SPEAKER 08 : 0:07

Walter? Upstairs! Are you alright?

SPEAKER 05 : 0:13

In the floor behind the chair. This is America.

SPEAKER 02 : 0:26

Does everybody know what time it is? Fix It Radio!

SPEAKER 07 : 0:33

And it's that time, Fix It Radio, KLZ 560. Welcome on this beautiful Saturday morning here along the Quad State region here in, what did we cover, Colorado, Wyoming, Kansas, Nebraska, several states. So thank you all for listening. We appreciate it greatly. And if you haven't been out and about yet, it is a beautiful day, going to be a great day to get a few things done and might be one of your last chances to actually get a few things done around the house. Myself, Larry Ungert. Larry, welcome. Good morning. Charlie Grimes, of course, our engineer. We've got a special guest joining us here right off the bat this morning, Caleb Roth. Caleb, welcome. How are you this fine morning?

SPEAKER 09 : 1:05

Hey, good morning. I'm doing great, guys. I appreciate you having me on today.

SPEAKER 07 : 1:08

Oh, you're very welcome. Thank you for being here. Founder of Stain and Seal Supply and the CEO of Restorative Industries. Talk to us about, as I said a moment ago, some folks may want to do some things as we have a nice fall day here in Colorado, but talk to us about some wood care, different things you ought to be doing this time of year to be ready for the winter.

SPEAKER 09 : 1:27

Well, every year, you know, the leaves start changing colors and people start doing a mad dash to get their outdoor maintenance taken care of. And so that usually looks something like either cleaning or restaining and sealing, you know, their exterior wood, fences, decks, siding, log homes, things like that.

SPEAKER 07 : 1:44

And so, yeah, it's time to get it done. What do you see are some of the bigger mistakes people make, you know, along those lines? In other words, you know, walk us through the right way to do some things versus the not so right way to do it.

SPEAKER 09 : 1:56

Well, if we start from the beginning and we just assume that we're talking about something that's brand new and it's just been installed, maybe it's a new fence, maybe a deck or wood siding, most people still believe that it needs to season for a whole year. And that used to be the case, especially with treated lumber. It took a long time for the treatment process to cure properly. Nowadays, we don't have that. In Colorado and Kansas, and I think you said Nebraska, those are Those are heavily, those are a lot of cedar in those markets.

SPEAKER 08 : 2:29

Correct.

SPEAKER 09 : 2:29

So cedar is not treated. So generally what we're looking for is we want to stain and seal that wood as quickly as we can as soon as the moisture content's down below about 13%. So there's two ways to check that. The first way is you can put the palm of your hand on it in a shady area, and if it feels cool, the touch, the wood's probably still wet. If it just feels dry, it's probably dry. But you can also buy a moisture meter just about anywhere. Those are only a couple bucks, and it'll tell you exactly what the moisture is. But I think probably the biggest mistake is people just waiting too long. and the wood starts to turn and get ugly, and then you stain over top of that, and you've sort of shot yourself in the foot.

SPEAKER 07 : 3:13

Okay, that makes sense. So there is a sort of a timeline, if you would, there to where you don't want to wait too long, because if you do, now you're probably having to do some things to get some things restored to then actually do the stain and actually make it the way you want it in the first place if you wait too long. Is that what you're saying? Yeah. Yeah, that's it.

SPEAKER 09 : 3:34

You know, it's usually with new wood, a good rule of thumb is anywhere from a couple weeks up to about six months is really about as long as you want to go. You know, stains, they highlight the beauty of the wood, but they also would highlight, you know, the texture. you know the ugly of right you let the wood turn gray and ugly so it's a good idea to get it done as soon as you can and then some real simple rules of thumb for maintaining you know exterior wood or you want to wash it every year just one time a year is enough and should we do that with like a solution power washing high pressure low pressure what's the rule of thumb there Really, really, once your wood's been stained and sealed, you're just trying to keep the dust and the dirt and the grass and the leaves off of it. And then we want to just remove any chance that there could be some kind of mold or mildew growing on the surface. So there's a lot of really mild wood cleaners, deck cleaners, that you can use for that. Sodium percarbonate-based is usually a good idea, which is one of the main ingredients. And OxiClean, you use it for cleaning your carpet, cleaning your laundry. But if you do that once a year... And then flat surfaces, so horizontal surfaces like deck floors, things like that, you want to do a maintenance coat of stain every two years. And then vertical surfaces like siding and fencing, a maintenance coat about every four years. A maintenance coat is a light coat. We're not waiting until the stain fades away to nothing. When the stain's sort of lost some of its luster, it's good to do just a light maintenance coat, and that keeps it looking good. Okay. That's kind of it, real simple rules, and the thing is you've got to do it.

SPEAKER 07 : 5:14

Talk about the products that you guys have. I'm on the website, and you guys have a plethora of products, and I think this is another area where people sometimes maybe struggle a little bit, or they go to a big-box store, they ask what should they put on, and I'm not trying to badmouth the big-box stores, but sometimes that guy may have just – you know graduated high school last week and now he's advising on what stain to put on your wood not saying that he doesn't know but you know there's times Caleb where you kind of wonder you know what's the experience level really like here and was it was this guy you know just to do it yourself or prior has he ever been in the trades you know was he working an IT job three weeks ago but AI laid him off so now he's at Home Depot and again not not bad off in any of these people it's I'm glad they're working and all that but you wonder at times how much expertise is really there Well, yeah, I think we've all experienced that.

SPEAKER 09 : 6:01

I think the thing to think about when you're trying to pick a product for your home or for whatever exterior wood you're working on is you have water-based and oil-based. And we're a big proponent of oil-based. Okay, and why is that? What's the difference and why is that? Think about this. If you had an old pair of leather boots and they were dried and cracked – Would you want to put a water-based product on it, or would you want to put an oil-based product on it? Oil-based. You know, a good oil-based product. Now, there is a caveat to that. We don't like high VOC products. You know, I know Colorado is like the only state that water flows out of but not into, so I know it's important there, too. Right. And so we want to use a product that's ultra-low VOC, and we developed our stains to be that. But you need a lot of pigment, which pigments what protects the wood from the sun. Right. Think of that as the sunscreen. You need something in your product to seal the wood from weather, rain, water damage, things like that. And then you need something to condition the wood, which would be the oil part of the product. So we have an oil-based product that's ultra-low VOC. It's one of the lowest VOC ratings, I guess. in the whole U.S. for an oil-based product. And we do that because it's just made up of oil. It's not made up of a lot of harsh solvents. There are some very small trace amounts of solvents and things. But we tend to try to – we want something that you can live on. We don't – You don't want to stay in your fence or deck for six months in the backyard. You smell it. You know, you've got toddlers walking around back there. So we recommend a good low or ultra-low VOC oil-based product that's going to condition the wood. And we like a penetrating stain. If you put a stain on your wood that creates a surface film, Like a shiny stain. Sometimes the shiny exterior stains are popular. They're great. They're beautiful until they start to crack. Or wear through if it's a deck you're walking on or whatever. And then if water gets under it, it cannot get out of it because it's sealed with that layer of like a latex or plastic. And so... So the maintenance on those types of stains are just a lot more – they require a lot more labor, a lot more input, and a lot more cost because generally you have to strip them with chemicals or a blaster, like a sand blaster, a media blaster. And particularly for log homes, that can mean a $100,000 difference in maintenance over a 15- or 20-year period. Right. So really, any type of stain that goes into the wood and protects the wood from the inside out is a good choice. We do offer those, stain and seal supply. The way we really got into the business was through service, so doing the work. We still have a service business going. That's a franchise called Stain and Seal Experts. So what we've found with all of our customers is, you know, oil-based penetrating stains look beautiful. They're low-maintenance, and they're easy to maintain. And so all our customers seem to really be happy with it. That's kind of a trend among most professional wood care contractors. They want something that's easy to install, easy to maintain, and good for the environment.

SPEAKER 07 : 9:15

So that's the line we try to ride. You said it a moment ago, too, here in Colorado, yes, we have a lot of cedar. Also have a lot of redwood in our area, even though we don't produce those trees. You know, that wood is, of course, brought in, but there's a lot of... of decks and things along those lines that are made out of that particular you know that particular wood and again those are things that need to have some maintenance done to them on a periodic basis now question i've got when it comes to you know redwood deck which there's a lot here in colorado Do you have to sand all that off? Does it depend? I mean, is that sort of a question where you really need to know what, you know, what you're at and if you let it go too long, are you then in that, you know, not only are you just washing it off, but are you having to sand some things off at the same time? In other words, to put your product on, does it have to be stain free or how does that work?

SPEAKER 09 : 10:01

Yeah, so it's a water penetration test. You've probably heard this before. You sprinkle some drops of water on the wood. If it absorbs water, then it will absorb stain also. That's kind of the universal rule of thumb to use. Now, as far as sanding goes, this will be kind of a tip for the audience that will take their projects over the top. So if you go into the world of the Internet and you look at photos of contractors who restore, finish, or refinish exterior decking, The most beautiful projects in the world, those contractors always sand the deck. It just makes a difference. They sand it with 80 grit. Now, a lot of people want to go 120 or 220. They think they're doing a good job. But if you go beyond 60 or 80 grit, you're going to close the pores of the wood. Make it hard for stain to absorb. So if you have brand new wood, it'll never hurt to sand it, but you don't have to sand it if it's brand new. But if you've cleaned it, It's turned gray. You've cleaned it. It's usually a good idea to just go across the top. A nice light sanding with 80 grit really makes the difference. It makes the wood grain pop a lot more. And it doesn't matter if it's Western cedar, if it's redwood, you know, all of them, you know, even the pines from the East Coast, all of those lumbers pretty much react the same. And so it's a pretty simple and straightforward process.

SPEAKER 07 : 11:23

Now, once it's stained, and this is, I think, again, another misconception some folks have, and I assume it has to do with the product that you're using, do you have to put any other kind of a top coat on the stain to keep the water from getting down into the wood and so on? Or if you use the proper stain, that's enough?

SPEAKER 09 : 11:40

No, we recommend a stain and sealer in one. And so a product with a lot of oil in it is going to repel water. But it's also, because of the nature of oil, if water gets trapped in the wood or wicks up from the ground, maybe the fence is touching the ground or the deck's really close to the ground, an oil-based product that's penetrating will still allow any vapor or moisture in the wood to come out, which is very, very important because if you paint your deck or use a solid film-form coating on a deck, especially ones close to the ground, the water can't get out. So you'll see a lot of decks will rot quite quickly with those type products on them when they're close to the ground like that. Right.

SPEAKER 07 : 12:26

Yeah. Okay, that makes sense. And so, and again, if you have any questions, please send me a text message. We can get an answer to it pretty quick while we have Caleb on with us. 307-282-22, 307-282-22. Now, to apply this, and again, throughout the years, I've seen guys use, you know, airless sprayers. I've seen guys use backpack, you know, sprayers like you would to spray weeds. I've seen folks roll it on, paint it on, you know, the brush. What's the best way to do that?

SPEAKER 09 : 12:56

Well, you can do it anyway, just like you said. If we're talking about decking, it's hard to beat a brush. Again, the best-looking jobs always have stain that's applied with a big, nice, natural bristle brush, all the stains brushed in. That's a great way to do it. If you have spindles or fencing and things like that, any type of sprayer really works. But what you're looking for is you think of your wood like a dry sponge. We want to apply stain to the wood saturation point. So once the wood becomes saturated, it will... Or you might say to refusal. You know, the... The wood will take so much oil, and then it stops. When it stops, we stop. And so a good rule of thumb for vertical surfaces is just flood-coated on. If there's any runs or lap marks, that means you probably don't have enough stain on there. If everything has leveled itself out nicely, then you've done a good job. If you have a deck... One of the biggest reasons for failures in decking staining is over-application of stains. The American way is more is better, but it's not always the case. It's a good idea when you finish staining the floor of your deck to wait maybe 30 minutes, and then if there's any shiny spots... or any puddling or pooling stain on the deck floor, you just wipe it off, just similar to what you would do for furniture. You wipe it away, and you'll have, I guess you might say, a flawless finish.

SPEAKER 07 : 14:27

These are great tips and not something that a lot of folks probably have ever had any instruction on. I mean, honestly, Caleb, I don't think most people really, I mean, they sort of watch a neighbor or they've watched their dad or their granddad or whatever the case, or they saw a video and so off they go. And I don't know that anybody's really, personally, I've never had anybody like you that I've talked to to say, yep, this is the proper way to do this or the improper way. Fortunately, I've done pretty good on my own just because of everything you've said is sort of what i just sort of i guess common sense said yeah this makes sense although i will say this uh the 80 grit thing makes a ton of sense i'm not sure i would have gotten that one on my own because you know kind of being a car guy and knowing the finish on that side there you want everything to be as smooth as possible before you put your last you know primer paint all of that on in this case no you want the opposite

SPEAKER 09 : 15:18

yep yep we want to open the wood grain so it but you're right it is simple um we do teach classes on this we've got a program called stain and seal university and people come out to we're outside of nashville tennessee okay and we get a couple hundred contractors every year that come out and we teach them teach them how to do this stuff and it's uh it's pretty fun and interesting and but it is very we'll call it advanced basics it doesn't take a whole lot of knowledge to get a great finished product. You just got to be willing to follow the steps and trust the process. So yeah, I think any of your listeners, if you've got time, here's another thing that's probably very important for you guys over in Colorado.

SPEAKER 07 : 15:58

And really quick, remember too, that we've got a large listening audience, a lot of folks up in the mountains, some listening might even have log type homes, cabins, things like that. So make sure we throw that in there as well.

SPEAKER 09 : 16:09

Yeah. So a lot of particularly water-based and a lot of oil-based stains have temperature restrictions. But generally speaking, penetrating oils, they have a lot more oil in them. They're actually real oil-type products. Those products can be used generally in any temperature. So if it's below freezing, if it's 110 degrees, if it's direct sunlight or shade, it doesn't matter. because oil doesn't freeze, and as long as the wood is dry, the wood has to be dry, the oil will absorb right into the wood, no problem. And so that's helpful for those that maybe waited a little too long, and you're starting to have some cold nights.

SPEAKER 07 : 16:50

You've still got time to get it done. Good to know. Well, and for us, we're now entering into our least humid season, time of the year. Now, our audience, of course, we've got folks in more humid areas, but here in the front range of Denver, and you head up into the mountains and that, you know, we'll enter into now very, very, people don't realize, they think, well, it's snowing, it's got to be high humidity. No, actually, it's kind of the opposite. And we'll drop all the way down humidity-wise into the, you know, not even the low teens, but down, you know, 10, 12% in the wintertime, Caleb. So we get to where we have very little moisture in the air. Yeah, that is a big miss.

SPEAKER 09 : 17:26

You're the only person I've ever heard that identified with me on that because same thing here in Nashville. We're high humidity in the summer, but low humidity in the winter. And so our wood is actually quite a bit drier in the wintertime than it is in the summer.

SPEAKER 07 : 17:39

Which to me means you should try to do these projects now, not in July. Yeah, and Denver's dry in the summertime compared to what we are. Oh, yeah, compared to you guys, absolutely. But even here, we can get into the 30%, 40%, which I know for some it's like, well, yeah, that's nothing. But to us, it's high. When you're not used to it, we get into a 40%. We had a couple of days this year where it got up to 70% or 80%. I think everybody here was dying. You guys are used to that all summer long. Oh, yeah. That's funny. Again, so when it comes to the log cabin end of things, because that's another one where I think there's a lot of misconceptions when it comes to cabins of what needs to be done. And by the way, Caleb, I think this even comes from, and I've owned some in the past, so I think this I can relate to. You talk to five different contractors, you're going to get five different answers on what you need to do with your cabin, and I'm not exaggerating when I say that.

SPEAKER 09 : 18:34

Oh, yeah. Well, that's the way it is. Really, it comes down to what product they're comfortable with using. The way I look at it, after years and years of seeing cabins and doing cabin restoration projects, what we notice is that cabins are a lot of work. They're a lot of maintenance. And some of the biggest problems that we see from cabins come from, one, lack of maintenance and the product that's put on it. Again, these film-forming products, they're beautiful when they go on because it makes the wood look like furniture. It's glossy. But the wood is completely sealed, but then the finish cracks or breaks because the wood expands and contracts. I've seen that, yes. You get water up under it, and then now we start having black spots. We start having failure of the stain. We start having mold, mildew, rot, things like this. The only thing, you know, your grandpa or your great-grandpa probably put oil on his, you know, his axe or hammer handles and...

SPEAKER 07 : 19:27

things like that and and you know they've been i guess all the way back to noah's ark we've been using oil on wood yeah good point we know it works great point it's tried and true great point okay again okay so move us to the inside because i know a lot of cabins whether they're getting built from scratch or even after the fact uh even on the inside we'll need some maintenance i assume your product can go interior exterior because of that low voc i'm assuming you can use it anywhere

SPEAKER 09 : 19:52

Yeah, you can. We also do have a product made specifically for log cabins. It's called our log and timber oil. It's the brand's expert log and timber oil. I see that. Yeah, but it's got about six essential oils in it that keep termites alive. carpenter bees, boring insects, even mosquitoes, things like that out of the wood. And it's a natural treatment. There are some chemical treatments that are a lot stronger and they'll definitely kill anything that gets nearby. But some of the things to look out for on your cabin are are going to be anywhere where you have large cracks, anything really over a quarter of an inch. Those cracks need to be filled with a backer rod, which is a foam rod, and then caulking. Any cracks that go all the way to the edge of a log Because if it goes all the way to the edge, then wind can blow and go through there. Water can go through there and get into the home. Those are big deals. And any cracks facing upward, water can fall into the crack and not fall back out. So those are things to look for. And then, again, if you see the cabins that last the longest, they've been oiled. You know, I think it's probably a bold statement, but... There are some stains and top coats out there for cabins that, you know, the cabin would last longer if you just didn't do anything to it.

SPEAKER 07 : 21:10

No, I agree with you on that one. Absolutely. No, I've experienced and seen exactly what you're talking about. No, I don't think that's a bold statement at all. I think you're spot on.

SPEAKER 09 : 21:19

But yeah, as far as, you know, removing those old finishes, it can be done. Usually the best way to do it is with a media blaster. Right. I recommend glass blasting. There is corn cob and walnut shell blasting, but that's organic matter, and it gets into the cracks and crevices of the wood, and it can grow mushrooms. It can cause mold and things like that. So the glass is, it's kind of like sand. It looks just like sand. That's really going to give you your best job, and And, again, you know, the southern exposure in the northern hemisphere is usually going to be the side that needs the most maintenance. That's right. Every couple years do that, and then, you know, probably twice as long you can wait to do the rest of the cabin. But if you do them right and you use the right kind of products, you know, good oils, you can really, really extend the life of those cabins.

SPEAKER 07 : 22:06

One last question, and I assume that this is a type of product that you can add to anything, but you've got an essential oil wood stain enhancement that is a defense mechanism against certain types of insects and so on. Talk about that for a moment. There may be folks out there. Again, we've got folks listening in a really broad area, and they may be struggling with that end of things and trying to figure out how do I make this insect-proof. You have an answer.

SPEAKER 09 : 22:31

Well, there's a lot of products in the world out there. We have Borate. We have lots of different things that manufacturers make. But one of the things that we've stood on in our company is we want products that aren't going to kill us. And so, you know, because people that use our products generally, they're exposed to them on a daily basis.

SPEAKER 07 : 22:49

That's right.

SPEAKER 09 : 22:50

So we always think about this. And so there are some known, like essential oils and other things. But for this conversation, we're talking specifically essential oils that are known to repel and sometimes even kill insects. specific insects, and they are exempt from EPA registration because they're safe. So citronella oil, cedarwood oil, things like that. And so we have a product. I think there's five or six oils in it. It says on the label. Can't remember. And those are essential oils. There's no filler in it. It's 100% essential oils. And that product is called Natural Defense. It can mix in any oil-based or water-based paint or stain. You can even mix it in water and spray it on your wood. But it keeps away. The list is a mile long.

SPEAKER 07 : 23:39

I see it. Yeah, I noticed that.

SPEAKER 09 : 23:43

Lizards, iguanas, rats, snakes, termites, boring bees. It does quite a lot. It does not affect honeybees. We still see honeybees. We still see a few wasps. But it smells great. And some people just spray it in the backyard before they have a birthday party.

SPEAKER 07 : 23:58

Some people put it on their wood a couple times a year. And so it does a good job. Okay. What's the website folks can go to, Caleb?

SPEAKER 09 : 24:07

Best place to find out more is probably stainandsealsupply.com, all spelled out.

SPEAKER 07 : 24:12

All right, and I'll put that in my notes for all of you as well. Caleb, I appreciate it. In fact, you're welcome anytime. This has been really great, useful information. Again, we have got a lot of people listening that have everything from you know fences and decks and cedar siding on their homes and log cabins and all the different types of log cabins as you know because it's not just a log cabin there's multiple ways as you know to to build it in the logs and everything along those lines so a lot of people listening i'm sure this is great information for them i've learned some things today so thank you caleb a bunch i appreciate it great audience has any questions we we have a technical support line you don't have to buy anything from us give us a call tell us what you're working on okay

SPEAKER 09 : 24:49

know um how to handle other products that we don't sell we also know how to deal and handle with our own and we'd be happy to help you and uh so thank you for the opportunity it's been great to you this morning no i appreciate it caleb again thank you so much and you're welcome anytime thanks

SPEAKER 07 : 25:04

All right, man. You bet. Have a great night. Great afternoon, I should say. And because he's, what, probably two hours ahead of us. So he's about 1130 right now. Yeah, yeah. So anyway, that was great. Great information. Dave Hart's going to join us in a minute. We're going to talk about roofs, which, by the way, coincide with a lot of what we just got done talking about as well. We'll be right back. Fix It Radio, KLZ 560.

SPEAKER 02 : 25:22

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SPEAKER 07 : 27:19

All right, we are back. Fix It Radio, KLZ 560. That was very interesting, very informative, and hope you guys all enjoyed that as well. Dave Hart joining us now, Roof Savers of Colorado. Dave, what's up? How are you doing this morning? Very good. And what we're going to talk about with you really dovetails into the whole wood conversation about how do you take care of your wood and keep it, in a lot of ways, the same as your roof. How do you keep it soft and pliable and keep that oil in there to where the wood's not getting damaged and so on. And really, that same thing when it comes to the RoofMax product, it's almost one and the same, Dave. It's the same principle, right? It really is. It's almost, I mean, it's not identical, but it's the same idea.

SPEAKER 10 : 27:59

Well, it's just rejuvenating. It's good things that last longer, good things that work and perform like they're meant to, and how you do that and save money in the process.

SPEAKER 07 : 28:08

Well, and that's where in your product, one thing, and we don't probably talk about this enough, and, you know, Caleb was talking about how, you know, his product is very safe. He knows people are going to be around it, which, by the way, you know, even though, you know, you and I and most everybody listening, you know, we by no means are, you know, what I would say, quote, unquote, tree huggers, although my father taught me, you know, you leave things better than you actually...

SPEAKER 10 : 28:28

found them and i'm all for you know if it's a product that is is is more safe especially for us to be around like caleb was talking about then of course i'd rather use that well your product is very much the same way very much yeah it's we're all our product is made it's all bio-based um and there's no harmful chemicals in it at all there's no vocs in it it's all oil-based product and you know it's pet friendly plant friendly human friendly i wouldn't recommend drinking a glass of it but i mean it's

SPEAKER 07 : 28:57

No, he probably wouldn't recommend, you know, his stain, you know, doing the same thing, but it's the type of product where, you know, you and I both know, I mean, there's other products out there, stains and cleaners and things like that, even things, you know, the folks that are, you know, even doing roof repair and things like that where, man alive, one little whiff of that and you're thinking, man, how could you be around this all day long applying it, number one, but then number two, I'm going to listen, you know, I'm going to. I'm going to smell the off-gassing of that for who knows how long. And some people are really sensitive to that, Dave, as you know. I guess being around the auto industry as long as I am, not a big deal for me. But there are some people where that becomes a really big deal.

SPEAKER 10 : 29:34

It is. And you wouldn't think it. And you and I have talked, you know, off air about it quite a bit, just things that we put in our homes. I mean, people just even new carpet or new paint or whatever. People get really sick with that stuff. I used to do mold remediation years ago. It's just the simplest little thing can set people off and send them to the hospital.

SPEAKER 07 : 29:51

Right.

SPEAKER 10 : 29:52

Anything that requires you to wear a mask when you're applying, you kind of have to question.

SPEAKER 07 : 29:55

Yeah, great point. That's a great point. Yeah, no, and in your case, you don't have to. I mean, the only time you're probably wearing a mask up there is if there's a bunch of other junk in the air that you're trying to, you know, allergies or whatever the case may be, but you're not wearing it for the product you're putting down.

SPEAKER 10 : 30:10

No, it has virtually no smell to it. We get our product, it comes in a massive 270-gallon plastic tote. If you pull the lid off that, you're going to smell something, but it doesn't make you cough, it doesn't irritate your eyes, your throat, nothing.

SPEAKER 07 : 30:25

So it's very bio-friendly, very environmentally friendly. Okay, so what is it, for everybody who may be tuning in for the first time, what is it actually doing to, you know, we're talking about asphalt shingle roofs here, what's it actually doing to the shingle?

SPEAKER 10 : 30:42

Well, I'll just go back to this real fast. So as the shingles sit on your roof, it's very much like the roads that we drive on every day that are made of asphalt. But 80% of the shingle is made of asphalt. So it sits up on the roof. As you guys are talking with the wood stuff, and we're very dry out here in this climate, and then it gets very warm. And so the petrol oils in that asphalt evaporate. And when that happens, it causes the shingles to dry out, which leads to granule loss, which is the grit that's on the shingles that gives you the color. And then when those granules come off, now you're losing UV protection, but then they start to dry out and they can't expand and contract any longer. just like the roads you drive on. So when they can't expand and contract, you get the cracks.

SPEAKER 07 : 31:27

And that cracks involve what then water can actually, just like he was talking about with, again, so similar when we're talking about the wood versus talking about the shingles. I mean, you get those cracks, things start to separate, the water starts to flow in. In our case, in the winter, we didn't even talk about this with him, but... In our case, where we do get a really, really hard freeze or it starts dripping way down, it can thaw out during the day, but it gets super cold and freezes at night. You get that freeze-thaw, that same thing can affect your roof.

SPEAKER 10 : 31:55

Absolutely. It just makes the cracks bigger. And so what this product does, it helps if they haven't started cracking yet, it prevents that from happening. It's very similar to putting lotion on your dry skin. So it just rehydrates that, prevents the cracks from happening. If you already have some minor thermal crackings, It'll reseal those cracks back up again. So it's just basically taking that shingle and making it as close to new as it possibly can. And it's fantastic. And as you know, we're growing like crazy, not only locally but nationally. And so it's really taken off.

SPEAKER 07 : 32:27

Well, and there's probably people listening, Dave, that would say, okay, time out. Why would I worry about actually maintaining and putting a product on my roof? Because, you know, at the end of the day, I'll just wait for that hailstorm to come along or that windstorm to come along. And, you know what, I'll just get the insurance to buy me a new roof when it's all said and done. I'm paying my premium. They owe me a roof anyway. So I'll just do that when that time comes, Dave. So why would I bother having you out?

SPEAKER 10 : 32:51

That is a very large question in a very few words. The main reason being is the differences or the changes that are happening within the insurance industry now. They're not paying the way they used to. If they do agree to pay for a roof, now your deductible is twice as much as it was, if not more.

SPEAKER 07 : 33:09

And a lot of people really let me stop for a moment there, Dave. And for all of you listening, read your policy, depending upon who you got your policy from. You may not even know what your roof deductible is, because in a lot of cases, your roof deductible deductible may be very different from your regular, you know. What I want to say, your regular deductible, or if you've got any kind of other damage, storm damage, something like that, Dave, at the end of the day, most likely your roof deductible for a replacement is different than the rest of your policy deductible, and you might not even know that.

SPEAKER 10 : 33:43

Correct. Yes, we have two different deductibles or two different parts of the policy. We have all peril, which is if you get a house fire, you don't ever have that. But let's say you do, it's a total loss. That's all peril. You might have $1,000 deductible for that. but then you have what they call the wind and hail portion of it. So you might have a much larger deductible for wind and hail because it's a lot more frequent when that happens. So again, insurance companies are just trying to keep money in their pocket and not pay out any more than they have to. And so over the years, because there's been so much hail, basically started in 2008, we started getting a lot more hail out here. Now everybody's got new roofs and all that, so they're looking for ways to keep money in their pocket and not pay out. Well, in the last two years, three years especially, deductibles have doubled. In a lot of cases, it's not even tripled. And, you know, in my personal house, I have a percentage deductible, so I'm looking at $10,000 for wind and hail if it were to happen. So that's what's happening. So the more we can get away from relying on the insurance company, the better. And it would be better for us statewide. You know, they're not going to keep raising their rates as much if we're not using them as much. But, again, it just keeps the roof alive and on the top of your house where it belongs. They're not putting them in landfills. And again, like you, I'm not a big tree hugger, but why waste a product if we don't have to?

SPEAKER 07 : 35:10

And I look at roofing and being an old car guy like I am, and everybody listening kind of would maybe follow along with me. And please, I think Dave can attest to this. And I understand it's a little different with a house as it is to your car. But Dave, I'm one of those guys where... You know, if you never have to mess with it, so the factory finish on your vehicle, that's why the paintless dent removal has become such a big deal. If you don't have to mess with that factory finish, you're better off on down the road. I kind of look at the roof the same way. If I can keep that from having to be stripped off and have a new one laid on, I feel at the end of the day I'm ahead. Absolutely, 100%. And you're a roofer, so you're like talking to the collision expert on the car end of things, and I know would also agree with me, even though he's in that industry, you are as well. I mean, you'll put a roof on, you're never hesitant to do so, but I think you're like me. If you can keep from doing so, at the end of the day, you're still better off.

SPEAKER 10 : 36:07

Yeah, and that's a good point. That's the big approach that we have when we go meet with our clients is we're there on the client's best interest. We get up, we look at the roof, we determine the condition that's in, ask a few questions, and then we get together afterwards and say, okay, what makes sense? And I always tell them you can do one of three things. And you can replace it, you can treat it, or you can do nothing. Obviously, one of the first two. But our goal is how do we save the client money first? That's how we look at the roof first. And if for some reason it doesn't make sense to spend the money on the treatment, and it would make more sense to put that money towards a replacement, then we're going to advise that. But at the end of the day, it's up to the customer how they want to handle it. And so we're a little different than most roofing companies out there. But, yeah, we can replace it. We can do the RoofMax treatment on them. We're doing a lot of flat roof coatings now too. So there's a lot that we can do, and we do provide a lot of options for our customers.

SPEAKER 07 : 37:00

Yep. And, again, for those of you listening, I'm not saying it just because Dave's here, but I'm one of those, Dave, where if you can save – And I get it. Sometimes that's impossible. You just you got to go ahead and bite the bullet and do a complete replacement of whatever it happens to be. I fully get that. But there's other times where, you know, I was talking to Hunter from Cub Creek, you know, not long ago and do interviews with him all the time as well. And he's got the same philosophy when it comes to your furnace. It's like, you know what, if we can take this older furnace, even though it might be only an 80 percent efficient, if you look at what a new furnace cost is and yeah, there's going to be some savings on your daily bill. But at the end of the day, if we can keep what you have running even longer than it is right now and get you several more years out of it, the math still makes sense to keep that old furnace running. It's no different here with your roof, Dave.

SPEAKER 10 : 37:43

It's the same thing. You know, and if you think about it, if – and Hunter's great. He does all my stuff, too, and I love having him come out and take care of our stuff for us. But if you look at it, let's say you have to replace your roof. That's obviously going to be your most expensive option versus treating. Well, at some point, it's just like normal consumer – consumerism, if that's a word. At some point, those costs get passed down. So if you're out replacing a bunch of roofs, somewhere down the line, we're all paying for it, especially if insurance gets involved. So anything we can do to keep that roof alive, keep it on the roof, then we're all the better for it. And we actually do a lot of treatments, too, that have some hail damage on them because it didn't make sense for that customer to call and make a claim, but we want to keep that roof alive and going. So I think the days of getting new roofs just because you have a hail event, hail damage, are over. And now I think we need to... keep the roof alive, even with hail damage.

SPEAKER 07 : 38:41

Well, that leads to my next conversation, because you've experienced some of these of late, and that is folks are getting letters in the mail that basically say, hey, guess what? Because of your roof and the condition of, we're going to go ahead and just cancel your policy. Unless you do something about that roof, we're just going to go ahead and let you go to another provider because we're not going to continue to carry insurance on this. You've been able to Step in, talk to the insurance company, do a treatment and still keep those insurance policies in effect. And I want to highlight that because I don't think folks really quite understand what's going on on that end of things.

SPEAKER 10 : 39:13

No, it's you know, we saw it happen last year. It would get one call a month with that situation. Now we're getting two or three a week of people's insurance being, you know, get a letter threatening to cancel most of their days unless they replace a roof. Well, now they have no hail damage to fall back on. Or if they do, it's too old to claim now. So now they can't make a claim to get it replaced. But who's got $15,000, $18,000, $20,000 sitting around to replace a roof? Not many people do. And so now what do we do now? Now we go in for a fraction of that cost. We can treat the roof. We work with the insurance company, getting the underwriters the appropriate information, and we're getting policies extended for the life of that treatment for another five years. So it's really come along and helping them out. So the insurance companies are really starting to see more and more of what we're able to do. And then we're also being able to provide that option with the clients and keeping them assured and they don't have to shop anywhere anymore. And it's great for their insurance agents because now they're paid a commission on the policies that they have. And so now it's keeping their book of business alive and their pocketbooks happy, too. So it's a win-win for everybody. We're keeping materials out of the landfill. We're keeping the shingles on the roof where they belong, keeping them insured, keeping insurance agents happy. It's a win-win.

SPEAKER 07 : 40:35

No, it really is. And I think, too, what you just said is really important because you get a relationship established with a particular agent or broker or company or maybe all three, by the way, and you're happy with all of that, and yet something's happened to where that's not going to be able to continue. Well, in your case, you might be able to continue those relationships and keep moving forward with your product.

SPEAKER 10 : 40:59

Absolutely. And even if somebody wanted to shop around because they got one of those letters, a lot of insurance companies are getting more proactive in doing roof inspections now. So they'll do a quick drive-by with the pair of renal catheters and go, oh, that roof looks old, so we're not going to insure them. Or we will insure them, but you're not going to get roof coverage or you're going to get half the coverage you would want. So at the end of the day, we're ready to keep that roof alive no matter what. And it just makes sense to try and keep things as is, keep that roof alive, keep your insurance going, and

SPEAKER 07 : 41:29

And not stress over finding somebody else. Now, the other thing I know and we don't talk enough about, which we need to start talking more about, is the fact that, okay, you're going to do a roof treatment, and there's an expense there. And, you know, it could be a few thousand dollars depending upon the roof and the square footage and so on. But let's just say round numbers, it's three grand. Well, that particular homeowner may not have $3,000 in their pocket, which, you know, I get depending upon the time of the year. Uh, that might be the case for some people, jobs, et cetera. Uh, you know, holidays, whatever. And maybe, maybe you do, but you want to keep that money because you've got Christmas coming or whatever. You have the ability to help people fund that. Don't you?

SPEAKER 10 : 42:06

We do. Yeah. I use two different companies that we, we offer financing. Um, and they're both great. And, uh, you know, one of, one of which I'm actually working with a little bit right now to see if we can get a longer deal going with them, but they do have a 12 month, uh, you know, no interest, uh, plan, if you will. Okay. Um, yeah, 0% interest for 12 months. A lot of people will take that and, and, uh, sure.

SPEAKER 07 : 42:30

Why not?

SPEAKER 10 : 42:30

Money in the bank, but we'll pay it off in 12 months. It's free money. Right. Um, so they use that a lot. The other one actually does have a pretty decent payments as far as, uh, low monthly payments. And either one you can use for a re-roof as well. You can use for larger projects if you want.

SPEAKER 07 : 42:47

So let's use a scenario. Let's say you're going to do the roof max treatment, but there's also some other repairs and things that need done. Maybe there's a gutter issue, a downspout, some flashing, a few shingles actually need to be replaced. Let's say that's a scenario. Can you still fund all of that?

SPEAKER 10 : 43:02

Absolutely, 100% of it, yeah. And I'm pretty sure they don't. I'm 99% sure they do not require any kind of a down payment. Okay. So it's just, if it's a $5,000 ticket, they'll finance it for $5,000.

SPEAKER 07 : 43:15

Well, and here's where I'm going with this, because some would say, well, guys, you know, wait a minute, you're basically encouraging people to go into debt to keep their roof up. No, look at it this way. I mean, yes, that, I guess, is the scenario, but... You're paying money for insurance on either a monthly, quarterly, six-month, or annual basis anyways. In some cases, it's coming out of your monthly mortgage payment depending upon how you do things. Some people pay directly to the insurance company because your mortgage or you don't have one, whatever the case. In other cases, it's coming right out of escrow. So keep in mind, at the end of the day, you're making money. a monthly quote-unquote debt payment to your insurance company anyways. Well, you could actually sit down with Dave and figure out, you know, wait a minute, maybe I should actually look at doing my roof treatment, raising my deductible on my insurance, especially on the roof end of things, knowing that I'm doing this treatment now, and at the end of the day, you may not be paying any more money out on a monthly basis when it's all said and done. That's where I'm going with this, Dave.

SPEAKER 10 : 44:17

Yeah, 100%. It's that. I forget the exact technical term for it, but it's absolutely the case. And a lot of times, let's say you're going to switch to an insurance company, your rates are going to go up anyway for that from where you're at. But even if, let's say, worst-case scenario, we have to replace the roof, and you're financing that at whatever that payment would be, well, now you're also going to get new roof discounts, and a lot of companies are still providing discounts for Class 4. So you're getting a pretty hefty discount on your premium, which will – cover the majority of that monthly payment anyway for doing a new roof. So it's all that cost of benefit.

SPEAKER 07 : 44:52

Yeah, and that's where, thank you, and that's where for some of you listening, it's worth sitting down and having a conversation. Don't just write it off that, well, that's an expense I can't afford. Well, you're probably in a way already paying for it, and there might be ways to actually sit down and redo something Some of what you have, that's where you bring Dave in, get your current policy out, figure out what some of your deductibles currently are, looking at things and saying, you know, wait a minute, let's do this. Let's get your agents involved here and say, OK, if we go and treat the roof for X money and X monthly payment, what can we actually do to lower the policy cost here when it's all said and done by raising? You're deductible, especially on the roof end of things, because, by the way, there's options there. You can raise it because a lot of them will say, sure, well, we'll give you a lower rate if you want to raise that. Basically be a little bit self-insured if you would. And at the end of the day, Dave, they're not paying any more money out.

SPEAKER 10 : 45:39

No, they're not. And even just a quick example, we've got a house that we're currently trying to sell, and the policy was renewed, and Paul helped me get that taken care of, and I went with the $12,000 wind and hail deductible, but that dropped my premiums $3,000. It was about $2,500 a year. Wow, that's a lot. That's a big chunk of money.

SPEAKER 07 : 45:55

Yeah, and if you do that over, you know, you look at the RoofMax product being at least a five-year product, that's a huge savings, Dave. Absolutely, yeah.

SPEAKER 10 : 46:02

So, again, that's what we're all about. We just, at some point, everything has an end, right? Yeah. We can only extend things so long. But anything we can do to prevent the inevitable and save money in the long run, that way people have time to save up for a new roof if they need to. But at the same time, at some point we're going to have to replace it. But we're all about just trying to save people money the best we can. And I love doing the roof max treatments. I think it's a fantastic option for, I would say, 85% to 90% of the people out there.

SPEAKER 07 : 46:31

Fully agree. No, it's on my roof, folks. Probably getting close to where I need another treatment here. We'll look at that here probably this winter because I'm up against that five-year mark. That's how long we've been doing stuff. And for those of you listening, I wouldn't be mentioning this if I didn't believe in it. And I'm also a guy. that you guys all know me. I believe one of the best ways to save money is don't be overinsured. Do some insurance, you know, self-insure some things on your own if you would. Raise those deductibles up. That's one way to do that. You save money on premiums. Keep some money in your pocket. But, yeah, you're going to have to spend some of that premium money on some of the things that we're talking about. But still, at the end of the day, we just did the math a moment ago. You're still saving money. You just gave a great example of that, Dave.

SPEAKER 10 : 47:12

Yeah, best case you're not coming up with any extra. You might be breaking even, but it's not a bad day either.

SPEAKER 07 : 47:17

Well, and you also have, and I want to throw this in there, you've got the peace of mind that, hey, my roof's in great shape. I don't have to worry about it.

SPEAKER 1 : 47:23

100%.

SPEAKER 07 : 47:24

Yeah.

SPEAKER 10 : 47:25

And the product does provide additional hail protection, too. So if you don't have it currently, it's going to give you another 33% of protection against hail.

SPEAKER 07 : 47:33

And I'll throw one more in that's on the wind side as well, because I know in my case the wind blows super hard where I'm at, and since doing the treatment, we've had zero issues. Absolutely. How do folks get a hold of you, Dave? Absolutely. 303-710-6916 or go to roofsaversco.com. All right. And if you miss any of that, just go to Fix-It Radio, Drive Radio, any of my websites, you're going to find Dave there. Roof Savers of Colorado make it easy that way as well. So fixitradio.com takes you right to Dave also. Dave, man, I appreciate it. Enjoy the beautiful day. Spend some time outside, and we'll talk this week. All right, man. You bet. Appreciate it very much. Let's do this. We'll take our last break. We'll come back, finish a few things up. Fix It Radio, KLZ 560.

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SPEAKER 07 : 51:19

All right, we are back. Fix It Radio, KLZ 560. And I got just a moment ago, I'll say it straight up, a really stupid comment on the text line that said, nothing like an hour-long commercial. And so my comment back was, you know what? If you'd like to write the check for the airtime for all the shows that I do on a weekly basis, be my guest. But it's guys like Dave Hart, by the way, that do write those checks that make sure that we're on air and we do the things that we do on a regular basis. And on top of that, I feel like the information that not only that we gained from Caleb Roth, which I didn't look at that one as a commercial. Caleb, yes, he owns a business, but he gave us a lot of information and even said, listen, you can use somebody else's product. I don't care if you've got questions. Call him. He'll help you. At the end of the day, that was definitely not a commercial. That was a help on how do you get things stained properly, take care of wood, your cabin, all those different things. In Dave's case, sure, I'm promoting Dave and his business because at the end of the day, by the way, if you use Dave, you will, in fact, save money. I'm not sure anybody really understands that, but I do. That's why I'm a big believer in Dave and his product. By the way, he's the best roofer that I've ever had in my entire life. He can fix things that, frankly, no other roofer can, and I'm living proof of that because I had one particular leak on my house that I think I went through three different roofers until finally finding Dave. This one was really tough to find, but Dave actually found it, fixed it, got it handled, and wouldn't give up until he actually did. It's rare to find a roofer that will actually do that. So, sure, I'm going to throw Dave a bone periodically. He's one of my best sponsors out there, supports a lot of the things that I do here on a daily basis, and a lot of the programs that you hear us on is because of guys like Dave Hart and the fact that he writes the checks to make sure that we're on air to do the things that we do. So, by the way, again, dumbest comment I think I've ever heard. And I'll say this. I'm never afraid to say this. If you don't like the content in what I'm saying, there's a dial. You can turn it. If you don't like it, be my guest. Because, frankly, I hate those types of comments because that just shows your absolute ignorance when it comes to how things work, meaning you've never in your life written a check for probably anything along these lines. So I'll just say that. I don't normally get too defensive when it comes to text messages until they're as ignorant as that comment is.

SPEAKER 03 : 53:31

Well, and I don't understand it because I'm listening to Dave's – It's pew on the air, and I'm not taking that as a commercial. I'm taking that as information that I can take home and use.

SPEAKER 07 : 53:43

And again, this person says back, there should be more time. There should be time for more than a commercial, but it's your show. Yeah, you know what? It actually is. I dedicate my time. I dedicate, especially on Saturdays, most of my day to do this show. I don't make a boatload of money off of any of these shows, by the way. I do these shows to really help most of you that are out there listening and participating. And I've got a lot of listeners and fans. And I'm sorry you don't like the content today. This particular texter, which, by the way, I think it's only one person, not the vast majority, because most people look at this and think, man, this is really great. And these are things that I can actually use. And if you look at the last 15 minutes I spent with Dave is nothing but a big, long commercial. You're a sorry soul. I don't know how else to say it. You really are. You don't understand what we're doing here. And again, like I say, you've never sat in this particular position. You've never been behind the microphone. You've never had to do the things that I do on a weekly basis. And it's always great to be an armchair quarterback. That's all I'll say. So you know what? Hats off to you, armchair quarterback. Here's to you. It's like the old Bud Light commercial. Here's to you, armchair quarterback. If at any point in time you ever want to go start your own radio show, you know what? There's plenty of stations out there that'll sell you airtime. Be my guest.

SPEAKER 03 : 54:58

And obviously he doesn't know it all because if he wasn't, he would have been texting and asking questions instead of texting, complaining about a commercial.

SPEAKER 07 : 55:06

Yeah, very seldom does everybody know everything. I mean, guys, listen, I know a lot of things about a lot of things because I read, I study, I interview. There's a lot of stuff that I come across on a regular basis. And our first guest, especially Caleb, when it comes to the staining and so on, for example, the what to sand, the grit of sandpaper to use when doing a staining project. It makes sense now that he says all of that, but I'll be straight up honest. I've never done that. Whenever I've done a deck resurface or something like that, I've always gone that extra step and gone higher in number on the sandpaper to get a smoother surface because I thought since you're going to be walking on it and so on, you want that thing to be as smooth as possible. But actually doing the opposite, closing the pores up, making the stain not as effective at the end of the day. So, yeah, I learned something from Caleb. And again, you know, guys, keep this in mind. Guys like Caleb especially. Sure, he's got a product. He's trying to sell what he does at his stain and seal supply company. But at the end of the day, he's taking time out of his Saturday morning to join us, which, frankly, I'm sure he's got better things he'd like to go do, but very informative, especially on the staining sides of things. And then when it comes to Dave Hart, really quick, too, I'll plug this for Dave. Dave does a lot of other things besides just the roofing sides of things. He can help you out with your gutters. He can do the gutter guard end of things. He can help you out when it comes to windows and doors. He works with Veteran Windows and Doors to help you with that end of things. Dave can do siding. He just went to a full bore class here recently to get the latest and greatest when it comes to siding. So Dave is more than just a roofing company. So if you need something exterior-wise done, to your home. Dave is the actual guy to call, and I mean that sincerely. And again, you can find him at our website, fixitradio.com. And I appreciate it, guys. Thank you so much for listening. We'll be back, of course, as always. We've got our next program coming up, so don't go anywhere. Don't turn that dial. And don't forget the website, fixitradio.com. This is KLZ Radio.

SPEAKER 04 : 57:15

The views and opinions expressed on KLZ 560 are those of the speaker, commentators, hosts, their guests, and callers. They are not necessarily the views and opinions of Crawford Broadcasting or KLZ management, employees, associates, or advertisers. KLZ 560 is a Crawford Broadcasting God and country station.