input so you know it's not something that this is in your face you know you like it or lump it He's getting input from all of them to discuss the impact of tariffs on their businesses. The discussion focused on broader tariffs imposed on imported goods. And you're talking about all the stuff that we bring in from China on these freighters. We have boots on the ground here, boats in the water. We see them all the time. And the containers... You know that every one of those containers is hooked up to a truck that leaves the Charleston port and heads out on the 526 or the 26 bound for their destination. So we see it right here. We're on the front lines of all of this.
SPEAKER 04 :
And we also see cars, we also see BMWs get dropped off here to go actually to be exported elsewhere. Yes. We do get some of both sides of it because... It's pretty amazing you get those trains that come. Where do they come from, Bill? Is it Greenville? Or are they coming from, maybe I think it is Greenville.
SPEAKER 03 :
Oh, the trains?
SPEAKER 04 :
They get the train with just, I don't know how many BMWs on it.
SPEAKER 03 :
Yeah, it heads up to Spartanburg and Greenville, sure. Now, let's look at the other side of this, okay? He's pushing, you know, you've got J.D. Vance in India right now with his wife who is of Indian descent. But he wants India to give us, the U.S., full access to their markets, especially the online. He wants Amazon and Walmart to have a big presence in India. So wouldn't that be a wonderful thing, you know, for us to be selling things around the world? Look, Walmart, how would you like to have access to the Indian market? Do you know how big that is? What's the population of India? It's enormous. And we're trying to, he's trying to open up full access for U.S. online retailers such as Walmart and Amazon as one of the concessions in the trade deal. So that would be an enormous market opportunity. for these companies here in the U.S. for them. So we'll see. Now, New Delhi, which aims to reach two-way trade of $500 billion with the U.S. by 2030, promised to purchase more U.S. oil, gas, military gear, and combat equipment and combat their illegal immigration that, you know, a lot of people from India have come here. And also, you know, open them up to our bourbon, our whiskey, our luxury cars, machinery, because right now India is like 100% tariffs on U.S. stuff. And here they are, you know, wanting us, they want their products coming to the U.S. tariff-free. So anyways, that's the other side of this whole argument. U.S. to meet with Ukraine and European allies on peace plan. Okay, that's moving along in the background. They're meeting in London on Wednesday to hold high-level discussions with our European allies. That's Marco Rubio over there, Keith Kellogg, Steve Witkoff on a possible peace plan between Ukraine and Russia. Now, Wells Fargo, all right. Scott Wren, who is their senior global market strategist, predicts U.S. stocks will overcome current market turbulence and deliver gains. Okay, I'm simpatico. I'm in that same boat. Advocating for investors to capitalize on recent price declines. I totally agree. And as I've said before, I created a relative value portfolio. I don't know of another relative value. I guess there's some GARP, growth at a reasonable price, but I'm using something totally different. I'm looking at recent historic P.E. ratios of really good companies that are now trading at big discounts to those historic P.E. ratios. That's relative value. That's a totally different track that Benjamin Graham took, that Graham and Dodd took with their intrinsic value. And I continue to pick up a stock here and there. When it's all done, I hope to have about 40 under management. It's a great time. It's a great strategy for a time like this. Give us a call. Have a little discussion about the relative value portfolio. We'll be right back. This is Bill Gunderson. Thank you for tuning in to today's Best Stocks Now, Best Inverse Funds Now show. I put several hours of research in during the wee hours of the morning each day to bring you the very best cutting-edge stories that I can. To get two free weeks of my newsletter, go to GundersenCapital.com. To talk to us about our fee-based only money management services, call us at 855-611-BEST. Now, back to the second half of the show.
SPEAKER 1 :
Call out the instigator Because there's something in the air
SPEAKER 03 :
And welcome back here to the second half of today's Best Docs Now show. You know, the one that they need to solve and make some progress on and chip away at is China, obviously. They're the elephant in the room. And, you know, there were some encouraging things a week ago yesterday coming out of China, but since then it's been nothing but tit for tat and, you know, stiffening your neck and not giving in and not budging and digging your feet into the sand. And so far, you know, this week I have not seen any progress. We don't know what's going on behind the scenes. You know, a lot of people wonder how far China can go into this, you know, with this stalemate, having the manufacturing economy that they have. But so far, You can back them up to the gates of hell and they won't back down, it seems like, Barry, right now. And in the meantime, we're seeing a lot of companies saying, you know, we're going to commit. I see Roche today, which is a big pharmaceutical giant out of Switzerland. they're going to park fifty billion dollars in the u.s. over the next five years and create twelve hundred jobs okay that's that's one of the objectives of this whole thing is to create jobs and uh... bring some of this uh... manufacturing we saw yesterday that uh... lily was going to uh... manufacture when when it's approved that the weight loss pill We saw the RAV4 from Toyota being targeted for Kentucky. So I've seen quite a bit along those lines. And Besant said it in his interview. He said, you know, don't watch so much the countries, but watch the individual companies. uh what they do okay then it looks like that the uh the drug stocks may be in the next in in the uh in the headlights again just what we need more turmoil but trump's got it in his craw that drugs are cheaper in foreign countries than they are in the u.s the same drug obviously and he's cautioning the drug companies that he wants to link the prices of U.S. medicines to the levels they are available in other developed nations. Kind of weird. I mean, how do they get away with that, Barry? You know, look, it's so much a pill here in the U.S., but you can get up in France for half the price and Canada for one. That doesn't make sense to me.
SPEAKER 04 :
Yeah, I mean, it's... Something's got to give there. I mean, you know, why that is, right? I mean, my guess is it has to be some type of legislation that was written in. I mean, there's, you know, when you think about it, I mean, the, you know, someone obviously agreed to whatever the, that's when you think of like drug prices, right? It's like, you know. They tell you the drug's this much, you go in, right, and you pay $45, right, or whatever. Like, I have no idea what happens behind the scenes. All I know is, right, that you paid $45, right?
SPEAKER 03 :
Yep, yep, yep. And insurance may be picked up. Now, in the meantime, Novo Nordisk is under a lot of pressure. That news from Lilly. on the pill has really hurt nvo once again lily is up a dollar today i'm surprised lily had well it did jump the initially uh on the news of the pill which they're hoping to get approved at some point in time noble nordisk you would think though from a relative value point of view That thing's trading at 12 to 13 times forward earnings, and their weight loss drug is, I think, every bit as effective as Lilly's. Now, if it's going to get hit with tariffs and they're going to lose the American market, I guess that's another consideration, but it sure is cheap. Amazon slides. Amazon's been on a slippery slope here recently. We don't own it except in the relative value fund. And so it's a pretty small holding because that's a brand new portfolio. But as far as our premier growth, I didn't like the way it was trading. They are pausing some data center leases. There seems to be a slowdown, and that's one of Amazon's big sources of income, obviously, is their data centers and their AWS. That's a part of Amazon's business. And then, of course, we don't know the impact yet on Amazon. It'll be interesting when they report. In fact, let's just take a quick look and see when Amazon is going to report how much stuff. Now, I order on Amazon a lot, and I haven't seen anything show up yet that there's a 20% tariff or 804% tariff on this. Amazon is going to report on May the 1st. So nine days from today. And it will be interesting to see what Amazon says, the impact of them. Now, Oxford Industries, a lot of us wear Oxford button-down collared shirts and other clothes. They're going to shift production to other regions of Asia outside of China. and their warning of higher prices this is one of the first companies that i've seen say look you know we're warning prices are going to go up on the on the products that we make and sell and that's obviously inflationary uh... and they're going to have to uh... go to some other countries production so they're not so dependent upon china and that's not helping the relations with us in china because china's furious They're warning other nations that cooperate with the United States, I guess is the way to put it. They say there's going to be severe retribution against countries that cooperate with the United States. Well, Oxford is going to look, shift some production to Cambodia, India, Indonesia, Peru. Next time you put on a white-collar button-down shirt, think about Cambodia. Just take a peek.
SPEAKER 04 :
Yeah, just take a look back there and see.
SPEAKER 03 :
Sri Lanka, Thailand, Turkey, Vietnam. You're not going to see Milwaukee, that's for sure. Okay, now the other big effort that the Trump administration has going on is strengthening American mineral production and not being reliant on Russia. Most of your titanium comes from the Russian nations over there. Most of your rare earth, 80%, comes from China. He wants to really strengthen our own production, and he's designating certain companies. Yesterday he did it with Perpetua, PPTA out of Boise, Idaho. He designated them as a, let's see, what is it called? Priority project, that's it. And today he designated Standard Lithium after saying the Southwest Arkansas project, part of the Smackover Lithium joint venture with Equinor, which is a Norwegian company, was designated as a transparency project in response to President Trump's recent executive order aimed at strengthening American mineral production. and reducing reliance on foreign nations for critical mineral supplies. So they're incentivizing companies and greasing the skids, I guess you could say, for them to really amp up. We saw the company yesterday that is switching over from processing coal to processing rare earth. That was in Indiana, I think, wasn't it? So there's a lot going on in the background. This massive disruption, it's pretty much in every industry out there right now. GE's aerospace shares rise on earnings beat. Okay. This is our friend, the turnaround expert, Culp, Larry Culp, that has turned GE around. Now it's three companies. It's GE Aerospace, it's GE Healthcare, and it's GE Power, nuclear energy and power generation, which is a hot industry right now. But GE, the aerospace company, up 4.4%. That's helping the market today. They had a very good earnings report, excellent earnings report. Their sales were up 14% year over year. Okay, so now this has nothing to do with the feud and the spat between Trump and Jerome Powell. This is earnings, earnings, earnings, which eventually the market comes back to. And you're seeing that today with the big bump higher in the markets. GE's earnings are up 103%. Listen to the last four quarters. GE, 197. This is almost a $200 billion company out of Evandale, Ohio. That's where it's headquartered. Their earnings up 47% four quarters ago, 62% three quarters ago, 20% last quarter, and 103% in the quarter that they reported today. And the stock up 4.1%. Now, when we come back, we've got earnings, earnings, earnings, and more earnings. We'll do as many as we can in the final segment of the show. This is the Best Stocks Now show. and welcome back here to the final segment of today's best stocks now show it's it's really nice to get back to earnings away from all of the tumult and uh and the war of words etc etc etc look at 3m today okay 3m is a member of the dow it's not the most the fastest growing company. In fact, it's pretty much a 0% grower these days.
SPEAKER 04 :
We've got some clients that work there in Minneapolis.
SPEAKER 03 :
Yes, we do. And looking at the last four quarters, there's been absolutely no growth whatsoever in sales. But they did exceed their expectations here today. That stock's up 7.2%. And as a member of the Dow, that helps. They did warn possible tariff effects. They updated their full 2025 guidance to include the effects of tariffs, okay? Now, this is 3M. Currently, they're expecting to make $7.90. They say the tariffs may reduce those numbers by $0.20. So pretty insignificant, at least for 3M. You go from $7.90... Take 20 cents off of that, that's a very small impact, at least for 3M. They're the first ones that I've seen that have reported that actually broke it down into the numbers like that. Very minimal impact on 3M. Verizon comes in, reports earnings, member of the Dow. They beat earnings. Verizon is up a little bit. Verizon is also a total non-growth company. That's why the Dow has underperformed the NASDAQ by such a wide margin over the years. The difference in growth between the Dow and the NASDAQ is a pretty huge gap. And you've seen it. That shows up. Stocks follow earnings. And when you've got a slower growth index like the Dow, you're going to see smoother performance and less volatility, but you're going to see great underperformance over the years because if you don't have those earnings growing, the stock price is not going to follow along. And Verizon has been a pretty poor performer over the last 10 years, but They have reported, and I don't see them mentioning anything. I can't see where Verizon would be impacted by tariffs. If so, it would be very insignificant, okay?
SPEAKER 04 :
Yeah, I guess maybe on the phone side because there are deals, but my guess is a lot of that would get passed on to customers just because you've got to have the phone.
SPEAKER 03 :
Well, GE also, I missed this the first time, GE said tariffs will result in additional costs for us and our suppliers, but we are optimizing operations and leveraging existing programs and strategies to reduce the impact from tariffs. Additionally, we are taking measures to control costs and implementing pricing action to primarily mitigate tariffs. the remaining profit the remaining impact so very little impact from GE Lockheed Martin stock rises on quarterly earnings results Not a member of the Dow, I don't believe. It's down 2.76% so far today. Lockheed's a quarter. Their earnings up 15%. Their sales up just 4%. Lockheed did not mention any possible negative impacts from the Trump administration's effort to cut federal spending. Now there's another one that you're going to hear from companies that do a lot of business with the government. And, of course, they're subject to doge and the cuts being made there, and they did not mention any impact. And they don't mention any tariff impact either. Okay, Raytheon reports earnings. Patriot Missiles, that stock's down 8.5% today. Not a very good chart on Raytheon. Their sales were up 5%. Their earnings were up 10%. They gave their outlook, and it did not incorporate the impact of the recently enacted incremental U.S. and non-U.S. tariffs. Management will provide additional details of potential impact, tariff impacts. Well, it's pretty hard to give tariff impact right now when you don't know what the tariffs are going to be. They're all a work in progress right now. Kimberly Clark trades lower after earnings. That's my favorite stock to hate. The diaper stock, Kimberly Clark, is down 2.2%. You know, the sad thing about it is most of these guys I listened to growing up, rock stars, I mean, some of them are wearing diapers now. That's kind of just, you know, Alice Cooper and these guys. It's just, you know, what happened? How did we get so old so quickly? Kimberly Clark trades lower after earnings warning on higher global supply chain costs. So they are warning, all right? They obviously bring in a lot of supplies from out of the country. And it was a bad stock before the tariffs, and now it's even a worse stock after the tariffs. Northrop Grumman's stock falls sharply on earnings shortfall. Well, I'm surprised to see the defense stocks not doing well. It's down 11.7% today is Northrop Grumman. And we'll do two more, and then we've got to call it quits. Halliburton, all right. You know, the oil industry, they're suffering from Trump because he's driven oil prices down to $62 per barrel. That's good for consumers at the gas pump. but it's not good for producers of energy. Halliburton is down 6.8%, not a good chart at all on Halliburton. And the last one is Equifax. Equifax, EFX is up 11.9%. And, of course, Equifax, I remember the big problem that they had with the data breach. They had one of the biggest data breaches of all time many years ago, the Atlanta-based company. Equifax up 11.9% today. Okay, we're out of time. The four-week trial continues. I say a lot during the day. I send out my comments, my observations, buys and sells. You can get four free weeks at GundersenCapital.com, access to the app, the full Monty newsletter on Friday with all the portfolios, including the new relative value portfolio.
SPEAKER 04 :
The calm through the storm.
SPEAKER 03 :
You know it. And if you want to set up an appointment with us, we'll have our Cleveland date here real quickly, but it's going to be roughly four weeks from now. We're headed up to Cleveland. You can start the calling. I think we're going to be somewhere downtown. You can start calling Edie and reserving a spot. We're going to do a workshop in Cleveland and appointments. 855-611-BEST 855-611-BEST Have a great day, everybody.
SPEAKER 02 :
This show is not a solicitation to buy or sell any securities. Bill Gunderson or clients of Gunderson Capital Management may have long or short positions in stocks mentioned during the show. Past performance is not indicative of future performance. Gunderson Capital Management is a fee-based registered investment advisory firm. All accounts are held at Charles Schwab. Schwab is a member of SIPC and FINRA.
In this episode, Kim Munson addresses the vibrant battle of ideas in the legislative landscape, unmasking the effects of policies on everyday citizens. From the environmental narratives surrounding Earth Day to pressing concerns over state bills impacting rights and governance, join the quest for truth and take action with the Colorado Union of Taxpayers. Don't miss the valuable conversation backed by trusted community sponsors, painting a picture of resilience and responsibility.
SPEAKER 05 :
It's the Kim Munson Show, analyzing the most important stories.
SPEAKER 03 :
That seems to me like government is establishing a religion.
SPEAKER 05 :
The latest in politics and world affairs.
SPEAKER 03 :
If you give people rights, women's rights, gay rights, whatever, there can't be equal rights if there are special rights.
SPEAKER 05 :
Today's current opinions and ideas.
SPEAKER 03 :
Surveys show that people still really prefer freedom over government force.
SPEAKER 05 :
Is it freedom or is it force? Let's have a conversation.
SPEAKER 03 :
Indeed, let's have a conversation. Welcome to the Kim Munson Show. Thank you so much for joining us. You each are treasured and you're valued. You have purpose. Today, strive for excellence. Take care of your heart, your soul, your mind, and your body. My friends, we were made for this day in history. And thank you to the team. That's Producer Joe, Luke, Rachel, Zach, Echo, Charlie, Mike, Teresa, Amanda, and all the people here at Crawford Broadcasting. Happy Tuesday, Producer Joe.
SPEAKER 19 :
Happy Tuesday, Kim.
SPEAKER 03 :
And we've got another great show planned for all of you. So fasten your seat belts. There's so much going on in our world. And as you know, here on the Kim Munson Show, we search for truth and clarity by looking at these issues through the lens of freedom versus force, force versus freedom. If something's a good idea, you should not have to force people to do it. And it's not compassionate. It's not altruistic to take other people's stuff. And that could be their rights, their property, their freedom, their livelihoods, their opportunities, our children's childhood. particularly here in Colorado, or lives via force. And force can obviously be a weapon, but it can be policy, it can be unpredictable and excessive taxation, fear, coercion, government-induced inflation, the agenda by the World Economic Forum that plays out with the globalist elites in the United Nations. This Colorado State Legislature, we've got two Two weeks and two days left in this legislative session. I know we all think that we will breathe a sigh of relief, which is true. However, what they have also done, and this is not just Colorado, but legislators then have pushed out and given power to boards and commissions and bureaucrats. And so we've got a lot of work to do to get government back in its proper role. And nothing happens down at this state legislature without this Colorado governor's blessings. And so he's part of all that. He's no libertarian. We are in a tyrannical, almost communist Colorado, this beautiful state that I love. and a lot of that can be laid at his feet. Of course, these different mayors that we've had in Denver, and that's why we do this show is because we are going to reclaim Colorado. But they do a variety of things. They use land use codes and zoning regulations and forced fees, conservation easements, national monument designations. The list goes on and on and on. And all of this is an assault upon property rights because foundational in the American idea is property rights. that everyday people could keep most of the fruits of their labor. And if that happens, what happens? Well, America happens. Big, broad, middle class people that have freedom to go after their hopes and dreams. So remember, if something is a good idea, my friends, it should be able to cut the mustard of standing up on its own two feet regarding the idea. If it's a bad idea, they're going to have to use force, coercion, Oh, I need to add incentives in there, Joe. That's another thing. Okay, I'll write that down. So on the show, though, we focus on the issues. And we'll mention the people pushing the issues, not the personalities. And I want to have a conversation later on in the week. with Alan because we've had such a conversation about being Republican and this litmus test or this on what it means to be Republican. But I will tell you, if you are on the Colorado Union of Taxpayers as a member and you get our weekly email that goes out to legislators and and the governor each Monday. There are four very, very bad bills. One of them is messing with the elections of our federal officers, the other is county commissioners, and also changing the number of PCPs. And we need to keep an eye on that, but you would have gotten the information on that. And then there's two others, and on one of them, it takes our TABOR refunds away from us and I hate to say this, but Barbara Kirkmeyer, Senate Republican leader, has her names on those things. And so we've got to figure out what to do exactly on that. So stay tuned. We will do that. Our word of the day is endemic. And it is spelled E-N-D-E-M-I-C. and hold on here got to get to it and i chose it because pam long had had that in her that word in her essay that we rolled out this weekend and check that essay out of my website it's regarding rfk jr and his first um first i think 90 days is what it was so endemic it's e-n-d-e-m-i-c and it could be prevalent in or limited to a particular locality region or people Number two, it could be native to or limited to a certain region. Or number three, common in or inherent to an enterprise or situation. And right now I would say tyranny is endemic down at the Colorado Statehouse. So your challenge is to use that word in a sentence today. Our quote of the day, I went to George Mason because we had talked about him yesterday, and he did not sign the Constitution. He was really a great thinker, but he was an American planter, politician, founding father, and delegate to the U.S. Constitutional Convention in Philadelphia in 1787. He was one of three delegates who refused to sign the Constitution. His writings, including substantial portions of the Fairfax Resolves of 1774, the Virginia Declaration of Rights of 1776, and his objections to the Constitution opposing ratification, he exercised a significant influence on American political thought and events. I think we need to do a whole show on him. And but this is what he said. He said to disarm the people was the best and most effectual way to enslave them. And backing up, I don't think that it regarding the Constitution, I can't. You know what? We're going to get Ben Martin on because he can tell us we'll do a whole show on George Mason. was that he believed in this whole American idea, but there were some things he was concerned about. But he understood all of these basic principles. So again, to disarm the people was the best and most effectual way to enslave them. Now, my ear to the ground, and thank you, Mary, is she shared something that there may be an even more onerous bill regarding firearms, our Second Amendment, coming down the pike here in the next couple of weeks down at the state legislature. And so we really need to keep an eye on it. And that is one of the first things that communists do. or socialists do is disarm the people. You saw it with Hitler, you saw it with Mao, you saw it with Stalin, all of them. And we see it happening right here in Colorado. And of course, we'll talk with Alicia Garcia and Teddy Collins about this on when they are on their new sponsors of the show with the Second Syndicate. So stay tuned on all of that. It's really amazing what's happening here in Colorado. So next thing, today is Earth Day. And it is celebrated on April 22nd. And the goal is to promote environmental protection and awareness. And this is one of the, I think it was started back in the 70s. Hold on here. I'm looking at this from USA Today. And let's see here. It says the 2025 theme is Our Power, Our Planet. Focuses on promoting renewable energy and clean energy by 2030. And it was first celebrated in 1970. It was founded by Senator Gaylord Nelson, Congressman Pete McCloskey and activist Dennis Hayes. And this is pushing this again. What we've learned is this is really an anti-human agenda is focusing on the planet, celebrating, worshipping the planet instead of worshipping the creator. They've gotten into a point where they want to worship the creation. Then that worship of the creation, they are you using that to be anti-human. And so that is happening today. And it's interesting that it is a it's considered a holiday now. And it says, this is from USA Today, it says, Earth Day brings people together with the common goal of protecting the planet from environmental threats, which that's what they say, but quite frankly, underlying that is control of the human race. And so that is happening today. The other thing I wanted to encourage you to go over to the Colorado Union of Taxpayers website. So last night was our board meeting, and we are doing amazing things. All volunteers at the Colorado Union of Taxpayers. That website is coloradotaxpayer.org. And before I mention this, I want to say thank you to this amazing group of patriots who are watching legislation that's happening down at the State House. I will get emails from people and say, well, are you making a difference? Well, out here in Colorado, we are in quite the battle. And we are going to reclaim this state. But one of the first things is to understand what's going on. Now, I know people are very concerned, for example, 1312, which that's one of the bills that we have on here, that you can take action on, which that is the bill that ultimately, apparently, if you do not affirm your child's gender confusion, that the Child Protection Services could take your child from you. Also, if you're out in public and you don't affirm somebody's gender dysphoria and confusion, That could be considered discriminatory. And one of the things about discrimination, being discriminatory, if you say something that somebody else doesn't like, that's called freedom of speech. And we would hope that people use good manners and are very thoughtful in their speech. However, people should have the right to be able to say what they want to. and it's called Freedom of Speech. And I know that words hurt. Of course, there's the old adage from when we were kids, sticks and stones may break my bones, but words will never hurt me. Words do hurt, but people need to have the right to be able to say them. So right as of today, 707 bills have been proposed down at the statehouse. This legislative session is over on May 6th. So we've got a couple of weeks, but really would encourage you. I got behind on this as I think all of you know, I was traveling. I forgot my computer. and got behind on it. Yesterday, we got the email out to all of the legislators. And if you're a member of CUT, you will get that as well. It's only $25 to be a member to support us and to be informed. That's the first step in reclaiming our state is we have to know what is going on. But we have selected four new bills that you can, basically, you just go to coloradotaxpayer.org and you click on CUT Engaged up at the top. And it'll bring up the bills that we have selected that you can take action on. And then you just click on that bill. And then it brings up our position on it. For example, Colorado bill, Senate bill 25257, which modifies the general fund transfers to our state highway fund. And if you, I don't know what they're doing with our, well, I don't. know what they're doing with our highway money. They are diverting it. But oh my gosh, our roads in Colorado are terrible. So you just put in your name and you put in your email and you can then just go ahead and uh send that you to the sponsors of the piece of legislation you can also include your senator and your representative and we've got a little tool on there for you to figure out how to do that and so the four bills the four new bills and we'll have four more probably by the end of the day is Senate Bill 25-257, modifying the general fund transfers to the state highway fund. You can make your voice heard super easy. This is only going to take you five minutes for all four of these. Number two, very interesting. CUT opposes House Bill 25-1215, redistribution of the lottery fund money. Remember the lottery fund money was supposed to be for education? Well, take a look at that one. Number three, this is one of those really bad ones. That's the 1312 Legal Protections for Transgender Individuals. If you weren't able to make it down to the big rally, you can make your voice heard right there. And then the fourth one that we chose was regarding this lawsuit on TABOR, Colorado's Taxpayers' Bill of Rights. And when there are those out there that say that humans are greedy, that capitalism is greedy, capitalism has no force involved in it. Now, cronyism does because business and government get in bed with each other and they use force for whatever they're doing, taking your money. But capitalism is the free exchange of value for value. And so there are those that say, oh, my gosh, that capitalism is greedy. It's not. It is the free exchange of value. But you talk about greedy, and that is PBIs, politicians, bureaucrats, and interested parties that don't have enough of your money. And so those that are supporting this lawsuit to get rid of TABOR, our Colorado's Taxpayers Bill of Rights, which is an amendment to the Constitution, that is greedy, my friends. So we have these discussions because we have great sponsors and all of you who support us. So I did want to say thank you to the Harris family for their gold sponsorship of the show. And now we are into hockey playoffs as well. And the Avs lost last night in overtime. But a great place to get together with friends to watch the games is Hooters Restaurants. And they have five locations, Loveland, Aurora, Lone Tree, Westminster, and Colorado Springs. Great specials for lunch and happy hour, Monday through Friday. How I got to know them, it's a really, really important freedom story. You can find that at my website. And again, we have these great sponsors. I know all of them, and they strive for excellence. And the Roger Magnet State Farm Insurance Team wants you to feel safe and well-served, and they will answer your call or text 24 hours a day, because things don't just happen nine to five. And so for that 24-hour peace of mind, give them a call. at 303-795-8855. Like a good neighbor, the Roger Mangan Insurance Team is there.
SPEAKER 06 :
Car thefts, hail storms, and uninsured motorists are presenting unique insurance challenges for everyday hardworking Coloradans. The Roger Mangan State Farm Insurance Team knows that when you need to make an insurance claim, financial strength matters. State Farm consistently receives high marks for the company's financial condition and ability to pay claims. For that peace of mind, to know that you are working with a financially strong company, contact the Roger Mangan team now at 303-795-8855 for a complimentary appointment to assess your insurance coverage. That's 303-795-8855. Like a good neighbor, State Farm is there.
SPEAKER 13 :
That's 303-880-8881. Call now.
SPEAKER 16 :
Focused and wise marketing is essential for your success, especially during tough economic times. If you love The Kim Munson Show, strive for excellence and understand the importance of engaging in the battle of ideas that is raging in America. Then talk with Kim about partnership, sponsorship opportunities. Email Kim at KimMunson.com. Kim focuses on creating relationships with individuals and businesses that are tops in their fields. So they are the trusted experts listeners turn to when looking for products or services. Kim personally endorses each of her sponsors. Again, reach out to Kim at KimMunson.com.
SPEAKER 03 :
And welcome back to the Kim Munson Show. Be sure and check out our website. That is Kim Munson, M-O-N-S-O-N dot com. Sign up for our weekly email newsletter. You can email me at Kim at Kim Munson dot com as well. And it is Tuesday during the legislative session. Every Tuesday, we talk with Kevin Lundberg, former state senator and author of the Lundberg Report. Kevin Lundberg, welcome.
SPEAKER 07 :
Well, thank you. It's great being with you. A little over two weeks left now in the session, so a lot's popping.
SPEAKER 03 :
A lot is happening, and I really encourage people to check out the Lundberg Report. First thing, ear to the ground, we've got a couple of weeks. And as you know, I'm the president of the Colorado Union of Taxpayers. And I tell you, this group has done such amazing work. We have taken positions on 244 bills. which I tell you, it is so much work. It's an amazing group. I want to, again, make sure that I give their names and say thank you. Steve Dorman, Greg Golianski, Russ Haas, Bill Hamill, Rob Knuth, John Nelson, Wendy Warner, Marty Nielsen, Ramey Johnson, Mary Jansen, Dave Evans, Corey Onizorg, Paula Beard, and Ray Beard. This is truly an amazing group of people, Kevin Lundberg, all volunteers that they have spent their weekends working on rating these 244 bills. And so there's a lot of bad stuff out there. I'm hearing that, and so we'd had a lull. We'd done just a few bills over the last few weeks. And these next two weeks, it could be kind of crazy. Do you hear of anything out there that we need to be concerned about? I heard that there might be another gun belt.
SPEAKER 07 :
Really? Well, I hadn't heard that. But it wouldn't surprise me because they've come out with about a dozen bad gun bills thus far. And if I was... You know, it's just unbelievable what they've done there. But I would correct you on one thing, and that is you said it may be crazy. No, that's not correct. It will be crazy. It is. It has been absurdly crazy this entire session. But every session gets crazy in the last couple of weeks for a lot of reasons. One is... Yeah, everybody, this is kind of their last shot at pushing their idea through. And so if they're going to get anything out there, it might happen in the next few days. But in addition to that, there are, I don't know what the count is, but my guess is that there are probably a couple hundred bills still out there that haven't been completely pushed through the system. And now they start thinking in terms of days and hours and minutes on can we get this all done or not? And also, here's another interesting game that's played. There is a three-day rule for the last three days of the session. where some of the limitations that slow the process down are removed so they can move things through quickly. For example, currently, a 24-hour period is required, or that's what it says, but what it really means is you have to go through one calendar day for any committee hearing, to be announced and then held. So they announce it on one day and they can hold it on the next day. Well, they eliminate that so the committees can be called immediately. And that gives the public zero notice that something's going to happen. But in those final three days, they can do that. Well, here's the dirty little secret. they can call these three final three days anytime they want. And sometimes they do. In other words, they'll say they'll pass a resolution that says these are the final three days, but constitutionally they don't have to wrap it up until after 120 days. So they could open the flood gates. You might say on immediate committee hearings any day now. I, I, I hope they don't, but they've played so many other games it wouldn't surprise me at all if they did it tomorrow, even though there are two weeks left, a little more than two weeks at that point. So keep an eye on that. And then here's another thing that at least I observed when we were in the majority in the Senate is about this time we'd take that list of all the bills that are still out there, And we would put it up on a big whiteboard, basically. We'd say, you know, we've got this many bills on this many subjects. And we'd start assigning these bills to various committees. And the committees would have the instructions of get this done and get it done quickly. and there would be kind of a daily triage as things got, you know, knocked off until you got down to the final. Now, I say that's what we, meaning the Republicans, did in the Senate when we were in charge, and I was there for the final four years as a majority leader at first and then one of the Joint Budget Committee members, so I was in the leadership team at that point. I don't think the Democrats always do it that way. Sometimes they end up battling with each other, which is just totally bizarre. But, you know, one leader hates another leader and they don't talk to each other or something. But sometimes they end up with this terrible crush of bills at the very end, because we really had a measured, systematic way of dealing with a whole lot of things all at once. We'll see if they can do that or not. And then one final factor. This is the off election year. Therefore, they can get away with the worst stuff this year. And next year, they'll probably be a little more reserved, thinking we don't want to rile the voters too much. You know, like they're not going to run these gun bills next year. They're running them this year. And a whole lot of other things. So that's why it's not correct to say it may be crazy. It's correct to say it will be crazy, crazier than it has been.
SPEAKER 03 :
Well, just checking on our Bill Track 50 that we use for Colorado Union of Taxpayers, there is 230 bills scheduled for hearing this week. Now, it could be second readings or a variety of things. That is a crush of bills. As I was talking to one of our legislators, they said, we're not representing the people. This is a bill mill down there. Mark, coming in on the text line, 720-605-0647. Mark is always saying, Kim, make sure that you let people know who the sponsors are of these bills. So we had selected four new bills for Cut Engaged, which is super, super easy, that you can make your voices heard. And when you go to Cut Engaged, we have all of the primary sponsors listed. of those bills are noted there. So, for example, this Senate Bill 25-257, modifying the general fund transfers for the state highway fund, has two Republicans and two Democrats on it. We are a no recommendation on this particular bill, but we have the sponsors there, and so you'll see who they are, but I'll just mention those on this particular bill, Jeff Bridges, Barbara Kirkmeyer, Shannon Bird, and Rick Taggart. So all that information is there. Now, let me point something out.
SPEAKER 07 :
Yeah, let me point something out for that bill in particular. That's coming from the Joint Budget Committee, and they only sponsor bills where all six of the members will agree to it, and then generally they will have several sponsors. I'm not giving them a pass on that one because I agree that's not a good bill. It's cutting the last place they should cut because they have cut it every year I was down there. They... could not support transportation. Instead, they'd spend it on everything else. And at the end of the day, we'd have lousy roads. I think that's the first responsibility of state government is to defend those elements of the infrastructure that the state is in charge of. And roads is one of them. But understand that unfortunately, that's one subject that they agreed to do, both Republicans and Democrats, is, okay, we've got a cut, so where do we cut? Well, just about first place. They look on the Democrat side is transportation. When I was on the Joint Budget Committee, our main goal was to preserve transportation dollars, if at all possible, and we managed to add a few hundred million dollars in on a short term, but Traditionally, for the last half century that I've been available, you know, been watching the process, the only time transportation got a priority was when Bill Owens was governor, the only, by the way, Republican governor we had at that time period.
SPEAKER 03 :
Okay, I have so much more to talk with you about, but let's go to break. I'm talking with former State Senator Kevin Lundberg. He has such a wealth of information. And check out his website. He does a weekly report, the Lundberg Report. It comes out on Saturdays, and it is so informative, so well done. I'd highly recommend that you check that out. And we get to have all these conversations because of our sponsors. And yesterday, Karen Levine and Lauren Levy were featured guests. And Karen Levine is really the person you want on your side of the table if you are buying a home or selling a home or looking at a new build.
SPEAKER 01 :
Award-winning realtor Karen Levine with RE-MAX Alliance understands the importance of home ownership. Karen Levine works diligently at the local, county, state, and national levels to protect your private property rights. With over 30 years experience as a Colorado realtor, Karen Levine will help you navigate the complicated metro real estate market, whether you are buying your home, selling your home, considering a new build, or exploring investment properties. Kim Monson highly recommends Karen Levine. Call Karen Levine at 877-7516. That's 877-7516 for answers to all your real estate needs.
SPEAKER 20 :
The Second Amendment was established to ensure that all individuals have the right to resist oppression, stand firm against government overreach, and protect our ability to defend ourselves, our families, and our freedoms. Today, that right is under relentless attack in Colorado. Colorado's premier grassroots Second Amendment organization, the Second Syndicate, is on the front lines, fighting to preserve and protect your constitutional rights. We expose the most pressing threats to the Second Amendment and provide the education, resources, and tools to stay informed,
SPEAKER 14 :
You'd like to get in touch with one of the sponsors of The Kim Monson Show, but you can't remember their phone contact or website information. Find a full list of advertising partners on Kim's website, kimmonson.com. That's Kim, M-O-N-S-O-N dot com.
SPEAKER 03 :
And welcome back to The Kim Munson Show. Be sure and check out our website. That is Kim Munson, M-O-N-S-O-N dot com. Sign up for our weekly email newsletter. You can email me at Kim at Kim Munson dot com as well. Thank you to all of you who support us. We're an independent voice and we search for truth and clarity by looking at these issues through the lens of freedom versus force, force versus freedom. If something's a good idea, you should not have to force people to do it. And do check out ColoradoTaxpayer.org. That's the website for the Colorado Union of Taxpayers. We've got four bills that we just added in that you can let the sponsors and your particular legislator know that on these cases, oppose them. And that is Senate Bill 25257. the general fund transfers to regarding the state highway fund next one kevin lundberg i think you're going to love this one as well that is house bill 1215 the redistribution of the lottery fund remember how um that was uh it was sold to us one way and uh again uh it looks like they're looking under every sofa cushion down there to take money from the the um people of colorado kevin
SPEAKER 07 :
Oh, yeah. That's the way they do that. And, you know, something that occurs all the time, and I was actually on a call yesterday where one person who was watching this said, you know, they avoided a lot of the – we were hearing dire predictions of deep costs because they were, you know, $1.2 billion short in their budget. Well, what they've done – is they've borrowed funds from – or borrowed money from funds that they have control over that were intended for different purposes. And this is going to come home to roost next year and the year following because these funds have a limited amount. And I remember the first year I was down there in 2003 – We had a deep recession. Well, not a deep recession. We had a recession. Okay. And so the revenue was shrinking and the budget was continuing to grow or wanted to. And so we had to find a way to cure that. And the Republicans were in charge. We had a Republican governor and a Republican Senate and House. But It drove me crazy because they just went and borrowed funds from everywhere to try to balance the budget rather than sit down and say, okay, we're short of revenue. And like a business, you would say, where do we cut back? Where do we trim back? Where do we find the efficiency within our system? And instead, they just borrow money from wherever they can find. The most egregious one I could think of, which is kind of a minor one in a sense, was the brand board. The brand board maintains the branding of cattle system here in the state and requires some funds. And there's a fee that's charged for the cattlemen that utilize the brand board services. And that money is used to run the brand board. Well, we stole from the brand board. We took the money away. Or the other one, which was huge, was the unemployment fund. So we took money from the unemployment fund. But the law said that the unemployment fund is run by fees charged to employers. And there was an automatic switch in there that if the employment fund dropped to a certain level, then the fees to the employers went up automatically. And so we levied a tax on employers directly. And that was the Republicans back in 2003. So, yeah, doesn't surprise me at all that they're playing the same games and doing it with gusto because they like to spend a lot of money, your money.
SPEAKER 03 :
Well, and they're getting help from Republicans on that this year. As you mentioned, the Joint Budget Committee, they put their name on it. And the two Republican representatives to the Joint Budget Committee are Representative Rick Taggart and Senator Barbara Kirkmeyer. That is a place where I wish that they would say no. And it's not just these two bills. As I was reviewing bills this week, there's enterprise zones, I guess, or what do you call them, enterprise zones? I think, is that right? Where if something is being funded in an enterprise, that takes that money out of the calculation for the TABOR refund back to you. So they've been playing these games for quite some time.
SPEAKER 07 :
Yeah. And actually, to explain the enterprise, that's an entity that does not – a government entity that does not receive 10% or more of its funding through taxes. So it's essentially run by fees. And because of that, yeah, they'll offload some activity that the state does – and call that an enterprise. And it's, it's an in round around Tabor. Um, and the reason Tabor doesn't control fees is they're supposed to be, um, dollars charged for services rendered directly for some service, you know, like the brand board, like I explained, um, uh, but, but they, they use this as a game, uh, as a very terrible game. And, and actually, uh, they, um, you know, I mean, they play other games with, with, um, Tabor, too, to run around a lot of it. Tabor does still constrain some of government, but not a lot because they do those things.
SPEAKER 03 :
So let me ask you about something. We haven't talked about this a little going back in history because you have such great institutional knowledge. And speaking of enterprise zones or enterprise companies, Is that what they're called, enterprise zones?
SPEAKER 07 :
Well, okay. Okay. I didn't get into the weeds on that one quite because an enterprise zone can be a geographical area where an enterprise has an interest in. At least that's one way of interpreting that. But an enterprise itself, as I say, is simply a state government-run agency. That's not the right word either because that's a technical one within the state law. But it's an entity within state government that's theoretically run by fees and therefore doesn't have to be limited by the revenues and spending limitations of what Tabor puts in place. Here's a terrible example of it. I mean terrible meaning I think it's a horrible idea that they kicked in. That is they have the road and bridge fee. which is simply a tax for highway construction, but it's called a fee, and you pay it when you register your vehicles because they simply wanted more money and they didn't want to be constrained by what Taylor says.
SPEAKER 03 :
And the other thing about fees, and I think you alluded to this, is now with Tabor, if PBIs are going to increase our taxes, they just have to ask us. It has to go to a vote of the people. We say, okay, you want this for this? Okay, yes, no. But with fees, PBIs can go ahead and raise those really in darkness. We don't know when they're going to do that, and that's another very – sinister thing about, uh, this enterprise trying to get around Tabor and the fact that they can raise those fees, uh, without our permission.
SPEAKER 07 :
Yeah. And, and, and, you know, if you look at the, the, the bottom line numbers on how big the general fund is, which is, uh, those agencies that are, uh, controlled by Tabor essentially, and then the cash funds and, uh, the, uh, the federal funds, um, It has been growing so fast. I mean, I was used to the bottom line on the long bill saying, you know, $18 billion, $20 billion, something like that. Whoa, and now it's $44 billion, and I've only been out for six years. Now, I'd like to ask, how many people make more than double what they did six years ago?
SPEAKER 03 :
Well, the state government does. Not very many. Not very many. So, OK, so next question, again, going back in history, because I made a note last week after we talked that I need to understand Ref C, Referendum C, which that was a timeout on Tabor. And that was, again, Republicans working with Democrats on this. I think Bill Owens was governor at that time. And it kind of reset things, and I thought, I really need to sit down and read this and understand what it's all about. So what's the best way for me and for listeners to do that, to find that and do that?
SPEAKER 07 :
Oh, boy. I used to have that up on my website, but with website changes, because I really did put together, I think, the most comprehensive list of things, because it's a little hard to dig into it. The best I can say is go on a search engine and put Ref C, Referendum C, Colorado, and you'll probably find some things. But it was, you know, 20 plus years ago, somewhere in there, somewhere in there. And Ref C, you see, one of the major components of TABOR is to set the spending cap for the general fund. And that can only go up by a formula of population growth plus inflation growth, which is a reasonable standard for state governments to hold the line. But they didn't like that. So they said, well, we're going to take a timeout and we are going to let it float upwards for five years. And then we will take the highest number within those five years as the new And then we'll grow from there. So they added billions of dollars. And it was it was really totally illegal. I mean, they said, well, we asked the people if we could do it. But but they didn't do it really within the specific constraints of Tabor. And you're right. There were a few Republicans, not too many Republicans. Not very many, but it did include our governor. And I gave him kudos a moment ago for looking after transportation needs. And there was actually a referendum D that he was promoting at the same time, which was a request to go for bonding authority to build more roads. And the people said yes, if I recall. And, you know, so he did it the right way there. But Ref C really was a legal game. You know, they were playing legal gymnastics with the law that could they do it or not do it. And, you know, here we are 20-some years later, and they're trying the same tune. Oh, you know, Tabor still constrains our spending more than we want. One other factor here is there was really only – as I say, a handful of Republicans who backed this. And unfortunately, in the Senate, it was my state senator, and I was in the House, and I became kind of a leading opponent. And my Republican senator from essentially the same areas in Larimer County was the leading advocate and the sponsor in the Senate for that referendum. And it turned into kind of an ugly political fight where Republicans – when we had debates on it, for example, they'd ask me to come and debate the opposition. And my Senate counterpart, Senator Johnson – He would be the proponent. And these, the Democrats, just sat back and smiled because they were all supporting this. And they just called it, you know, kind of an inter-party battle among the Republicans. And surprise, surprise, out of that mix, it passed and it became a part of Colorado's laws.
SPEAKER 03 :
Oh, Kevin, I just love the fact that you have all of this information. And we're not going to get, I don't think, to a lot of the Lundberg reports. I'd recommend that people check that out in these next two weeks because one of our listeners had this great question. And it's Mark. He said, now, please. give the bill sponsors. And I'm trying to remember to do that when I mentioned a bill. But he's got this excellent question, and that is, who are the actual authors of these bills? And so I'll leave that as our cliffhanger. When we come back, we'll have that discussion with Kevin Lundberg. But did want to mention the USMC Memorial Foundation is having their Second annual golf tournament. It is May 15th, which I can't believe it is right around the corner. And it's out at the Ridge Golf Course in Castle Pines. So great day. If you're a golfer, great round of golf. Meet some great people. Support the USMC Memorial Foundation. What more could you want? More information, usmcmemorialfoundation.org. That's usmcmemorialfoundation.org. And if you have been injured, there are some things that you should do pretty darn quick. And one of those is called John Bozen at Bozen Law.
SPEAKER 18 :
A serious accident or a life-changing injury can leave you with seemingly insurmountable physical, emotional, and financial challenges. How will you be able to afford your medical bills? What if you can't return to work? The attorneys at Bozen Law understand the immense stress you are under and want to help. Bozen Law's attorneys have decades of experience helping people like you navigate some of the most difficult times in their lives. Bozen Law can provide the guidance and support you need to get back on your feet. Call Bozen Law now at 303-999-9999 for a complimentary appointment. That's 303-999-9999.
SPEAKER 17 :
Don't delay. All of Kim's sponsors are an inclusive partnership with Kim and are not affiliated with or in partnership with KLZ or Crawford Broadcasting. If you would like to support the work of The Kim Munson Show and grow your business, contact Kim at her website, kimmunson.com. That's kimmunson, M-O-N-S-O-N dot com.
SPEAKER 02 :
It's late at night, you're winding down with your family, and then you hear something outside. Your heart races. What's your next move? At Franktown Firearms and Colorado CQB, we make sure you're not caught off guard. Our purpose-built 360-degree defensive shoot house puts you in realistic home defense scenarios so you can build the skills to protect what matters most. in our home defense series you'll train with experienced military and law enforcement instructors to handle critical situations with confidence learn to assess threats at your front door clear rooms safely manage entry points and make smart decisions under pressure even in low light conditions because when it's real life there's no time to second guess And with Franktown Firearms located in one of Colorado's lowest tax districts, you'll save money while investing in your safety and your family's future. Be prepared. Be confident. Learn more now at klzradio.com slash Franktown.
SPEAKER 03 :
And welcome back to The Kim Munson Show. Check out our website. That is KimMunson.com. Sign up for our weekly email newsletter. You can email me at Kim at KimMunson.com as well. Thank you to all of you who support us. We're an independent voice. We search for truth and clarity by looking at these issues through the lens of freedom versus force, force versus freedom. If something's a good idea, you shouldn't. have to force people to do it the idea should be able to stand on its own two feet in the battle of ideas and that's why we do this show is so that you can get your brain around these issues and i know so many of you say what are some trusted trusted sources we have so much going on out there so i wanted to mention drew dix's new podcast uh drew dix is a medal of honor recipient one of the co-founders of the center for american values located in pueblo And that website is AmericanValueCenter.org. And they're doing such great work there. But you can find Drew's new podcast there. So check that out. He was actually stationed in Greenland for several years. And he has a super interesting take on this whole conversation on Greenland. So be sure and check that out. That's at AmericanValueCenter.org. But I wanted to mention another trusted source, and that is the Lundberg Report. Former State Senator Kevin Lundberg, his website is KevinLundberg.com. He writes that every Saturday during the legislative session. And actually, Kevin, do you write this each week, all 52 weeks? I always am over during the legislative session, but is it weekly?
SPEAKER 07 :
I've been doing that for quite a few years now. Yeah, yeah, every week. So it's kind of a... you know, a family tradition. And, and, uh, actually I, I make sure that it's published by Saturday morning. So I'm usually writing it late Friday, especially during session time, because I've got to see the, you know, what happened to those bills. And, and so I can't really do my, much of my research until, uh, until the, well, everything is loaded up on, on the state's website. Um, But yeah, it's out there 52 weeks out of the year so far.
SPEAKER 03 :
Well, it really is important.
SPEAKER 07 :
Well, it's a huge task, I'll tell you. But my commendation to cut, because you mentioned all the people who do go through the bills and you said they rated over 200 bills. And that's because some of the bills are like common sense, simple things that really don't have any fiscal impact. But But, you know, and that's because we've got over 600 bills that have been introduced. Now, if you add the resolutions, it's well over 700. But the actual bill count is 635 as of. Three o'clock this morning. Wow.
SPEAKER 03 :
So that brings up the next question. And that is, and Eric, one of our listeners, continues to indicate that the ACLU is very involved as being authors in many of these bills. And so that's the question on the table is who authors these bills? Because these legislators are not talking to constituents and finding out that something from constituents and representing the people. And there's all these different bills. They're not writing them. And they're not even many times coming up with the ideas. What I think is interested parties are shopping these ideas with these legislators. So, you know, how does this work?
SPEAKER 07 :
Well, you describe how it should work ideally, which is you represent the people that sent you, that voted for you. And in talking with them and, you know, other interactions, you come up with these ideas that really represent your district and in some way the state as a whole. And I was one of those foolish legislators who really thought that that's the way it ought to work. And so I brought my ideas to the table that way. Now, when you bring an idea, what that means is you go to legislative legal services and they have a whole stable of attorneys who specialize in various areas of state government. and you say, I'd like to do something concerning education. So they'll assign you one of their attorneys that works on that, who will craft the actual language for the bill, or they'll take what your ideas are, and it could be a complete bill that you wrote, and they'll simply say, well, it's going to fit here in the statutes, and oh, don't forget this is the way we phrase things and the like. So theoretically, that's the way it works. And you do need those those legal eagles down in Ledger Legal to make sure that what comes out as the law is consistent and isn't a hodgepodge of different terminology and different ways of approaching things. So that makes sense. But very often, and I'm afraid to say most often, Bills simply originate because somebody got to a legislator and said, run my bill. And I think there's an appropriate place for that. I mean, I'm an active part of the American Legislative Exchange Council, which has been in business for over 50 years. Actually, it was initially established by some state legislators here in Colorado, but it's a nationwide thing. And they come up with model legislation that goes through a very careful vetting process where they spend about a year figuring out, does everybody agree that this is a good idea here, whatever it is. And I believe that their legislation, their boilerplate bills are – are good ideas, and I encourage legislators to look at what they have on a wide range of topics. And there are other organizations that do the same, but you're quite right. There are some organizations that have really learned how to game the system that way, and it's rather frustrating when they come up because you can always tell who's behind it by who shows up at the committee hearings. you know, Planned Parenthood, if there's a sex education bill, Planned Parenthood is there on the front row talking about what a great idea. Why? Because they are the largest supplier of sex education curriculum to our schools nationwide. You know, it's a, it's, it's usually kind of boils down to who's, you know, follow the money. And, and that's, that's what happens there. Um, And then another big source is the state government itself. And appropriately, they'll say, well, the law is not working in this area, so let's change something. But more often than not, they're just kind of cooking up their own ideas. And believe me, if they get behind it, it's almost a done deal that it's going to go through, and it's going to go through the way they want it to go through. Right. You know, it's going on and on, but our time is almost up.
SPEAKER 03 :
Well, we are. Yeah, this has been so informative, Kevin, and we will have a conversation next week. We've got basically two weeks left in this legislative session. But I think that this is great institutional knowledge for our listeners. So we've got a minute left. How would you like to wrap this up, Kevin Lumberg?
SPEAKER 07 :
Well, first off, you've made reference to my great institutional knowledge over many years. That's a very kind way of saying, Lundberg, you're pretty old, aren't you?
SPEAKER 03 :
No, it isn't.
SPEAKER 07 :
Hopefully the hoary-headed statesman of some sort can share some of this knowledge. And oftentimes what – something that happens all the time down there is – is something that already happened. So it's true. History repeats itself, and you'll get in the same mess if you didn't know how you goofed up the last time. So it is a good idea to keep an eye on what's happening and to remember how the process works and to be actively engaged. And I certainly thank you and your listeners for being the backbone of conservative values here in Colorado.
SPEAKER 03 :
Well, and conservative values means conserving this idea of America, that all men are created equal with these rights from God of life, liberty, and pursuit of happiness. Kevin, have a great week. We'll talk next week. Okay, and our quote for the end of the show is from George Mason. He said, the laws of nature are the laws of God, whose authority can be superseded by no power on earth. And my friends today, be grateful, read great books, think good thoughts, listen to beautiful music, communicate and listen well, live honestly and authentically, strive for high ideals, and like Superman, stand for truth, justice, and the American way. My friends, you are not alone. God bless you. God bless America. And stay tuned for our number two.
SPEAKER 09 :
Talking about freedom
SPEAKER 15 :
The views and opinions expressed on KLZ 560 are those of the speaker, commentators, hosts, their guests, and callers. They are not necessarily the views and opinions of Crawford Broadcasting or KLZ management, employees, associates, or advertisers. KLZ 560 is a Crawford Broadcasting God and country station.
SPEAKER 05 :
It's the Kim Munson Show, analyzing the most important stories.
SPEAKER 03 :
The socialization of transportation, education, energy, housing, and water, what it means is that government controls it through rules and regulations.
SPEAKER 05 :
The latest in politics and world affairs.
SPEAKER 03 :
Under this guise of bipartisanship and nonpartisanship, it's actually tapping down the truth.
SPEAKER 05 :
Today's current opinions and ideas.
SPEAKER 03 :
On an equal field in the battle of ideas, mistruths and misconceptions is getting us into a world of hurt.
SPEAKER 05 :
Is it freedom or is it force? Let's have a conversation.
SPEAKER 03 :
Indeed, let's have a conversation. And welcome to our number two of the Kim Munson Show. Thank you so much for joining us. You each are treasured, you're valued, you have purpose. Today, strive for excellence, take care of your heart, your soul, your mind, and your body, my friends. We were made for this moment in history. And thank you to the team. That's producer Joe, Luke, Rachel, Zach, Echo, Charlie, Mike, Teresa, Amanda, and all the people here at Crawford Broadcasting. and it is tuesday check out the website that is kim munson m-o-n-s-o-n.com while you're there sign up for our weekly email newsletter that way you'll get first look at our upcoming guests for the week as well as our most recent essays that goes out on sundays you can email me at kim kimmunson.com i'm behind on emails i'm working on that i'm working on changing that text lines a little behind on that but i'm getting caught up uh that text line is 720-605-0647 Thank you to all of you who support us. And the show comes to you 6 to 8 a.m. Monday through Friday. The first hour is rebroadcast 1 to 2 in the afternoon, second hour 10 to 11 at night. And that's on all KLZ 560 platforms, which is KLZ 560 AM, 100.7 FM, the KLZ website, the KLZ app. And if you say, Alexa, play KLZ, we come in loud and clear. On the show, we look at these issues through this lens of freedom versus force, force versus freedom. Remember, if something's a good idea, it should stand on its own two legs in the battle of ideas. You shouldn't have to use force to implement it. And that is such an important litmus test as we look at all of this legislation, which go to coloradotaxpayer.org, which is the website of the Colorado Union of Taxpayers. Amazing group of people. We had our board meeting last night and I sitting around the table. I'm just amazed at the wealth of knowledge of these people. And that group is Steve Dorman, Greg Golianski, Russ Haas, Bill Hamill, Rob Knuth, John Nelson, Wendy Warner, Marty Nielsen, Ramey Johnson, Mary Jansen, Dave Evans, Corey Onozorg, Paula Beard, and Ray Beard. And when you see these folks out there, say thank you for the dedication that they have. But to the people of Colorado, but coloradotaxpayer.org, we've selected four new bills that it'll take you five minutes max to get your voice heard to the bill sponsors as well as your legislators. Super easy. We invested money in this to make this happen. Zach did it. And what an amazing job that he did. But the four that we added on that you can have your voice heard. is Senate Bill 257, modify the general fund transfers to the state highway fund. 1215, the redistribution of the lottery fund. 1312, that's that really bad one regarding the transgender extremists that basically if you do not affirm your child's gender confusion, that child protection services could take your child from you. It's crazy right here in Colorado. So make your voices heard on that. I've heard that maybe this one might be in trouble because so many people are making their voices heard on this. So be sure and do that today. And then the last one is regarding Tabor, that lawsuit to basically get rid of Tabor. And Tabor is Colorado's taxpayers' bill of rights. So when I get done with the show, I'm going to make my voices heard on all of those things. So our word of the day is endemic. It's spelled E-N-D-E-M-I-C-K. And your challenge is to use that in a sentence today. So first definition, prevalent in or limited to a particular locality, region, or people. Number two, native to or limited to a certain region. Number three, common in or inherent to an enterprise or situation. And let's see. I would say that tyranny is endemic right now with the Democrats down at the statehouse. And we've got some Republicans that are helping them on some of these things. So we've got to shed light on that. And then. Hi, I'd like to in the last segment at the top of the hour, Bill Federer was talking about this day in history, the Oklahoma land rush. And I want to talk with producer Joe about that in the last segment. So I'm going to make a note on that so I don't forget that. because we've got John Bozen on the line. John Bozen with Bozen Law is on the line. That's easy for me to say. And if you've been injured, you certainly would give them a call. So John Bozen on the line. Welcome.
SPEAKER 12 :
Good morning, Kim. I wasn't sure where you were going with that or if you're jumping in or not, but...
SPEAKER 03 :
I wasn't either. And so if I couldn't figure it out, it'd probably be difficult for you to figure it out. But John, I wanted to talk with you just a little bit. We always say that people should give you a call if they have been involved, if they've been injured. But why would people really need a lawyer if they've been injured?
SPEAKER 12 :
Do we have an hour and a half, Kim?
SPEAKER 03 :
No, but let's try.
SPEAKER 12 :
We'll knock it out in a couple minutes here. Most accidents that people are involved in are due to someone else's negligence. Someone did something, didn't do something. But the party that we deal with on behalf of the injured victim is, by and large, almost always an insurance company. because the person who caused the harm has insurance to cover themselves. So we're dealing with insurance companies and big corporations typically. On the other side, doing everything we can, fighting to make our clients whole to get back some, as much as we can, of what they've lost. And big insurance companies, big corporations, pharmaceuticals, they don't like giving up that money to take care of folks. They're in it for the profits. And insurance companies will do sometimes, I've seen it many times, cross on that line whatever they can to reduce or eliminate their exposure. In other words, they don't want to pay anything. And they're not going to fight. They're not going to do anything that is typically in the best interest of my clients, the injured victim. So folks got to have an experienced, competent client. strategically aggressive attorney on their side, or they're going to get mopped up by the insurance companies and big corporations because they know how this is played, this game, very serious game. Without that, folks don't know what they don't know. And, again, it's the insurance company and it's big corporations, big pharma. It's their job to save their money, to preserve it for their shareholders. So we balance the scales. Good, competent, strategically aggressive attorney is going to tip that scale in favor of the injured victim. So that's the number one biggest reason. Many others. I mean, lawyers at my firm, we're going to do everything we can to make sure that our client is getting appropriate and necessary medical care. And I tell folks this on the front end all the time. The money's going to help you, but your health is more important than anything. And so if you're not treating with the right doctors, doctors familiar with the type of injury that you have, and you don't have a good recovery, that money's not going to mean a whole lot to you. Our health is more important than anything. And I can go on and on and on, but, you know, cases, you know, there's liability. We have to prove that the other side did something or didn't do something that caused the harm. And then we've got damages that we need to prove for our clients. What have they lost? The medical bills they've incurred, the money that they may not have been able to make because they couldn't work. And then you throw on pain and suffering, loss of enjoyment of life. And you've got to prove those things to get your client compensated. You've got to prove it with the insurance carrier. And if they don't get it, then you've got to prove it before a jury.
SPEAKER 03 :
And that's why I think that it's just so important that people contact you at Bozen Law because you've got an amazing team and you're not one of those law firms that are just in it to try to settle and then get a portion of that settlement. You at Bozen Law really care about your clients. And I think and I I love that, what you just said. Now I've lost it already, but it was something about balancing the scales at Bowes & Law. I love the fact that you do that, that you represent the people. And so if people have been injured, what's the best number for people to reach you?
SPEAKER 12 :
Well, time is always of the essence. I don't want people to wait. And if your listeners out there know someone that's been involved in an accident, family, friend, neighbor, coworker, hopefully not themselves, but the best thing to do is call right away. Early advice is huge, and that number to call is 303-999-9999.
SPEAKER 03 :
Again, that number for Bozen Law is 303-999-9999. And that call, that's complimentary. And you'll take information and then determine if it looks like something that you could work together on. And, again, that number is 303-999-9999. John Bozen, thank you for these weekly updates. We'll talk to you next week.
SPEAKER 12 :
Thank you, Kim. I look forward to it. Have a great rest of your show.
SPEAKER 03 :
And I work with amazing people like John Bozen. And another great team is the Roger Mangan Insurance Team. And if you are up at night, there's so many things that can keep us up at night, but your insurance coverage should not be one of those things. So for a complimentary appointment to know where you are with your insurance coverage, give the Roger Mangan State Farm Insurance Team a call at 303-795-8855. Like a good neighbor, the Roger Mangan Team is there.
SPEAKER 06 :
It seems like we are getting squeezed everywhere. Inflation, high taxes, at the gas pump. Where can you save money? Well, when you bundle your insurance coverage with the Roger Mangan State Farm Insurance team, you may save money on your insurance premiums. The Roger Mangan team will help you with a personalized plan to cover all your insurance needs. for your home, auto, boat, and renter's coverage. For a complimentary appointment, call the Roger Mangan team now at 303-795-8855. That number again is 303-795-8855. Like a good neighbor, the Roger Mangan team is there.
SPEAKER 01 :
Property is surely a right of mankind as real as liberty, wrote founding father John Adams. RE-MAX realtor Karen Levine has been working diligently at the local, county, state, and national levels to protect property rights and home ownership. Karen has navigated the often challenging Colorado metro real estate market for years. That's 303-877-7516. That's 303-877-7516.
SPEAKER 14 :
You'd like to get in touch with one of the sponsors of The Kim Monson Show, but you can't remember their phone contact or website information. Find a full list of advertising partners on Kim's website, kimmonson.com. That's Kim, M-O-N-S-O-N dot com.
SPEAKER 03 :
And welcome back to The Kim Munson Show. Be sure to check out our website. That is Kim Munson, M-O-N-S-O-N.com. Sign up for our weekly email newsletter. You can email me at Kim at KimMunson.com as well. Thank you to all of you who support us. We are an independent voice on an independent station searching for truth and clarity by looking at these issues through this lens of freedom versus force, force versus freedom. If something's a good idea, you shouldn't have to force people to do it. And I wanted to say thank you to the Harris family for their goal sponsorship of the show. They've been sponsors of the show. I'm starting my seventh year solo broadcasting. They've been with me since almost the beginning. And so really do appreciate them. I am thrilled to have a new guest on the line with me. And that is Ryan Morgan. And he is a reporter with the Epoch Times, which I think is one of the most informative publications out there at this time. I am a subscriber to the Epoch Times. And he focuses on military and foreign things. And so I wanted to talk with him about a piece that he recently published regarding Iran. So Ryan Morgan, welcome to the show.
SPEAKER 04 :
Well, thanks for having me, Kim. It's great to be here.
SPEAKER 03 :
Well, it's good to have you. And this is a really interesting piece that was published at the Epoch Times. Let's see, I think it was, was it the 19th? And you said the U.S. Special Presidential Envoy, Steve Wyckoff, arrived in Rome on the 19th for a second round of talks with the Iranian foreign minister regarding this whole nuclear thing with Iran. So what should people know about this, Ryan Morgan?
SPEAKER 04 :
Yeah, you know, it's been interesting the last couple weeks to watch kind of how this has played out. So obviously, I want to say kind of mid to late March, President Donald Trump sort of came out and very unambiguously started saying, you know, Iran cannot have a nuclear weapon. He not so subtly says, hey, if they don't come to the table and make a deal, there could be some bombing involved. There will be very heavy bombing. I think the implications of that are pretty clear. Then in the next couple of weeks, we start to see the Iranians come to the table. They're a little bit more agreeable to talking with Trump or to the Trump administration. And what we've seen is that things appear to be moving kind of on a week-by-week basis. So that first meeting was in Oman, kind of on a little more Iran-friendly turf. But Steve Witkoff goes and meets on April 12th. The very next week, seven days later, there they are in Rome. And out of this second meeting, they have planned a third for exactly a week later back in Oman. So they're moving along these talks at a relatively rapid clip when you're comparing them to, say, what's going on with the discussions regarding Ukraine, for example. And so... I would just say that the Iranians at least are paying lip service to the idea that they are willing to make some kind of deal, and they're calling it trust-building measures with the United States with regard to limiting their nuclear program to not include nuclear weapons. So it seems very clear that there is – some discussion to avoid having nuclear weapons. The question now is what happens with everything else in Iran's nuclear program? And I can go on or I can kind of let you get back in here if you want. Yeah.
SPEAKER 03 :
Well, and I think that's an important question. But regarding the special envoy, Steve Wyckoff, what's his creds? Tell us a little bit about him.
SPEAKER 04 :
He has kind of an interesting background because he is, if I'm not mistaken, he's primarily a real estate guy, much like Trump himself. But there is something to be said about the validity of having a businessman as a peacemaker, as a negotiator. Business background, you're dealing with negotiations of one type or another. So he doesn't necessarily have a really deep foreign policy background that's obvious, but he knows how to make deals, and he knows how to kind of understand what the other side's terms are and find the middle ground.
SPEAKER 03 :
Interesting. Well, let's set this up, though. In the Biden administration, so Obama, Biden, Iran got cash. It set us up, I think, to get us to a very dangerous position that we're at right now, Ryan Morgan.
SPEAKER 04 :
Yeah. So you're talking about the I can't remember exactly.
SPEAKER 03 :
Weren't there the plane loads of cash in the Obama administration that was given to Iran and then Biden walked back what Trump had done and Trump won? And so it seems like the Democrats have been very supportive of Iran, which has put us in a very dangerous position in the world.
SPEAKER 04 :
Yeah, to clarify the... Those pallets of cash – so I guess the 2015 Iran nuclear deal included sanctions relief for Iran and obviously the Obama administration. you know, negotiated the U.S. entry into that deal. Part of that deal was to, like I said, unfreeze some of the sanctions and release back to Iran some frozen assets. So that, I mean, that is where that money's coming from. That's, I guess, been the point of sending that money back to Iran. Yeah, Trump kind of said from the get-go in his first administration that, you know, he thought the Iran deal was a It was a horrible deal, and he certainly – I think it was 2018 he pulled the U.S. back out of the deal, and with that came the reapplication of sanctions against Iran. That money was frozen up again. There was an effort – During Biden's administration these last four years where he tried to kind of warm things back up with Iran, get us back into the 2015 nuclear deal, but that never really went anywhere, though there was some kind of moderate sanctions relief up until summer of 2023 and then obviously in October of 2023. There was the Hamas attack across Israel, and everyone's kind of figuring out what was the Iranian connection to that attack, and, okay, we need to lock it back down again and be much more aggressive and watchful of what Iran is doing in the region with its destabilizing activities.
SPEAKER 03 :
So, Ryan Morgan, it's great that they are at the table, but I don't think the Iranians can be trusted regarding their nuclear capabilities. Of course, I'm a radio host in the West, in Colorado, so what do I know about that? What do you think?
SPEAKER 04 :
Yeah, you know, first off, I would say trust is a two-way street, and I The last sit-down that – or I guess the first sit-down that Steve Witkoff had with his Iranian counterpart, Abbas Aragshi – I don't know if I'm saying his name right. But their first sit-down was, I believe, the first real face-to-face interaction between a U.S. representative and an Iranian representative officially – since the Obama administration. So there's a lot of atrophy in our ability to have conversations with the Iranians. And it's like you said, there's a lot of trust to... There's a trust issue to overcome where we know that the Iranians have involvement in destabilizing activities around the region. So we... We have to spend some time figuring out how we can come to trust each other. There is an alleged Iranian plot to have Trump assassinated and take it for what it's worth. Trump is willing to now try and meet them at the negotiating table. So Trump is certainly able to kind of put things in the past and try and turn over a new leaf. Now it's just kind of a question of whether or not there's anything the Iranians can give to convince Trump. That's going to be the real tough question. The Iranians say that their nuclear program is peaceful in nature. And last month, Director of National Intelligence Tulsi Gabbard said, we currently assess that the Iranians are not pursuing a nuclear weapon. However, they do have highly enriched uranium. I believe it's about 600 pounds of 60% enriched uranium, which you need 90% enriched uranium for a nuclear weapon. So they're well on their way to get there. And one of these sticking points of the talks has been, okay, everyone's saying there's not going to be an Iranian nuclear weapon, but what do we make of all of this highly enriched uranium, which the Iranians don't necessarily seem willing to want to give up and give back up? So that's kind of where the breakdown in trust is, and that's what we're going to have to keep watching for. In the next couple weeks, I'll be interested to see what comes of this third round of talks here coming up this Saturday to see if there's any movement on that. That's where I would keep my eye focused.
SPEAKER 03 :
So, Ryan Morgan, it seems like I remember headlines when there were supposed to be inspectors regarding these nuclear facilities in Iran. And that they weren't really honest about letting the inspectors come in. And again, that was a number of years ago. What's your thoughts on that?
SPEAKER 04 :
Yeah, you know, the... The International Atomic Energy Association, the UN's nuclear watchdog, has been able to get into some nuclear facilities. I think the question is, are they able to see the full picture? We do know with the picture that they are seeing that the Iranians are stockpiling highly enriched uranium. So if we consider what we can see through the IAEA, we have to ask ourselves then, what are the Iranians hiding that the IAEA can't see? So that is a tricky question. A valuable component of these discussions with Iran might include kind of a more robust discussion inspection policy where we can get kind of a better understanding of what the Iranians are doing. That would certainly go a long way towards actually building trust between the Iranians and the United States and the Trump administration. That's, yeah, yeah, that's kind of my piece on that.
SPEAKER 03 :
Okay, super interesting. I'm talking with Ryan Morgan. He's a reporter for the Epoch Times, and he focuses on military and foreign affairs, so he's got a lot to write about. We're going to continue the discussion when we come back, but we get to have all these discussions because of our great sponsors, and very pleased that a new sponsor is the Second Syndicate.
SPEAKER 20 :
The Second Amendment was established to ensure that all individuals have the right to resist oppression, stand firm against government overreach, and protect our ability to defend ourselves, our families, and our freedoms. Today, that right is under relentless attack in Colorado. Colorado's premier grassroots Second Amendment organization, the Second Syndicate, is on the front lines, fighting to preserve and protect your constitutional rights. We expose the most pressing threats to the Second Amendment and provide the education, resources, and tools to stay informed, empowered, and prepared. Join the movement. Protect your rights. Visit thesecondsyndicate.com. That's thesecondsyndicate.com, where the second is first.
SPEAKER 18 :
You don't have to suffer the consequences of someone else's negligence on your own. The attorneys at Bowes & Law have extensive experience handling all types of personal injury and wrongful death claims involving motor vehicle accidents, medical malpractice, defective products, catastrophic injuries, and more. Bowes & Law also assists clients with matters related to workers' compensation. and Social Security Disability, SSD. Bowes & Law takes pride in truly getting to know their clients and genuinely cares about helping you seek the justice you deserve. Call Bowes & Law at 303-999-9999 for a complimentary consultation. That number is 303-999-9999. Call Bowes & Law now.
SPEAKER 17 :
All of Kim's sponsors are an inclusive partnership with Kim and are not affiliated with or in partnership with KLZ or Crawford Broadcasting. If you would like to support the work of The Kim Munson Show and grow your business, contact Kim at her website, kimmunson.com. That's kimmunson, M-O-N-S-O-N dot com.
SPEAKER 03 :
And welcome back to The Kim Munson Show. Check out our website. That is Kim Munson, M-O-N-S-O-N.com. Sign up for our weekly email newsletter. You can email me at Kim at KimMunson.com as well. Thank you to all of you who support us. We're an independent voice and we search for truth and clarity by looking at these issues through the lens of freedom versus force, force versus freedom. If something's a good idea, you shouldn't have to force people to do it. And do check out the website for the Center for American Values. The center is located in Pueblo, and they do several things. They have these beautiful portraits of valor of over 160 of our Medal of Honor recipients, great educational programs, and then they are fabulous on values speaker series, which I was down there last week, emceeing the event with Norma Donlon. And you can find that presentation at AmericanValuesCenter.org. And then co-founder of the center, Drew Dix, Medal of Honor recipient, has started a new podcast, Words from the Silo. And so be sure and check that out at AmericanValueCenter.org. And pleased to have on the line with me, Ryan Morgan. He is a reporter with the Epoch Times, focuses on military and foreign affairs. And he has just recently published a piece regarding India and India. steel tariffs and so ryan you're probably you're probably you have a front row seat to all this tariff stuff and the market is up it's down right now it's up yesterday i think it was down uh so what's your thoughts on all this tariff stuff and and this uh 12 tariff on steel in india so talk to us a little bit about that
SPEAKER 04 :
Yeah, yeah. I'll start off by saying I'm a little far afield when I talk about tariffs. I'm no great economist, so I'll just kind of throw that caveat in. But yeah, what we saw yesterday was the Indian government levied a 12% tariff on I believe it was five categories of steel products. And, I mean, this is very clearly oriented towards keeping India competitive with China. China is by far and away the most productive steel-producing nation. If I have my numbers right from the World Steel Association, back in January said that China produced a billion metric tons annually. of the approximately 1.8 billion tons of steel that were put out in all of 2024. So they're over half of all steel products. At a distant second is India with about 149 million metric tons. So you can do the math. That's a pretty big gap. So over the last few years, China has been rolling out tons of steel, and they're a powerhouse. And with all that heavy production comes a pretty cheap product. Supply and demand, they've got a lot of supply. So the cost there is pretty low, and they're putting that out on the international market. And if you're a nation like India, I believe their main – Their main source of steel imports, because India does import some steel from around the world, is South Korea. But China is still a pretty competitive exporter of steel to India. So the Indians are looking at this situation and saying, how do we keep our domestic industry in that valuable number two spot? And so, yeah, they've applied this 12% tariff, and it is kind of limited, five categories, as I said, and it's supposed to last for the next 200 days. So it's kind of a stopgap measure, and I guess we'll kind of have to see where they go from there about six months out. They could extend this. They could say we've gotten what we need to out of it. But, yeah, that's the situation there. with India's steel tariff program.
SPEAKER 03 :
Well, and where does the United States fall regarding steel production globally?
SPEAKER 04 :
Yeah, that's a great question. So Japan is the third largest producer, 84 million metric tons as of 2024. And the United States is in the fourth place, 79.5 million. So we are competitive. We're We're up there in the top five, but obviously still well south of where China is at.
SPEAKER 03 :
Well, and I've always been a free trade girl. So initially when Trump had talked about tariffs, I was concerned about it because I like free trade. But one of – well, economist Brian Dmitrovich and I had a conversation on air, and then I have a good friend, Helen Raleigh. who immigrated from China, and she writes extensively. And both of them said that tariffs really have been one of the tools, one of the few tools that Trump had in his toolbox to try to get people to the table to talk about things, and that we don't have a really – free and honest trade with China because they don't have the labor costs that we have. In some cases, they maybe even use, we've seen on different things, the Uyghurs with slave labor. And so they don't have the labor costs, which then they can come in and undercut our market. And then we lose that manufacturing here in America. Of course, Trump is saying to bring that manufacturing back. And so he's using this to I want to get to free and honest trade. But that can't happen when you have a government such as China subsidizing an industry and then dumping that product into other economies. Ryan, so this is super interesting to watch what Trump's doing on this.
SPEAKER 04 :
Yeah. Yeah, you know, if I could throw one point in about, you know, about industry and about industrial competition with China, you know, even if you take the, you know, the factor of, you know, China applying unfair trade practices, even if you take that out of the equation, when you look at this from a strategic situation, you know, Say we're to have a friendly relationship with China. It doesn't really concern us that they're producing goods that we like to buy. But the question is, what happens when you are entirely reliant on China for major strategic resources? You know, if ever there comes a day where you're in direct conflict, China, and all of your supply chains are running through that country, yeah, you're going to have to do a reroute in the middle of a fight, and you're going to be scrambling for resources at the worst possible time. So that's another just kind of way I would look at that. Now, back to your question about how Trump has used tariffs as a negotiating tactic. Yeah, I think you're right in saying that from a free trade perspective, tariffs aren't necessarily a – they're not necessarily something that people want. And we saw quite a bit of consternation over the last couple months with what's going to happen once Trump applies these tariffs around the world. We did see that he, at the beginning of this month, put out a pretty extensive tariff schedule for basically the rest of the world, which countries getting which tariffs. And that ran for about a week before Trump decided to put a 90-day pause on just about all those tariffs except for China. So those are still – Those are still in place. Those are still kind of moving ahead. But what we've seen is that there have been a lot of countries that have come forward and said, okay, you know, we can start to play ball. We can discuss how to even out our playing field when it comes to trade with the United States. I'm having a little bit of trouble with recall here, but I believe it was a couple weeks ago that the – I want to say it's – I won't say her name because I don't remember it off the top of my head, but the European Union commissioner came along and said we're willing to discuss – a rapprochement with the U.S. when it comes to trade, where we're going to kind of equalize some of the playing field here and kind of get to more of a trade parity. And I think that is in part due to the economic threat that Trump has put out there with this massive tariff schedule. So as far as a negotiating issue, tactic goes, I think Trump has demonstrated that tariffs can be useful for starting a discussion, even if they're not a preferable thing to actually have applied.
SPEAKER 03 :
Well, and Ryan Morgan, when you mentioned the pressers that Trump was doing regarding these tariffs, he had this poster board, and he had all these different countries and what the U.S. was going to charge those tariffs. But he had also – I thought this was brilliant. He had listed what they are charging – on tariffs on our products going into their country. And I think there's a lot of media that has not been honest about that. I think Americans have thought, oh, well, they're not charging any tariffs on us. And Trump has realized for years that this is not fair. And so I was trying to get some information. I wanted to put something on X about that. So I was looking for that photo. And interestingly enough, I found the photo by Newsweek, and they had Trump holding that poster, but they had cut off all of that portion about the percentage of tariffs that they were charging on our tariffs. And I thought, this is so dishonest from a media standpoint. So I guess that's where I can say I so appreciate the Epoch Times, because I think that there is this goal to really report the news. And of course, opinion pieces are opinion pieces. But I really – I thought that that was so dishonest from a journalistic standpoint of Newsweek on that, Ryan.
SPEAKER 04 :
Yeah, you know, I don't want to comment on the editorial decisions that other publications make, but there are plenty I disagree with. If I can take – kind of the opportunity now. I would just like to highlight some great work by some of my colleagues, Jacob Berg and Savannah Holsey-Poynter. They both put out together a really great chart, just kind of laying out the whole tariff schedule. And yeah, we try and give as much context as possible to help our readers understand the decision-making process. These things aren't happening in a vacuum. History didn't start the moment that Trump spoke about a topic. These things have been going on for a while. Trump has been talking for a while about his concerns about trade imbalances and tariffs. So yeah, this didn't come from nowhere. And Trump has been working on this for several years.
SPEAKER 03 :
Well, and Ryan Morgan, I have to say class act. Regarding my comments regarding Newsweek, very classy of you to be able to deflect that and just focus on what you do over at the Epoch Times. So classy thing to do on that, Ryan Morgan. Thank you. This has been super interesting, and I would recommend that people check out what you're doing over at the Epoch Times. That's Ryan Morgan. What's your final thought that you'd like to leave with our listeners today, Ryan?
SPEAKER 04 :
Yeah, stay tuned. I would say first off, stay tuned. I'll be watching closely with the developments, discussions with Iran and Iran. My focus is trying to understand, like I said, the full context of the story, and we'll try and get as much depth as we can with that information. And yeah, we're trying to provide our readers with kind of the actionable information that they need to understand the world. And we hope to do a good job. We're not always perfect, but we do our best.
SPEAKER 03 :
Well, and striving for excellence, doing your best is the first step on all this. And as we do on the show here, we search for truth and clarity. So I appreciate the great work that you're doing. Love to have you back. So we'll have to make that happen again.
SPEAKER 04 :
It was my pleasure. Thank you so much for having me.
SPEAKER 03 :
Absolutely. That's Ryan Morgan. You can find him at the Epic Times. And as you know, we're an independent voice on an independent station. We're independent because of all of your support and great sponsors like Lauren Levy. So for anything mortgages, reach out to Lauren.
SPEAKER 13 :
The current level of interest rates is causing challenges and creating opportunities. For nearly 20 years, mortgage specialist with Polygon Financial Group, Loren Levy, has helped individuals realize their hopes and dreams of homeownership, fund kids' educations through second mortgages, and access capital by utilizing reverse mortgages. Loren's not constrained to work with just one lender. Because he works with many different lenders, Loren offers you choices for your individual mortgage needs. Knowledge is power and preparation leads to success. Call Lauren Levy at 303-880-8881 so that you are prepared for the opportunities in the mortgage market. That's Lauren Levy at 303-880-8881. Focused and wise marketing.
SPEAKER 16 :
essential for your success especially during tough economic times if you love the Kim Munson show strive for excellence and understand the importance of engaging in the battle of ideas that is raging in America then talk with Kim about partnership sponsorship opportunities email Kim at Kim Munson com Kim focuses on creating relationships with individuals and businesses that are tops in their fields. So they are the trusted experts listeners turn to when looking for products or services. Kim personally endorses each of her sponsors. Again, reach out to Kim at KimMunson.com.
SPEAKER 02 :
It's late at night, you're winding down with your family, and then you hear something outside. Your heart races. What's your next move? At Franktown Firearms and Colorado CQB, we make sure you're not caught off guard. Our purpose-built 360-degree defensive shoot house puts you in realistic home defense scenarios, so you can build the skills to protect what matters most. In our home defense series, you'll train with experienced military and law enforcement instructors to handle critical situations with confidence. Learn to assess threats at your front door, clear rooms safely, manage entry points, and make smart decisions under pressure, even in low light conditions. Because when it's real life, there's no time to second guess. And with Franktown Firearms located in one of Colorado's lowest tax districts, you'll save money while investing in your safety and your family's future. Be prepared. Be confident. Learn more now at klzradio.com slash franktown.
SPEAKER 03 :
And welcome back to The Kim Munson Show. Be sure and check out our website. That's Kim Munson, M-O-N-S-O-N dot com. Sign up for our weekly email newsletter. You can email me at Kim at Kim Munson dot com as well. Thank you to all of you who support us. We're an independent voice and we search for truth and clarity by looking at these issues through the lens of freedom versus force, force versus freedom. If something's a good idea, you should not have to force people to do it. And May 15th will be a great event for the USMC Memorial Foundation. It is their second annual golf tournament out at the Ridge Golf Course in Castle Rock. And so if you're a golfer, what a great, great day. You're going to get to play a great course, meet some great people, support the foundation. You can get more information about all that and get signed up at usmcmemorialfoundation.org, usmcmemorialfoundation.org. And you can text me at 720-605-0647. I do want to hear from you. And Producer Joe, at the top of the hour, we played the American Minute by Bill Fetter. And he said, on this day in history, I think it was 1839, a gunshot started the Oklahoma land rush. And you grew up in Oklahoma. And so during the break, you told me something so cool that they do in Oklahoma. So share that with our listeners.
SPEAKER 19 :
Yes, thank you, Kim. So they do like a mock land run pretty much every year.
SPEAKER 03 :
Okay, hey, Joe, let me stop you for just a minute. Volume at least coming through my earphones as you're a little light.
SPEAKER 19 :
They brought in Native Americans, and they just taught us kind of the way it used to be, and it was very, very, very neat.
SPEAKER 03 :
I think that is so cool that they would do that with school children. That is just so neat. And so I wanted to share that. And, again, I've never really been to Oklahoma, and I would like to do that. I hear that Tulsa is really a great city. And so one of these days I need to do that. Anyway, super interesting, and I did want to hear from all of you, so I wanted to get through some of these text messages. Mark said regarding these tariffs, buy your new TV now that those prices might be going up. And then let's see here. This is from Eric. He said that the cash that was sent to Iran was during the Obama administration. Now, I know that those that supported that cash going to Iran – have said that that was their money and he was just giving it back but we i don't think we should be funding terrorists which is one of the things that i think that they've done is they've funded terrorists throughout throughout the the the globe and so this is so interesting that trump is getting everybody to the negotiating table on that and then let's see here uh So this is from Susan. She said, if I were Iran, I'd probably hang on to my nuclear material, too, because they watched what happened with Qaddafi and other countries. So, yeah, this whole trust thing. It is so interesting regarding these negotiations, but to have a country that supports terrorism and is supporting the annihilation of Israel, it's probably important that we try to make sure that they don't get nuclear weapons. So I appreciate what Trump is doing. on this, getting to the negotiating table. And so let's see, several other things that I wanted to mention is right here on the local level. And I thought this was so interesting because we hear about these mountain towns who basically have been, I think, gouging tourists, charging more for taxes regarding short-term rentals, and have just really, I think, been gouging tourists. And so I thought this was an interesting headline, and this is from CBS Colorado. It says, Breckenridge tourism takes an unexpected dip in Colorado's mountains amid general economy concerns. And it goes on to say that there were rumblings from local Summit County residents in Colorado's high country that it felt like it was especially quiet this spring season in regard to visitors. And that feeling has been justified because the Breckenridge Tourism Office has its latest data on this. And it says, looking at the past winter, they were down about 12% in guest nights for spring break, for example. And then looking at the winter overall, they think that that is down as well. And so I think there's a lot going on. But, gosh, to take a family skiing is so expensive. And I'm wondering if maybe they're also pricing themselves out of that particular market, then all of the taxes and the fees to go to – Colorado's mountain towns, I think that we're starting to see that play out a bit. So I thought that that was a really important headline that we need to be watching. And so the key here and the conversation that we've had with With Kevin Lundberg, is government on the local, the county and the state level? What happens is these electeds get into these offices and they forget that they're supposed to be representatives of the people. And the Thomas Jefferson or the quote about Thomas Jefferson yesterday from Andrew Napolitano says, That so many presidents have thought, and he said every president except Jefferson thinks that their job is to keep Americans safe, which, yes, that is important. National defense is certainly important. But bottom line is to keep Americans free. And so one of the ways is to keep government in its proper box, its proper role. And when you look all in at taxes and fees at the local, county, state level and national level, I bet that they're taking at least half of the production of the things that we produce, the work that we do. And that's not the way it's supposed to be. But please have on the line with me. We haven't heard from him. I hear from him on the text regularly, but haven't heard him on the line. And that is Eric of Manning's Famous Burritos. Eric, welcome. What's on your radar?
SPEAKER 08 :
Hi, Kim. You know, it bugged me very, very much. So when Greg Lopez was on your show, I think it was last week or a week and a half ago.
SPEAKER 03 :
Uh-huh.
SPEAKER 08 :
Then he went on to another show after that. And I'm going to just tell you, it was Jeff Hunt asked him how he rated Polis. And Greg had the audacity to rate him with a C instead of an F minus. Yeah, that made me hot as fish grease.
SPEAKER 1 :
And
SPEAKER 03 :
Anyway, I'm not laughing at the fact that you were a hottest fish grease, but every time you say that it gets touches my funny bone.
SPEAKER 08 :
So anyway, OK, so it's with me when Greg had the chance to give him a minus. And I text into that show and I said, well, now Scott Bottoms has my vote because of what Greg said about, you know. And I think Scott Bottoms, to assure to be the next governor, should run on no property taxes, period. Just like the governor in Florida, DeSantis. It's that simple. It's ours. I mean, it's yours in our land. There should be no property taxes, Kim. That would surely put Scott Bottoms in the governor's office.
SPEAKER 03 :
Well, I will talk to Greg Lopez about that. And to your point regarding Scott Bottoms, he has thrown his hat in the ring for governor as well as Mark Baisley on the Republican side. They are – I think all of them are fine, fine men, and I'm really excited about the fact that they've thrown their hat in the ring on that. And, yeah, I would give Jared Polis not an F minus. I'd give him a zero, Eric.
SPEAKER 08 :
Well, that's worse. I'll give him one, too. I'm right there with you, my dear. Much love. God bless. Thank you.
SPEAKER 03 :
Thank you. And Jared Polis is no libertarian, and nothing that is happening down at the Statehouse doesn't happen without his input and him knowing what's going on and his support. And so we've got to reclaim Colorado, and we're working on that. So I really appreciate all of you listening. and appreciate all of your support. And we work really diligently to put together informative shows for you so that you can engage in this battle of ideas out there with your friends and your family and your colleagues because America was founded on an idea, and we are in a big battle of ideas right now. And this is our 1775 moment. regarding these and so i love this quote from george mason he said the laws of nature are the laws of god whose authority can be superseded by no power on earth so today my friends be grateful read great books think good thoughts listen to beautiful music communicate and listen well live honestly and authentically and strive for high ideals because like superman stand for truth justice and the american way my friends you are not alone God bless you. God bless America. And we'll talk tomorrow.
SPEAKER 09 :
Talking about.
SPEAKER 15 :
The views and opinions expressed on KLZ 560 are those of the speaker, commentators, hosts, their guests, and callers. They are not necessarily the views and opinions of Crawford Broadcasting or KLZ management, employees, associates, or advertisers. KLZ 560 is a Crawford Broadcasting God and country station.
Navigating life's complexities can often seem daunting, but Rick Hughes provides remarkable insight into how biblical principles can serve as a guiding light. This episode unpacks the concept of personal and impersonal love as powerful tools for personal growth and spiritual fortitude. Through discussions about the unconditional love of God and the implications of suffering, Rick invites listeners to embrace these truths and apply them with faith and understanding. With this compelling study, find inspiration and motivation to align more closely with divine wisdom.
SPEAKER 01 :
Welcome to the Flatline with your host, Rick Hughes. For the next 30 minutes, you'll be inspired, motivated, educated, but never manipulated. Now, your host, Rick Hughes.
SPEAKER 02 :
Good morning and welcome to the Flatline. I'm your host, Rick Hughes, and for the next few minutes, please stay with me. It won't be long, only about 30 minutes. Motivation, inspiration, education... And we always do it without any type of manipulation because we're not trying to con you. We're not trying to solicit money. We're not trying to sell you anything. We're just trying to give you some accurate information. Hopefully information that will help you verify as well as identify God's unique plan for your life. If we can do that, then you can orient and adjust to the plan if you'd like to do so. It's your life. You have to make your decisions. You're only going to get one shot at it. And remember, bad decisions limit future options. The worst decision you could ever make in your entire life is to reject Christ as your personal Savior. Because you don't leave God any alternative if you do that, you'd be forcing him to condemn you to the lake of fire. And that's not what God intended. He didn't intend you to go to the lake of fire. He sent his only beloved son to take your place on the cross and die for your sins and pay the penalty for your sins and for my sins. And so you have to make a decision. And that decision is, is Christ who he says he is? That's the single greatest decision you could ever make, to believe in the Lord Jesus Christ. So don't ever forget that. This show will talk about a lot of information from the Bible, but primarily we want you to come to know Christ as your Savior and have a confidence that you have eternal life. So if you ever have a question about that, you can always go to our website, rickhughesministries.org. That's rickhughesministries.org. Contact us through the website. We'll be glad to send you some information, free books that we've written. That will clear these things up and help you to understand it in the most personal way that we can do. Okay? Well, thank you for listening. Thank you for giving me a few moments of your time. Today, if you are a first-time listener, please be aware of something. What I'm trying to do with a few shows recently is explain how we came up with the name FLOTLINE. F-L-O-T, FLOTLINE. It's not FLIGHTLINE like an airplane, and it's not FLATLINE like in the hospital with no heartbeat. FLOTLINE. And this name is actually a military term for what we call the forward line of troops, F-L-O-T. Now that flat line refers to ten fundamental biblical doctrines which are called problem-solving devices. And if you learn these ten problem-solving devices and use them, then you will find that adversity and circumstances don't have to be controlling your thinking or your life. In the past few shows, I think we've done three so far, we've dealt with the first five problem-solving devices. We've dealt with the word rebound, which is the word for covering your sins, confessing your sins. Then when we all sin, we have a sin nature, we're going to sin. If a man says he has no sin, he's a liar, and the truth is not in him, the Bible says. And when we sin, we fail, we break fellowship with God. And the term that my pastor came up with years ago was rebound as a way to recover, like to bounce back. You recover from sin by confessing your sin to God. Therefore, 1 John 1, 9 tells us how to do that, confess our sin to God. If we confess our sin, he's faithful and just to forgive us and purify us from all wrongdoing. Anytime you sin, personal sins include mental attitude sins, sins of the tongue, even overt sins, you must rebound or else you're going to let your sin nature control your life and you're going to quench and grieve the Holy Spirit. So we covered rebound, we've covered the filling of the Holy Spirit and how that helps you overcome the energy of the flesh because you have a war going on inside of you. The Bible says the flesh wars against the spirit and the spirit wars against the flesh. These are contrary one to the other, so there is a battle. And so the filling of the Holy Spirit helps you win that battle. Then we talked about the faith rest drill, how to stand on the promises of God, how to have a relaxed mental attitude, how to take it easy under those circumstances. Then we talked about grace orientation, and that's orienting your life to God's grace, but primarily his saving grace and then his living grace, even dying grace. and surpassing grace. And we talked about doctrinal orientation as a problem-solving device, or orienting your life to the Scriptures, the importance of the Word of God. So the scriptures tell us that our number one priority obviously is for us to love God. That's always our number one priority, to love God. Deuteronomy chapter six verse five in the Old Testament says this, you shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, with all your soul, and with all your strength. That's a challenge for you as well as it was for them. Moses went on to tell us these words in Deuteronomy seven verse nine. Therefore know that the Lord your God, he is God. He is the faithful God who keeps the covenant and mercy for a thousand generations with those who love him and keep his mandates. That's what the Bible says. You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, Deuteronomy 6, 5, with all your soul. with all your strength, and if you love God, he will keep his word. If you keep his commandments, he'll bless you for generations and generations. That's the conditional. That verse guarantees us that God is faithful. Listen again. He is God, the faithful God, who keeps covenant and mercy for a thousand generations with those who love him and keep his mandate. So we got two types of love. He loves you and he wants you to love him. But he also wants you to obey him, keep his mandates. And that verse guarantees you that God is faithful. He will do what he promises to do. But it does include the challenge for you to be faithful as well, to keep his mandates. So our love for God must be reciprocal. That means it goes both ways. 1 John 4, 19 says, we love him, that's God, because he, that's God, first loved us. So his love was demonstrated by sending his anointed son, our own Lord Jesus Christ, to pay for the sins of mankind. You know the verse as well as I do, John 3, 16. God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten son, so that whoever believes in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. There is a demonstration of God's love. God so loved the world. And of course, our job is to reciprocate that love, 1 John 4, 19. We love him because he first loved us. So God loves us and his only begotten son to pay for our sin. Now the question is, do you love God? I know you say you do, but we're going to talk about that this morning. Do you love God? Personal love for God is a tremendous problem-solving device. This statement was made by Jesus. I'm about to read it to you. But the statement that I just read in John 3.16 was made by Jesus when he was speaking to Nicodemus, the Pharisee who approached him under the cover of darkness for fear of people finding out he was talking to Jesus. And he was trying to understand exactly who he was. John wrote these words. Listen to 1 John 4, 9, and 10. By this, the love of God, there it is, was manifested. In our case, that's for you and me, because God has sent his unique son into the world in order that, or for the purpose that, through him we might live. By this, divine love exists, not because we have loved God, but because he loved us and sent his son to be a propitiation for our sins. So the love started with God loving you, and it responds with you loving him. So here's what's amazing. Prior to you accepting Christ as your savior, God's love for you was based on his total character, not yours. His character, not yours. You know as well as I know, and me included, we were jerks. We were just pitiful. And God loved us in spite of who we were, and he didn't love us based on who we were. He loved us based on who he was. that's impersonal it's not it's not our love it was his love this divine love that god had for us was impersonal it wasn't based on who i was and what i was doing it was based on who he is and what he was doing so once you've made the decision to receive christ and hope you'll do that then his love for you becomes personal because the righteousness of Christ is credited to your account. Listen to 2 Corinthians 5.21. For he made him who knew no sin, that's Christ, to be sin for us so that we might become the righteousness of God in him. That's the only way we can have any fellowship with God. We must have equal righteousness, and we'll call that plus R. God has plus R. We have minus R. The Bible says there are none that are righteous, no, not one. So how could we ever have a relationship with God if he's plus R and we're minus R? Well, it's through the Lord Jesus Christ. On the cross, he took our sins and when you come to the cross, he gives you his righteousness. So once you make the decision to believe in Christ and receive Christ as your savior, then you become family. And so listen to 1 John 3, 1. Behold what manner of love the Father has bestowed on us that we should be called the children of God. That's my question for you today. Are you a child of God? Have you believed in the Lord Jesus Christ and received him as your Savior? It's not going forward in the church. It's not going backwards in the church. It's not going up in the church, going down in the church. It's faith alone in Christ alone. Listen to the Bible again. For by grace are you saved through faith. It's a gift of God, not of works, lest any man should brag about it. The Lord Jesus Christ never gave a come forward invitation. The Lord Jesus Christ never asked anybody to jump through any hoops. He just said, believe in me. I'm the one that God sent. Do you believe that? And they did. The disciples believed it and followed him. So that's the wonderful thing about it. You and I, when we accept Christ as our Savior, we become the children of God. Now it's a different love. Now it's not an impersonal love. It's not God loving me based on the basis of who he is. Now he's loving me based on the basis of who I am because I'm a member of the royal family of God. Now love is virtue-driven. So how can you love and trust somebody that you don't even understand? That's a good question. If you say you love God, do you understand God? Let me give you a few principles my pastor taught me years ago. God is limitless. He's infinite, limitless. He's eternal and he's invisible. You probably know those things. You and I are finite and we're temporal and we are visible. We're not invisible, we're visible. So the question is, how can our finite minds come to know the infinities of the eternal God who created us? How can we do that? And secondly, We claim to love God, but God is beyond comprehension in the function of our limited mentality. What do you think about God? What do you know about God? We as humans lack the cognitive ability to see and to talk with God face to face. We can't do that. We can observe what he created, but we cannot see him. And in Romans 1.20, the Bible says, for since the creation of the world... His invisible attributes are clearly being seen. So I mean, it doesn't take a genius to look around and say that something created this stuff, and that something is God the Father himself. So in Romans 1.20 again, for since the creation of the world, his invisible attributes are clearly being seen. and understood, seen and understood by the things that are made, that's you and I, even his eternal power and Godhead, so that we, they, that would be you and I, are without excuse. Nobody ever has an excuse to say I didn't have a chance to know God. Every human being on this planet has an opportunity to know God if he wants to. And if he wants to know God and wants to have a personal relationship with God, God will send a missionary or someone with the word to give him the gospel so that he can be invited into the family of God and believe in the Lord Jesus Christ and receive him as a savior. So there's no excuses for anyone to say, well, I never had an opportunity to know God. Yes, you did. The invisible things of the creation of this world make it possible for you. So point three, God is infinite. God is eternal life. So God is unending and unchanging. His life is unending. and he never changes. And a significant part of God's life is God's love. And this love is part of the essence of being God. In Psalm 136, verse 26, give thanks to the God of heaven for his loyal love endures forever. I added that word forever. His loyal love endures. So God is not going to abandon you. God's not going to forsake you. He loved you before you came to Christ and he will love you after you get in Christ. He loves you. There's no doubt about that. He loved you and he made provision for you and he will provide for you, point four, because God's love is perfect and absolute righteousness and integrity. So this means that his divine love can never be prejudice, his divine love can never be unfair, or in any way discriminatory at all. God loves all equally, every person equally. Every person on this planet, he loves them equally. Now point five, personal love for God the Father is the first adult problem-solving device. And it's necessary to have this problem-solving device deployed on the flat line of your soul in order to pass providential preventative suffering. What is that? You remember Paul's thorn in the flesh when he asked God to take it away and God said, no, I'm not gonna do it? Paul prayed three times for God to take it away and God said, my grace is sufficient. you are going to experience suffering in your life. You have to go through providential preventative suffering in order to grow, to break your arrogance, to get you to depend on the Lord. And so this is what's important for you. Personal love for God the Father, it must be understood, and you must have it. And you must never turn on God because something bad happened in your life, and you thank God through you under the bus. God has never thrown you under the bus. He never would do that. You may walk away from him. He will not walk away from you. In 1 Peter 5, 10, the Bible says, but may the God of all grace, who called us to his eternal glory through Jesus Christ, After you have suffered for a while, perfect, establish, and strengthen, and settle you. After you've suffered for a while. That's providential preventative suffering. We go through that. That's what all Christians have to go through that to learn how to depend on the Lord. I mean, we live in the devil's world. We're going to go through suffering, which is a good thing. Not suffering for discipline. That's a bad thing. But suffering for blessing. So point seven. Capacity for loving God the Father does not come from emotional streaks of gratitude. You know, it's not you getting on a mountaintop and seeing the sun peak up over the valleys and saying, oh, I love God, look at this. This personal love for God comes from the mechanics of the spiritual life. It's your capacity to love God based on your knowledge of God through the word rather than based on your emotions. Now you may get emotional about it, and that's okay, but that's not the strength of your love. The strength of your love comes from the word when you understand him. Because I'm telling you, you cannot love somebody you don't understand. It's impossible to do. So personal love for God is what motivates obedience and trust. So once you know and understand him, then you will trust him and you will appreciate him. In 1 John 5, 3, for this is the love of God that we keep his mandates, and his mandates are not a burden. Many individuals claim they love God, but they don't understand God, nor do they obey God. Listen to Jeremiah 9, 24. Let him who glories glory in this, that he understands and knows me, that I am the Lord exercising loving kindness and judgment and righteousness in the earth. These are the things I delight in, says the Lord. If you want a glory in something, he wants you to understand and know me. I'm telling you it's possible for you not to understand the God you claim you know. That's where you have to learn the scriptures. You have to learn the words. You have to understand who and what God is and who and what God does. So personal love for God is demonstrated by you then having another problem-solving device called impersonal love for other people. Because if you claim that you love God, but you hate some other people, you're kidding yourself. That's not true. Because the Bible says in 1 John 4 20, if someone says I love God, but he hates his brother, he's a liar. For he who does not love his brother whom he has seen, how can he love God whom he has not seen? All the hatred in people's hearts. Hatred because of their political leaning or hatred because of their family members or hatred whatever reason. You say you love God and you hate some race of individuals, you're lying. God doesn't hate anybody. And if you're going to understand that, if you're going to understand how God's love works, you have to understand you're not going to be hating anybody either. Christ died for everybody, including you and me, and we were jerks just like the rest of the world. So, personal love for God must be demonstrated by you and I having impersonal love for people that we normally might want to hate. This impersonal love is a problem-solving device. We call it problem-solving device number eight. Problem-solving device number seven was your personal love for God. So problem-solving device number eight is impersonal love for others. This particular problem-solving device gives you the ability to love even the weird, obnoxious jerk who's your neighbor. Maybe he has some sort of OPD. You don't know what an OPD is. It's called an obnoxious personality disorder. And maybe you got a neighbor like that. And maybe there's someone you work with like that. When you have personal love for God, you will have impersonal love for others. So how do you love a weird, obnoxious jerk? Well, you use the filling of the Holy Spirit. Problem-solving device number two. The Bible tells you the fruit of the Spirit is love. There it is right there, Galatians 5.22. And you will understand that Christ died for everyone that you and I despise. then we might be able to relax and not react every time that individual comes around. You have to understand that we can't live like that. So listen to John 13, 34. A new commandment I give to you, that you love one another, uh-oh, just as I loved you, uh-oh, that you also love one another, And this is how people will know you're my disciples, if you have love for one for another. So these are the words of our Savior, the Lord Jesus Christ. I loved you with impersonal love. He loved you before you loved him. That was his impersonal love for you. And then once you got saved, he loved you as a member of the royal family. So keep that in mind. You have personal love for God the Father. You must have that. And then you have impersonal love for other members of the planet Earth, people that you might not want to like. And this impersonal love that I'm talking of, listen to this, a new commandment, John 13, 34, a new mandate. This is not a request, it is an order. The moment that you react with anger, the moment you react with disgust towards anybody, you are sinning. And do not forget what a jerk you were before God saved you. So this impersonal love that we're talking about is a love that's based on your essence, on your character, on your fidelity, not theirs. You are loving them the same way that God loved you. He loved you based on his character, not yours. It's not impossible to do. It's very possible to do by means of the filling of the Holy Spirit. and by means of doctrinal orientation. So if you're filled with the Holy Spirit, you can exercise impersonal love towards even the most obnoxious person you know. That means you don't get your hackles all up when they come around, you don't start to vibrate when you see them. I mean, there are people that just may set you off if you look at them. If they do, you haven't conquered this yet. You've got to understand this is an individual that Christ died for and you don't have any excuse or any reason to hate him or to be disgusted every time you see him because your love must be based on your character, not their character. It's a tremendous importance in the Bible placed on impersonal love throughout the whole scriptures. Listen to this, Ephesians 4.32. Be kind to one another, tenderhearted, forgiving one another, even as God and Christ forgave you. That's impersonal love. Sometimes the toughest person to love may be your spouse. Maybe as a husband you get angry at your wife. Impersonal love gives you the ability to forgive others than lashing out in bitterness. You can forgive or you can get mad. One key thing about impersonal love is that you never have to fall into the bitterness trap. When a family member disappoints you, you just turn on impersonal love and you'll be able to respond with forgiveness rather than to react with bitterness. So you're gonna have to learn how to do that. That's what mature Christian life does. So contentment and tranquility are the byproducts of this impersonal love. But remember this, in order for impersonal love to work, you must be filled with the Holy Spirit, problem-solving device number two, or else your frustrations will quickly return after you cool off. Does that help you understand how this works now? Personal love for God is your motivational virtue, and impersonal love is your functional virtue. These are two of the tremendous problem-solving devices found in the Scripture. I hope you're understanding that, and I hope you'll learn that, and I hope you'll apply that into your life. Now these are seven and eight in the problem-solving devices, We still have to review the next two, which is sharing the happiness of God and occupation with Christ. And then we'll have a complete understanding of why we call our show The Flat Line. If you'd like to have more information on this, please let me know. We've got a book available free of charge called Christian Problem Solving that explains all this in detail. I thank you for listening this morning. Thank you for dropping by to pay attention. And I hope you will apply this information into your life. Until next week, this is your host, Rick Hughes, saying thank you for listening to The Flatline.
SPEAKER 01 :
Thank you for listening to The Floodline with your host, Rick Hughes. If you'd like to contact Rick, please write to him at P.O. Box 100, Cropwell, Alabama, 35054, or online at www.rickhughesministries.org.
HE IS RISEN! Haven’t forgotten that, have you? Just because we celebrated Easter and the Easter message of resurrection even though virtual, Sunday, April 20, I just can’t let you and me ever forget that. It’s not just April 20, it’s every day of 12 MONTHS.
HE is the only man who ever triumphed over death and the grave, none before Him and none since. THE ONLY ONE! That resurrection, that bodily resurrection, that ascension, that VERIFIED – WITNESSED resurrection and ascension is crucial, pivotal, revolutionary, life changing, essential and indispensable to the belief of every Christian. Morning, noon and night, every day of all 365, the living, resurrected Christ LIVES within the hearts of every Christian believer. And every believer, the Christ has promised, will live with Him now, in this life, and in the life WITH HIM to come. Incredible, is it not?
Wonderful, glorious, jubilant, to every believer. But to the natural man:
FOOLISHNESS, Absolute and altogether foolishness. It is absolutely ridiculous, says a natural man, an atheist or agnostic, that a mere human being, a carpenter from Nazareth no less, who came from dust and shall return to dust as the scriptures say should rise from the dead. It is just simply not possible. And of course, the myth of the resurrection and the myth of the virgin birth and even for many the myth of the crucifixion all are nothing more than fairytales or as the scriptures say IDLE tales. One can readily see how a natural man, one not drawn by THE HOLY SPIRIT, with eyes closed and ears blocked would scoff, mock and ridicule the EASTER story. If you want, as physicist and astronomer Steven Hawkins would say to believe in a myth of fairytale, that is your right. But the world of science says Hawkins, astronomy and the so called reason and rationality of the mind dismiss a resurrection possibility out of hand. It didn’t happen, says Hawkins. IT CAN’T HAPPEN! And, to that, the Apostle Paul says if in fact the resurrection did not happen, then:
YOUR FAITH IS IN VAIN. Worthless. No better than any other belief system, if even that. If Christ be not risen, any professing believer is not only deceived but becomes him or herself a DECEIVER. Such a believer testifies to a lie, perhaps the biggest lie in all of human history and
consequently, becomes a conspirator in the spread of evil and duplicity. So that, not only is the believer’s faith in vain, but the guilt of the false belief of others lies upon him or her as well. When you or I profess to be Christian, we must therefore champion the resurrection with all of our heart, soul and mind. There can be no doubt. NONE!
Perhaps that is why the nonbeliever dislikes, even hates Christianity and as a consequence the Christians who follow it. Nonbelievers hate the concept of sin. They see no need for forgiveness. They deeply resent the demands of Christianity and the Christ who boldly proclaims:
NO MAN OR WOMAN COMES TO THE FATHER BUT BY ME! Nonbelievers hate that demand, that exclusivity. For it rules out everything else, every other form of belief, in fact every other religion. The crucifixion at Golgotha was merely the death of one man, perhaps even justified. The man who died was a revolutionary, a seditionist, constantly conspiring to get THE PEOPLE to resist and rebel against Rome, the political system, Herod and Pilot on the one hand and the religious authorities, the Pharisees and Sadducees on the other. And he even admitted he came to stir up trouble, to turn one family member against another. He called Herod the Tetrarch of Rome a FOX, cunning, deceiving and lying. The religious establishment despised him because he referred to them over and again as nothing more than hypocrites, or whited sepulchers, empty inside. If any mere man deserved to die, and die in an excruciating way, it was this mirror man Jesus of Nazareth. It was with HIM then as it is now love or hate. You embraced him, believed in him, gave him your all. Or you despised, even hated him nothing more than a rebel or rabble rouser, deluded, even perhaps insane a man in no way to be taken seriously. WITH OR AGAINST. And, written off by Him who again boldly even arrogantly stated:
HE THAT IS NOT WITH ME IS AGAINST ME.
The world, the secularists, the natural men and women accommodate Christianity one weekend, three days each year. From Good Friday through resurrection Sunday, those who believe in fairytales are allowed their celebration. But then comes Monday and it is back to business as usual, criticizing Christianity, attempting at every hand to get Christians, Christian beliefs and Christianity out of the public square, out of the marketplace, confined if at all possible to the four walls of a church. They are determined, these rabid, progressive secularists to curtail or eliminate Christian witness, any form of evangelism for they the enemy have determined that all Christian speech is:
HATE SPEECH.
They are determined to destroy, eliminate any form of testimony, any message which states:
CHRIST IS RISEN Even as they scoff at the message:
UP FROM THE GRAVE HE AROSE WITH THE MIGHTY CHILD O’ER HIS FOES Wherever he was buried, there he remains they say. From the time he was laid in a tomb, everything else, EVERYTHING is nothing more than myth, fairytale, idle tale WHY!
But, natural man, like it or not, he did in fact rise again. HE WAS SEEN first by the women Mary Magdalene, Mary the Mother of James and Salome, and Joanna, and other women. They first saw the empty tomb as they brought spices, the announcement of the resurrection by the angel and these women were the very first EVANGELISTS. They were the first to go and tell. They told Peter, and the disciples, 11 of them and others that at the tomb:
HE IS NOT THERE!
HE IS RISEN! He was there, back for some 40 days before an ascension. He fellowshipped with his disciples and with others. He was there in the flesh for he was hungry and thirsty. He ate and drank and he showed them his nail pierced body and the wounded side where he was pierced. He returned as a man alive and ascended in glory as the eternal Christ. For Christian believers, it is true, all of it. It is fact. It is the foundation of belief. He was alive in the flesh before and after the crucifixion and now lives eternally and forever with his saints to reign. So, the Christian joyfully proclaims Easter Sunday and every other day:
HALLELUJAH
CHRIST AROSE We the believers celebrated the Easter weekend, mourning at the remembrance of the crucifixion on Good Friday, but joyfully and jubilantly celebrated HIS Resurrection on Easter Sunday. That resurrection message was heard that day the world over. The world made time, even priority at least to recognize that incredible message. But now, only mere days later, it is business as usual. Perhaps even we who believe become gradually less open, less aggressive in our testimony, perhaps even unwilling to STAND for what we believe, in Him. Perhaps, gradually, we become more defensive, even withdrawn, unwilling to testify and confront. Perhaps the message of those three potent days becomes a matter of memory, fading, the power of it all dissipating, the courage to fight the fight of faith waning.
So, just a few days after the Easter celebration, it is well for us to celebrate again, and again and again, and every day the fact, the most supreme fact in all of human history that:
HE IS RISEN.
That, as the old hymn says, Christ the Lord is risen today, and every day. Hallelujah! Let us with all our hearts proclaim that message and live that message. It is the greatest fact in human history!
So, from the virgin birth, to a powerful human life symbolist, to the crucifixion offering forgiveness for all mankind through the shed blood, to the resurrection, believe it, proclaim it, and live it every day of the year.
And one more thing. There is yet to come the rapture. This, the crucified and resurrected Christ will return again for his church, for us. Perhaps that day is near and we should be ready. The rapture is yet another fairytale, so says the natural man. But for Christians, it is the ultimate event, the culmination of everything. If you are Christian, if you believe, then the Holy Spirit bears witness, fortifies your belief, encourages you and strengthens you and makes certain that you live joyfully in the faith, hope and love of the Christian journey. Easter was celebrated just a few days ago. But Easter is not a day, it is a way of life. Celebrate morning, noon and night:
HE IS RISEN HALLELUJAH CHRIST THE LORD IS RISEN TODAY AND EVERY DAY!
On The Good News, host Angie Austin leads an enlightening discussion with Debbie Hartung, who explores the intricate layers of mental health and the often hidden realities faced by those battling mental disorders. Debbie offers a candid recount of her life-altering week on a San Francisco psych ward following a suicide attempt, shedding light on the social and personal factors that led her there. Angie and Debbie's conversation unveils the chilling influence of a new age cult that played a pivotal role in Debbie's mental health crisis, emphasizing how even the most intellectual individuals can become prey to exploitation. This episode is not only a testament to resilience but also a call to action against the dehumanizing aspects of psychiatric care systems. Tune in to be inspired by Debbie's message of hope and healing.
SPEAKER 03 :
Let Exclusive Furniture spring clean your sleep with an ultimate sleep reset package. Springtime is the best time to refresh your sleep. Save up to $800 on a sleep reset package. Complete with mattress, mattress protector, pillows, sheets, and an adjustable base for maximum comfort. Plus, 60 months no interest financing. And we'll haul away your old mattress and recycle it for free. Upgrade, refresh, and save.
SPEAKER 04 :
This is Exclusive Furniture, where low prices live.
SPEAKER 03 :
And better sleep begins. Every day. See store for details.
SPEAKER 02 :
Welcome to The Good News with Angie Austin. Now, with The Good News, here's Angie.
SPEAKER 05 :
Hey there, friend. Angie Austin here on The Good News. I'm really excited about today's interview, and I'll explain more in depth in a minute, but I'm fascinated by the topic because of my family history. The book is The Factory of Maladies, and the author, Debbie Hartung, is joining us. Welcome to the program, Debbie.
SPEAKER 06 :
Thank you, Angie. I'm so happy to be here, and I'm really looking forward to chatting with you about my new book this morning.
SPEAKER 05 :
OK, so it talks about, you know, the complexities of mental health, et cetera, family dynamics. And I understand that your aunt was involved with the cult and you basically woke up and you were in a situation that was very foreign to you. So let's just get into your story so that we can talk about the complexities of mental health.
SPEAKER 06 :
Sure. I'd love to just dive right in. Let's do it. OK, so my memoir, The Factory of Maladies, is very interesting. It's a visceral and raw, deeply personal story. And yes, nine years ago, I awoke on a psychiatric ward and I could not remember how I arrived. It was extremely terrifying and I couldn't recall anything. What had happened? I woke up in a freezing room. It was dark and I was on a mattress that smelled and I couldn't grasp how I arrived at that point in my life.
SPEAKER 05 :
So you're freezing cold, which, sorry, that's just like one of my things that's like my top five least favorite things is to be extremely cold and then to be scared in the dark, not know how you got there. It's like really tipping off on like some of the top five things people would be terrified by. And when do you figure out why you're there and what happened? Yeah.
SPEAKER 06 :
So my memory had huge blank spots. And through the week, so my memoir actually is just about this one particular week in my life. And throughout the week, I start having flashbacks and my memory starts to recover and the blank spots start to give way to the reasons in which I the reasons for which I was hospitalized and how complex and intense my suicide attempt was.
SPEAKER 05 :
So as your memories are starting to come back and I know I was reading about you too, Debbie. I mean, you remind me of me, you know, in terms of college educated, you know, you, you know, were a successful person. It wasn't like you're this person on the street that's, you know, we hear about people in mental health units that maybe have used drugs or, you know, done this or that, you know, you, you aren't actually the person I would come to first think of ending up in a psych ward. Right.
SPEAKER 06 :
No, and that's part of the reason I felt compelled to share my story because I experience the stigma of mental health and especially those who have attempted suicide is a particular stigma within a stigma. And I really, I just want to drive home the point that mental health challenges do not discriminate. If you have unbalanced brain chemistry... It really is like any other medical condition. It can happen to the most well-educated, wealthy, happy, healthy individuals. And it can happen at any time. And when it does, in my experience, the spiral happens so quickly from when I was living this great life as a budding artist. I had a stable relationship. I had money in the bank. And I think it was a matter of six months. from that point until I woke up on a psychiatric ward, not knowing how I arrived there.
SPEAKER 05 :
You know, I would say half of my family struggles with mental health issues. And one of my brothers was paranoid schizophrenic. And I think he had seasonal affective disorder. He'd be a little more depressed, you know, in the winter months. And they said bipolar disorder, schizophrenia, and maybe the seasonal affective disorder. But, you know, there were times when he was so loving and caring, and he was an artist as well. And so bright and engaging and funny. And then when he would have these episodes, he was unrecognizable to me. And I remember when I was a little kid, just the first time that he was institutionalized and I was maybe, I think he was 17. So I probably would have been about 11. And I remember going to visit him at the psych ward and they had him strapped down on like a metal table and his ankles and his wrists were bound and it was there was very sterile you know the camera was on him so we're viewing him from outside of the room and there was nothing in there except tile and this metal you know bed with uh wrist and leg constraints and i was like oh my gosh he's 17 years old like How terrifying for him. Like I was terrified. He's standing there watching him. And I was always afraid, like, what if that happened to me? You know, and I have a little brother that also is similar that my older brother was murdered. And my younger brother has been institutionalized on and off for all of his adult life. I haven't seen him. He disappeared about 10 years, but I haven't seen him. for many years and like once a year I'll get a call. There's never a phone number for him because he's too paranoid to have a cell phone because he thinks people are tracking him and this and that. But anyway, to make a long story short, I just was always fascinated by it because if I told people that my brothers had cancer, they'd be like, oh, my goodness i am so sorry your brother's sick but like that they're crazy you know i mean like that oh they're crazy well that's somehow shameful that what is wrong with your family what happened to them how did you guys grow up like why did they turn out that way you know and it's hard to explain because you don't know you can't figure out how they got cancer and i can't figure out why he's a paranoid schizophrenic right so how do you wrap your head around it if if you know, there's, like you said, the stigma. So then do you tell people the truth about what, you know, what their issues are? Or do you pretend they're just in the hospital because, you know, they've got an infection? You know what I mean? Like, why does society make us feel differently about something that's a mental health issue? And when, like you said, it's just like any other illness, it's just something's amiss in your body.
SPEAKER 06 :
Yes, I completely agree with the stigmas. And I also really empathize with you and your family situation and your brothers and I also have paranoid schizophrenia and bipolar disorder in my family as well. So I can really relate to that. And yes, I'm so glad that you're sharing this because I think the more we talk about it, the less power the stigma will hold. And unfortunately, society, it just hasn't quite caught up. to the fact that mental illness, like you said, is an illness. If you broke your leg bicycling, the doctors would, you know, fell off your bicycle. A doctor would, you know, give you compassion and feel sorry for you and elevate your leg and give you painkillers and make you comfortable. However, if something's wrong with your brain chemistry and you're in a crisis, more often than not, if you're in a publicly funded hospital, um, At least in my experience, I was treated almost like a criminal. And it's just not fair. You know, really? Oh, sorry. Sorry.
SPEAKER 05 :
No, I just want people to know about you even like... So I'm just going to read a little bit about your bio. You're a San Francisco-based abstract artist and an author, obviously. We're talking about your book. You studied psychology and visual art at the University of San Francisco. I mean, hello. You graduated with honors. You're an avid traveler, which I completely relate to. It's such a beautiful thing to do. Passionate about the healing powers of the arts, including visual mediums, music, and writing. The Factory of Maladies is your literary debut. And really, this is... something that you felt compelled to write to get rid of some of the stigma and to share your story about this crisis in the psychiatric ward that you're chronicling that week. So what led up to you, that six months that led up to you finding yourself in the psych ward and not knowing how you got there in the freezing cold room, what led up to it as you've uncovered more of that?
SPEAKER 06 :
So the mystery that began to unravel itself was very fractured. My mind was fractured, and there was big, dark, gaping holes. And yet, when things came through and I was able to piece together what had happened, I came to realize that I was associated with a New Age group. And in the beginning, it felt like a spiritual... group that you know have good intentions in the world and um you know my family member that i trusted implicitly sort of indoctrinated me into this group and i had no reason to doubt her or her at this point in my life and the more i came became involved with the group unfortunately the guru shall we say became increasingly greedy and power hungry And he realized that I was in a unique position because I was conveniently off of my medication, which he recommended. Oh, interesting. Yes. I was not seeing a licensed therapist because he said I didn't need one and he could be my therapist. And as I began... the longer I was off of my meds, the more I lost my reasoning and logic skills. And I just believed I trusted him. And he saw my weakness and exploited it. And it quickly cascaded from a group into a cult situation. And he implied that my mental health struggles and my depression and anxiety were karmic related. And he sort of prescribed these spiritual healing tools that would clear my karma and restore me to, you know, balance brain chemistry.
SPEAKER 05 :
You know, it's interesting. I just wanted a side note. I've watched so many, I guess I'm fascinated also by cults and the power they have over people. And you see how highly intelligent people are. fall prey to these charismatic leaders that in so many cases are abusive in numerous ways. And I guess from the outside looking in, I'm just fascinated by the phenomenon. I don't even like to say the word Scientology because they visited me once in Southern California when I was working on a story with them. And I realized there were people at my place of work in Burbank, California, that must have been associated with Scientology to know that I was working on this story. Interestingly enough, Debbie, a young woman that had some mental health issues and she ended up dying. My understanding, and I could be wrong, was that it was because of dehydration and they weren't feeding her. And it happened down in Clearwater, Florida. And so I was hiring producers to investigate what happened to her. And they visited me at my station and they tried to get me to come visit them and brought me a lot of books. And I was the only person there on the weekend. And no one knew that I'd gone. I was single. I had just gone to work on a Sunday to do some extra work. And so someone was following me or notified them that I was there alone. And so I thought to myself, oh, my goodness, like these people. These organizations, shall we call them, and these documentaries that I've been watching on cults, so many highly intelligent people that have a need for something. Maybe it's an acceptance. Maybe it's like you said you trusted. You thought he could help you. He got you off your medication. He's giving you these spiritual remedies to balance your brain chemistry. And you're like, wow. I found someone that really understands me, that's going to help me and I won't have to be on this medication for the rest of my life. This is like nirvana. This is so great for me. And then here you end up in a psych ward and you're, you know, manipulated by this person that you think has your best interest at heart. All right, Debbie, I'm so interested in our conversation that we have to end this segment here in a minute. So I'm going to come back with you. But for people who may not be able to stick around and hear you, more about The Factory of Malady, Seven Days on a San Francisco Psych Ward. Would you give us your contact information so people can find you and your book? I found you on Amazon, by the way.
SPEAKER 06 :
Oh, thank you. And thank you so much for sharing that amazing and extremely sad story. And it really does show how dangerous these types of organizations and pervasive how they are. Yes, I am available through my website. website the factory of maladies.com and you can also purchase my book as we mentioned on amazon bookshop.org and barnes and noble all right let's take a break and we'll come right back with debbie
SPEAKER 01 :
It's that time of year to start cleaning out your closets, basement, and garage by donating to Ark Thrift. With 34 thrift stores and 15 donation centers across the Front Range, you have almost 50 different locations to donate your gently used clothing and items you don't need anymore or are taking up space in your home. Ark will also take large furniture off your hands by scheduling a pickup through the Ark website. Any soft goods you choose to donate, you can just put in bags, while hard goods need to go into boxes. This helps ARC turn their 5,000 weekly donations per store into resellable items immediately. With spring around the corner, donate the spring and Easter clothing that is too small or just sitting in a closet to help out another family. And while you're there, get your Easter decorations and clothing. To schedule your large furniture pickup or to find the nearest ARC Thrift Donation Center or store location near you, go to arcthrift.com.
SPEAKER 03 :
Kimball, Nebraska is listening to the mighty 670 KLT Denver.
SPEAKER 05 :
Hey there, friend. Welcome back to The Good News. I'm really engaged in our conversation with Debbie Hartung, the author of The Factory of Maladies, Seven Days on the San Francisco Psych Ward. So it really chronicles that seven days you're on the psych ward, but we're talking about what led up to it. You had a very trusted family member who was involved in what you found out later to be a cult. And this leader told you, get off your medication for your mental health issues, and I will help lead you into a perfect situation where you'll no longer be dependent on those. And We'll balance your brain chemistry through what the person called like some kind of spiritual healings. So then what happened, Debbie?
SPEAKER 06 :
So, yes. So, yes, that is correct. So as I think, you know, is about six months of this healing and and obviously my brain chemistry did not improve. And I've suffered from major depressive disorder and anxiety my entire life. And I was so low. I was contemplating suicide. And as this guru was acting as my therapist, I confided in him.
SPEAKER 04 :
I know. This seems to be a movie. I'm like, oh, no. What is he going to do with that information? Okay, so you told him that.
SPEAKER 06 :
Right. I know it is very cinematic. So unfortunately, and this is so, so sad, he died. continued to exploit me and put two and two together that I had some money in the bank. My grandparents had lovingly bequeathed me a small inheritance about 20 years before this happened. And because of the family dynamics, he was aware of this. And he encouraged me to take my own life and to leave my small inheritance to him.
SPEAKER 05 :
Okay, that is so evil on so many levels. Like, I can't even imagine, like, other than just stabbing you and robbing you. I mean, it's right up there. Like, he's basically saying, kill yourself and redo your, you know, your will so that you leave all the money to our cult. I mean, unbelievable. And that your trusted family member is kind of backing this and telling him this information so that he knows you have this money available to, quote unquote, him.
SPEAKER 06 :
Right. It's just so even to this day, it's been nine years. It's still incredibly heartbreaking and unbelievable. You know, I just sometimes just don't even believe it really happened. But that is the truth. And it all came to light during an occupational therapy session. And I write about it in my book. And it was, you know, incredibly sad and intense. But once I realized what had happened and how easily it happened and how much shame I felt around, um, my suicide attempt and, and sort of falling for this, um, gurus, you know, for his, um, His prescriptions.
SPEAKER 05 :
And, you know, it's interesting, his prescription for healing guru, but really he's a murderous con artist. You know what I mean? Like here he's respected as a guru, a healing guru, but really he's a murderous con artist. It's unbelievable to me. And that these people can wield so much power over their organization, shall we call the cults.
SPEAKER 06 :
Right, exactly. And I forget that we're just on a call, so you can see my air quotes or my facial expressions. Yes. But yes, I completely agree with you. He was a con artist. And I just, there was just so many emotions and then the shame of having a suicide attempt and the stigma around mental health and the manner in which I was treated in the hospital and how I saw my fellow patients treated. That's why I felt compelled to share my story Because I just want people to know that mental illness is not something to be ashamed of.
SPEAKER 05 :
You know, you had these journal entries that you turned into the book, The Factory of Melodies. And, you know, I'm picturing you in there, like if I was in a similar situation, that I'd want to wear a shirt that says, hey, I know I'm in a psych ward, but I graduated from college with honors. I'm a successful person. You know, I have a highly successful life. You know, I have money in the bank. You know, I'm an artist. Like, you wanted to say, like, hey, like, I'm okay. But then you're all lumped in there in the crazy house, right? And they're all treating you the same. And from my understanding, it was in a rather degrading manner where you lost your identity of who you'd been on the outside.
SPEAKER 06 :
I did, yes. I lost it so intensely that it was really hard to remember who I was. And yet I looked around and... So many of my fellows were Ivy League educated. One was a psychiatric nurse, actually. One was a teacher. These were people that were very successful in the outside world, yet their illness was so intense, they also found themselves in the same situation with me. And there was a moment while I was in the psychiatric ward where There was this lovely nurse and she was very kind hearted and somewhere in my chart, there was information about my history and that I was an artist and a writer. And one night I was trying to sleep, which was virtually impossible, but my eyes were closed and they opened them and she was standing over my bed. And I, of course I was initially terrified and frightened. And she said, you know, be quiet. And she handed me a blank notebook and a miniature golf pencil. And she said, I know you like to write. And she looked at me and it was almost as if she was saying, tell your story. And it was prohibited for any patient to have a sharp object, i.e. a pencil or anything else you can think of, or a notebook. And then she ran out of my room and at that point I it really hit home that this was something I needed to share with the world no matter how uncomfortable it made me feel so you started those journal entries and figured out why you were there how you ended up there yes I did and um I was so discombobulated and um It's inferred in the book, but not said outright. I experienced a brain injury for my suicide attempt. So when I was trying to write, unfortunately, it was just scribbles. I couldn't make my brain and my hands work together at that point. But a month afterwards, I was able to write again. And I just began writing journals and cafes all around San Francisco to heal the PTSD that I experienced from my institutionalization. And I call it putting my pain to paper because it was the ultimate catharsis for me.
SPEAKER 05 :
You talk about family dynamics in the book and then this trusted family member that led you to this new age cult and this con man that manipulated you. What do you think made you in particular vulnerable to the influence of this cult?
SPEAKER 06 :
I think there's, um, quite a few factors. One of them is that I'm inherently a very trusting, optimistic individual, and I always try to see the best in people to a fault. So that, um, was, I was just predisposed, I think to that sort of influence. And, um, also, I had no reason to doubt my family member. She had never given me any reason before. And I honestly thought that she was trying to help me. And I think the third is that because of my depression and anxiety issues and also eating disorders, which I talk about in the book, my childhood wasn't ideal and being depressed. very creative. I didn't quite fit in with my fellow students and I was picked on and made fun of. So I think I always had a longing to be a part of a group. So all of those factors, I think, plus my unbalanced brain chemistry just... It was like, you know, the perfect storm.
SPEAKER 05 :
Yeah, that all makes sense to me. Now, in writing the book and talking about the time in the mental health ward in the institution, how has writing the book impacted your mental health journey?
SPEAKER 06 :
It's impacted it in some wonderful ways. I feel really happy to share. It's really gotten me out of my comfort zone. I... As an artist and writer, I usually worked behind the scenes, especially my writing, helping other people with their manuscripts or writing marketing copy. But this, this time, it was as if the spotlight was on me. And although it brought up anxiety and it was triggering, it's actually pushed me to be an even better version of myself than I was before.
SPEAKER 05 :
Now, in terms of reform and like your experience and the dehumanizing experience of being in a mental health facility, do you, you know, in terms of reform and what that would look like, like kind of what do you want us to know about those facilities and what would be beneficial to the way that they, you know, their treatment of their patients?
SPEAKER 06 :
So I think if I may share an example, I think this example really illustrates the differences between a regular hospital ward and a psychiatric ward. So five years before I was institutionalized, I was at the same hospital with the same health insurance and I had a severe problem with my ovaries and I spent five days in the hospital. And while I was there, I was given warm blankets, extra pillows, round-the-clock care from compassionate and highly educated, trained nurses, very attentive doctors, and I was given morphine for my intense physical pain. And yet, when I found myself in the psychiatric ward and I was being held there against my will, I... I felt as if I was a criminal. I was freezing the entire time. The mattress I slept on was incredibly dirty and thin. And I was given pancakes and pillows. And no one offered me clean scrubs until I discovered them in a closet and requested them. But I was walking around, you know, and I was extremely dirty. And then on top of it to be, you know, as you mentioned, the dehumanizing aspect of it, the staff I encountered, although many of them had good intentions, they were clearly not trained to deal with people in an emotional crisis. And the doctors were overworked and very busy working. And there was really no therapist on call. So, and on the weekends, there's absolutely no programming scheduled. So I just felt, and I could tell that my fellow patients felt the same. We just wandered the halls or we just sat in the day room. And also we weren't allowed outside. So all of those factors just added to the extreme anxiety sense of feeling like you know we were being treated as if we had committed a crime
SPEAKER 05 :
Well, I think your memoir is going to help a lot of people so deeply personal and really, you know, helping to take the stigma off, really opening yourself up to people and to potential criticism. But I think that what it's going to do is make, you know, you and I talking about it, make people more compassionate towards people, you know, dealing with mental health issues, just like they are people dealing with cancer. Again, the book is The Factory of Malady, Seven Days on a San Francisco Road. psych ward. Debbie Hartung, give us your website.
SPEAKER 06 :
It's the factory of maladies.com.
SPEAKER 05 :
Well, thank you so much. A real blessing to have you on the show. Thank you, Debbie.
SPEAKER 06 :
Oh, thank you, Angie. It's been lovely to talk with you. Thanks so much.
SPEAKER 02 :
Thank you for listening to the good news with Angie Austin on AM 670 KLTT.
In a dynamic conversation with expert insights and comedian Theo Vaughn making a guest appearance, the episode delves into the realms of tariffs and American economic strategy. The dialogue explores how tariffs could potentially revitalize U.S. cities by encouraging domestic manufacturing, but also acknowledges the short-term obstacles this might present. With trade deals and long-term economic plans on the table, can this strategy reshape the American economy, or does it risk alienating voters in the short term? Tune in to hear the engaging arguments and form your own opinion.
SPEAKER 09 :
This is Rush to Reason.
SPEAKER 08 :
You are going to shut your damn yapper and listen for a change because I got you pegged, sweetheart. You want to take the easy way out because you're scared. And you're scared because if you try and fail, there's only you to blame. Let me break this down for you. Life is scary. Get used to it. There are no magical fixes.
SPEAKER 09 :
With your host, John Rush.
SPEAKER 19 :
My advice to you is to do what your parents did!
SPEAKER 03 :
Get a job, Turk! You haven't made everybody equal. You've made them the same, and there's a big difference!
SPEAKER 01 :
Let me tell you why you're here. You're here because you know something. What you know you can't explain, but you feel it. You've felt it your entire life, that there's something wrong with the world. You don't know what it is, but it's there. It is this feeling that has brought you to me.
SPEAKER 17 :
Are you crazy? Am I? Or am I so sane that you just blew your mind?
SPEAKER 04 :
It's Rush to Reason with your host, John Rush. Presented by Cub Creek Heating and Air Conditioning.
SPEAKER 05 :
Actually, it's Andy Pate. Party of choice. And welcome to hour number two here on Rush to Reason. I'm Andy Pate filling in for John Rush and joined by Luke Cash. Okay, Luke, quick question for you. Sure. Should 18-year-olds be allowed to carry guns?
SPEAKER 18 :
Oh, Andy. We don't always agree on everything. But I'm also probably the most two-way person to ever exist on this planet. Andy, I believe if you're 18 years old and you can afford an F-16 fighter jet, you should own one. OK, so, yes, an 18 year old should be able to carry a firearm.
SPEAKER 05 :
Yeah, I think so, too. And well, the reason I bring this up is Iowa Governor Kim Reynolds. She signed legislation this past Friday that allow it changes their state law to allow 18 year olds to own and carry handguns. And of course, there are a lot of people who are saying, oh, my gosh, this is going to make life more dangerous. Why will it not?
SPEAKER 18 :
Well, I mean, first of all, I feel like that shouldn't even be a question. It is your right. It is your right to protect yourself. It's a right to own and carry a firearm. The fact that that's up for debate in any capacity is weird. But then additionally... The people who are going out to purchase and go through the effort to carry a firearm are doing so to protect themselves and their loved ones. If you have evil intent and you live in that state now – How likely is it that you're going to go out and try and do something stupid when you know every 18-year-old around every corner is probably packing a little something now? I mean, talk about a good deterrent.
SPEAKER 05 :
Yeah, amongst young people, won't it be the cool thing? I mean, seriously, are you going to be the one who doesn't have one? No, I don't think so. Now, obviously, I totally agree with this. And my reasoning is very simple. If they can go to war for us, why can't they carry it home? Right? You know, it just doesn't make any sense.
SPEAKER 18 :
You can vote and change policy. Yes, you should be able to own a firearm.
SPEAKER 05 :
Yeah. And but now let me play devil's advocate. Obviously, 18, 19 year olds are less mature, more emotional, more given to emotions. Could you say, gee, that's more dangerous to put guns in those hands?
SPEAKER 18 :
I think you could. I think it also depends on how the state system already works, right? I mean, there's background checks that you got to go through. If it's constitutional open carry, then anyone's allowed to open carry. But I know for a lot of states, you still need a permit for concealed carry, which is still a process and you have to go through a class. But I also think sort of, again... Like it's the right of the person, right? And if someone wants to be dumb and make a very stupid decision, then they're going to suffer the consequences of that. But I mean, ultimately, it's your right. It is your right to do it.
SPEAKER 05 :
And, you know, I think it's even more than you're right. I think it is you're right, but what I mean is I believe it brings more safety.
SPEAKER 18 :
Yes.
SPEAKER 05 :
I think you're safer when there are more guns legally owned. I really do. I think you're much safer when people know, wait a minute, if I want to commit mayhem, if I want to hurt people and shoot people up, you know, there are going to be a lot more people shooting back.
SPEAKER 18 :
Yes. There are going to be consequences.
SPEAKER 05 :
Yeah. And that is why where do all the mass shootings happen?
SPEAKER 18 :
That's all the gun-free zones.
SPEAKER 05 :
Yeah, I mean, they're in gun-free zones. Gun-free zones, should they be eliminated altogether in, like, schools and so forth? I don't like schools being gun-free zones. I really don't because there's no one to shoot back. It is fish in a barrel. If you want to go in there, if you want to do a killing, Right? That's the place. And I hate to say that. It's horrible. But that's what they do. They target those areas. They always go to the areas where they don't think somebody will shoot back. So what if people can shoot back everywhere?
SPEAKER 18 :
Yeah, exactly. I'm very 2A. I am not one of those people who think it should be like state-mandated armed teachers. However, comma, I think if a teacher owns a firearm and wants to bring it to the school for their and their class's protection, that should be allowed. I'll tell you this. When the shooting starts, which classroom are all the students running to? That one. The teacher with the gun. Right.
SPEAKER 05 :
That's where they're going to run.
SPEAKER 18 :
Yeah.
SPEAKER 05 :
Oh, I agree. Okay. We agree too much on that one. Let's jump to the next one. I want to listen.
SPEAKER 04 :
Let's get it.
SPEAKER 05 :
Let's start debating. Honestly, you and I are pretty close on most issues. I think so. We really are, you know, because there are some issues, like even immigration, where we are both pretty moderate on it. You know, we believe, you know, no illegal immigration. You should do it legally. But, you know, that doesn't mean you have to have every single person who's here illegally rounded up and taken out. There are some... Some in-betweeners, we can have work visas, we can work something out. Obviously, the dangerous ones should all go. You know, I think there's a lot of middle ground there that's pretty easy to relate on. But I want to look at tariffs.
SPEAKER 18 :
Tariffs. Now this hot topic.
SPEAKER 05 :
Very hot topic. And I thought this was really interesting. We're going to listen to these are a couple of guys. And, you know, one is interviewing Theo Vaughn. Theo Vaughn is a comedian. Comedian. Right. He doesn't say anything comical here. He's just talking on the issue. And he surprises the interviewer because the interviewer thinks that the Trump tariffs are horrible. Theo Vaughn kind of has a different look. Here we go.
SPEAKER 07 :
These tariffs are getting getting out of control.
SPEAKER 06 :
Oh, yeah, the tariffs are getting out of control. All the everyday items that will cost Americans more following Donald Trump's global tariffs. But here's the thing with tariffs. The goal of tariffs is that if it costs more for people to bring their products in, then they'll build them here.
SPEAKER 07 :
Yes, that's part of it, yeah.
SPEAKER 06 :
So it's kind of a long-term play. It's going to take a while.
SPEAKER 07 :
It's going to be bumpy for a while, but that's if it works. So we'll see, but it might take 10 years.
SPEAKER 06 :
Right. If we don't try this, though, then I think it's a wrap.
SPEAKER 07 :
Oh, you think just go for it, bite the belt and go for it.
SPEAKER 06 :
I do, because I think at this point, even from my own perception, we'd probably on this tour, this comedy tour, been probably the top 200 cities like Saz was in America. Maybe, maybe even more than that. And.
SPEAKER 05 :
OK, listen closely to what he's about to say. He's been to 200 cities, the major cities. And listen to what he describes here.
SPEAKER 06 :
A lot of them, there's nothing there. Yes. It's empty downtowns.
SPEAKER 07 :
Oh, yeah. It's boarded up.
SPEAKER 06 :
We're in Amarillo. It's empty downtown. Shreveport, Louisiana was empty downtown. Toledo, Ohio, right? It's getting a little bit better there. And that's just a few. I'm in a lot of places. Montgomery, just empty.
SPEAKER 07 :
Yep.
SPEAKER 06 :
And so you start to be like... There's nothing coming that's gonna make that different, right? And maybe it doesn't matter. Maybe that's just how society changes and evolves. And we just end up with like seven big cities in America and the rest of it is just like rural land where people live and have great lives, but they're not in like a city. And these things...
SPEAKER 05 :
Okay, what do you think of that? Because what he's saying is basically this. Look, if we keep going in the direction we were going, what's happening is all industry and making things is being sent overseas to every other country. They can do it cheaper. And, oh, by the way, they're punishing us with all kinds of tariffs, so we can't send anything there. All right? And the end result of that is we're losing our cities. They're being gutted. And he's seeing it everywhere he goes. What do you think?
SPEAKER 18 :
Yeah. I think it's – I get his point. I get his perspective in that the sort of crux of his argument being we got to try something, right? And I do agree with that, right? You look around and you see the sort of consequences of what the past handful of years have done.
SPEAKER 05 :
The past several decades.
SPEAKER 18 :
Yes, the past several decades. And we don't like it. It's not looking good. I'm still – I still don't think tariffs are the way to go personally.
SPEAKER 05 :
What other leverage, though, could Trump use to get other countries? Because here's the goal. And by the way, I'm not a tariff guy. I'm a free trader. Okay. But if the other countries aren't free trading. What do you do? What other leverage can you do? Because the ultimate goal is obviously to get them to bring down their tariffs so that you can sell your products overseas so that we can have people employed in those inner cities again and bring industry back here to sell to them. And then that way we're selling both ways, not one way.
SPEAKER 18 :
Yeah, and I think it – I don't disagree with the idea in concept, but I think in execution there's a lot of nuance that gets lost.
SPEAKER 05 :
Okay.
SPEAKER 18 :
Where you say, for example, we'll just use a very broad example. Sure. Let's tariff Mexico, right? If you want avocados, right, you're going to have to pay a lot more money if they're coming from Mexico or you just grow the avocados here and you pay less money if they're grown here. But then that also doesn't take into account all of the components that make up the production of that product. Right. Components that can't be sourced by America, right? Say, for example, we tariff Taiwan, right? And we want – we don't – we physically do not have the capacity to make those computer chips here in the United States. We don't have the minerals. We don't have the infrastructure. We don't have the manufacturing.
SPEAKER 05 :
Right.
SPEAKER 18 :
It's –
SPEAKER 05 :
Although Trump's Trump's entire idea is for like Nvidia is going to build here to do just that.
SPEAKER 18 :
And then. What we play, we pay American wages and then the costs still go up because the price to do those things here is still more expensive.
SPEAKER 05 :
The price to do everything is going to be less overseas because they're paying peanuts. Right. So the idea. So so do we therefore become nothing but a purchasing society where everything is made overseas? because it's made cheaper because they're paying slave wages. And then suddenly we don't make anything. We're dependent on the entire world to make everything.
SPEAKER 18 :
Yeah. I mean, I think there's, I think there's a middle ground. I think, okay, what is it?
SPEAKER 05 :
Define it. I agree with you, but just go ahead and define it.
SPEAKER 18 :
I was going to say, uh, on one hand, I mean, obviously there's the ethical implications of purchasing something for cheaper because it's made with slave labor, but that's also just the mechanisms of the society we live in, right? That is the capitalism that exists within the world. That's something you're going to do. Uh, I mean everyone can stop paying for their phones and computer chips and whatever, but we're not. Not enough people will at least.
SPEAKER 05 :
No, no, of course not. And I wouldn't ask that.
SPEAKER 18 :
So I think you could get some manufacturing back here, the things that we have the capacity to make at a reasonable cost, right? If what we make here in the United States is still more expensive than what can be bought overseas, people will still buy what is overseas. They will go towards what's cheaper and the better product, right? But I think, like Theo Vaughn said, it might be a long play, but what if in this long play it hurts for a while? It's a 10-year game is the number he gave. Say in the next three years and some odd months we're hurting because it's a 10-year play, and then a Democrat president comes in, removes all the tariffs, and we suffered that period of time for nothing because the next administration just chops it.
SPEAKER 05 :
Okay, but now wait a minute. Let's take a step back. What if in this next 90 days we have 50-plus countries give us better trade deals than we had before? Suddenly we go from – because here's what happened. Over a number of decades, these tariffs that were on America, they didn't all come at once. They were mounted. Bit by bit, this nation added this, that nation added that, this nation added this, that nation added that. It's not just that labor is cheaper overseas, Luke. It's also that we're paying 200% tariff to send something to a certain country for them to buy it. Another country like Canada could say, we don't want to buy any of your grain or we don't want to buy any of your whatever because we want to protect our industries. And so what you have is... Nation after nation after nation after nation protecting all their industries from us being able to sell things there. So it wasn't just lower wages that did it. Although, by the way, that's a huge factor. But it's also the fact that it's just it's absolutely prohibitive for us to be able to sell anything in their countries because of their tariffs. So what if. And by the way, I do believe this is going to happen. So I'm just going to say Trump is over the next few months going to get us an awful lot of trade deals, which will set the tariff levels on America far lower than they were before. I think that's a guarantee that's going to happen. We are going to have far better tariff arrangements than we had before. So we're going to go from worse to better.
SPEAKER 18 :
I'm still personally in the sit back and see what happens because I'm personally not so certain where I'm seeing the immediate ramification.
SPEAKER 05 :
Several nations have already pledged they're going to lower them to zero. Certainly that's better.
SPEAKER 18 :
I think pledging is nice. I think once I see a material impact on the United States that proves that these tariffs were beneficial, then I'll be able to take my deep breath and give a sigh of relief, right? But until that moment, I'm going to remain pretty tentatively sort of on the sidelines.
SPEAKER 05 :
Well, beneficial, I think it's going to go both ways because there's obviously going to be the inflationary aspect, as you were talking earlier, but also you're going to get the better deals. I think you're going to see both, not one or the other. Yeah, it's very possible. Yeah, and so... Getting back to Theo Vaughn, his point was we couldn't continue on the direction we were going. On that, I would agree. Something had to be done.
SPEAKER 18 :
Yeah, something had to give.
SPEAKER 05 :
And because here's the bottom line. We couldn't continue having the rest of the world charging us ludicrous tariffs for us to send anything anywhere while we were charging next to nothing. I mean, that couldn't continue. And so the answer is we have to get them to lower their tariffs so that our people can make things here. We needed two things, really. We needed lower tariffs on American goods. And secondly, we needed foreign investment back into America to make goods. All right. Well, Trump has certainly gotten the second one. We've already got $5 to $7 trillion pledged that they are going to be building. I mean, they are going to be building here and making products to send overseas and also to send here. That part's happening. Okay. My question is, how do you get other countries to negotiate and lower their tariffs without doing Trump's strategy?
SPEAKER 18 :
Don't know. Couldn't tell you.
SPEAKER 05 :
See, I don't have another strategy to do it. And so I kind of look at it like Theo Vaughn. It had to be done. Now, did it have to be done to this extent, not targeted, all across the board in the exact way it was done? I don't know. I don't know about that. But something like this to where we looked at a number of nations and basically said, look, it's going to be reciprocal. If you're going to charge this ludicrous tariff on us, we're going to charge a tariff on you. Okay? And that will give you incentive because these countries want the American market. We are a consumer society. They want our market. We're the best market in the world. Right. Okay? And so if they realize, oh, my gosh, I'm going to get cut out from the American market, I will lower my tariffs. As a result, is that not beneficial?
SPEAKER 18 :
Yeah. I mean, I think in theory it sounds beneficial. Yeah.
SPEAKER 05 :
Yeah. I mean, I just don't see how else to do it. It is painful. I... I don't know. I see a lot of pain here that's going to happen. I see short-term pain for a long-term gain, but I think the long-term is going to happen. My only concern is this, and I'll be honest. How many American voters don't think long term? They never do. Otherwise, we wouldn't have $38 trillion in debt. Right. Okay, if they thought long term, they wouldn't support the deficit spending. They wouldn't say, give me all kinds of free things and tell me it's good for me, even though I know it's being piled on my kids. They wouldn't do that. So I'm not worried about the strategy per se. I'm worried about... upcoming elections in the midterms and in 2020 2026 and 2028 will americans who have had it so easy but we're losing i mean their cities were being gutted but they had cheaper goods are they going to churn on trump and the republicans and because if they put the democrats in that's that's all she wrote we're going to go right back to where we were going and that was down the sewer You see what I'm saying? It seems like a very painful choice here. I'm not worried about, I know that, what I'm saying is this. I know that if the American public would wait and let Trump hold that leverage until he got better deals, if they would be patient and let that play out and go for the long game, I know it would succeed. And I know in the end we would have far lower tariffs overall. I guarantee it. Now that I know. My question is, will the American public let him do it? Go ahead and answer.
SPEAKER 18 :
I don't know. I don't know. That's also what I was saying, where it's like if this is a 10-year plan and people hurt for the next three years, then we're not going to see the rest of that plan because people said, I hurt, vote it out, change it.
SPEAKER 05 :
True.
SPEAKER 18 :
Everything will have happened for nothing.
SPEAKER 05 :
Absolutely. If they only see pain for three years, they're going to vote out every Republican in sight.
SPEAKER 18 :
Right, which is what I fear, which is why I'm not confident in the plan because I think that's a realistic outcome to expect.
SPEAKER 05 :
I think that the only way this plan works, and I think you would agree on this, and then we'll go to break, is if he gets a bunch of deals in the next three to four months. They need to see a bunch of deals rolling in where they say, wait a minute, our producers were having to pay 50%, 80% tariff to send something to Vietnam, and now it's down to zero or very low. If they see that, I think the American consumer will start turning around, but they need to see a lot of these deals, a lot.
SPEAKER 18 :
Yeah, I'd agree. You need to see a lot.
SPEAKER 05 :
Yeah, otherwise we're in tough shape. Okay, let's take a break. Up next is Paul Leuenberger. Paul is now an insurance broker representing nine great companies all competing for your dollar. To get the best coverage, call Paul at 303-662-0789.
SPEAKER 02 :
Looking for top-notch home, auto, classic car, and business insurance? Look no further than Paul Leuenberger. Paul is now an insurance broker with access to industry leaders like Hartford, Travelers, Safeco, Liberty Mutual, Nationwide, Allstate, AIG, Chubb, Pure, Berkeley, Grundy, and Hagerty. Paul has you covered. Paul is also proud to continue his work with American National for all non-property insurance needs as well. Paul Leuenberger now serves Colorado, Wyoming, Arizona, Nevada, and Texas with more states on the way. Paul's mission is simple, to connect you with the right coverage at the best value. Are you ready to protect what matters most? Call Paul Leuenberger today at 303-662-0789. That's 303-662-0789. Mile High Coin. Do you have a coin or a stamp collection that needs evaluated? Call Dave Gonzalez at Mile High Coin at 720-370-3400.
SPEAKER 04 :
You inherited a coin collection, some beautiful jewelry or sterling flatware, and you're not quite sure who to trust with it. You need Mile High Coin. Owner David Gonzalez has 36 years working in precious metals, knows the market extremely well, and he has over 285 star reviews. Unlike any pawn or coin shop, Mile High Coin prides themselves on building trust first through educating you and through relationship building because he understands this business better than most. David will explain the value of what you have and then discuss all your options so you can decide what's best for you. Mile High Coin is open six days a week by appointment only for your privacy and security. David has a solid, outstanding reputation. And with honesty and transparency above all else, David will always do right by you and your family. Mention you're a KLZ listener and receive a no-charge appraisal when you connect with Mile High Coin by going to klzradio.com.
SPEAKER 12 :
Have you recently received a letter saying that your roof is no longer covered under your insurance due to its age? The insurance industry is changing the face of roof replacements, but we want to ensure that you can keep your roof alive and out of the landfills. With over 4 million square feet treated every week, We here at Roof Savers Colorado strive to maximize the life of your residential or flat roof. Up to 90% of older or damaged roofs do not require a full replacement. Extreme weather conditions here in Colorado lead to the drying, cracking, and granule loss that slowly kills your roof. Dave and his team are here to save it. With the rejuvenation treatment, we can put critical oils that bind your roof together back into the asphalt shingles, adding up to 15 years of life to your existing roof. And it's 100% people, pet, and plant friendly. For your commercial or flat roof needs, we provide a silicone-based coating with up to 95% UV reflectivity and a 50-year ponding warranty. Call the Roof Savers team today to set a free roof inspection at 303-710-6916 or go to roofsaversco.com.
SPEAKER 05 :
putting reason into your afternoon drive this is john rush all right luke hey get just a couple minutes here i want to ask you about tsa right now there is a movement within the trump administration to get rid of tsa at the airports altogether and have it be privatized and so every airport runs its own screening what do you think of this
SPEAKER 18 :
I think it's interesting. I don't know enough about TSA to have a really strong opinion. I guess the one immediate concern that comes to mind is how do you ensure that there's almost like a standardization between airports? Because if each airport is private, then the process for going through that private security is probably going to differ pretty heavily.
SPEAKER 05 :
Yeah, you're going to have safer airports, not very safe airports.
SPEAKER 18 :
Right, so I think it becomes a variety. Like you have super low-income airports who aren't going to foot the bill for the nice stuff. Those airports suddenly become more dangerous. I think TSA exists as a standardization across all airports. There's an expectation going through. You know, if I go to downtown Chicago and I know they paid the cheapest TSA and I want to smuggle a bomb on board. Right.
SPEAKER 05 :
Exactly. But here's the big problem. In 2017, they did covert tests through DHS and TSA agents. They reportedly failed to catch 80 percent of the fakes. And what I mean is fake weapons. DHS sent ringers through airport security with fake weapons. 80 percent got through. Okay. It's pretty bad. Yeah. I mean, that's absolutely terrible. And it's been this way in testing since the agency's founding. The program apparently is not really working. And perhaps nothing, this article here, it says, perhaps nothing reveals the scam more than the fact that for $78, you can buy your way out of the worst part of the experience and sign up for pre-checked. I don't know. Mike Lee really wants this from Utah. I don't like TSA. I can't stand the experience at the airports. But just getting rid of it, are we unleashing hell? And that's what I want you to close with. What do you think?
SPEAKER 18 :
Because that worries me. It does worry me. It worries me as well. I think it's too dangerous to do without a backup plan.
SPEAKER 05 :
What would you do as a backup plan?
SPEAKER 18 :
I'd have some standards. I'd have a phase out. If you wanted to do it, I would phase out TSA and then run in like half TSA, half private security as like a tester to see. Okay, like test markets. Right. And see how it works. Or in some, like say DIA, you get half of those TSA agents out of there and you sort of slowly integrate a fusion of TSA and some private security to see how it goes.
SPEAKER 05 :
Last question. Do they just need to also have a faster process? Because backing up lines in the airports is terrible.
SPEAKER 18 :
Yeah, you need a faster process. You need a more secure process, too. TSA missed, what, 80%? That's outrageous. Surely we can be safer and more efficient.
SPEAKER 05 :
I mean, they're putting us through all that. It's a completely miserable experience to be ineffective.
SPEAKER 18 :
Yeah.
SPEAKER 05 :
I don't get it. All right. Luke, thanks so much. Up next is Veteran Windows and Doors. Hey, they tell you to shop around first, then go to them. You'll see the difference in price and quality. So call Veteran at 303-529-0720.
SPEAKER 19 :
Veteran Windows and Doors knows that other companies only care about getting the sale. Those companies sell you on emotions, pressuring you to sign today to get the best price, but they don't even know about the critical energy codes and ratings of the windows. Dave Bancroft, owner of Veteran Windows and Doors, guarantees he will get you the right windows and doors designed specifically for your home. without the ridiculous sales tactics and needless pressuring. Dave is passionate about educating you so that you can make an informed decision on your timeline and wants to protect you as a consumer. And Dave has seen other companies' prices appear cheaper initially, but once the door you bought doesn't fit or it's the wrong door, they must structurally change the door frame to create the opening. You've lost thousands of dollars. Don't deal with just a sales rep. Work with Dave. For the month of April, when you buy up to three windows, enjoy 35% off. Buy four or more windows, you'll receive 40% off, all with free installation. Just go to klzradio.com.
SPEAKER 15 :
Al Smith of Golden Eagle Financial isn't just another financial advisor with a system to plug into. He's a counselor, an advisor, a relational advocate. Whether you're a lifetime worker with a pension and no plan or a spreadsheet warrior with every penny accounted for, Al meets you where you are and can find ways to improve your situation with no pressure, no obligation, and of course, no charge for a consultation. Al asks questions that other advisors might skip and he puts himself in your shoes. What makes you tick? What motivates you? What brings you peace? And how can your money best serve you? That's why so many KLZ listeners trust Al Smith of Golden Eagle Financial because he tailors every strategy to your comfort with risk. Your lifestyle and your goals, not an AI system. So if you're ready to get intentional with your retirement plan, call Al Smith of Golden Eagle Financial for a no-obligation conversation by going to klzradio.com slash money. Investment advisory services offered through Brookstone Capital Investment LLC, a registered investment advisor. BCM and Golden Eagle Financial Limited are independent of each other. Insurance products and services are not offered through BCM, but are offered and sold through individually licensed and appointed agents.
SPEAKER 17 :
Cub Creek will give you confidence that your HVAC system is not going to fail. Heating and AC systems need checkups every now and again, and they need to be maintained so that they work efficiently. When they fail during extreme weather, it can be a big inconvenience. That's why you should have Rheem Pro Partner Cub Creek come out to see if your HVAC is performing as it should, so you don't wind up needing expensive emergency service. Cub Creek won't upsell you. Their techs don't work on commission, and they will provide creative options so you can make an educated decision for your unique home. They can navigate incentives and rebates with you to save you as much as $4,500 and make sure you maximize the savings you get. They offer warranties above manufacturer guarantees, and Cub Creek takes pride in their work, as you can see in their five-star Google reviews. Don't wait to get your HVAC looked at. Contact Cub Creek Heating and AC. Find them on the klzradio.com advertisers page.
SPEAKER 11 :
Putting reason into your afternoon drive. This is John Rush.
SPEAKER 05 :
And welcome back to Rush Reason. Denver's Afternoon Rush. KLZ 560. Andy Pate filling in for John Rush on the line right now. We got Richard Rush. Richard, it's that time.
SPEAKER 09 :
That's not the best time of the year, Andy, and I'm not talking Christmas time.
SPEAKER 05 :
No?
SPEAKER 09 :
I am talking NFL draft season, baby.
SPEAKER 05 :
It is NFL draft season. Richard, why do people get so excited about the NFL draft? Because let's face it, you've got drafts in the NBA, which there's some excitement. You've got drafts in the MLB, almost no excitement. Same with hockey. But the NFL draft, for some reason... People go nuts for it. They are packing bars across the country. They're getting ready. They are looking at mock drafts for months out. They are studying and studying and just talking about it everywhere you go. Every team thinks that they're going to get the Christmas presents that put them over the top.
SPEAKER 09 :
And I feel like it's a few reasons, right? I feel like, number one, the NFL has just done a better job at marketing the draft. They've made it part of their year-round mantra, right? To where you watch, you tune into the NFL for free agency. Because, yeah, free agency is big in other sports. But the NFL, it's like you've got this tampering period. It's just massive. And that's, again, tied to TV viewership and all sorts of things. I think the other thing, Andy, is the immediate impact. in the NFL with the first-round draft picks, I feel like is sort of second to none. And what I mean by that is you look at the NFL and – or not the NFL, but you look at the NBA and even MLB especially, right? You know, those guys, you know, fall off. But especially the NFL, right? Those guys, ideally, they go to the league – And they make a immediate impact. Right, Andy?
SPEAKER 05 :
Well, really quick, if I can jump in. In Major League Baseball, they go into the minors for a few years. I mean, there is absolutely no excitement, even though it's incredible seeing some of the players that are taken at the top. But, you know, you get this incredible player at the top in the top five picks in Major League Baseball. You're not going to see him for three years.
SPEAKER 09 :
100%. And Andy, you obviously know the NBA, right? Cooper Flagg from Duke is likely to be the number one overall pick this year, right? And while I think he's a great player, he's likely going to come into the league and he's going to struggle. He's going to have his moments, but I feel like the NBA takes about two or three years for these guys to blossom. Very, very rarely do you get a LeBron James. He comes in and just strictly dominates the league and the older competition. And I'm with you. I think that there's a lot of things that are at play here. But number one, I just think it's the immediate impact. And the NFL just does a better job. They put people forward. and they put prospects forward that maybe they don't do that in other sports.
SPEAKER 05 :
You know what I mean? I agree. Maybe there's another reason as well, specialization. Here's what I mean. You go into the NBA, and, yeah, you've got the taller positions, the center, power forward, and so forth, and the shorter ones, point guard, two guard, and so forth. But outside of that, these are roughly the same kind of body types. They're long and lean, right? They're fast. I mean, how many shacks do you see? Let's let's be honest. And so you go in and you have to be able to do some of pretty much everything. Got to be able to shoot. Got to be able to defend. You got to be able to do this. Got to be able to do that in the NFL. You come in and all you're playing is wide receiver. And all you have to master is wide receiver, and you've spent the last two years doing it in a major college against major competition.
SPEAKER 09 :
Unless you're Travis Hunter, Andy, don't you forget it.
SPEAKER 05 :
Well, yeah, but he's unique, and we'll talk about him in a moment. But you can come in, and you have already specialized in one tool. You don't have to do everything at both ends of the court like you do in the NBA. You do one thing. You block everything. As an offensive tackle, and you're already 315 pounds with muscle, you run the ball and catch out of the backfield. You are a quarterback. You've already been reading defenses probably for six, seven years. You do one specialized skill, and you do it well. Whereas in the NBA, you've got to be able to do several things right out of the bat. Otherwise, you see that spot on the bench down there? You enjoy that, okay, rookie? Because I got news for you. Your name's not LeBron, and you're not going to mean anything until year two. In the NFL, you can come in right away. I guarantee you there's going to be receivers come in right away this year and tear it up.
SPEAKER 09 :
And Andy, actually, that's a great point. Again, we'll talk about the unicorn that is Travis Hunter and all this stuff. But maybe it is. Maybe it is specialization. Maybe it is this idea that the NFL guys kind of come in and they're ready. And maybe it's maturation. Andy, everyone knocks. You know, and it's been challenged in court and everything else. You know, the three-year rule, right? You've got to be three years removed from high school. And so maybe it is that these kids are bigger, older, faster as compared to, you know, again, in hockey, right, Andy? You've got these 18-year-old kids being drafted. And I'm not saying that they're not worth it because they are, right? I mean, look at Sidney Crosby from years ago.
SPEAKER 05 :
Yeah, but if they go right in the NHL, they're going to get killed. They'll get run over.
SPEAKER 09 :
You're 100% correct. And so, well, I mean, even then, even if they do, right, Andy, I think that happened last year, a couple years ago with the Sharks. They drafted Macklin Celebrini, right? I think he was an 18-year-old prospect. So it happens, right? It does happen. However... It's, again, with the NFL, Andy, I think even the younger side, right, these kids are 20 years old. Nowadays, Andy, some of these rookies, I think there's a rookie quarterback, isn't it, Tyler Shaw, I'm not sure how you say his name, from Louisville, right, who was at Oregon and I think one other place. and and that guy's 26 years old right his name looks like shoe like s-h-o-u-g-h something like that that's like shuck yeah it's kind of but i don't know actually he's old you make a great point that the specialization piece of it plays a pretty big role in the overall uh i guess how do i say in the well just in in the talent development right and andy the fact that basically the NFL players have been in the minor leagues, which is the NCAA Division I, right? In some cases, Division II. But they've been in the minor leagues for three years already.
SPEAKER 05 :
Yeah. And by the way, college baseball is similar to the minor leagues. It is. But college football is the minor leagues for the NFL. And you're already ready to go. And really quick here, let's talk about Travis Hunter. He's coming out of CU. He is... You know, there's one A and one B. We're going to talk on Wednesday about our top 10 players. I got mine ready. I'm very excited about this because these are the guys who are going to come in and blow people away right off, right out of the gate. And so we're going to be telling people on Wednesday, guys, these folks are going to wow you this year in the NFL. OK, and they're going to blow your minds. And one of them is Travis Hunter. Is he going to play full-time offense and full-time defense? I don't believe so. So even he, I believe, is going to specialize one or the other and then play about 15, 17 snaps the other way. Let's not kill the kid. He's not playing against future accountants anymore. He's playing against NFL talent, right? But man, is he exciting.
SPEAKER 09 :
Oh, he is a lightning rod, Andy. Obviously, having watched him at CU for the past two years, it was a thrill, and it was really a privilege in a lot of ways because he is a unicorn. Arguably, Andy, if he was just the wide receiver, he's the number one wide receiver in this draft. if he was just a cornerback, he would be the number one cornerback in this draft. I can argue, I know that there's some jibs on that, especially on the receiver side of things, but he is just a ridiculously talented guy. And again, I don't think he plays both ways. However, if you would draft him and you don't play him at least key moment on both sides of the ball, then I think you're you're really missing out on who he can be, which is why I think he'll go, I'll just say it, Andy, I think he'll go top three, right? And we'll talk a little bit more about that on Wednesday. But I think he'll go top three. And he's just incredibly gifted and talented. But, Andy, what you just said, and we'll talk about it more on Wednesday, is the top ten players and the immediate impact, you just don't get that in other leagues. No. You don't get that immediate, consistent impact.
SPEAKER 05 :
It's like we're talking about 10 LeBrons. It's so exciting because these guys, Abdul Carter is going to come in and have double-digit sacks right away. You guys had one for years here in Denver. Who did that?
SPEAKER 09 :
He was great right away. Yeah, he was. He was fantastic right away. I think there's a lot at play. And football is just a different game, Andy, like you say, with just the specialization as far as most guys focus on one side or the other. And it's just because, again, Travis Hunter is a unicorn. And guys have tried it, Andy. They've tried playing both ways. They've been unable to do so at an elite level. We'll see if it happens.
SPEAKER 05 :
Well, I'll tell you what, let me give you my prediction really quick on, not my prediction on what he'll do. I'm going to say what I would do with Travis Hunter. And when we come back from the break, I want to talk more Denver. I got some questions for you. Okay. If I were Travis Hunter, I would like to see him start at cornerback. And here's why. Not because he's better at one or the other. I love them both ways. But in the defensive secondary, you've got to work as a – the chemistry is everything. You've got to work as a unit, okay? If this cornerback has to, you know, cover tight, and that way the safety can back off and he can shade over here. No, now you're facing against this wide receiver who's all world, the next Megatron. You're going to need safety help, and the cornerback is going to back off a little because that guy's – okay. All of this affects all four, five, six guys in the secondary on every play, right? Which means that your secondary players have to have great chemistry with one another. It's almost like an offensive line, okay, back there. Wide receiver, I can put him in for 15 to 18 plays that are built for him, that are packages for Travis Hunter, okay, where I can spring him open, right? And I can do that with him. And I don't really care if he has great chemistry with the other wide receivers in the field. It means nothing to me. Run your route. Make your read. Run your route. I really don't care. But in the secondary, I need you to have chemistry. So if I play him full-time wide receiver, which, by the way, the team that I think is going to take him will. The problem is, okay, then you put him in as a nickelback, but he's not going to have great chemistry with the rest of the secondary. Am I making any sense here? That's why I would play him corner, and then I'd still play him plenty at receiver, just I would start him at corner. What do you think?
SPEAKER 09 :
I would agree with you. I think it's easier to fill in from defense to offense, you know, on offense and defense. And I'm not saying offense isn't complex, and you're going to get an argument of offense versus defense and all these guys and, you know, Defensive guys are going to say it's more complicated than offense, and offensive guys are going to say it's... I'm not even talking that anymore. They always say that. There's a cohesion in the defensive backfield that has to happen, and if it doesn't, you lose. And as a defense as a whole, there's just a cohesion about you. Now, granted, pass rusher is different, and we have yet to have literally a tight end that can go and then also a pass rusher the other way, but I'm with you, and we'll talk a little bit more about it on Wednesday.
SPEAKER 05 :
I mean, if Von Miller had wanted to, could he have suited up the 10-12 plays as a tight end? Yes. He's that good.
SPEAKER 09 :
He's a freak athlete, but like you say, you knew that he was much more valuable getting after the court. And honestly, Andy, I think a lockdown corner, which is what he can do, and like you said, you can throw him in for some goal line packages, whatever it might be, to be able to do that on offense.
SPEAKER 05 :
Oh, yeah. There are so many packages where I would use them on offense and develop it. Okay, tell you what, let's take a break and we can come back and talk Broncos. Sound good?
SPEAKER 09 :
Sounds great.
SPEAKER 05 :
Okay, up next is Ridgeline Auto Brokers. When you're looking at used cars, you want good selection and the best inspections. Hey, Ridgeline has both, and you'll find both locations at klzradio.com.
SPEAKER 13 :
Are you in the market for a reliable car, truck, or SUV that won't break the bank? Does your vehicle need high-quality auto repair? Then look no further. Ridgeline Auto Brokers and Legacy Auto Repair specialize in quality used cars that cost between $15,000 and $25,000, making them a great option for first-time drivers or anyone looking for a great deal. At Ridgeline, we pride ourselves on providing a transparent and happy hassle-free car buying experience. That's why we never charge any dealer fees. Plus, all of our vehicles are inspected by our team of ASE-certified technicians. You can trust that the car you're buying is in excellent condition. And remember, we can also service your vehicle after the sale. At Ridgeline, we can take your current vehicle on trade, and we also offer competitive financing options for vehicle purchases and also for vehicle repairs. Ridgeline now has two locations, one in Boulder and now a second location in Fort Collins located at 1101 North College Avenue. Both locations offer full-service auto repair and a host of off-road accessories. Check out all their services at RidgelineAutobrokers.com. Ridgeline, the smart way to buy or service or accessorize your car, truck, or SUV.
SPEAKER 14 :
Interested in buying a new home? Well, the cost may have just gone down. It's been a seller's market for years, and buyers are regaining some authority. Want to cut your costs when you buy? Take AIM, Affordable Interest Mortgage, 720-895-0500. Recent changes to buyer's agent compensation now helps the buyer spend less. Sellers no longer need to raise the price to cover compensation for both sides. Your pre-approval now gives you more control in pricing and compensation. Make sure you work with a knowledgeable mortgage broker that will save you money. Take AIM 720-895-0500. AIM has a team of broker agents willing to negotiate their compensation and save you thousands. They know the new law. They're experienced and professional. Before you sign with an agent, protect yourself with a real pre-approval letter that puts you in charge. Take AIM. Affordable Interest Mortgage, 720-895-0500. We have that team willing to work for you. That's 720-895-0500. Regulated by Dora and MLS, 217-147, Equal Credit Lender.
SPEAKER 03 :
Safebox knows you don't trust big government or financial institutions. Safebox is entirely confidential, more reliable, convenient, and secure than any bank or government institution. They never disclose any of your information or even the fact that you own a box to anyone. not even the government, you can trust Safebox. In order to create Safebox, they had to pass a 220-point checklist to become accredited with their insurance company, so you know your belongings are absolutely safe. There is complete anonymity with Safebox, and they have enhanced all security measures and procedures to include the most advanced alarm system available, 24-7 surveillance, and ballistic glass, to name a few. They provide a wide selection of water and fireproof safes in their vaults, along with very affordable pricing. Store your jewelry, guns, passports, gold coins, documents, or anything of value to you. They are Better Business Bureau accredited and even accept cash for those who want complete privacy. Know your possessions are safe and confidential by setting up an appointment with Safebox at klzradio.com.
SPEAKER 16 :
Is your office ready for a new copier? Business Equipment Service has you covered. Whether you're a small business or a large corporation, Business Equipment Service has current model Konica Minolta and Canon copiers on sale right now. Our models have very minimal usage at a fraction of the cost of buying new. We stand behind our equipment with a 90-day parts and labor warranty, as well as a one-year or 100,000-page performance warranty. giving you the reliability you need to keep things running smoothly. Right now, get free delivery and installation when you mention this ad. Why choose us? Aside from saving thousands on high-performance copiers, we have lease options starting at $100 per month, we service and supply what we sell, we offer full-service maintenance plans, fast on-site service, and remote support. For over 20 years, Business Equipment Service has helped hundreds of Colorado businesses find affordable, reliable office solutions. Visit us at besofcolorado.com or call 303-825-5664.
SPEAKER 11 :
We don't yell at you. We inform you. Now, back to Rush to Reason.
SPEAKER 05 :
And welcome back to Rush to Reason. Denver's Afternoon Rush. KLZ 560. Andy Pate filling in for John Rush on the line. We got Richard Rush. Richard, what do the Denver Broncos need? You see, right now, they're going shopping. And unless you are into online dating, you generally don't go shopping for people. So this is pretty exciting for them.
SPEAKER 09 :
It was frowned upon you for many years ago. You know, this is one of those things, Andy, this year with the Broncos, we are so much better off than we have been in years past in that we don't, you know, we don't have to go shopping for a specific position, right? You know, it's like when you, you're basically, you know, you, you, You know, you can't even compare it to, like, going to the store and, you know, you've got $1,000 and you can spend it on whatever. Like, this is a situation of obviously you're getting need.
SPEAKER 05 :
Yeah, you're not walking into the store saying, I desperately have to have this one thing, forget everything else. You get to look at the store.
SPEAKER 09 :
It's not an emergency, right, Andy? Yeah. Exactly. It's not an emergency. You're not having to go and, okay, we got to be a break class because we got to, you know, we got to get this.
SPEAKER 05 :
fire extinguisher aka quarterback but we're not sure if the fire extinguisher is going to work very well right you know it's even big can what's even more exciting is denver is on the way up kansas city is on the way down and you know it i i hope and you get the key player you get that key player you could be uh leaving casey in the dust next year it's going to be it's so big i just i just hate i hate the draft for that reason i'm sure you do i hate watching my other i you know the raiders used to be terrible
SPEAKER 09 :
at drafting, right? Like, same with the Chargers. And they would just draft awful players. Like, you know, when Al Davis took Sebastian Janikowski, you know, with the first round pick. And then he took Darius Hayward-Bey, right? A guy who most people had in the third round. And, you know, they took him in just because he could run really fast. I miss those. And unfortunately, all of the AFC West tends to draft well now. And the Chiefs are likely going to get an offensive tackle. But, you know, it may fall off a little bit. But to me, Andy, and obviously we're going to talk about this a lot more come Wednesday. Wednesday's going to be fun. But to me, the Broncos, oh, man, it's going to be a blast. Because, again, the Broncos have at least found a serviceable, a lot of people are going to say more than that, and Bo Nix, a really good quarterback that they can build around. And you can now go get him some weapons, right? I know running back's going to be a hot topic for us on Wednesday. We'll give a little teaser there. You know, running back, tight end, I don't think it'll be receivers. But I think it's for different reasons, right, Andy? To me, it's due to – to me, it's sort of the depth of the draft, right? And we'll talk about that on Wednesday.
SPEAKER 05 :
Well, really quick here, because we've got just about three minutes left, all right? Running back and tight end, there are four players slated to go in the first round. Any one of them would turn Denver into a contender overnight, okay? Okay. Now, one of them I really don't think you're going to get, and that's Gentee. But you know what? The other three are possible, okay? Especially the second tight end and the second running back. Here's my question. What could cause Denver to trade up or down in this draft? I'm going to give you an example. Let's say, for whatever reason... the Raiders decide not to take Ashton Genting, the great running back, at number six. Okay? And I know that's high for a running back, but folks, this guy had more yards after contact in college this year than all other running backs had total. All right, this is Marshall Falk, the sequel. Yes, you take him at number six. If the Raiders don't, fire their entire front office. That's my opinion. But let's, I mean it.
SPEAKER 09 :
They're all just hired.
SPEAKER 05 :
Yeah, well, just fire them all immediately. All of them. And have Trump deport their families. I'm sorry, that's the way it is. We got to be strict. Let's say they don't take Ashton Gentry. And he's falling down close to, because you know the Bears would then at number 10. So he's falling down a couple picks. If you're Denver, you trade up, don't you? I trade the house for that guy.
SPEAKER 09 :
Andy, you're asking me, right? You know you and I both have a complicated relationship with running backs. We do. Considering my feelings on Saquon Barkley. Yeah, but here's the thing.
SPEAKER 05 :
Barkley went to a team that had no offensive line. Denver has a team.
SPEAKER 09 :
They've already got a team, man. But Andy, to move up that far, and again, we'll get into this a lot more Wednesday, folks.
SPEAKER 05 :
And I don't think you're going to, but go ahead.
SPEAKER 09 :
It would just take so much, right? Like, to get into the top ten of the draft, it would take next year's first plus probably a second-round pick. And for me, for the Broncos, we're not just a running back away. As good as Jente is, and I do think he's really, really talented, I don't know if the gap from him to Omarion Hampton and then even – maybe even a Travion Henderson, Andy, depending on the scheme.
SPEAKER 05 :
Well, there's a gap.
SPEAKER 09 :
And you're not wrong, but I'm just, depending on the scheme with how Sean Payton views it, if I told you that Travion Henderson out of a state was Alvin Kamara for Sean Payton, you would take that at pick 20, wouldn't you?
SPEAKER 05 :
I would. But by the way, I think I'm predicting you're going to take Hampton at number 20 and you're going to love him. Omarion Hampton's terrific.
SPEAKER 09 :
I hope you're right, Andy. I hope you're right, because I do like him, too. Honestly, the only guy I'd go up and get if he falls out of the top ten would be Tyler Ward, the tight end out of Penn State. And we'll talk more about him on Wednesday, because obviously he's going to fall into my category of one of my top ten players.
SPEAKER 05 :
Oh, he's wonderful.
SPEAKER 09 :
But that's where I would go with it, Andy. Outside of that... I think it's fantastic. I think that, again, this best is exciting. And we talk about it, right? Spring, you know, flowers, all the other things. Spring, NFL draft. It sort of brings hope eternal, you know, or breeds hope eternal. with what it allows us to do. So again, folks, tune in Wednesday. It will be exciting. You may be bored, but you also may learn a little bit. So tune in to Andy and I. We'll just talk about all sorts of things.
SPEAKER 05 :
I don't think it's going to be boring. I've heard people who aren't even that into football, they talk about when you and I and Walt do that show, it's so rapid fire going back and forth. They're just like, man, I don't even know what you're talking about, but I'm loving it.
SPEAKER 09 :
Hey, that's all that matters, as long as we all have a good time, Andy.
SPEAKER 05 :
All right. Thanks a lot, Richard. We'll see you on Wednesday. Hey, folks, that's it for hour number two. Jersey Joe joins me in hour three with a lot to talk about. Until then, keep it right here on Rush to Reason, KLZ 560.
SPEAKER 1 :
I'm a rich guy
In this episode, as Andy Pate fills in for John Rush, the discussion is focused on the unexpected passing of Pope Francis and its implications for the Catholic Church and beyond. Joined by Luke Cashman, they delve into the political and spiritual legacy left by the Pope, reflecting on how his liberal stance and outspoken political views divided the Catholic community. The episode examines the reactions of Catholics and non-Catholics alike, providing insights into how Pope Francis' approach reshaped perceptions of the church. Listeners are invited to weigh in, providing a multitude of perspectives on what the future holds for the church. With a significant cross section of Catholics grappling with changes, the hosts explore potential paths for the church's leadership and the impact on its followers, setting the stage for considering how religious institutions might navigate political climates. The episode also takes a broader view, pondering the Catholic Church's trajectory. As the conversation unfolds, it becomes evident that Pope Francis' leadership style has ushered in an era of reconsideration and debate within the church, pushing boundaries that few could have foreseen.
SPEAKER 08 :
This is Rush to Reason.
SPEAKER 04 :
You are going to shut your damn yapper and listen for a change because I got you pegged, sweetheart. You want to take the easy way out because you're scared. And you're scared because if you try and fail, there's only you to blame. Let me break this down for you. Life is scary. Get used to it. There are no magical fixes. With your host, John Rush.
SPEAKER 13 :
My advice to you is to do what your parents did. Get a job, sir. You haven't made everybody equal. You've made them the same, and there's a big difference.
SPEAKER 01 :
Let me tell you why you're here. You're here because you know something. What you know you can't explain, but you feel it. You've felt it your entire life, that there's something wrong with the world. You don't know what it is, but it's there. It is this feeling that has brought you to me.
SPEAKER 14 :
Are you crazy? Am I? Or am I so sane that you just blew your mind?
SPEAKER 18 :
It's Rush to Reason with your host, John Rush. Presented by Cub Creek Heating and Air Conditioning.
SPEAKER 03 :
Filling in is Andy Pate, party of choice. And I'm your host, Andy Pate, filling in for John Rush. I'm joined today by Luke Cashman. And we are together, all of us, I believe, whether we're Catholic or not, we are mourning the passing of Pope Francis. This really came as a surprise, didn't it? Because, I mean, look, we knew that his health had been failing, but it sounded like he had really bounced back. And he was serving mass and he was functioning and he did a lot on Easter Sunday of all things. He even met with Vice President Vance and suddenly he was gone. Apparently he had a, I think a heart attack is what it was, I'm pretty sure, or a stroke. And boom, just like that and he is gone. Do you have any thoughts on this?
SPEAKER 09 :
Nothing personally. No, I mean, I was more surprised by it. I saw it, and at first, I guess kind of due to the state of things, I thought it was a joke at first, and then I saw it two or three more times. Like, oh, I guess it is real. I guess it did happen.
SPEAKER 03 :
Well, yeah, that's true. Let's face it, on social media, people will joke about anything.
SPEAKER 09 :
Especially right after Easter, it felt like it was a joke in poor taste.
SPEAKER 03 :
Exactly. The timing of it was really shocking, right? The day after Easter. The day after Easter, the Pope passes on. And, you know, I really thought that Donald Trump, they put out a very good statement on this. Rest in peace, Pope Francis. May God bless him and all who loved him.
SPEAKER 09 :
Yeah, I thought that's a nice response.
SPEAKER 03 :
I would echo that. Absolutely. But you know what? Luke, this really brings up some questions. Neither one of us is Catholic. So first of all, anyone who is Catholic who wants to weigh in on Pope Francis in any way, by all means do. Our number here is 303-477-5600. Or you can text us at 307-200-8222. John Rush should be able to relay that to me. But I want to talk a little bit about what does this mean for the Catholic Church? What is next? Because Pope Francis, as everybody knows, had charted a very unique course for the Catholic Church. Right. He was easily the most liberal pope we had ever seen. And he was not shy about his political views. Obviously, I don't share his views, but I hold no hatred for the man because of that. Look, we have different views. That happens. That's part of life. I've had good friends with whom, you know, we I've had very good friends where I've had different views. But this was different. And here's what I mean. While I'm not a Catholic, I have never seen a pope in my life who caused so many of my Catholic friends who are conservative in nature or even in the middle of the road, middle of the road to conservative, right, to be upset. And they were very upset. No, they didn't want him dead, but they wanted him to step down. They wanted him out of the position. And I've never seen that before. Usually, in my experience, Catholics basically fall in line. Whoever the pope is, they say, yeah, we may not always agree, but we're always going to be totally supportive of the pope no matter what because it's the pope, right? It's almost like kids saying, I always support my parents even when I disagree with them. They're my parents. And they would look at him as their great religious leader, which of course he was. He was a very kind man. OK, Pope Francis was very kind. He he cared for the poor. He was a Jesuit. He was from the streets, as they say. Right. Right. And that made him very interesting in that way. And so in a lot of ways, I think a lot of people really liked. The personality of the man, I think a lot of people got very angry at his political stances and the way he would inject himself into those things, especially in terms of America and immigration and so forth. That became a real problem. But what I'd never seen before. was so many of my friends who were Catholics saying, please, can we get a new one? I've not seen this in my life. And I'm saying this as a non-Catholic, folks. I'm just speaking as a non-Catholic here. I'd never heard that. I had seen very conservative popes. I'd seen very moderate popes. Right. Even maybe a touch left leaning. But I'd never seen a pope so divide the Catholics that I knew. Had you noticed this?
SPEAKER 09 :
It's interesting. You know, you mentioned that you've seen a bunch of popes. I've only seen three popes.
SPEAKER 03 :
Well, I mean, not just in my lifetime, but studying, you know, looking back. Right.
SPEAKER 09 :
I don't have a lot of experience with popes. Right. I was I was seven years old when John Pope John Paul II was out. And then I was, you know, around, but wasn't super paying attention for Benedict. What was he? Fourteen.
SPEAKER 03 :
Right.
SPEAKER 09 :
And then I was, you know, I was a bit more aware of Pope Francis. as he came about. During those times, I was Catholic. I was raised Catholic for a majority of my life.
SPEAKER 03 :
I did not know that.
SPEAKER 09 :
Yeah. Okay.
SPEAKER 03 :
I thought you were never a church guy.
SPEAKER 09 :
I was born and raised Catholic all the way up until sort of around high school, and then I deviated off.
SPEAKER 03 :
So we kind of went opposite directions.
SPEAKER 09 :
Yes. We have the opposite life story, I think. Okay. Just about. And it's interesting because I remember— You know, I mean, I was just starting in high school when Pope Francis came on, and as every high schooler is, is very opinionated. Even then, like in high school, I was hearing a lot of discourse. Either people really liked it or people really didn't like it. I found, for the most part, people who were Catholic and sort of in the church weren't too happy with it.
SPEAKER 03 :
They were stunned. They were shocked.
SPEAKER 09 :
Right. People outside of Catholicism were like, you know, thank God for the change of pace. It was interesting to see non-Catholics take an interest in it because the Pope sort of mirrored their values more.
SPEAKER 03 :
Well, and wait a minute. What does that say, though, that non-Catholics like the fact that he made the Catholic Church less Catholic?
SPEAKER 09 :
It was interesting.
SPEAKER 03 :
And I don't mean that he made it less elitist. Mm-hmm. he made it more of something that blends in yeah with society that is more accepting of i'll just say it things that the bible would call sin okay it's very interesting to see yeah it really was i i found very interesting that he would insert himself so much in the ways on america's borders for instance i didn't know why it mattered so much to him that america have these wide open borders OK, he never said word one when America and I know this sounds like I'm being negative, folks. I'm not OK. Honestly, the head of the Catholic Church is not a thing for me. I'm not Catholic. Right. It was just interesting to watch. I mean, there are there are people who opine with liberal viewpoints that I disagree with all the time. He was just one of them, one of many. But it was really interesting. He never said a word when Joe Biden allowed our country to be all out invaded. for four years to a degree that not only had never been seen, but had never been imagined. He never said a word. He was fine with that. He was absolutely fine with all these people pouring in to the United States, which, of course, has created a lot of problems. And then when Trump came in, he weighed in and was very upset that Trump was going to stop all that. I guess it just, look, you know, I'm MAGA, you know, and this guy was obviously very anti-MAGA. I'm just being honest. All right. I don't hate the guy. I never did. I wished him well. I wished him long life. And by the way, he had a long life. He was 88. I wish it had been 98, 108, you know. But I've never seen any pope come out with these kinds of stances and basically look at America and basically say, All of these other countries should be able to send everybody they want there. And you need to open the doors to all of them with no limits whatsoever. And that's how you should do it. And that's how you should conduct your business. And there are a lot of Catholics I knew who are looking and just saying, will you please, will he please stop talking? Because they were very upset about this. Catholics actually voted pretty strongly for Donald Trump. And I just don't know. I don't know. I've never seen anything like this. And now looking forward, you wonder, what are they going to do next? Are they going to pick another one? Got to keep in mind that the guys who picked him in the first conclave are largely either they're still around or their understudies are around. Right. It's largely the same group, the group that decided to take the entire Catholic Church and go hard left. with this guy, because this guy was largely a Marxist. Okay. Very much so. And it's going to be pretty much the same people who are going to be choosing the next one. And you wonder, are they going to choose another one like him? And if they do that, will a lot of people in the American Catholic Church leave? Because a lot of them, I got to be honest, I have Catholic friends and basically the way they've been looking at it is, well, let's see what happens after this one leaves. You know, and they're not even asking for some right winger MAGA guy to come in. They're just asking for somebody who leaves the politics out of it. I don't know. I mean, I don't know what to expect. Do you have any idea?
SPEAKER 09 :
No, I don't know what to expect. It's so interesting, though, to see because the pope involving himself in politics is a very classical approach to being a pope, right? I mean, historically speaking, the pope was very involved in politics for a number of years.
SPEAKER 03 :
Well, overseas, I guess so. How so? How so?
SPEAKER 09 :
Like historically, you go back to like the ancient Roman Empire. Oh, yeah. Like classically speaking.
SPEAKER 03 :
Gotcha.
SPEAKER 09 :
The pope as a political figure was kind of the standard for a proportionally huge chunk of time. And historically, relatively recently, they've been taking a more sort of hands-off approach. So to see a classical pope in politics as a sort of hearken back to ancient times is But to take that classical approach with very new quote-unquote ideas was very – it was like a weird direction to have seen things gone. It's not something I would have anticipated. I'd say things are so out of left field at this point. I mean I could take a shot in the dark and probably be either very accurate or very far away because there's no telling.
SPEAKER 03 :
Well, I mean, what is next for the Catholic Church? They're at a crossroads right now. And this pope brought them to a crossroads because he divided them in ways that they had never seen before. Okay. And, you know, he knew what he was doing. Now, for those who don't understand, just so you know, if people are thinking, well, everything the pope says is perfect. Folks, in terms of Catholic doctrine, that's only when he's speaking ex-cathedra, when he's speaking for the church. That's not when he's talking about his politics. His politics are his own. His sports teams that he supports are his own. You see what I'm saying? He has his own life of his own, and that's what the pope has always been. Catholics, at least in my understanding, don't believe the pope is the next Jesus. They believe he is actually representing the next Peter, the head of the church, and that he has his own life and he has his own political views. And his political views are not necessarily the political views, right or left, of the church. Right? Right. But what's the answer? What does the Catholic Church got to become next? You see... I'll be honest. I mean, like you said, a lot of non-Catholics really embraced him and liked him.
SPEAKER 01 :
Why?
SPEAKER 03 :
Because he made the Catholic Church less Catholic. OK, talk of sin and death and hell and these things. Basically, he was a leftist. He was a hardcore liberal cleric and talk of sin, death, hell. These things kind of totally went by the wayside. I never heard any of that out of his mouth. And you kind of wonder what what what is the Catholic Church going to do next? Are they going to keep going to the left? Is the idea is the answer for the Catholic Church to simply become more and more and more like the rest of the world? And at that point, my question, I'm not a Catholic, but my question is, then why do we need the Catholic Church? We already have the rest of the world. So what's the point?
SPEAKER 09 :
That's a good question.
SPEAKER 03 :
Really? I mean, did you ever see the movie Dogma?
SPEAKER 09 :
No, I can't say that I have.
SPEAKER 03 :
Oh, there was an image in there called Buddy Christ. OK, he's your buddy. And it's this positive image that the church was trying to put out. And no, Francis wasn't like that. That was done satirically for fun. Right. By the way, it was a funny movie. OK, it was done for that reason. But I just wonder what is coming next for the Catholic Church. And I'll sum it up with this. Sorry, folks, if I'm kind of grasping at my thoughts here, it's such a strange dynamic that we've seen over the last several years with this pope. Once again, I've never seen this many American Catholics so angry at their own leadership. I've never seen anything like it. I don't know what comes next. And if they continue, you've got largely the same kind of people who are going to choose the next pope. And if they choose another one who's going in this direction... Could the entire church just split apart? Because it was almost like so much of the church was just waiting for him to not die, but step down.
SPEAKER 09 :
Right.
SPEAKER 03 :
You know, and pass along to another one. I don't know what comes next. I don't I don't think they can keep going to the left as they were with with this pope and still be the church at some point, because at some point you've just become the world. I don't know. I really don't. And I think that that is the question right now that's on a lot of Catholics' minds. Obviously, they're in mourning for the loss of this man because he was a good man. He was a kind man. I liked him personally, you know, just looking at him as a person.
SPEAKER 09 :
As a human being.
SPEAKER 03 :
As a human being, yeah. I liked him. Now, I didn't like when he inserted himself politically, but, you know, that's his life. He has a right to that. Right. I'm a believer in free speech, but I think a lot of Catholics are wondering what comes next. Hey, folks, for the rest of the first hour, if you want to call in and weigh in, we're going to go off on other topics. But if you decide you want to call in at 303-477-5600 and weigh in on the Pope, if you are a Catholic and you can speak on this from the inside, because Luke and I are on the outside.
SPEAKER 09 :
Yeah, I haven't been a Catholic for many years.
SPEAKER 03 :
Right. We will divert from any topic that we're on and listen to you. We'd love to hear you out because I would love to hear from fellow Catholics out there and see what do you think? What do you think right now? What do you think about this great loss of a great man? Because he was an inspirational man. But also, what do you think is next? Because I think that's what's on a lot of people's minds. Sound good? Sounds great. Okay. Let's take a break. We'll come back and talk about some other things that are not Pope-related. Up next is Golden Eagle Financial. Prepare your financial future by maximizing your present with Al Smith. No one does it better, so call Al at 303-744-1128, or you can find him at klzradio.com.
SPEAKER 12 :
Retirement planning with Golden Eagle Financial isn't about products or spreadsheets. It's about you. Al Smith spends more time listening than talking when he meets with clients. He understands that before he can build a strategy, he must understand the person for whom it's designed, fears, dreams, wants, needs, and comfort with risk. That's why clients trust Al Smith with comprehensive retirement planning, from pensions and Social Security to owning property or donating time and money. Al wants to know the things you really want to do with your money in retirement. Once he understands you, he will use tools to help you understand different scenarios to fine-tune your plan. Al Smith says it's easy. Once he knows someone, the planning is simple. Call Al Smith of Golden Eagle Financial if you're ready to make your dream a reality. No pressure, no upfront cost. Just a conversation and a unique plan crafted for you. Find Golden Eagle Financial on the KLZ Advertiser's page to start the relationship your nest egg deserves. Investment advisory services offered through Brookstone Capital Investment LLC, a registered investment advisor. BCM and Golden Eagle Financial Limited are independent of each other. Insurance products and services are not offered through BCM, but are offered and sold through individually licensed and appointed agents.
SPEAKER 03 :
Okay, Roof Savers. No state has weather that's harder on roofs than Colorado. So get your roof the treatment it needs to last 5, 10, even 15 years longer. Call Dave Hart at Roof Savers. That's 303-710-6916.
SPEAKER 02 :
At Roof Savers Colorado, we are about more than roofs. We are about helping you make the best decisions with the right information. Being a homeowner isn't getting any easier or cheaper and neither is getting your roof the solution it needs. Deductibles are going through the roof and with every passing year, insurance covers less than the one before. Due to a record amount of hailstorms recently, insurance companies have started limiting your coverage and pulling out of states entirely. We know the industry. With over 3,000 roofs under our belts and 23 years of experience, Dave Hart and his team are ready to complete a free roof inspection and discuss the option that is best for you. Don't wait. Policy renewals are increasing by as much as 50%. Now is the time to get the solution you need. Call Roof Savers Colorado today at 303- 710-6916 or go to roofsaversco.com. That's 303-710-6916 or go to roofsaversco.com to schedule your free inspection and start saving your roof today.
SPEAKER 03 :
Okay, group insurance analysts, do you know all the details about insurance? Of course not. So I have GIA shop for you. Call group insurance analysts at 303-423-0162.
SPEAKER 08 :
God. Country. Reason. Now back to John Rush.
SPEAKER 03 :
And welcome back to Rush to Reason. Denver's Afternoon Rush. KLZ 560. Andy Pate filling in for John Rush along with Luke Cash. Man. Okay, Luke, let's talk a little bit about immigration because while the Pope, of course, took a different view of that, and that's okay, he took the view of the Biden administration. He did. Right. He wanted it wide open, let them all in, And that's it. OK, setting him aside. That's his view. Here's what's happening. And they were talking about this on CNN. I'm sure you've probably heard this clip before, but this is the guy on CNN who's working the board. And he's talking about the changes in the polling on this issue. Here we go.
SPEAKER 06 :
Deport all undocumented immigrants. Voters favoring the government trying to deport all 11 million of them. Back in 2016, just 38% of voters wanted the government to try to deport all 11 million undocumented immigrants. Compare it to where we are in 2025. Sixty-six percent, the majority, the American people have come a long way on this issue, much closer to Donald Trump, and I think that's a big part of the reason why Americans are increasingly saying the country is on the right track when it comes to immigration policy and why Donald Trump's net approval rating on that issue is in the positive.
SPEAKER 03 :
Okay, Luke, why do you think that is? I mean, we're talking about eight years later, basically. It was really 2017 as Trump started his first term. And, I mean, that is an unbelievable 18-point jump. 18-point jumps in polling. You know me. I'm a polling nerd. Those are so rare, especially in a period of time that's short. What happened?
SPEAKER 09 :
I think sort of immigration and its policies and people's response to it is sort of a response you see a lot in a nation regarding just about anything. When people themselves, the people of a country, find themselves struggling more. When you or me or your neighbor is hurting more on groceries or hurting more in other places, it's hard to look and have compassion outwardly.
SPEAKER 03 :
So you think they're looking for scapegoats or do you think they're look or they simply have less compassion? Do you think that their views on immigration have changed due to them having Americans becoming less compassionate?
SPEAKER 09 :
Maybe not less compassionate but more – as Americans struggle more, it's less of a focus on other people, more of a focus on, OK, well, I need to make sure I'm good now. And with immigration as an issue, it's hard to draw too much focus of we need to let these people in. We need to give them all these resources. We need to do X, Y, and Z for them when we're struggling, right? I think it's a harder sell.
SPEAKER 03 :
Well, and also, I mean, they're breaking the law.
SPEAKER 09 :
Yeah.
SPEAKER 03 :
I mean, look, Luke, you and I, we get up every day and we spend our entire lives not breaking laws. Yes. Okay. It's very important to us. I've seen you in action. You don't break laws.
SPEAKER 09 :
Famously.
SPEAKER 03 :
Right. And neither do I. They're breaking the law simply by coming here. You've never invaded a country. You've never gone somewhere unlawfully or stayed somewhere unlawfully. You've never done this in your entire life. I think the fact that it was kept a low burn and a trickle coming in for so many years and then Biden unleashed the tidal wave, I think it brought it to the front of our minds. It's like, wait a minute, this has always been illegal. It's always been wrong.
SPEAKER 15 :
Right.
SPEAKER 03 :
Right. I'm all for legal immigration. My biggest problem actually with illegal immigration is that it backs up the system so badly that they have to slow down legal immigration. People can't come through legally when the system's already trying to absorb all these millions who came the other way, who jumped to the front of the line. Could it be that Americans are simply looking at this and saying, Guys, you're invading us. I mean, this is a full invasion. And by the way, it's not just 11 million who are in this country as well. It's well north of 20 who are in this country illegally. And people are looking at and saying, guys, you know, we we don't like you said, we don't have the resources for this for our own lives to take care of our own lives.
SPEAKER 09 :
Right. I think that's a huge part of it. Like I said, people here in the country are so focused on making it through to the next paycheck themselves. It's so much harder to make allowances, right? Maybe it would have flown if everyone was doing well, right? Sure. But everyone's not doing well. And then this is sort of just another thing to add on top of it. It just feels very crushing. It's like there's too much going on.
SPEAKER 03 :
Well, and I think also, Luke, I mean, you look at the systems that are being overwhelmed. Look at the public schools are being overwhelmed with illegal immigrant kids. If you look at emergency rooms are being overwhelmed and that's affecting everybody, your tax dollars are going into that. And then, of course, there's illegal immigrant crime. All right. And you can say, well, you know, on average, they don't commit crimes at a higher rate. Yes, but every one of their crimes is an added crime. We already pay our taxes to try to support the cops and support the people, the first responders in place to handle the crimes that are already going to be committed by the citizens we have here. Right. Every added crime overloads that system.
SPEAKER 09 :
Yeah.
SPEAKER 03 :
Right. And so that's the problem. When you look at an illegal immigrant crime, especially when it's one of these terrible ones, rape, murder, and so forth, those horrible examples. Well, when an American citizen commits one of those things, it is a horrible tragedy. But when an illegal immigrant commits one of those things, that wouldn't have happened had we simply enforced the law in the first place.
SPEAKER 09 :
Right. It feels very comparable.
SPEAKER 03 :
I mean, you can't prevent... Right. Go ahead.
SPEAKER 09 :
I was going to say it feels very comparable almost like from a pure numerical standpoint, this idea that it's also hard to justify excessive expenditure in other countries when our own country is hurting so much. Right. I don't want to pay for underwater basket weaving studies in Libya, right? You know, I can't afford groceries. I don't want to pay for the consequences of this action when I'm already struggling to afford eggs.
SPEAKER 03 :
You don't want to pay tens and tens and tens of billions of dollars securing Ukraine's border when ours is wide open.
SPEAKER 09 :
Right.
SPEAKER 03 :
It doesn't make any sense.
SPEAKER 09 :
It feels like priorities are off. It feels like they're not focusing enough on the American people and over-focusing on not the American people.
SPEAKER 03 :
Is America first as a mindset? Is it selfish or is it realistic?
SPEAKER 09 :
I think to a certain extent it has to be both because, I mean, when you go America first, obviously that is by definition in self-interest, right? But I don't think that's a wrong thing either. I think a country focusing on its own issues predominantly shouldn't be looked at in the negative.
SPEAKER 03 :
Well, yeah. I mean, Luke, when you go – you and your girlfriend, you go to the store. Right. You're buying for you two. You're not buying for the rest of the city. Right.
SPEAKER 09 :
Right.
SPEAKER 03 :
How selfish of you. Yeah. No, no. You're tending to your needs. You're tending to your lives because that's your responsibility.
SPEAKER 09 :
Right. It's like, you know, fix the termite infestation in your own house first before building a fence for your neighbor. I just feel like that should be the standard.
SPEAKER 03 :
I agree. And especially when you're talking about a country that's pushing 38 trillion in debt.
SPEAKER 09 :
Right. It's like we're already hurting.
SPEAKER 03 :
Yeah. We really can't afford.
SPEAKER 09 :
It's a numbers thing, too. It is. It is just the numbers.
SPEAKER 03 :
And that's not cold and harsh because let's take a step back here for a moment. What if you ignore the numbers and say, no, no, no, no, no. Let's give, you know, all this public assistance and food stamps and, you know, homes, which, by the way, they have in many states in this country, including this one. They've been giving all kinds of tax funded breaks and benefits to people who are here illegally. People who are not even supposed to be here. People who have done something you and I have never done. Invade a country. I mean, we've never done that.
SPEAKER 09 :
I've never.
SPEAKER 03 :
I've watched you closely. I have drones everywhere you go in life. As you should. And they have not seen you invade a country or go anywhere and stay there illegally. You've never done it in your life. People act like that is some normal thing. If it's so normal, how come we don't do it? Right. It's not normal. But... When we look at this and we see these politicians saying, okay, we have to give, give, give, give, give, give to these people. I take a look at them and I say, you do realize we are charging our entire economy right now on our kids' credit cards. Right. That $38 trillion, it's not going to be paid by me, Luke. I'm old. I'm nearly gone. I could go any moment. And it's going to be paid by people who are like you or younger. And they're going to pay, and they're going to pay with tremendous interest, and it's going to cripple their economy. And I look at these political leaders, and I say, how can you say that they should cripple the economy of their children for people who have come here committing an illegal act?
SPEAKER 09 :
Yeah.
SPEAKER 03 :
I mean, is that out of whack? It shouldn't be. Yeah. Now, by the way, I'm all for work visas.
SPEAKER 09 :
Right. Right. Being anti-illegal immigration doesn't mean anti-immigration. Oh, no. Those two get conflated a lot.
SPEAKER 03 :
I love immigration. And by the way, I believe that here's what's going to happen. And we'll go to break after this. I believe that Trump's efforts in trade will eventually result in a dramatic upsurge in hiring. We're going to have way more companies investing so much more in our country. They're already talking five to seven trillion in promised investment in our country. That's a lot of jobs. OK, people got to take those jobs. And then what do you need? You need more people to do work either at those jobs and in factories or at other jobs that are vacated by the people who go into those jobs. Right. Bottom line, you're going to need bodies. You're going to need more people. And guess where you can get those immigrants. OK. And so I would look at these people and I would say, hey. Work visas. Do it legally. There's a thing called a port of entry. Use it.
SPEAKER 09 :
Yeah.
SPEAKER 03 :
Okay, and if you're here illegally, okay, tell you what. Get on the grid. Agree to. Go back out. And this is what the Trump administration is saying. You go back out, but if you do it honestly, up front with us now, guess what? You can be brought back. You come back on a work visa, and you can be back part of the system again. We just don't want you to stay here under the radar breaking the law. What do you think?
SPEAKER 09 :
Yeah, I think it makes sense. Yeah.
SPEAKER 03 :
I don't know. I really think that something needs to be done. Oh, by the way, tell you what, after the break, I want to talk about a New Mexico judge.
SPEAKER 09 :
Okay.
SPEAKER 03 :
And you're thinking, why would I want to talk about this? Because it pertains to immigration. And this is something, here's the big frustration with me, Luke. The other side, when it comes to immigration, is absolutely lawless. They want no law. And they don't respect the law. And we're about to talk about a judge who feels exactly the same. All right. Let's take a break. Up next is Dr. Scott Faulkner. He doesn't serve big pharma. He only serves you for a total approach to your total health. Call Dr. Scott at 303-663-6990.
SPEAKER 10 :
Are you tired of crisis care and instead want true healthcare? Do you want to improve your overall fitness and beauty? Do you have a chronic medical condition that no one has taken the time to understand? Are you trying to meet a health or weight goal? Or maybe you're just looking for a great doctor who thinks the way you do. Dr. Scott is a board-certified internal medicine specialist, bringing decades of experience and expertise to the table. Dr. Scott is a true advocate of the latest advancements in health care. That's why he uses umbilical derived stem cells, which have been clinically proven to be the most potent stem cells available. Worried about being lost in the crowd of impersonal health care? Fear not. Dr. Scott is a big picture doctor, not beholden to big pharma or big insurance like some other providers. He takes the time to understand your unique needs and will customize your health care to fit you, your body, and your lifestyle. Reach your full potential and achieve your goals. Call Dr. Scott today at 303-663-6990 or visit him online at castlerockregenerativehealth.com or find him at rushtoreason.com. Dr. Scott Faulkner and Castle Rock Regenerative Health Care is your path to a healthier tomorrow.
SPEAKER 03 :
Michael Bailey Law. Procrastinating with your will could cost those you love most. Don't wait. Call Michael Bailey at 720-730-7274.
SPEAKER 16 :
When it comes to your estate, you really don't want to leave things up to luck. Michael Bailey doesn't rely on chance. He relies on solid, thorough planning and getting to know you as you develop your plan together. That's because a good estate plan isn't about luck. It's about wisdom, preparation, and making sure your family is protected no matter what. Think about it. When you pass on, will you leave your family to guess what to do with your possessions, investments, and other assets? Or would you want to make those instructions very clear so your family can know your final wishes in detail? That's what an estate plan does. It's not about luck. It's about making sure what you want to happen is followed, your assets are protected, and your family isn't left searching for answers. Rely on solid planning from Michael Bailey, not good luck charms. Find the mobile estate planner Michael Bailey on the klzradio.com advertisers page to make sure your last wishes are followed.
SPEAKER 03 :
SafeBoxes. Hey, starting at just $15 a month, secure the values, the valuables you really want to keep safe. Call SafeBoxes at 303-771-8000.
SPEAKER 17 :
SafeBox knows you don't trust big government or financial institutions. SafeBox is entirely confidential, more reliable, convenient, and secure than any bank or government institution. They never disclose any of your information or even the fact that you own a box to anyone, not even the government. you can trust safebox in order to create safebox they had to pass a 220 point checklist to become accredited with their insurance company so you know your belongings are absolutely safe there is complete anonymity with safebox and they have enhanced all security measures and procedures to include the most advanced alarm system available 24 7 surveillance and ballistic glass to name a few they provide a wide selection of water and fireproof safes in their vault along with very affordable pricing. Store your jewelry, guns, passports, gold coins, documents, or anything of value to you. They are Better Business Bureau accredited and even accept cash for those who want complete privacy. Know your possessions are safe and confidential by setting up an appointment with Safebox at klzradio.com.
SPEAKER 07 :
Finding the right home and auto insurance can be confusing, and picking the wrong plan can cost you thousands of dollars more out of your pocket. You need an expert in home and auto insurance to help you find the best coverage that fits your needs and at the very best premium. Call Paul DeNigro at GIA Insurance, and his team of home and auto insurance specialists will help you find the right plan for your needs. I'll see you next time. Whether it is your home, auto, classic car, or liability insurance, GIA has got you covered. Call 303-423-0162, extension 100, or go online to e-gia.com. Get more without paying more.
SPEAKER 08 :
The best export we have is Common Sense. You're listening to Rush to Reason.
SPEAKER 03 :
And welcome back to Rush to Reason, Denver's Afternoon Rush, KLZ 560. Okay, Luke, this happened in Fremont County, Colorado. Okay. Just very recently. Last month in Fremont, a mostly rural county southwest of Colorado Springs. Do you know where that is? No, I can't say I'm super familiar. It is gorgeous down there. I'll take your word for it. Okay, well, a couple of Fremont County detectives, they noted a van passing them without dimming headlights, and so they initiated a stop. What they found was eye-opening, around 180,000 rounds of ammunition. OK, well, you're a gun guy. So hang on and listen to this, because here's what these people said. Martinez Solis, he's one of the people pulled over. He told authorities that he and Amador Garcia, whom he claimed was his brother in law, had traveled from Mexico to Denver a day earlier to purchase a vehicle before driving to Salt Lake City to look at another vehicle he was interested in buying. In Salt Lake City, the men stopped at a firearms and ammunition store where Armador Garcia bought the ammunition, according to the affidavit. Solis further explained that he did not know the intent. with the ammunition, but that he believed it was destined for Pueblo. He didn't know the intent. They bought this. So he believed it was destined for Pueblo, the affidavit stated. Pueblo is a city in Colorado. Okay, this is a story from Red State. This much ammunition, I mean, look, you are a gun guy, okay? Yeah. Isn't that a lot to buy? Help me out here. 180 rounds?
SPEAKER 09 :
180,000 rounds. Does it say what kind of ammo it is? Not that it super matters.
SPEAKER 03 :
Yeah. It breaks it down here in just a second. Hang on. Okay, it looks like there were two kinds. 7.62 ammo?
SPEAKER 09 :
7.62, okay.
SPEAKER 03 :
Okay, and which is roughly equivalent, they say, to the .308 Winchester?
SPEAKER 09 :
Yeah, it's 7.62 by, I mean, I'm sure it'll say what it is. That's usually like AK-47 is what you're looking at for 7.62. Okay, AK-47.
SPEAKER 03 :
stuff is is rounds for an ak-47 typically because there were 150 boxes of the 308 ammunition okay and approximately 30 boxes of um the 762 okay okay each box uh containing roughly a thousand rounds what does that tell you
SPEAKER 09 :
That tells you you're paying a lot of money. For reference, the average cost of about a 7.62 round is 55 cents. So 180,000 rounds of ammo times 55 cents a round is you're paying almost 100 grand for ammo. That's $99,000 worth of ammo. How much? $99,000 worth of ammo.
SPEAKER 03 :
Okay, 100 grand of ammo?
SPEAKER 09 :
Yeah.
SPEAKER 03 :
And they're transporting this in their van.
SPEAKER 09 :
Yeah, I don't have $100,000 to blow on ammo, and I'm a pretty big gun enthusiast. I don't know many people who have $100,000 to blow on ammo.
SPEAKER 03 :
Okay, well, needless to say, Homeland Security is involved, along with the Denver Field Office of the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms, and Explosives, just so I'd say it all. Okay, I think there's probably going to be more charges here. I mean, wouldn't you? Doesn't this sound like it's going to either cartel or gang-related activity?
SPEAKER 09 :
Yeah, I mean, it sounds like it's going somewhere.
SPEAKER 03 :
It sounds like you're arming up.
SPEAKER 09 :
Yeah, I mean, you could put all that in your garage for a rainy day, I guess. But, you know, I don't—I mean, where are you even storing all that?
SPEAKER 03 :
There's no mention of them even showing, you know, where they bought it. The guy who wrote this article says nobody's really going to sell that much all at once. They probably had to go to several stores.
SPEAKER 09 :
Right. 180,000 rounds of ammo is an absurd amount of ammo to have on hand.
SPEAKER 03 :
Okay, so you would suspect that they went to several stores. I think you'd have to.
SPEAKER 09 :
Unless you went to a Walmart super center or a Costco equivalent of a gun store.
SPEAKER 03 :
Yeah. Okay.
SPEAKER 09 :
I don't know of any Costco gun stores. If you do know one, let me know. I want to go. But I've never seen them.
SPEAKER 03 :
I mean, I don't want to call you, oh, my gosh, this is two Hispanic people. It must be Trend de Aragua. I'm not saying that. I don't know what they're doing.
SPEAKER 09 :
It's a lot of money, though.
SPEAKER 03 :
It's a lot of money, and it's a lot of ammo. Where are you taking it? And this has not been discovered yet. And this idea, they're saying they bought it at a place. Really? Where? You know, receipt?
SPEAKER 01 :
Yeah.
SPEAKER 03 :
Can you tell us the place? And I assume this is what the Homeland Security is looking into. Okay, tell us the place. We're going to go to the place. We're going to ask them, did you sell this much to these two guys? Here's their pictures. Here's their identities. What do you think is going to come of this?
SPEAKER 09 :
I don't know what's going to come of it.
SPEAKER 03 :
Because this is down in Fremont is where they got them.
SPEAKER 09 :
The thing I fear, you said they, well, something to consider. And, I mean, I haven't read the article. I have nothing. This is fully speculative.
SPEAKER 03 :
There are two Mexican nationals in the U.S. on non-immigrant visas.
SPEAKER 09 :
Grains of rice and all that. Right. Not grains of rice. Grains of sand and salt or whatever. Yeah, yeah. What if they didn't buy it here and they are bringing it up from somewhere else to deliver to someone here?
SPEAKER 03 :
Right.
SPEAKER 09 :
I think the current implication is they bought it all here and are bringing it down. What if it's the other way around?
SPEAKER 03 :
I agree. I mean, it could be, right?
SPEAKER 09 :
I mean, we simply don't know. There's not enough information. But something to keep in mind.
SPEAKER 03 :
I think that's pretty scary, man. I think that's pretty scary, and I kind of wonder, you know, what comes next. If they're moving that much, it just sounds to me like there was going to be some real serious shooting going on.
SPEAKER 09 :
Yeah, 180,000 rounds of ammo.
SPEAKER 03 :
And those are for AKs.
SPEAKER 09 :
It's crazy. Yeah, 7.62x39 is typically what you're using in an AK-47. Okay.
SPEAKER 03 :
Well, when we come back, I want to talk about Iowa, because Iowa just passed a law that I actually like. Okay. Sound good? Sounds good. All right. Up next is Cub Creek Heating and Air. Hey, their techs don't work on commission, so there's no upsell. I hate upsells, don't you? No. They come, you get this like little clip coupon, whatever, and they come and then they find 10 other things. Right. And they work it all in. Okay, they don't do that at Cub Creek. For the best in heating and air conditioning repair, call Cub Creek at 303-656-5467.
SPEAKER 14 :
Cub Creek will give you confidence that your HVAC system is not going to fail. Heating and AC systems need checkups every now and again, and they need to be maintained so that they work efficiently. When they fail during extreme weather, it can be a big inconvenience. That's why you should have Rheem Pro Partner Cub Creek come out to see if your HVAC is performing as it should, so you don't wind up needing expensive emergency service. Cub Creek won't upsell you. Their techs don't work on commission, and they will provide creative options so you can make an educated decision for your unique home. They can navigate incentives and rebates with you to save you as much as $4,500 and make sure you maximize the savings you get. They offer warranties above manufacturer guarantees. And Cub Creek takes pride in their work, as you can see in their five-star Google reviews. Don't wait to get your HVAC looked at. Contact Cub Creek Heating and AC. Find them on the klzradio.com advertisers page.
SPEAKER 03 :
American Stonehenge. Kids learn best when families read together. Now you can get 10% off with the promo code KLZ. Find American Stonehenge at JimmyAndAndrew.com.
SPEAKER 11 :
Mike Goldstein, author of American Stonehenge, wants to ignite a love for reading in your kids or grandkids. This book doesn't just entertain, it equips. American Stonehenge subtly teaches survival skills and how to think critically, wrapped inside a captivating adventure that pulls them in and keeps them turning the page. Because Mike believes reading isn't just fun, it's a survival skill for life. Today's kids know how to build something in Minecraft, but American Stonehenge invites them to build something real for their life. Knowledge, confidence, and curiosity. Mike spent years researching this story and every detail matters, from science and history to the language itself. He wrote and rewrote again and again until every page flowed, every sentence carried weight, and nothing slowed the reader down. Mike writes like a sculptor, carefully crafting the story. If you want your kids or grandkids to learn critical thinking and real-life skills, buy this book for them. Enter promo code KLZ for a 10% savings. Read the free preview at klzradio.com slash read.
SPEAKER 18 :
Are you in the market for a reliable car that won't break the bank? DriveRadio's sponsor, Ridgeline Auto Brokers, specializes in quality used cars that cost between $15,000 to $25,000, making them a great option for first-time drivers or anyone looking for a good deal. They pride themselves on providing a transparent and hassle-free car buying experience. That's why at Ridgeline, they never charge a dealer fee. Plus, all vehicles are inspected by Legacy Automotive, a Colorado select member and sponsor of Drive Radio. For a limited time, they are offering first-time customers the first oil change for only $1. Every car comes with a 30-day warranty, with the option to purchase a service contract. And at Ridgeline Auto Brokers, there are competitive financing options to fit your budget. If you cannot make it to the dealership in person, there are videos of all Ridgeline cars for sale on their website at RidgelineAutoBrokers.com. Call today at 303-442-4141 to schedule a test drive or visit RidgelineAutoBrokers.com. Ridgeline Auto Brokers, the smartest way to buy a car.
SPEAKER 15 :
Veteran Windows and Doors knows that other companies only care about getting the sale. Those companies sell you on emotions, pressuring you to sign today to get the best price, but they don't even know about the critical energy codes and ratings of the windows. Dave Bancroft, owner of Veteran Windows and Doors, guarantees he will get you the right windows and doors designed specifically for your home. without the ridiculous sales tactics and needless pressuring. Dave is passionate about educating you so that you can make an informed decision on your timeline and wants to protect you as a consumer. And Dave has seen other companies' prices appear cheaper initially, but once the door you bought doesn't fit or it's the wrong door, they must structurally change the door frame to create the opening. You've lost thousands of dollars. Don't deal with just the sales rep. Work with Dave. For the month of April, when you buy up to three windows, enjoy 35% off. Buy four or more windows, you'll receive 40% off, all with free installation. Just go to klzradio.com.
SPEAKER 08 :
Now back to Rush to Reason on KLZ 560.
SPEAKER 03 :
And welcome back to Rush to Reason, Denver's Afternoon Rush, KLZ 560. Online, we've got Jersey Joe. Joe, what are your thoughts on this, sir?
SPEAKER 05 :
Well, which one of your co-hosts is the gun nut today? Because I'm a gun nut too. Luke. Luke is a gun nut. How are you? All right, good. Yourself? I'm doing good, thank you. If you ever watch these shows like Contraband Seized at the Border or To Catch a Smuggler, one of the things they always catch you, there's two things they catch being smuggled into Mexico. One is money, which is the proceeds from drug sales, and the other are guns and ammunition. Guns and ammunition are tightly, tightly controlled in Mexico today. And there's a huge market, you know, people are just trying to, I mean, if you can smuggle 10 boxes of ammo into Mexico, you can sell it for, you know, 10 times what you paid for it. So I suspect it was bound for the drug lords in Mexico.
SPEAKER 03 :
Probably, but that's bad. That's bad. Now, Joe, Joe, really quick here before you run on. Why is it so tightly regulated down there when you think about it? Because you're talking about a government that works almost hand in hand with the cartels, which are criminal organizations. I mean, why would, of all things, ammunition be tightly regulated?
SPEAKER 05 :
Well, New York and they passed it. I've got I've got a friend that lives. He moved down there 10 years ago. He's still a U.S. citizen and he's an avid shooter. But, you know, he said, forget trying to buy a gun or ammunition in Mexico. It's just not available to the ordinary citizens. Now, if you're corrupt, you know, and you're bribing the police chief, yeah, you can get anything you want. But legally, you can't. Citizens in Mexico can't legally buy guns or ammunition. Just impossible.
SPEAKER 03 :
So basically, when gun ownership is a crime, only criminals have guns.
SPEAKER 05 :
Only criminals have guns. Now, 308 is a big rifle round. It was used by the military in the M14. It's also used in the A-10s. which is the big brother of the AR-15. The A-10 can handle a larger caliber round than the AR-15, which, by the way, shoots a little diminutive, the .223 round, really .22 caliber round, the .308. Now, the 7.62 interest, there's two different 7.62s. One is the 7.62x51, which is the NATO rifle round, which is the equivalent of the .308, which can be used interchangeably, but I suspect The 7.62s were the 7.62x39, which is used in, Luke, what's the 7.62x39 used in?
SPEAKER 09 :
The AK-47s.
SPEAKER 05 :
AK-47 submachine gun. So I suspect the 7.62s, if you're going to, you can't, you can't, I don't think, fire the .308, rifles for the .308 are not that common. AK-47s, you know, are a dime a dozen. It's the most widely produced gun in the history of the world. So I suspect the 7.62s were for the AK-47, which is not a long-range round. It's a rifle round, but it's good for 100, 150 yards, whereas the .308 is good for 500 yards. So I suspect it was a lot of AK-47 ammunition, which is one of the favorite weapons of the cartels. It's a cheap gun. You can buy it. five ak-47s for the price of one m14 so basically they were transporting this they were basically arming the cartels that would i that if i had to bet bet my house i would bet they were going to try to smuggle it into mexico uh you know to help arm the cartels supply ammunition to the cartels apparently as uh charlie was saying they opened the van and it was top to bottom yeah there's a picture i've got a new york post there's a picture how do the shocks handle that Custom suspension. Yeah. No, there's actually a picture. It's floor-to-ceiling, wall-to-wall. Just Google 180,000 rounds of ammunition, and you'll see the picture. I can actually send it.
SPEAKER 03 :
Yeah, but okay, but wait a minute here. We've got a couple minutes left here. I mean, if you load up a van that much, Luke, I'm going to ask you first, then you, Joe, isn't that going to be really riding low? I mean, doesn't that stick out like a sore thumb to the cops? Yeah.
SPEAKER 09 :
Like I said, it would. I made a joke about the custom suspension previously. But that is what you do when you're smuggling people across the border, is you intentionally raise the suspension on the rear of the vehicle so when you pack it full of people, it lowers to a normal level. So very possible. I mean, if you're running 100 grand worth of ammo, chances are you know at least a little bit of what you're doing. I don't think a suspension could handle that much ammo unless you had it raised in some capacity.
SPEAKER 03 :
But enough about how Luke spends his weekends.
SPEAKER 09 :
Yes.
SPEAKER 03 :
Joe, go ahead.
SPEAKER 05 :
And I suspect, by the way, it's unfortunate, but they arrested last week, they arrested a couple of border agents for collusion and some smuggling of people across the border or drugs across the border. So I suspect, I don't think they gambled that they weren't going to get inspected. I suspect that they probably have a border agent on the payroll and they're going to try to cross the border at 11 o'clock at night. and just pay this guy $10,000 to look the other way.
SPEAKER 03 :
I think that that would be incredibly lucrative for any border agent willing to look the other way.
SPEAKER 05 :
Yep. And that's why they just arrested two of them last week. Now, again, I don't want to diminish – I have great respect for – there are tens of thousands of people who work for Customs and Border Patrol, and I admire them for what they do. But in any group, whether they be police officers or whatever, you're always – It's not hard to find one half of one percent who are willing to betray their oath.
SPEAKER 03 :
Oh, yeah. Joe, I mean, who hates a bad cop the most? Other cops. Good cop. Yeah. So trust me, there are plenty of great cops and I think they're doing a fantastic job on the border. But you've got to understand you still have remnants of the Biden people who are in there. And those are people who why wouldn't they look the other way? They weren't enforcing it anyway.
SPEAKER 05 :
Yep. All right.
SPEAKER 03 :
Joe, are you going to be back in Hour 3?
SPEAKER 05 :
I will be back on at 5 o'clock. Talk to you then, Andy. Sounds like a lot of fun.
SPEAKER 03 :
All right.
SPEAKER 05 :
Take care.
SPEAKER 03 :
Hey, folks, that's it for Hour 1 and Hour 2. It's going to be more with me and Luke. And then Richard Rush is going to join me to talk about the Broncos going shopping. Ooh, shopping. It's shopping time. It's NFL draft time. Until then, keep it right here on Rush Reason, KLZ 560.
SPEAKER 04 :
The Average Guy's Ordinary Average Guy.
