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In this latest episode of Washington Watch, host Jody Heiss navigates through a series of compelling topics ranging from the upcoming release of Epstein-related documents to significant redistricting battles across the United States. Jody welcomes esteemed guests, including Washington stand reporter Casey Harper, to provide deep insights into the implications of these political turmoils. Listen in as prominent figures share their perspectives on how key decisions might influence future elections, transparency in government, and the shifting dynamics within the news cycle.
SPEAKER 02 :
from the heart of our nation’s capital in Washington, D.C., bringing compelling interviews, insightful analysis, taking you beyond the headlines and soundbites into conversations with our nation’s leaders and newsmakers, all from a biblical worldview. Sitting in for Tony is today’s host, Jody Heiss.
SPEAKER 10 :
So we have released 33,000, over 33,000 Epstein documents to the Hill, and we’ll continue to follow the law and to have maximum transparency.
SPEAKER 03 :
That was Attorney General Pam Bondi earlier today saying the Justice Department will release its Epstein-related materials within 30 days, as required by legislation that passed yesterday in both the House and the Senate. Welcome to this November 19th edition of Washington Watch. I’m your host, Jody Heiss, an honor today to be sitting in for Tony Perkins, and thank you so much for joining us. All right, coming up, the Justice Department’s announcement today comes after nearly a unanimous congressional vote to make all those records public. Congressman Mark Offord from Missouri will join us to break it all down and what may come out of the latest developments. And then a little bit later, Matt Carpenter, director of FRC Action, will be joining us to explain the latest in the redistricting battle after a judge struck down Texas’s new congressional map. OK, a federal court has blocked Texas from using a new congressional map that was designed to strengthen Republican representation in next year’s midterm elections. And Texas Governor Greg Abbott. It’s called the ruling absurd. And he immediately filed a notice to appeal to the Supreme Court. Joining me now is Washington stand reporter Casey Harper. Casey, as always, thanks for joining us. All right. This redistricting battle seems like it just keeps on escalating week after week. What’s the court saying specifically about this Texas case?
SPEAKER 13 :
Yeah, Jody, if it does make it to the Supreme Court, the whole country will be watching. It has huge implications. But this most recent court ruling said that the map was drawn based on race, which is quite the accusation. And that’s, of course, one that Republicans deny. So the ruling forces Texas to stick with the original 2021 map, which keeps them in control of 25 of the 38 House seats. And experts say it’s probably going to cost them five Republican seats. Now, meanwhile, similar redistricting battles are erupting nationwide. California, for instance, Democrats are pushing a new map to target Republican-held seats, and that sparked a federal lawsuit from the Trump administration to block that effort. Meanwhile, Virginia, they’re also redrawing their political maps, potentially giving Democrats an advantage if the court decisions uphold it. These new maps and the court rulings could easily tip the balance of power in Congress, where Republicans, as you know, currently have a razor-thin majority, Jody.
SPEAKER 03 :
Well, thank you, Casey. On that, let’s talk about some of the updates over the releasing of the Epstein files, especially after really a rare bipartisan support in both the House and the Senate. Where do we go from here?
SPEAKER 13 :
Yeah, Jody, you’re right. Yesterday, the Senate advanced the Epstein Files Transparency Act, which requires the DOJ to release files on the late convicted sex offender, Jeffrey Epstein. That measure passed by unanimous consent, which came shortly after the House also approved it almost unanimously. The bill is now headed to President Trump for his signature. Senate Democratic Leader Chuck Schumer, he called the move a victory for the public, and said Americans deserve the truth about Epstein’s network and those who enabled his crimes. SEN.
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CHUCK SCHUMER , This is about holding accountable all the people in Jeffrey Epstein’s circle who raped, groomed, targeted, and enabled the abuse of hundreds of girls for years and years. The American people have waited long enough. Jeffrey Epstein’s victims have waited long enough. Let the truth come out. Let transparency reign.
SPEAKER 13 :
As you noted earlier, Jody, Attorney General Pam Bondi said the DOJ is going to release files from its investigation into Jeffrey Epstein within 30 days.
SPEAKER 10 :
So we have released 33,000, over 33,000 Epstein documents to the Hill, and we’ll continue to follow the law and to have maximum transparency.
SPEAKER 13 :
Everyone’s eagerly waiting for those documents, which could shed new light on Epstein’s activities, but more importantly, the connections that he had in a case that has fueled public scrutiny and a lot of conspiracy theories. Jody.
SPEAKER 03 :
Yep. This is going to be very interesting to watch this unfold. Casey, if we can, let’s shift to the Saudi crown prince having some congressional meetings. Are you hearing any specifics as to what came out of some of those meetings?
SPEAKER 13 :
Yeah, Jody, we are starting to see details emerge. Now, Saudi Crown Prince Mohammed bin Salman visited the U.S. Capitol today after visiting the White House yesterday, continuing his two-day visit to the U.S. That visit has raised concerns, but it’s also highlighted this renewed, stronger-than-ever economic and security relationship with the U.S. Now, earlier today, President Trump spoke at the U.S.-Saudi Forum, a speech I watched, where he touted the strength of relations between the two countries.
SPEAKER 11 :
We officially designated the kingdom yesterday as the major non-NATO ally. That’s a big deal. That’s actually a very big deal. I just see how important that is to you and to a lot of your friends in the room. Sudan, and we’re going to start working on Sudan. I didn’t think that that was one that was going to be so easy to do. But we’re going to start working on it.
SPEAKER 13 :
As you can see there, President Trump is saying he’s willing to step in to help end the war in Sudan at the request of the Saudi crown prince, just showing how strong that relationship is seeming to be, Jody.
SPEAKER 03 :
All right, Casey, thank you so much. We always, always appreciate you giving us updates on what’s happening in the news. All right, I want to go back now to the original item that we discussed, and that is the developments on the Epstein file saga. I’d like to get a congressional perspective of all of that. And joining me now to discuss this and more, Congressman Mark Alford. He serves on several House committees, including the all-important Appropriations Committee. He is also the chairman of the Republican Study Committee’s Messaging Task Force. He represents the 4th Congressional District of Missouri. Congressman Alford, great to see you. Thank you for joining me.
SPEAKER 17 :
Thank you, Joe. Good to be with you.
SPEAKER 03 :
All right. There has been a lot, a lot of movement since yesterday. I mean, we had the House vote, and then we had the Senate vote, and now we have the DOJ response. What do you make of all these developments with the Epstein files?
SPEAKER 17 :
I am so glad this is coming to an end, the information being released. We have pushed for this from the very beginning, full transparency. We made a call for that in July, September 3rd. We voted on a resolution that was attached to a rule. I know that’s techno-speak in Congress, but basically we voted for the Oversight Committee to get these files and release them. We’ve been consistent in this. And even President Trump, you remember back this summer, ordered the DOJ and Pam Bondi to release these files. I think what’s going to come out of this is going to be a big nothing burger for President Trump. Yes, his name is going to be mentioned, as we’ve seen in some of these emails, but nothing that’s going to tie him to any illicit activity involving Jeffrey Epstein. Here’s my focus, though, Jody. You mentioned that I’m on appropriations. We had a meeting today, the Republican appropriation members under the direction of our chairman, Tom Cole. And we are singularly focused now with all these distractions out of the way of getting these remaining nine appropriation bills done. We’ve got all 12 of them out of committee before the end of the fiscal year. And all we were asking is to have a seven-week extension to get the remaining nine passed on the House floor. And that’s what led to the government shutdown because the Democrats did not want us to do that. Now our focus is getting that done for the American people. We have only 27 legislative days, though, to get that done until the new deadline of January 30th. We’re going to be up against the gun on this, but we’re determined to get this done. And I think we have a good chance for the first time that I’ve been here in Congress in three years of returning to regular order when it comes to our appropriations process.
SPEAKER 03 :
Yeah, it’s so I mean, we certainly hope so. Congressman, you know, we have been in away from regular order for so long that regular order itself almost seems like irregular order. But come back to it. We’ve got to come back to this. Let me switch gears with you a little bit, but somewhat on a similar topic. One of the next big battles, I think, that is going to take place on Capitol Hill is a fight over health care. I mean, the Democrats are pushing for permanent COVID era Obama subsidies. And, you know, let’s face it, the Senate has said they’re going to have that vote. But how do you see all of this playing out? This is going to be a big battle, isn’t it?
SPEAKER 17 :
The Senate will have a vote. I think it will be defeated. There’s no promise by Speaker Johnson to bring it up in the House. We’re all concerned about it. I think the committees of jurisdiction will take an active role. In fact, I know they will. Speaker Mike Johnson said in our conference meeting, the first time we’ve been together as a conference in some six weeks, that this is going to be a priority, that we are going to work on the committees of jurisdiction, energy and commerce, ways and means, uh to make sure that we have something for the american people will we extend these covid era subsidies i don’t know i don’t think so i think the american people realize that the covet is over jody this was a failed system from the very beginning obamacare was never designed to succeed It was designed by the Democrats, voted singularly in by the Democrats to replace the health care system that we had in America with universal health care, Medicare for all. We are not content with letting that happen. We do have to find some ways forward, though, maybe tort reform, maybe insurance reform. I kind of like the idea of the money going to the individuals. And you are smart enough to decide how you want to negotiate your health care prices. My wife and I are on a MediShare-type program now. We could be on Obamacare with the rest of Congress, but we decided not to do that. We negotiate our own prices. Americans are smart enough to do that if we give them the chance.
SPEAKER 03 :
Yeah, absolutely. And, you know, I think I think another thing when you’re talking about the American people, certainly smart enough to handle their own decisions with all of this. But they also need to be educated on some of this. The waste, fraud and abuse in these subsidies is all over the place. And I guess, you know, certainly Republicans are going to deal with some of these issues, won’t they?
SPEAKER 17 :
Yes, we will. I think half the people who are on or getting these subsidies never even file a claim. Now, just because you have car insurance doesn’t mean you’re going to necessarily get into a wreck. But when you have that high of a number not filing claims, something is wrong. Subsidies are going directly to the insurance companies, which is a mistake. I think that leads to increased prices for the consumer because the insurance companies are certainly making the money. And we also need to make sure that people who are using these services are getting the quality services they need and deserve. You know, we made the reforms in Medicaid under the one big beautiful bill, right? We kicked illegal aliens off. We put in work requirements. We can do the hard job of reforming these systems to save these systems for the American people. But it’s going to take some work and it’s going to take some time. I don’t think we’re going to get something done on these subsidies, whether totally outright rejecting them or reforming them in some way by January 1st.
SPEAKER 03 :
Well, there’s a lot of work to do, as you said. And, you know, also tied up in all of these are taxpayer funding for abortion and so-called gender transition procedures. The American people need to know those type of things. And I’m hopeful that Congress will deal with it as well. By the way, we do have a FRC. We’ve got a petition where people can come on board and sign. Just text ACA to 67742. That’s ACA to 67742. Thank you, Missouri Congressman Mark Offord. Always great to see you and an honor to have you on Washington Watch. Happy Thanksgiving. Appreciate it. Likewise to you, my friend. All right. Coming up, we’re going to get the latest on the redistricting battle. FRC actions. Matt Carpenter will be joining me next. So stick around. We’ll be back in just a moment.
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SPEAKER 06 :
The book of Hebrews says that the Word of God is living and active, sharper than any two-edged sword, piercing to the division of soul and of spirit, of joints and of marrow, and discerning the thoughts and intentions of the heart. Family Research Council invites you to join our Stand on the Word Bible reading plan as we finish our two-year journey through the living and active Word of God before the new year. Join us for 10 to 15 minutes a day as we read the last books of the New Testament. and discover that the Bible is one big story, a story of many words pointing to the Word, the One who is the same yesterday, today, and forever. The Word is alive and His name is Jesus. Find our Bible reading plan and daily devotionals from Tony Perkins at frc.org slash Bible. Join us and may the Word of God come alive in you.
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SPEAKER 03 :
Thank you so much for joining us today on Washington Watch. Welcome back. I’m Jody Heiss sitting in today for Tony. All right. I want to underscore this again. Our last segment, we discussed the battle over health care. And I just wanted to encourage you once more to sign our petition. And I want to just take a quick second to explain why the Democrats want to make permanent. They want to make permanent the COVID-era Obamacare subsidies, and they want to continue funding insurance plans that cover abortion and so-called gender transition procedures. So our petition is here for you to sign, and it will be sent to House Speaker Mike Johnson and Senate Majority Leader John Thune. And the basic message is no more taxpayer funding for abortion and so-called gender transition procedures. That’s what the petition’s all about, and that’s where it’s going. Again, for you to sign on, simply text ACA to 67742. That’s the letters ACA to 67742. All right, let’s move on. Judges have now entered into the redistricting war. This is a war that you’ll remember started with Texas and California and since then has spread out to a slew of other states, both red and blue. Yesterday, a panel of three federal judges in Texas blocked that state’s new GOP-favored house map from being used ahead of the upcoming 2026 midterms. And their reasoning? Well, the judges said that they found it was likely racial gerrymandering. So what does this mean for Texas? And what does this mean for the wider battle as a whole? Well, joining me now to discuss this is Matt Carpenter. He’s the director of FRC Action and an expert on this redistricting battle. Matt, welcome back to Washington Watch. Thanks for joining me.
SPEAKER 01 :
Thanks for having me, Jody. Great to be with you.
SPEAKER 03 :
Okay, so let’s talk about this Texas decision. How did Texas Governor Greg Abbott respond to the court’s ruling?
SPEAKER 01 :
Yeah, swiftly and decisively, just hours after this ruling was handed down from the district court, a three-judge panel ruled two to one against Texas’s maps. And Governor Abbott came out, like I said, hours after this ruling dropped, denounced it, said that the claims of the court that this was racially motivated were erroneous and pledged to appeal to the Supreme Court. So, you know, this, the mid-site, mid- The mid-decade redistricting cycle we’re in was always going to be litigated, and it seems like we’ve arrived at that stage now where the courts are going to have to weigh in.
SPEAKER 03 :
Wow. It’s amazing that we’re dealing with this. So what does all this mean, Matt, politically, as we wait for the decision now from the Supreme Court? What’s going to happen in the meantime?
SPEAKER 01 :
Yeah, Jody, you mentioned in your remarks in the beginning, it was a great point, that it’s a red and a blue state phenomenon here, this kind of unique mid-decade redistricting cycle we’re in now. And a lot of states are kind of waiting in the wings, trying to figure out which way this is headed. I think whatever comes from the Supreme Court, if they decide to take up this case, it’s going to have enormous ramifications for some of the states that are making overtures that they’re going to redraw their own. districts. Florida is looking at redrawing their districts. Indiana is it’s kind of stalled, but they’re looking at it as well. So and you’ve got blue states like Virginia and Maryland that are also looking at redistricting. And there’s potential for even more in the future.
SPEAKER 03 :
Yeah, you mentioned Indiana stalling. What’s what’s tell us about what’s going on there?
SPEAKER 01 :
Yeah, recently, the Indiana Senate leadership came out and signaled that they actually didn’t have the votes to go through with this redistricting push in the state, despite the despite pressure from Governor Braun and the White House. they were looking at potentially going after two democrat seats in the hoosier state but despite that it looks as though they may take up redistricting when they convene for the regularly scheduled session so it i guess the concern was they were not able to get the votes during a special session but we’ll see if maybe with some additional time once they convene in january perhaps they’ll have the votes needed to look at their maps again
SPEAKER 03 :
You mentioned several other states. I know Virginia, you mentioned Florida, Maryland. Are they all waiting for the court decisions now, or are some of them still trying to press forward? What’s the posture in these other states looking like?
SPEAKER 01 :
You know, it’s a pretty unique thing. Each state has their own sort of labyrinth of constitutional requirements and statutes around redistricting. The situation in Virginia is there’s basically no room for error. If you look at the course of action that the Democratic-led legislature there has taken, and they have got a new governor coming in, Abigail Spanberger, who’s a Democrat, they have to pass a constitutional amendment this session, with this governor he won’t have to veto it but then they have to come back next session and pass an identical constitutional amendment get it on the ballot before their spring primaries i believe are in april and get it passed so they have a series of events that that they can’t miss any one of those deadlines in order to circumvent their constitutionally required bipartisan redistricting commission The situation in Maryland, as you mentioned, they’re one of the blue states that are considering redistricting as well. It’s a little different there. They have a Supreme Court that’s been loaded up from former Republican Governor Larry Hogan. And so I think the political calculus from Democrat Governor Wes Moore in that state and the Democratic leadership in the legislature is that they’re not likely to get new maps past that Republican-dominated state Supreme Court. Nevertheless— Governor Moore is pushing through with a redistricting commission. So he’s trying to circumvent the legislature even. So each state is different. Florida Governor Ron DeSantis has been clear that they’re going to look at their maps, potentially redrawing three or five Democrat districts more in the GOP direction. So we’ll have to see how that plays out. First week of December, they’re going to be back in session. And the expectation is that they’re going to proceed with new maps.
SPEAKER 03 :
Yeah, I just hate to see the courts having to get pulled into all of this. It ought to be left to the states, as the Constitution says. But here we are. So less than a minute left, Matt. The U.S. Supreme Court is also looking at several southern states, in particular Voting Rights Act. Is this just going to throw more chaos into the midterm elections?
SPEAKER 01 :
Oh, without a doubt. Yeah, I think if if if Louisiana succeeds in their case against the Section two of the Voting Rights Act, Jody, you’ve got about 19 districts that could be impacted by that ruling that could potentially drag in other states like not just Louisiana, but Georgia. Alabama, Mississippi, North Carolina, South Carolina, and even some other districts in Florida could be on the cutting board as well. You might see this redistricting battle extend even further.
SPEAKER 03 :
Matt Carpenter, director of FRC Action, thank you for this incredible update. We appreciate it. All right, coming up, we have a 28-point peace plan for Russia and Ukraine. Wow. We’ll discuss all of this when we come back, so stay with us.
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Three years ago, the Supreme Court issued its historic Dobbs decision, a ruling that overturned Roe versus Wade, which for nearly 50 years imposed abortion on demand, silencing voters and bypassing the democratic process across the country. The Dobbs decision was a huge step forward against abortion, but it didn’t outright ban it. It returned the power to the people. Now, 29 states have laws on the books protecting life. However, there’s a catch. Abortion numbers since Dobbs have actually gone up with an increase of 12% since 2020, climbing from 930,000 to over 1 million in each of the most recent years. So how can this be? The answer is simple, the abortion drug. Today, over 60% of US abortions involve abortion drugs, many of these without medical oversight. In 2021, the Biden administration quietly removed bare minimum longstanding safety protocols for the abortion drug that have existed for 20 years to protect women from life-threatening risks and ensuring informed consent. The Biden DOJ then declared that they would not enforce the Comstock Act, which prevents the mailing of anything that causes an abortion. This is not only illegal, but also dangerous. A study shows nearly 11% of women who take the abortion drug end up in the emergency room with serious complications. Unless the Trump administration reverses these reckless Biden-era policies, pro-life laws will remain largely symbolic. Without a full review and repeal of Mifepristone, unborn lives will remain in grave danger, and pregnant mothers will remain at risk. Let’s stand for life and end this mail order abortion drug pipeline. Sign the petition urging the Trump administration to take action at frc.org slash stop chemical abortion.
SPEAKER 03 :
Good afternoon. Welcome back to Washington Watch. I’m Jody Heiss, an honor to be sitting in today for Tony, and thank you likewise for joining us. All right. Yesterday, Axios broke a news on an in-the-works, if you will, kind of peace plan for Russia and Ukraine. And this whole plan is inspired by the deal that President Trump successfully got Israel and Hamas to agree to as it relates to the war in Gaza. And according to Axios, this plan currently at least has 28 points that fall into four general buckets. The Trump administration has reportedly been working on this plan in consultation with Russia. So what else is being reported? What are some of the expectations? Joining me now to discuss this is Peter Doran. He’s an adjunct fellow at the Foundation for Defense of Democracies and the former president of the Center for European Policy Analysis. Peter, welcome back to Washington Watch. It’s always good to have you.
SPEAKER 15 :
We’re always talking about Russian and Ukrainian peace whenever we get a chance to chat. Glad to be here.
SPEAKER 03 :
Yes, we are. All right. So before we get into some of the details of this plan, bring us up to speed, Peter, if you will, on where things appeared to stand before Axios published this report.
SPEAKER 15 :
Whiplash. That is the best way we can describe events over the last 30, I’d say 90 days. We have been on again, off again with a potential peace agreement between Russia and Ukraine. But here’s the catch with this latest proposal. It doesn’t have the hallmarks of a just and enduring peace. Rather, it looks a lot more like a humiliating surrender on the part of the Ukrainians. And we can understand why the Ukrainians might be opposed to this. Let’s set aside the fact that Russia is demanding that they defang and demobilize their military to a large extent. Let’s set aside the fact that Russia is demanding territory it doesn’t even control, or the fact that none of the leaks so far have made any mention of the stolen children, more than 20,000 perhaps, that Russia has taken from Ukraine. No, the really humiliating part of this agreement are the faithful of Ukraine. Russia is demanding that Ukraine make the Russian Orthodox Church the state religion over and above the heads of all of Ukraine’s Orthodox faithful who don’t want to have that hierarchy over their heads. This has all the hallmarks of a humiliation and not so much of an enduring peace, Jody.
SPEAKER 03 :
Wow. Incredible information there. So we have right now a 28-point plan. I don’t know. It may end up 27 or 29. Who knows? The president’s 20-point plan in Gaza started out, I think, at 21 points. But anyways, we’re talking four general buckets. Can you kind of unfold for us what those buckets are and what this thing potentially could look like?
SPEAKER 15 :
Right. So it’s important to say up front, we are seeing diplomacy via leaks. We haven’t seen any official documents. And a lot of this is based on, as you mentioned, reporting from Axios, but also some other major and reputable media outlets out there. So a lot of people are leaking what the plan is saying without actually showing it. Also, we have to state very clearly, the Russians have said officially that there have been no major breakthroughs in negotiations, that such a plan doesn’t exist. And for their part, the Ukrainians are saying we’re still waiting to hear from the Americans. So we are dealing in a bit of a fog right now. But what we know for sure, based on the information available, is that the Russians want territory that they don’t fully control. This would be mainly the provinces in the east and south of Ukraine. They want a future where Ukraine is two and a half times, their military is two and a half times smaller. They are offering some hope for so-called security guarantees. But let’s recall, Russia has broken every single promise it has made over the last 30 years to Ukraine. So it’s hard to expect that they won’t do that again. And it’s offering some enticements to the Trump administration. renewing Russian-U.S. relations, and perhaps there’s some economic trade deals nestled in there. So we’ve got a lot of talking from the Russians, no response yet from the Ukrainians, and all of this is being done through leaks.
SPEAKER 03 :
Wow. Very interesting. And according to multiple U.S. officials, Secretary of the Army Dan Driscoll actually arrived in Kiev today as part of a delegation of senior Pentagon officials. And at least reportedly, one of the items on their to-do list is to start exploring ways to restart these peace talks. Do you know any more about that?
SPEAKER 15 :
We do know that there is a delegation. I would also add one of the purposes of this visit is to take stock of what Ukraine’s military needs are. So it does show that the administration is very open to the idea that Ukraine will need the ability to defend itself It also shows that the administration is trying to listen to the Ukrainians in a serious way, specifically on the question of weapons and their future defense. So I take some hope in this. What will almost certainly happen is that our military delegation from the army will return back to Washington, and this will become part of a brief for President Trump. Ultimately, President Trump has been hot and cold on this process. When he’s paying attention, he gets angry. He gets upset at Putin. And then he delegates the negotiations to others. He looks to other issues. He returns to the stove, as you will. He sees the pots are boiling over. He takes action. And then he moves on to other topics. This is a recurring pattern we’ve seen again and again. So expect that pattern to continue for the foreseeable future.
SPEAKER 03 :
Very, very interesting to see how this all potentially could unfold. I know that the chessboard seems big, and there are a lot of moving parts. As you said, they come and go from one day to the other. It seems from all three of the parties involved in all of this, it’s quite amazing. Thank you so much, Peter Doran, Adjunct Senior Fellow at the Foundation for Defense of Democracies. Always a fascinating conversation. Thank you for joining us on Washington Watch.
SPEAKER 15 :
Thank you for having me.
SPEAKER 03 :
All right. Coming up, we’re going to take a look at Saudi Arabia’s abysmal religious liberty record. And my former colleague in Congress and current chair of the U.S. Commission on International Religious Freedom, Vicki Hartzler, will be joining me right after the break. So stay tuned. We’ll be right back.
SPEAKER 16 :
For over 4,000 years, the Jewish people have had legal, historical, and biblical ties to the land of Israel, especially the heartland of Israel, Judea and Samaria, which much of the world still calls the West Bank. To Israelis, Judea and Samaria is far more than a name. It’s the center of their ancestral homeland where nearly 80% of the Bible’s events took place. Abraham purchased property in Hebron, Jacob in Shechem, Joshua made an altar on Mount Ebal and led the Israelites into a covenant before God. On Mount Gerizim, overlooking Shechem, Jesus talked to the Samaritan woman at the well about worshiping neither on Mount Gerizim nor in Jerusalem, but in spirit and in truth. Judea and Samaria is nearly a quarter of Israel’s current land mass, not a small strip of land on the Jordan River, but a vital and strategic part of the nation’s identity. The October 7th massacre, launched from Gaza, shattered the illusion that giving away territory brings peace. Gaza, which was once seen as the cornerstone of a two-state solution, became a launchpad for terror. Today, only 21 percent of Israelis support a Palestinian state. Trust in a two-state solution has all but collapsed. The Middle East is changing. Iran’s grip is weakening. New alliances are forming. But Western countries and some U.S. officials still chase the mirage of a two-state solution. History speaks clearly. The 2005 Gaza withdrawal, backed by the U.S., led not to peace, but to a terrorist regime. Judea and Samaria are 24 times larger than Gaza, deeply woven into Israel’s geographic and spiritual fabric. To surrender them would not bring peace. It would invite conflict and existential danger. Family Research Council stands with Israel’s rightful claim to sovereignty. It’s time for America to do the same for history, for justice, and for lasting security in the Middle East.
SPEAKER 08 :
How should Christians think about the thorny issues shaping our culture? How should Christians address deceitful ideas like transgenderism, critical theory, or assisted suicide? How can Christians navigate raising children in a broken culture, the war on gender roles, or rebuilding our once great nation? Outstanding is a podcast from The Washington Stand dedicated to these critical conversations. Outstanding seeks to tear down what our corrupt culture lifts up with an aim to take every thought and every idea captive to the obedience of Christ. Whether policies or partisan politics, whether conflict in America or conflict abroad, join us and our guests as we examine the headlines through the lens of Scripture. and explore how Christians can faithfully exalt Christ in all of life. Follow Outstanding on your favorite podcast app and look for new episodes each week.
SPEAKER 03 :
Thank you for joining us today on Washington Watch. I’m Jody Heiss sitting in today for Tony, and so glad to have you on with us as well. All right, before I get to my next guest, I wanted to remind you, just in case it’s not on your radar, it needs to be, Christmas. Christmas is just around the corner. And if you’re looking for a gift idea, I want to encourage you to check out our Stand on the Word store. Take a look at some of the items that we’ve put together there. All of them, by the way, inspired by the Stand on the Word Bible reading plan, including our newest study guide on Paul’s letters to leaders. This and many, many other resources are designed to encourage you, your family, your friends, encourage them specifically to continue standing on God’s word. And in order to make sure that whatever you order gets to you by Christmas, I want to encourage you to order by November 23rd. That’s a Sunday. So mark it down November 23rd to check out all the collection of what we have on the stand in the word store. Just simply text the word store. to 677-42, 677-42. All right. President Trump, you probably saw it, he gave the royal treatment to Saudi Arabia’s crown prince yesterday, capping the day, in fact, with a black-tie dinner at the White House. That dinner was attended by a number of prominent figures. And the president announced that the two leaders had finalized a series of landmark agreements that deepened the U.S. and Saudi partnership.
SPEAKER 11 :
And we had a big day today. a very big day for both countries. We’ve gotten to know each other well over the years, and he has become a true partner for peace and prosperity for our countries and for the world and for peace in the Middle East, which was a crowning achievement for both of us.
SPEAKER 03 :
Well, while certainly many Americans are welcoming the strengthened economic and defense partnership with Saudi Arabia, but on the other side, there are some who are urging the president to hold the line on sanctions due to egregious religious freedom violations, which are ongoing. And my next guest is one of those. Joining me now to discuss this and a whole lot more is former Congresswoman Vicki Hartzler. She currently serves as the chair of the U.S. Commission on International Religious Freedom. Vicki, what an honor to see you again. Thank you for joining us. Welcome to Washington Watch.
SPEAKER 09 :
Thank you. It’s great to be here, Jody.
SPEAKER 03 :
All right, before we get to Saudi Arabia, I’m sure some of our longtime viewers and listeners would love to hear what you’ve been doing since leaving Congress, how the Lord has led you to this incredible place where you’re currently serving.
SPEAKER 09 :
Well, I just want to be available to do whatever the Lord wants to make a difference for him and for others. And I was very blessed and honored when Speaker Mike Johnson and Steve Scalise reached out to me and asked if I would be willing to be appointed to the U.S. Commission on International Religious Freedom. And of course, I have long been concerned about the persecution of people of faith around the world, and this is a perfect fit because the U.S. Commission on International Religious Freedom is charged by the 1998 law that Congress passed to monitor the religious freedom around the world and to report to Congress and make recommendations on what we can do through our foreign policy to help. And so I’m traveling and learning and reading and working with our other commissioners and our full-time staff in D.C. to try to shine a light on the abuses and to advocate for real change to help people of faith.
SPEAKER 03 :
Well, I just want to underscore, I think this is a perfect fit for you, Vicki. It was such an honor to serve with you and to see your faith in the Lord Jesus and the Scripture stand out so brightly in Congress. You and I had the honor of serving together in the Values Action Team with you leading that and me carrying as much water as you’d let me carry. But this is such a perfect fit, and I’m so grateful that God has opened this door for you. Tell me what it’s been like so far for you in this new role.
SPEAKER 09 :
Well, it’s been heartbreaking in some ways as on a daily basis, I hear more specific stories of our brothers and sisters in Christ and people of other faith who are being tortured or imprisoned or arrested or their family members are being killed just because of their beliefs. And we have so much to be thankful for here in America. I think we sometimes take it for granted. But a scripture that has been near and dear to my heart for a long time is something I live by now. But it’s Hebrews 13, 3 says, remember those who are in prison as if you were their fellow prisoner and those who are suffering as if you were being mistreated. And that’s what we have to do. We have a joint call to speak up for those who can’t speak up for themselves. And so I’ve been learning a lot and traveled to countries that I never thought I would get to travel to, visit with people of faith, but also have a renewed sense of the need to pray for people and to get involved. And I’m thankful that through our US government and the foresight of our Congress back in 1998, that we put this advocacy for religious freedom equal to our advocacy for national security interests and economic interests in our foreign policy. And so the way it’s supposed to work is when our president or secretary of state goes and negotiates for tariff reductions or for military equipment with another country that has violations they should be raising these concerns with them as part of the negotiations. And President Trump in his first term and Secretary Pompeo were very, very strong about doing that. And we are advocating and hopeful that President Trump will be just as proactive in this administration in raising these issues and to demand some change in order to get the U.S. support.
SPEAKER 03 :
Case in point, let’s turn back to the discussion on Saudi Arabia. There are many who are not aware of the extent of Saudi Arabia’s religious freedom violations. Can you kind of go over some of that with us?
SPEAKER 09 :
Yes, you bet. Well, only Muslims can have a church building. There are no non-Muslim buildings of faith or worship in Saudi Arabia. And you can meet privately, but only after giving government approval, letting them know how many attendees you’re going to have, the time and the place. Christian churches… cannot have bank accounts, which makes it difficult for them to operate and vulnerable to potential charges of money laundering for taking offerings or helping the needy. They can’t advertise any religious gatherings on social media. These are just a few of the controls that government has over Christians there, but they also have these horrible capital offense laws there where you can get the death penalty for converting Christians. from Islam to Christianity or charges of blasphemy. And Saudi Arabia is known for its executions. They have killed and executed over 240 people so far this year. And many of those are religious freedom activists. prisoners who simply were living out their faith or protesting or posted something on social media, certainly nonviolent offense. And yet Saudi Arabia takes these nonviolent offenses and they give people the death penalty for them. So it’s very problematic. And then as a woman, the government forces all the laws on marriage and divorce and child custody and inheritance based on Sharia law. And so even if you’re not Muslim, if you have an inheritance issue, it has to be done under the Sharia law and the male guardianship system, which is really repressive for women.
SPEAKER 03 :
Wow. I know Saudi Arabia is one of at least 16 countries that the Commission for International Religious Freedom, USURF, that your commission has recommended for designation as a country of particular concern, a CPC. And that’s a pretty… Incredible list. I mean, we’re talking countries like China and Iran, Nigeria, North Korea, Russia, some of these others, I can’t recall them all. But for those who may not be familiar with what a CPC designation means, can you kind of explain that for us?
SPEAKER 09 :
Sure. These are countries who have ongoing, systematic, and egregious violations. And Saudi Arabia falls under that category with their imprisonment and executions of individuals. We hear reports of torture as well, but then the government oppression and suppression of just the ability to live out your faith in public. It’s illegal and against the law to express your faith in public as well. So these are very egregious and systematic and they’re ongoing violations now saudi arabia and under the crown prince has talked about trying to make some changes there are some small improvements i would say for instance women can have driver’s license now but that doesn’t erase the the severe violations and so if our country designates goes ahead and follows through on our recommendation from you sir There’s a toolkit of options that our government and our president has that they can impose on this country. They can withhold military aid or foreign aid, or they can sanction individuals. These are just a few of the options. But what our government has done in the past is they have acknowledged these things. They’ve said, okay, you’re a country of particular concern. But there is a provision in the law where you can give a waiver, a defense waiver. And that is what our government has done with Saudi Arabia in the past, basically giving them a free pass. And there are no ramifications for these violations. And At USURF, we are advocating that Saudi Arabia be designated this again and not get the waiver and that we would, in our negotiations with them, force them to make some changes before we give them F-35s or any other military equipment.
SPEAKER 03 :
So there’s no doubt that the relationship with Saudi Arabia is fairly strategic on several points. So you just laid out some things that the Trump administration can do as it tries to navigate its way forward on this relationship. What would probably be the number one or maybe the top two things that you would hope this administration would do?
SPEAKER 09 :
Well, I would hope that they would withhold giving them the F-35s until they change their laws. For instance, their apostasy law saying, OK, we’re not going to execute you if you change your faith. You know, do something tangible. How about allowing Christians to have a church? And changing the law to allow somebody to share their faith in public. We wouldn’t have to ask them to change 100% of their laws right away, but certainly have some good faith steps and some changes moving to improving and expanding religious freedom in the country immediately. And saving lives, frankly, quit executing people for religious beliefs as a way to incite them to be able to qualify for receiving the F-35s. So that would certainly be one thing. I think we could do some visa restrictions or sanction some individuals who are carrying out these acts. prosecutions of these blasphemy laws, apostasy laws, and or executing these prisoners. Just doing some of these things might get their attention and they want to work with us, clearly. You saw the Crown Prince yesterday. They’re just as interested in having a strategic relationship with us as we are of having one with them. And so now is the opportunity. Now is the time for our administration to stand strong and to demand some changes, to speak up for religious freedom. and to make the world a better place.
SPEAKER 03 :
Now is the time to do just that. And I want to encourage our viewers and listeners to take some of the points that you just shared and make these points of prayer, because we need divine intervention to help our current administration navigate through these issues, not just from an economic perspective, but from the issue of religious freedom as well. Now, obviously, we’ve been talking a lot about Saudi Arabia, but this is just one. There are many, many other countries. So I want to switch gears a little bit and ask you a more broad question, the view of religious freedom in the world. How do you see things trending right now globally as it relates to religious freedom?
SPEAKER 09 :
Well, sadly, it is trending down. We are seeing an increased level of persecution all over the world, especially of Christians. And you look at what’s going on in Nigeria. We’ve had over 52,000 Christians slaughtered just since 2009, and 18,000 churches burned. And we are so grateful for President Trump designating Nigeria as a country of particular concern, and he’s soon going to be announcing plans to work with and cooperate and and coerce the Nigerian government to take action to save lives and to change ways. So we’re very encouraged by that. But China is horrific. Of course, they have over one million Uyghur Muslims in concentration camps there. They’ve taken over one million both Uyghur children and Tibetan children from their families and are putting them in boarding schools and indoctrinating them. But they’re also imprisoning Christian pastors and church leaders and we saw pastor ezra jinn and his church leaders in prison just a couple of weeks ago and they’re really cracking down on the christians there and of course iran is executing so many christians there and people of faith But the good news is that the gospel is still spreading in Iran. It can’t be stopped. We’re hearing multiple reports of dreams and visions of Jesus appearing to people. And the same in China. The church is growing despite the persecution. So there’s some encouraging news along with the concerning news as well. But God overcomes and good overcomes evil and light overcomes darkness ultimately.
SPEAKER 03 :
Amen. 30 seconds. How would you encourage people to be praying right now?
SPEAKER 09 :
Well, pray for our government leaders that they would prioritize religious freedom as we work with and have these opportunities with these other countries that are coming to us. Pray for the people who are persecuted to stand strong and to have their needs met and to be a light in that community and pray for open doors for more gospel to go forward.
SPEAKER 03 :
Amen. Vicki Hartzler, chair of the U.S. Commission for International Religious Freedom, thank you so much for joining us. Great to see you again. Keep the torch ablaze. All right, that wraps it up today. We’ll see you again tomorrow right here on Washington Watch. Good evening. Good evening.
SPEAKER 02 :
Washington Watch with Tony Perkins is brought to you by Family Research Council. To support our efforts to advance faith, family, and freedom, please text GIVE to 67742. That’s GIVE to 67742. Portions of the show discussing candidates are brought to you by Family Research Council Action. For more information, please visit TonyPerkins.com.
