The episode takes a critical turn as discussion shifts to the perceived weaknesses in American foreign policy under President Biden. Speakers on the show argue that a lack of substantive action from the US government has contributed to the persistence of the hostage situation. In contrast, President-elect Donald Trump has promised a harsher stance, warning that there will be severe consequences if hostages are not released by his inauguration.
The conversation also touches on Israel’s own military strategies and the significant burden borne by this small nation. Given its geographical vulnerability, Israel’s robust defense is essential, and John Rush emphasizes the critical role of the United States in supporting its key ally in the Middle East. The speakers agree that maintaining a strong alliance with Israel is vital, both for strategic reasons and for ensuring regional stability.
As the episode progresses, the panel dives into the deep roots of terrorism in Gaza and the complex dynamics of regional politics. There is a call to action, arguing that more decisive measures should be taken to dismantle terror organizations and protect civilians. Reflecting on history and the future under a new administration, Virginia Allen raises questions about the broader implications for US foreign policy and its global reputation.
In conclusion, John Rush and his guests highlight the intricate issues facing global leaders today. They call for a blend of diplomatic and strategic acumen to address the challenges posed by terrorist groups while supporting international allies. The episode serves as both a critical examination and a hopeful appeal for change, with the aim of fostering peace and security in one of the world’s most turbulent regions.
Listeners are encouraged to reflect on the discussions and engage with the questions posed, as the Rush to Reason team seeks to inform and empower the public with knowledge about crucial international crises. The insights shared in this episode underscore the pressing need for policy-makers to stand firm in their commitments and take meaningful action.
Join us on this eye-opening journey through the geopolitical landscape as we discuss the impact of strong words versus decisive actions. From the tri-national hostages in Gaza to the wider implications for US foreign policy, this episode highlights the pressing need for actionable strategies. Gain perspective on the situation in Israel and insights into the leadership dynamics as we approach a new presidential term. Don't miss out on this informative and engaging discussion.
SPEAKER 05 :
This is Rush to Reason.
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With your host, John Rush.
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Let me tell you why you're here. You're here because you know something. What you know you can't explain, but you feel it. You've felt it your entire life, that there's something wrong with the world. You don't know what it is, but it's there. It is this feeling that has brought you to me.
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Are you crazy? Am I? Or am I so sane that you just blew your mind?
SPEAKER 13 :
It's Rush to Reason with your host, John Rush. Presented by High Five Plumbing, Heating, and Cooling, where every call ends with a high five.
SPEAKER 06 :
All right, we're back. Hour number three, Rush to Reason, Denver's Afternoon Rush, KLZ 560. Myself, Andy Pate, Charlie Grimes, of course, and Virginia Allen joining us now. As I said a few minutes ago, she would. She is senior news producer for the Daily Signal, host of the Daily Signal podcast, and Problematic Women. Virginia, welcome back.
SPEAKER 10 :
great to be with you.
SPEAKER 06 :
It's always a joy. Thank you so much for joining us. Talk to us about this Israeli-American hostage situation that's going on, as we have all now been watching for well over a year now. Donald Trump has even chimed in, and reality is, and I've said this many times on the program, had I been in charge, this wouldn't be going on.
SPEAKER 10 :
Well, and I think that that is President-elect Donald Trump's attitude. I mean, the news This week is heartbreaking every time we learn of another hostage who has died. You just think of their families, and specifically in the case of Omar Nutra, we've learned now new intelligence from the Israeli Defense Forces has confirmed that he was actually killed on October 7th. But his parents, God bless them, they have spent the last 14 months traveling across America, the world, advocating for their son, speaking with leaders, asking, you know, do anything you can to try and release him. I had the privilege of hearing them speak at the Republican National Convention on the main stage, and they delivered a press conference. with Concerned Women for America at the RNC. Just sweet, sweet people. Their names are Ronan and Orna Nutra. And just, you know, for them to have held out hope for 14 months that just maybe their son was still alive. How heartbreaking. Absolutely heartbreaking.
SPEAKER 14 :
How heartbreaking. Hey, Virginia, what role has American weakness in the form of Joe Biden played in exacerbating the situation?
SPEAKER 10 :
That's the question that I think you are so not alone in asking, right? As Americans kind of scratch their heads as to why are there still U.S. citizens who are hostage in Gaza? And right now there are still three individuals, three men who are believed to be still alive who are dual U.S.-Israeli citizens being held by Hamas in Gaza. And, you know, I think we are going to, it remains to be seen what action we're going to see from President-elect Donald Trump. But from his post on True Social yesterday, shortly after the news broke of the confirmation of Omar Nutra's death, that what we're going to see from a Trump administration is likely going to be very different from what we've seen from a Biden administration. You know, the Biden administration, I want to be clear, they've been they've been very clear in their verbiage about, you know, we stand with Israel, we are for Israel. But what President-elect Trump pointed out in his post yesterday, he said there's been a lot of talk and there's not been a lot of action. And I think it remains to be seen what that action is going to look like. But the fact that he essentially threatened Hamas, he said if all of the hostages are not released by the time I'm sworn into office. His exact words were, there will be hell to pay. We don't know what that hell was going to look like.
SPEAKER 06 :
Well, I can only imagine, but yeah, I think knowing Donald Trump the way we've known him from his previous time in office, he means business, and I would hope and pray that Hamas is listening. It's in their best interest to.
SPEAKER 14 :
They have to. Yeah, I mean, Virginia, I mean, if for any extended period of time, and it's not just foreign relations, it's at any business, it's at a church, it's in a family, it doesn't matter. If you have an extended period of time where you're all words and no action, the words are going to lose their meaning and they're going to lose their impact.
SPEAKER 06 :
There's no force there.
SPEAKER 10 :
That's right. That's right. Well, and that's where we get into situations where our enemies take advantage of us and they push a little further and a little further and they take advantage of our friends overseas. And Israel has, for a small country, they do just a phenomenal job defending themselves, protecting their people, guarding their borders. And I think it's critical that the United States recognizes, and they do, but again, we can't just be worried. They have the action to back that up. Israel is our only friend in the Middle East, and so we need to make sure that we are maintaining that relationship. really well and of course always wherever american citizens are making sure that they are protected where wherever they may be and that includes these three hostages that are still sitting in gaza bottom line we've allowed this we and i say that we as united states of america we have allowed this to go on far too long we have spent literally you know over a billion dollars plus
SPEAKER 06 :
to a country called Ukraine and not going down that path. But my point is we have supported one while, yeah, I know we support Israel in some ways, but the reality is this thing over there has gone on way, way, way, way, way too long, and we should have put a stop to it months, you know, we should have put a stop to it about 14 months ago.
SPEAKER 10 :
Yeah, and it was great to see Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu. Today he responded to Trump's comments, and he said those comments are in the right place in relating to Trump saying there would be hell today. And he said, you know, President Trump has his emphasis in the right place focusing on Hamas and he kind of inferred instead of some other people who maybe haven't quite had that same focus at the end of the day that that's The point to me is if Hamas wanted this to end, they could end it.
SPEAKER 06 :
That's right. Well, and just so you know where we come from as a show, that very next day or two after that particular incident happened, you know, I went on air publicly basically saying that if I were in charge, I would drop leaflets and get the word out that you've got seven days to vacate. Because anybody left here after seven days, we are going to carpet bomb the crap out of this place. We're going to turn it to glass. We're going to then start over. And the reality is no one's welcome here besides folks from the country of Israel. Bottom line is you're not going to be welcome anymore because of what just happened. And I would have just leveled the place.
SPEAKER 10 :
I mean, I think for so many, they think we wanted to see way more aggressive action. And there's, of course, factors that we have to make sure that even being conscientious of where attacks are launched in order to hopefully protect the lives of the hostages as well that are still being killed.
SPEAKER 06 :
I get that. I get that. And that's true. And that'd be one of those things during those seven days that you're working on and getting handled and so on. But and again, I'm by no means a strategist and I'm not president of the United States. But trust me, Virginia, if I'd have been in charge, we would have been done with this thing a long time.
SPEAKER 14 :
long long time ago when it comes to even you know those folks that would come out and say well how do you protect the people that actually live there well no offense they voted these knuckleheads in to lead them that's their problem not mine well yeah as a people they are harboring terrorists correct they created this who just went and slaughtered neighbors right okay i mean how do you defend that virginia how can we not simply tell them look clear the area we're done We're going to give you some time, clear the area, but we are not going to sit there and try to go door to door and risk our young soldiers' lives going door to door and allow you to stay. You harbored people who went and slaughtered people in Israel.
SPEAKER 06 :
Literally slaughtered people. On October 7th. That's right.
SPEAKER 14 :
And by the way, when your people who you harbor went in and did that, they were not looking at just military targets. They were going after civilians.
SPEAKER 06 :
Yeah, women, children, everything.
SPEAKER 10 :
Yeah. Well, you know, and just looking at this and addressing those points, of course there are people living in Gaza who want peace, who respect Israel, but we know from interviews that have taken place with those that were in those kibbutzes by the border that there was for many such a sense of betrayal because they allowed Palestinians to into Israel to work on their farms, to harvest crops, and they really felt that we're friends, we're community, we're building bridges, we're building that connection, and we know that some of that intel then was used by the terrorists on October 7th. against the people of Israel. So while there certainly are wonderful people who desire peace living in Gaza, the roots of terrorism go very, very deep.
SPEAKER 06 :
And I don't want to sound hard in Virginia, but I would tell those same people, and again, maybe this is me and it's probably why I'm not president, but I would tell those same people that I get where you're coming from, I understand you want peace, but here's the reality. How can you live in a place that fosters this type of hatred toward your neighbor? At the end of the day, if you really want peace, move out, because at the end of the day, you're not accomplishing anything. So if you really want peace and mean it, you should move.
SPEAKER 10 :
Well, I think many of those people do want to move, especially after the last 14 months. I think they are eager to have, for one, to have fresh leadership that is real leadership, but also just to get away from the corruption that is embedded so deeply.
SPEAKER 14 :
Well, elections have consequences, okay? If you vote in terrorist leadership that outwardly says, we want the removal of Israel from the planet, from the river to the sea, if you vote in leadership that wants that, then how can you complain about anything that comes down on you?
SPEAKER 10 :
Yeah. Well, and I think probably for many, especially maybe for young people, right, like this is a pulling back of the curtain of really seeing, oh, this is the reality. You know, it's not just words. They put real action. And, you know, of course, unfortunately, in the United States, we've seen a lot of young people who have further pulled the wool over their eyes around the situation. It was a whole other conversation about protests on college campuses.
SPEAKER 06 :
I've got about 48 days, in my opinion, to figure this out, because then, as Trump said, all holy hell will break loose.
SPEAKER 14 :
What would Americans want if Canada voted in leadership that committed all forces of Canada to the removal of America from the planet?
SPEAKER 10 :
Hmm. It's frightening, right, when you put it in those terms, and you realize that's the reality that the Israeli people face every day. It hits home at a different level. Okay, wow. And it would really be like the United States. It would be like Canada and Mexico and every nation that's around us. And, of course, over Israel, they're so small, and you have all these large nations that are against them.
SPEAKER 06 :
A better comparison would be Colorado is surrounded by... Exactly. Seven states, and we're not, you know, actually we're larger than the state of Israel. But just think if we as a state had all other seven states wanting to annihilate every single one of us in Colorado. That's the comparison.
SPEAKER 14 :
Well, I'm a little worried about Wyoming.
SPEAKER 06 :
I mean, for people, though, Virginia, you've got to put this into context, because when I said it the way I just said it, for the average person that really doesn't understand geographically what it's even like over there in Israel, and again, it's not even the same comparison, because we as a state are much larger than Israel itself. I mean, you've got to take just one end of Colorado and shave that off, and that's what you've got in Israel.
SPEAKER 10 :
Yeah, well, Israel's about the size of the state of New Jersey. Correct. It is small. It looks like New Jersey. Yeah, it does. It really does. I mean, the only reason why they're able to defend themselves so effectively is because they realize, for one, as a nation, they can. So they put a lot of resources, a lot of financial resources, time resources and people resources into defending their country. It's a full united front for every Israeli to be a part of that defense effort. because it's their reality day in and day out.
SPEAKER 06 :
Well, I also think, personally speaking, that they also have the hand of God upon them that helps them out on a routine basis that allows some of these things to take place the way they do, otherwise they wouldn't exist.
SPEAKER 10 :
Yeah, no, you cannot debate with that. I think, biblically, we see that very, very clearly.
SPEAKER 06 :
Virginia, thanks for all that you do. Daily Signal, we appreciate it. I read you guys' stuff on a regular basis, and thanks for all that you're doing.
SPEAKER 10 :
Absolutely. Have a great night.
SPEAKER 06 :
Will do it. Virginia, take care. Appreciate you joining us on a routine basis. And she's always a joy to have. And I encourage all of you do subscribe to The Daily Signal. Watch what they put out on a daily basis. They have everything from print articles to videos and so on. So go ahead and subscribe if you can. And you'll get a lot of great information from doing so. Flesh Law is up next. Kevin Flesh, civil, criminal, you name it. Kevin's there to represent you. 303-806-8886.
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SPEAKER 05 :
Putting reason into your afternoon drive. This is John Rush.
SPEAKER 06 :
All right, we are back. Rush to Reason, Denver's Afternoon Rush, KLZ 560. And yes, if I'm not in charge, probably a good thing because things would be different, maybe better in some ways, maybe worse in some ways. But when it comes to this whole nonsense going on over in Israel with Hamas, yeah, I literally would have wiped Hamas off the map by now. Done. Gone. You're out of here, guys. See ya.
SPEAKER 14 :
If you were in charge, I think a lot of countries would go missing.
SPEAKER 06 :
Well, I would have even gone as far as to say, you know what, here's how this is going to work, Hamas. You've got seven days. And, oh, by the way, Iran, if you want to get involved, be my guest, because I'll do the same thing to you when this is all said and done. So I would suggest that you guys just stand down and let me handle what's going to happen in that particular area, because when we're done, it'll be over with, and things will go back to normal when it's all said and done. But if you want to get involved, you'll have the same thing.
SPEAKER 14 :
You know, John, I don't think there's any nation on the planet that's going to go through a bigger change going from Biden to Trump than Iran. Except maybe China. I think China, it's going to be devastating.
SPEAKER 06 :
Ukraine's going to have a little bit of adjustment as well. They are, although— Not like what you just said, though.
SPEAKER 14 :
Although Ukraine, let's face it, their war is going to come to an end.
SPEAKER 06 :
What's my mean? So their money flow is going to stop. Right. This last payment today of the $750 million, I doubt highly they get any more of that.
SPEAKER 14 :
Yeah, but so much of that money is going to the elites.
SPEAKER 06 :
I know.
SPEAKER 14 :
The people of Ukraine, I don't see where it's going to be that huge of a difference for them. They're going to have a war end.
SPEAKER 06 :
Yeah, it'll be better for them when it's all said and done, because as I've told you before— They're going to lose territory, because it's not—look, the borders are not going to be where they were before. I would highly doubt they will be, Andy.
SPEAKER 14 :
Right.
SPEAKER 06 :
There will be some give and take on some of that, because that's the only way you're going to get the thing ended.
SPEAKER 14 :
Is it really going to be that big? Look, I'm not saying, gee, it was okay for Russia to invade a country.
SPEAKER 06 :
No, no, no.
SPEAKER 14 :
I've never said that.
SPEAKER 06 :
It's never okay.
SPEAKER 14 :
But the bottom line is, eastern Ukraine, most of the people in that region were very pro-Russian.
SPEAKER 06 :
It's very Russian, yes. OK, you know, I don't know. I mean, like I told you, the last vacation this summer at one point was talking to some folks that were there. And they and I happen to be talking through interpreters because there was two different sets of individuals, which I found ironic that were one couple was from Ukraine and one couple was from Russia. And so I just went ahead and started asking some questions. You know, the more I got to know him and we, you know, started having some, you know, conversations on some banter back and forth and so on. You know how it is. I just finally said, OK, so what do you guys all think about the war? You know, from me, from either side. Yeah. Almost in unison, because they almost knew what I said, even though I don't speak their language. They knew enough English where they both almost in unison came back and said, it's just politics. In other words, the people are done. They're ready for this thing to be over, whether you're on the Ukraine side or the Russian side. They know this is all about payola and politics when it's all said and done. They want the thing done and over with as much as we do, Andy.
SPEAKER 14 :
Well, you know, one other thing, John, I don't think either country right now looks at their leadership and says, gee, these are good, honest people.
SPEAKER 06 :
No, they don't. You're 100 percent. That's exactly what these people were saying, Andy. These are the people that live there. and said that.
SPEAKER 14 :
Putin is a strong man. Let's face it. He is a strong man. He is not somebody who's a good guy who inspires the people, who wins an election sweeping in like Trump did. Look, there's none of that going on in Russia. And by the way, the people running Ukraine are just tied in with the oligarchs. They don't care.
SPEAKER 06 :
That's right. That's right. You're 100% correct. And that's exactly how the people feel, Andy.
SPEAKER 1 :
100%.
SPEAKER 06 :
Okay. As always, the people really suffering are the people, not those that are in charge.
SPEAKER 14 :
And the war.
SPEAKER 06 :
That's right. And the war. Well, never should have started, in my opinion. But we, Joe Biden, not we, Joe Biden and his regime that we talked about earlier, he started that one.
SPEAKER 14 :
Absolutely.
SPEAKER 06 :
Those of you that are on the left, you may disagree with me, but he started it.
SPEAKER 14 :
Oh, 100%. He did it twofold. Number one, he's weak so that Putin felt there's no real opposition because there's weak leadership over America. And number two, he made them rich by driving up their number one product, that is oil, and they used oil wealth to fund their war machine. Otherwise, they couldn't have done it.
SPEAKER 06 :
There's no doubt.
SPEAKER 14 :
And I'm just talking Russia there. Then he turns around and he has been by far and away the main supplier and financer of Ukraine. He has made both sides of this war able to fight it.
SPEAKER 06 :
He's made both sides wealthier than they were when they started.
SPEAKER 14 :
Yes.
SPEAKER 06 :
Despite what anybody might think, the amount of money that has flowed into both countries is enormous.
SPEAKER 14 :
This is Biden's war.
SPEAKER 06 :
Billions upon billions upon billions. He left behind billions in Afghanistan. He's doing it again over there.
SPEAKER 14 :
Without Joe Biden, neither side could have fought this war.
SPEAKER 06 :
And keep in mind, he's also made the coffers of Iran even richer and China's coffers richer and so on. It's why those countries didn't want to see him leave office.
SPEAKER 14 :
Oh, they're in trouble now. And I'm not even talking war. I'm talking finances.
SPEAKER 06 :
Oh, no. They're in trouble. It'll be interesting to listen to the Jordan Goodmans of the world, America's Money Answer Man, to see what his thoughts are on some of that because there's going to be, to your point a moment ago, Andy, a lot of countries worldwide that are now looking at what's going to happen in the U.S. thinking, oh, crap. Now what?
SPEAKER 14 :
I agree.
SPEAKER 06 :
Literally, that's what's going to happen.
SPEAKER 14 :
Okay. Hey, John, when we come back from break, can we pivot? Because you had a great talk yesterday with a caller, and it had to do with the disciplining of kids.
SPEAKER 06 :
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SPEAKER 06 :
All right, we are back. Rush to Reason, Denver's Afternoon Rush, KLZ 560. Myself, Andy Pate, Charlie Grimes. All right, Andy, you want to shift gears here just for a minute?
SPEAKER 14 :
Yeah, let's shift gears. John, you had a great call. Really, I thought a very interesting caller yesterday. I forget his name. But he wanted to call in and say that he had some concerns. about corporal punishment with kids. And clearly he was against it. He wanted it ended. And I think he was going a little far. And the reason I felt that way is, as you know, my degree is in the ministry. And at one point he brought up the passage from the 23rd Psalm, Thy rod and thy staff, they comfort me. And he said, you know, a lot of Christians use this and to say it is good to discipline kids physically, and they said the rod of discipline. And he says, look, it's not referring to the rod of discipline there in the 23rd Psalm. And he's right, by the way. Rod and staff there is talking about what a shepherd uses.
SPEAKER 06 :
And he also was talking about spare the rod, spoil the child.
SPEAKER 14 :
Right, but that is not, that's, yeah. Right. The problem is, is he generalized that and said, because of that, it's never good to use a rod. And he said at one point, you know, when you physically discipline a child, that's an act of violence. And that shows the kid what you're really teaching the kid is that might makes right and that violence is the answer and so forth.
SPEAKER 06 :
Which I disagree with, by the way.
SPEAKER 14 :
I strongly disagree.
SPEAKER 06 :
Because I've raised enough kids to know that. I strongly disagree with that. Let's just say that. And really quick, for those of you who didn't get a chance to listen yesterday, where this all came from was I talked about on vacation. Charlie always asks me what are some of the highlights from vacation. One of the things I mentioned was I just see more and more out-of-control kids because of this whole gentle parenting approach that literally lets the kid run wild because we're just going to – You know, talk softly and let the kid do whatever they want to. And, you know, what are your feelings like and so on and so forth when, in fact, some of these kids need a nice paddling, in my opinion.
SPEAKER 14 :
Right. You know, and spanking kids and so forth. Look, first of all, John. Let's get back on the right track with discipline. Okay, that was, you know, he was talking, he was basically equating all physical discipline with beating kids and with abuse.
SPEAKER 06 :
And I was very clear on that yesterday that that's not what I meant.
SPEAKER 14 :
Right, I know it wasn't. Let's get back on the right track. First of all, he was taking one passage, which he had the correct interpretation of, by the way.
SPEAKER 06 :
And I agreed with him on that, absolutely. Right.
SPEAKER 14 :
But then he was extending that throughout the whole Bible. You see the Bible isn't for physical punishment of kids. Okay, let's look at Proverbs really quick here, and just a few. They're very brief. Go ahead. Proverbs 23, 13. Do not hold back discipline from the child. Although you strike him with the rod, he will not die. Let's take a look at 2215. Foolishness is bound up in the heart of a child. The rod of discipline will remove it far from him.
SPEAKER 1 :
2915.
SPEAKER 14 :
The rod and reproof give wisdom. But a child who gets his own way brings shame to his mother. And there are several more that say the same thing.
SPEAKER 06 :
Yeah, we can keep going. Yeah, absolutely.
SPEAKER 14 :
So physical discipline of the child is not bad. It is necessary.
SPEAKER 06 :
Well, and I would say, Dan, hang tight really quick. You know, he was using the example of the sheep, that the rod was there to protect the sheep. We should be doing it with our kids, which, by the way, I fully agree with on the same token. I also know from being around not only kids, but animals, they're not all equal. And I said this yesterday. In some cases, you can just look at a kid and that's enough discipline to where they're going to be back in line and things go. There's animals, by the way, that are that way. I happen to own a dog right now. Currently, Andy, that's very much that way. You can just kind of look at him at times and he'll be like, oh, geez, I screwed up, didn't I? It's different personalities in not only animals but kids. And in some cases, you don't need to do much more than that. On the same token, Andy, I've raised animals and kids that needed that rod of correction at times.
SPEAKER 14 :
Oh, yes. And you're not being loving when you withhold that.
SPEAKER 06 :
No. In fact, I'm going to let them go to their own demise. Right. Correct?
SPEAKER 14 :
Oh, absolutely.
SPEAKER 06 :
If I don't correct them, I'm going to let them go to their own demise is what I meant to say there. Dan and Blackhawk, go ahead.
SPEAKER 12 :
It's also consistency on the discipline.
SPEAKER 06 :
Correct.
SPEAKER 12 :
So I'll have a little story I'll tell. And we used corporal punishment. We used a spoon. We never used our hands because the hands show love.
SPEAKER 06 :
Use an item.
SPEAKER 12 :
Right. The item was the item of discipline. Right. And so what my wife at the time did is she would let me— discipline the kids when I got home, I'd give her a cooling off period. And I don't know if, if there's times that she showed mercy to our kids, but you know, they didn't want dad to discipline them because I, you know, I played baseball, so I'd have a nice little flick of the wrist right when I'd hit their box and it stung, but it never bruised them. If you bruise the kid, it's too much discipline. You should, you should never bruise the kid because, The reason why I'm saying is discipline is I think my youngest son was like three or four at the time, and we had a family gathering, and my brother-in-laws were standing around, and my son was at the bottom of the stairs being defiant towards me. So I said, you have to count to three to get upstairs, to get up to the top of the stairs to come up here, and he was going to be defiant. I counted. I didn't even get to two, and he's at the top of the stairs. And the reason why is because he knew if I got to three, I was going to go down there and I would discipline him.
SPEAKER 03 :
Right.
SPEAKER 12 :
And, and my brother-in-law's looked at me and they're like, Ooh, they're like, wow. And I'm like, that's because if I said I was going to fall, he knew he knew the consequences.
SPEAKER 14 :
Dan, did you do it really quick here? Did you do it like Hans and die hard? Did you say, I'm going to count to three. There will not be a four.
SPEAKER 12 :
No, no, I did not do that. I just, he was just being defiant and it's, And there was no corporal punishment in that incident. That's right.
SPEAKER 06 :
And the reason is because you were consistent with what that punishment on the front side was, and he knew that if he continued down that path, that's what was going to happen, which, by the way, is how discipline should work. It's the way the Lord disciplines us.
SPEAKER 14 :
Not only is he learning good and evil, he's actually learning consistency. Correct. Which is a good thing.
SPEAKER 12 :
Consistency and consequences to your actions.
SPEAKER 06 :
The problem, and my point yesterday was, you know, this whole gentle parenting, and I just call it that, it's utter nonsense. It is. This whole gentle parenting thing, I just don't know where we're going to be 20, 30 years from now when these kids are adults and they've never had any.
SPEAKER 12 :
It all started with Dr. Spock.
SPEAKER 06 :
Yeah, what's it going to be like then, Dan?
SPEAKER 12 :
Yeah, I mean, but it started back in the 60s with Dr. Spock.
SPEAKER 06 :
And it's gotten to the point where just as a side note, I didn't say this yesterday, but this whole gentle parenting thing has even got people on social media running skits on social media making fun of these people or running skits on, I should say, on social media about the gentle parenting. There's skits out there that are making fun of gentle parenting because of how outlandish it is.
SPEAKER 14 :
Oh, those are funny. But here's something that's totally ironic in this. The people who are suffering the most from undisciplined kids are school teachers, and yet the school teachers teach against physically disciplining kids.
SPEAKER 06 :
Great point.
SPEAKER 12 :
It just makes no sense.
SPEAKER 06 :
Great point, Andy.
SPEAKER 12 :
And when you're out in public, you know, and if your kid is throwing a temper tantrum, you don't discipline them in public. You remove them from the situation, and you take them privately, and that's when you discipline them. And if you do it in the home privately, and I'm not saying that you're beating your kids, because you, what does it say in Scripture, and I don't know the reference, what father doesn't discipline his kid because he doesn't love him?
SPEAKER 06 :
And basically the Lord disciplines us just like our fathers discipline us, and they discipline us because they love us.
SPEAKER 12 :
Yes, and that's because they know, because if we don't, let's go back to your dog example. I had a yellow lab retriever, and we'd go duck hunting. I was out on the river one time, and the river was iced over. And unfortunately, I wounded a duck, and she went out to get it, but the duck went under some ice.
SPEAKER 03 :
Yeah, you don't want her going out there.
SPEAKER 12 :
She was going to go after the duck in the ice. But because I had trained her, I said, no, she stopped and swam back to me. If I hadn't had trained her and I, you know, I had to. She may have drowned. She may have gone under the ice. That's right. I would have lost my dog. But because I disciplined her. Great point. And taught her, she knew to respond to my commands and it saved her life. Great point.
SPEAKER 06 :
And again, and I want to make sure I'm clear on this. When I was talking yesterday, there is not, and I will be the first to say it, there's not a one-size-fits-all when it comes to raising kids. Every child is different, and I'm not one that says you need to do equal punishment to each kid because some kids need different type of punishment than others, and you need to know your kids to know exactly what to do, just like Dan when it comes to even raising. And I'm not trying to say kids are dogs, but the comparisons are still there. Some dogs need different discipline than others because their temperament is different. Correct?
SPEAKER 14 :
Yes. You just have to be careful because the kids are watching.
SPEAKER 12 :
We got to go.
SPEAKER 14 :
Geez, you never do that with my brother.
SPEAKER 06 :
They are. But, you know, I use some of those, Andy, I use some of those raising kids as a teachable moment saying, well, you know why? It's because X, Y, Z. You do this, your brother does that. much better to what i'm telling her to do when i ask her to do something you don't so yeah when you continue to act the way you do you're going to get a stiffer punishment than she gets because she responds and you don't right because look with every kid do you ever do you go straight to corporal punishment no you try not to because you don't want to you first tell them don't do this correct because nobody wants to do that right off the bat yeah secondly you you're right yeah secondly you do you use some lesser discipline and then finally you go to spanking
SPEAKER 14 :
Correct.
SPEAKER 12 :
Well, guess what?
SPEAKER 14 :
Your sister responds to the first two. You don't.
SPEAKER 12 :
Go ahead, Dan. The liberals misinterpret the, you know, I saw a bumper sticker many years ago about how an eye for an eye and a tooth for the tooth. They don't understand what that scripture means. What it means is the consequences or the punishment fit the crime, is basically what the Lord was saying. And it's not, he didn't say that if somebody plucks out an eye, you pluck out their eye. it's the punishment has to fit the crime. Correct. And they, they misinterpret that. And they're like, we'll see how, how vindictive God is. And it's like, no, he's not vindictive. What he was saying is that the, the punishment for the crime should be, should fit. Oh, well, let's go to the pardon of a certain individual whose dad is the president of the United States. The, that is not justice that should have been followed through. Um, He was pardoned for some laws that he broke, gun control laws for one thing. If I lied on the return, I'd be thrown in jail, and I wouldn't ever have a chance of being pardoned. Correct. You know, so was the punishment, does that fit his crime?
SPEAKER 06 :
Let's just say this, Dan. There's people right now in jail for things they did at J6 that are far less than what Hunter Biden did.
SPEAKER 12 :
Yeah, and they're still in jail.
SPEAKER 06 :
Correct. Correct.
SPEAKER 14 :
Which is ridiculous. Well, here in a moment, when we have another moment here, I want to give the clear difference between discipline and abuse.
SPEAKER 06 :
Okay, we'll do that. Dan, I'll let you go, and we'll come back and do that. Appreciate it very much. Thanks for your comments, Dan. Golden Eagle Financial coming up next. Al Smith, if you need help when it comes to your future financial plans, getting there, staying there, having a plan, sticking to the plan, talk to Al today. Find him at klzradio.com.
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SPEAKER 05 :
It's time to leave your safe space. This is Rush to Reason on KLZ 560.
SPEAKER 06 :
All right, we are back. Rush to Reason, Denver's Afternoon Rush, KLZ 560. Thanks for joining us today, by the way. We appreciate it very much. This last about half hour or so we've been talking about a topic I got into briefly in the 3 o'clock hour. Then we had a follow-up phone call in the 5 o'clock hour talking about, you know, the rod and the staff and so on and so forth and discipline with kids. And you've heard some of our last segments there with Dan and Andy and I as well. And, yes, as somebody that raised seven kids. Do I believe in corporal punishment? Yes, and nobody's going to convince me otherwise. Now, with all that being said, does it need to be done correctly, not in anger, making sure that the child understands exactly what's going on and so on? And was I a perfect parent? No. Did my kids all grow up to understand what all of this means, and have they become very productive citizens? Yes.
SPEAKER 14 :
Well, Richard is not a Packer fan, so I think you were an awful parent.
SPEAKER 06 :
Oh, there we go.
SPEAKER 14 :
I mean, you obviously blew it from the start.
SPEAKER 06 :
I taught him right. He's not a Packer fan.
SPEAKER 14 :
I mean, my goodness. Okay, really quick here. One of the things... That was mentioned by the caller yesterday was this, said, if you strike your child, you are basically conveying that might makes right and violence is the answer. And that is completely incorrect. Here's the thing. You can abuse power without using any physical nature. What if you ground your kid for a year over a minor offense? Aren't you then abusing power? Yes, you are. What if you're the president and you have your political enemy, you raid Mar-a-Lago with Same example. Physicality is not abuse of power. Abuse of power is abuse of power.
SPEAKER 06 :
Right. You can do that physically, mentally, all sorts of ways.
SPEAKER 14 :
Exactly. You can over discipline in any number of ways, including physically. And here's what I think is a really good rule of thumb, no matter what discipline you use. And you just alluded to it. You nailed it. Doing it in anger. Okay, here it is. If you do it, as a rule of thumb, it's not perfect, we aren't perfect, but if you do it for their good, for their benefit, then it's discipline. That's right. If you do it for your benefit, out of your anger, because you feel insulted because they're not respecting your...
SPEAKER 06 :
Your authority.
SPEAKER 14 :
Your authority. My gosh, I work all week to try to put food on the table and hear the kid X this way toward me when I, you know, and shows this disrespect in front of other people at that party or at the mall. Whatever it is. I am so angry. If you do it out of anger... Then it is abuse. Correct. It's usually going to be abusive, and it's going to lead to more abuse because it's going to feel good. And then you're going to want that feeling more. I feel good because I got it.
SPEAKER 06 :
Really quick, too. I also know when it comes to kids, because, again, I raised enough kids to know this, there becomes a time, Andy, where you also have to determine where's the pain point with that child. Let me explain. Oh, yeah. As children get older and a little tougher, boys especially— they may just as soon have the corporal punishment as opposed to the removal of an item in their life. Oh, yeah. Or grounding or something along those lines. So you also have to know where is that pinch point, that pain point with said child, and know that sometimes corporal punishment might actually be their easy way out. And taking away the PlayStation for a week, by the way, might be a bigger punishment than actual having some corporal punishment.
SPEAKER 14 :
Oh, let's get even more cruel. The phone.
SPEAKER 06 :
Oh, yeah.
SPEAKER 14 :
Oh, my goodness. There are a lot of kids. They'll look at you like, yeah, you spanked me. No, no, no, no. It's not going to be that easy.
SPEAKER 06 :
I'm taking the phone for a week. Yeah. Or two days or whatever it is.
SPEAKER 14 :
Right. The guy yesterday, and by the way, he seemed like a really good guy. But he clearly was an activist against corporal punishment. And it's like, look, first of all, you start to misuse scripture. You start to take one scripture. He got one right and then expanded beyond that. And you ignore a lot of other scriptures. You always got to take the whole balance of scripture. But secondly, you have to take into account what is your motivation as a parent? And by the way, set aside parenting for a second. What is your motivation as a boss? Why do you discipline this employee? Do you do it out of anger? We can do that as bosses.
SPEAKER 06 :
True.
SPEAKER 14 :
We can do it out of anger because they disrespected me and they didn't or they're lazy here. I work so hard as a boss. I put in 60 hours. I come in and they're sitting on their, you know.
SPEAKER 06 :
Their duff's doing nothing.
SPEAKER 14 :
sitting on their duffs doing nothing when I hardly ever do that. And I have to constantly ride them just to get them to do their job. And you find yourself not disciplining them to help them become better. You're not thinking about their career path. You're thinking about your anger. When we act out of anger, In all of life, when we act out of emotion in all of life, how good are our decisions?
SPEAKER 06 :
Not very.
SPEAKER 14 :
Not very.
SPEAKER 06 :
Been there, done that, by the way, so not very.
SPEAKER 14 :
And the same is true of discipline.
SPEAKER 06 :
Yeah, I mean, again, was I perfect as a father? Was I perfect as an owner and as a boss? No, Andy, I've made all sorts of mistakes, and everything you just said is exactly correct. When you do it out of anger, when you're hot, you don't make the right decisions, you don't do things correctly, you say things that you shouldn't, and at the end of the day, it never works out well.
SPEAKER 14 :
Right. Right. You know, when I look at all these people who voted for Kamala, and you see all these people enraged online, you know, screaming in their cars.
SPEAKER 06 :
Because they lost?
SPEAKER 14 :
Yeah. Notice the only reasons they blame are racism and sexism. Why? Misogyny.
SPEAKER 06 :
Misogyny. Misogyny, Andy. Come on now.
SPEAKER 14 :
Yeah. It has nothing to do with the price of groceries.
SPEAKER 06 :
No.
SPEAKER 14 :
You know, and... But look what they're screaming out, and they're screaming out in anger, in emotion. If your decisions are pure emotion, what are the odds that you make good voting decisions?
SPEAKER 06 :
You don't. Not very good. You don't. In fact, to your point, I had this in my notes for today. I'm not going to spend a lot of time on it, but there's an article in The Atlantic, that nice right-leaning publication. The Atlantic. Misogyny comes roaring back. So to your point, there's an article written about the very thing that you're talking about. Once again, the left, the Atlantic is the left. They're blaming misogyny for the reason why Donald Trump won and she lost.
SPEAKER 14 :
Yeah, they can't look at the quality of the candidate. And her plan, which, by the way, she refused to offer one. Even the media on their side of the aisle, left-wing media, were infuriated with the fact that she wouldn't, as one put it, answer the blankety-blank question. They couldn't take it anymore. She won't answer the questions. She diverts. Donald Trump just says flat out, I'm going to do this, I'm going to do this, I'm going to do this, I'm going to do this. Bang.
SPEAKER 06 :
So, by the way, this is how far off they are. Yeah. So Donald Trump, perhaps the most famous misogynist ever to reach the highest office. But in 2020 for 2024, it was even more alarming than in 2016 was how Trump's campaign seemed to be promoting. And I don't know where this is coming from because I didn't see any of this. Maybe maybe I'm blind, Andy, but they seem to be promoting a version of the country in which men dominate public life. while women are mostly confined to the home, deprived of a voice, and neutralized as a threat to men's status and ambitions. Where is that coming from?
SPEAKER 14 :
I don't know. Somebody should ask Tulsi. I'm just confused, Andy. Trump surrounds himself with all these highly accomplished, brilliant women. Okay, he does. When you look at the women in Trump's orbit, they're the Pambandis. They're brilliant. This, by the way, was written by a woman, but just so you know. Well, of course. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But this is why Mark Cuban's comments were such wonderful fodder for the Trump campaign.
SPEAKER 06 :
Oh, it helped us win.
SPEAKER 14 :
Oh, it did help us win. Thank you, Mark. Because Trump women just rose up. What about Lara Trump, who's probably going to be the next senator from Florida? She's brilliant. Okay. Yeah, she's last name Trump. Yeah, she got where she was because of who she knows. But she would have risen up any organization. It just happened to be this one. Look. Brilliance is brilliance. It doesn't matter. But these people were acting out of rage. They're acting out of bitterness. And they're not taking a step back and examining what was wrong with what we did. And this gets us back once again to discipline of kids. Are you acting out of rage? When in the moment of disciplining the kid, are you thinking ahead? How is this going to make them a better person? Or are you thinking now behind? How did they offend me? How did they disrespect me? How did they embarrass me at that party, at the mall, at that restaurant, at wherever, everywhere? How did they make me feel? Or are you thinking about how are they going to turn out? Why are you doing it? And if you think about that, not just in parenting, but in business and everywhere else, you're probably going to make better decisions.
SPEAKER 06 :
Frankly, even in voting, are you looking out for what's best for the country or what's best for you?
SPEAKER 14 :
Yeah, is it America first or just you first?
SPEAKER 06 :
I think with these people, Andy, it's definitely just you first. Oh, yeah. It isn't what's best for the country. It's what's best for you. Because, again, to your point, she had no plan as to even how to make the country better. She was asked point blank numerous times. And the answer you got back was, well, yeah, I was raised in a middle class home. Well, first of all, what's that got to do with helping the economy and the price of groceries? It doesn't. But that was her answer, Andy. I grew up in a middle-class home, which, by the way, she didn't.
SPEAKER 14 :
What has that got to do with guys going into the ring and beating up women? Okay? There are real issues here.
SPEAKER 06 :
It doesn't.
SPEAKER 14 :
We don't want men and women sports. It doesn't.
SPEAKER 06 :
We don't want green energy.
SPEAKER 14 :
We want oil and gas. We don't want war in Ukraine. Get it through your skull.
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SPEAKER 05 :
We don't yell at you, we inform you. Now, back to Rush to Reason.
SPEAKER 06 :
All right, that's wrapping things up for today. About a minute left is all Rush to Reason, Denver's Afternoon Rush. By the way, just as a reminder, you can always find our past shows and the different things that we talk about on the website. Just go to RushToReason.com and click under the show notes section, and you can find all of those things there. But, yeah, Andy, there's still a lot of folks out there. And I know I had to ask you earlier. We didn't get a chance to talk about it, so maybe we'll do it a little bit. We can do this again next week on next Tuesday, which is have they learned anything from the recent loss? I don't think some of them have. There's some higher-ups that most likely have learned, and they will make some different strategy adjustments and so on. But the average liberal has learned nothing, Andy. They're just mad.
SPEAKER 14 :
And the proof of that is that they're blaming misogyny.
SPEAKER 06 :
They're blaming sexism and racism. That article I just read. Right. Prime example. That's the proof they're not learning. They have not learned. Now, yes, a lot of the strategists and the higher-ups and so on, they will get it. They will have different strategies. Trust me, we cannot just sit back on our laurels in 2026. We're going to have to come out strong again because, believe me, they will adjust accordingly. They will. All right, we'll be back tomorrow. Have a great night. Be safe out there, I should say. Health and wellness tomorrow. This is Rush to Reason, Denver's Afternoon Rush, KLZ 560.
