In this powerful episode, The Kim Monson Show highlights the crucial story of Cindy Stein, a mother at war with the system to protect her daughter. From battling health issues to resisting the overreach of activism in her child’s life, Cindy offers a glimpse into the complexities of modern advocacy and education. The discussion expands to cover issues of freedom versus force, the role of education in shaping young minds, and the enduring power of parental love in the face of adversity.
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It’s the Kim Monson Show, analyzing the most important stories.
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I find that it takes work to get your brain around these ideas, and it takes work to engage in these conversations.
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The latest in politics and world affairs.
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With what is happening down at the Statehouse, I used to think that it was above my pay grade to read the legislation, and it’s not.
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Today’s current opinions and ideas.
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I see big danger in as much as we will be giving an unelected bureaucrat the power to make rules about what we inject into our bodies.
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Is it freedom or is it force? Let’s have a conversation.
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Indeed, let’s have a conversation, and welcome to the Kim Monson Show. Thank you so much for joining us. You’re each treasured, you’re valued, you have purpose. Today, strive for excellence, take care of your heart, your soul, your mind, and your body. My friends, we were made for this moment in history, and we were put in Colorado for this reason as well. We are at the tip of the spear, and my friends, we’re stepping up, and the patriots are looking down upon us, and they’re very proud, I think, of all of us. We have a lot of work to do. Thank you to the team. That’s Producer Joe, Luke, Rachel, Zach, Echo, Charlie, Mike, Teresa, Amanda, and all the people here at Crawford Broadcasting. It is Thursday, Producer Joe. Happy Thursday, Kim. Yeah, happy Thursday. And another great show planned for you. And be sure and check out my website. That is Kim Monson, M-O-N-S-O-N.com. Sign up for our weekly email newsletter. That way you’ll get first look at our upcoming guests. as well as our most recent essays, and that comes out on Sundays. You can email me at kim at kimmonson.com. You can text me at 720-605-0647, and I am behind on all of that communication, but I’m working on it. But I want to hear from you, so do not give up on me. And thank you to all of you who support us. We’re an independent voice. We search for truth and clarity by looking at these issues through the lens of freedom versus force, force versus freedom, if something’s a good idea. Shouldn’t have to force people to do it. And I do thank the Harris family for their gold sponsorship of the show. It is reliable, efficient, affordable, and abundant energy. I’m getting mixed up. That’s Laramie Energy. Thank you to the Harris family for the gold sponsorship of the show. But Laramie Energy is also a gold sponsor, and it is reliable, efficient, affordable, and abundant energy. energy that comes from oil, natural gas, and coal that fuels our lives, powers our dreams, and empowers us to change our own personal climate. The show comes to you 6 to 8 a.m. Monday through Friday on all KLZ 560 platforms, rebroadcast. 1 to 2 in the afternoon. Those platforms are KLZ 560 AM, KLZ 100.7 FM, the KLZ website, and the KLZ app. So be sure and check that out. It comes in apparently loud and clear on Alexa, and then the show podcasts are found on Spotify and iTunes as well. Our word of the day is from Eric, reciprocity. It’s R-E-C-I-P-R-O-C-I-T-Y. And it could be a reciprocal condition or relationship. Number two, a mutual or cooperative interchange of favors or privileges, especially the exchange of rights or privileges of trade between nations. and mutual action and reaction. I’m concerned that there’s reciprocity down at the State House with these radical activist legislators that are pushing forward special interest agendas. And I’m concerned there’s some reciprocity there. So again, R-E-C-I-P-R-O-C-I-T-Y, your challenge is to use that in a sentence today. Our quote is from James Madison, one of our founding fathers born in 1751, died in 1836, and he was an American statesman, diplomat, and founding father. He served as the fourth president of the United States. He was popularly acclaimed as the father of the Constitution for his pivotal role in drafting and promoting the Constitution of the United States and the Bill of Rights. And, my friends, he said this. He said, “‘Resistance to tyranny is service to God.'” And I think that’s pretty amazing. Again, resistance to tyranny is service to God. And we are going to talk with two women here in this next segment. There is the tyranny of this radical activist, transgender, extremist, special interest stuff that is being pushed on our children. And we are going to talk about that today. We have these important discussions because of our sponsors. One of those great sponsors is the Roger Mangan State Farm Insurance Team. And Roger knows that life can be challenging. We do know that. But their mission is to maximize your financial security as you manage the risks of everyday life. So call Roger Mangan at 303-795-8855 for more information. Like a good neighbor, the Roger Mangan team is there.
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And welcome back to The Kim Monson Show. Check out our website. That is Kim Monson, M-O-N-S-O-N.com. Sign up for our weekly email newsletter. You can email me at Kim at KimMonson.com as well. Thank you to all of you who support us. We’re an independent voice and we search for truth and clarity by looking at these issues through the lens of freedom versus force, force versus freedom. If something’s a good idea, my friends, you shouldn’t have to force people to do it. I am very pleased to have on the line with me two women, one of them I know very well, and that is Lori Gimmelstein. She is the co-founder of the Colorado Parents Advocacy Network, doing amazing work for children and families and parents. And Lori Gimmelstein, welcome to the show. Good morning, Kim. Thanks so much for the opportunity to join you this morning. Well, most definitely. And then also a mom, Cindy Stein. We’re going to hear her story. And Cindy, welcome to the show. Thank you very much. I appreciate you having me. Yes, and a very important story. But Lori, before we get into this, we need to let people know about Colorado Parents Advocacy Network and also this summit that is just right around the corner.
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Thank you. Yes. So for your listeners, on April 6th, we have a very important summit, as you said, coming to Colorado at the Inverness Hilton in Englewood, Colorado. It’s the Rocky Mountain Summit on Safeguarding Children from Gender Affirming Treatment. And we are absolutely thrilled. This is the first event in Colorado that has been approved to give physicians continuing medical education, professional development opportunities. And so physicians that are tuning in this morning, please go online this morning, coloradoparents.org and get your tickets to get CME so that you can hear from the experts. We are bringing in the top Of the top people, we have Dr. Miriam Grossman. She is a renowned child psychiatrist, best-selling author of a book called Lost and Transnation. And we have President Trump’s deputy counsel, Candace Jackson, joining us. She is deputy counsel with the U.S. Department of Education, civil rights attorney, brilliant. We have Dr. Lior Sapir with the Manhattan Institute. He’s a data analyst. And we also have for the first time, Dr. Michelle Stanford. She’s a Colorado pediatrician. She’ll be speaking in Colorado. She’s going to be talking about the harms of gender affirming treatment on minor children. And then that panel is going to be moderated by my very good friend, Dr. Travis Morrell with Colorado Principled Physicians. And then I’ll be moderating a panel that is bringing in families. So we have Erin and Chloe Lee. I know your listeners are familiar with Erin’s story. And this is the first time her daughter, Chloe, who’s now 16, will be speaking out about what happened to her publicly. And then we’re also flying in Florida parent January Littlejohn, who many of you remember from President Trump’s State of the Union address. She is the mom who he honored. She stood up. She’s has beautiful blonde hair, the long hair when she stood up in the beautiful blue dress. She’s coming to talk about what happened to her family and how her daughter’s school transitioned her behind her family’s back. And then we also have pediatric gender clinic whistleblower Jamie Reed on the panel. It’s going to be an event nobody wants to miss, April 6th, Inverness Hilton. Get your tickets today, coloradoparents.org.
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So great work on that, Lori Gimmelstein. And Lori, you reached out to me and you said that there is a story. It was published first at the Daily Wire, but you wanted us to be the first locally to talk about this story. So thank you. And it’s the story of Cindy Stein. And Cindy, welcome to the show. So Lori, set this up a little bit. And then Cindy, we want to get over here and hear about this journey that you’re on. Sure.
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Yeah, absolutely. So we have at the Colorado Parent Advocacy Network an incident reporting tool. It’s the heart of our advocacy. We help families, help parents, students, teachers when issues arise so that we can help them get the support they need to be successful. And Cindy reached out to us in November. I’m going to let her speak to the story, but just kind of in summary, her daughter was really befriended by a math teacher named Joanne Smotherman at Durango High School when she was a junior. And her daughter has some comorbidities that make her very vulnerable. She’s diagnosed with autism, anxiety, depression, and ADHD. And Cindy had been diagnosed last year with cancer and was going through some very aggressive medical treatments. And during that time, Joanne Smotherman befriended her daughter. And at first, I think that there was some gratitude that she had somebody at school to help her. But it has really turned into a nightmare for Cindy and her family. Joanne Smotherman has basically coerced and convinced Cindy’s daughter that she is actually a boy. And now her daughter ran away and moved in with Joanne and her transgender husband, Kevin Smotherman, who goes as Vivian Smotherman. And the police, CPS, school district, everyone has failed Cindy. And Cindy’s daughter is, the police were unwilling to take Cindy’s daughter out of the Smotherman’s home at the age of 17. And the body cam footage of the police on scene is available on our X account at CPN Colorado as our handle. People can go on X and just search Colorado Parent Advocacy Network to follow us and to see that body cam footage. But it’s so alarming how the system has failed this mom. She has full custodial rights. It was against her will that she be staying with these people. And It’s so alarming what’s happening in Colorado. So Cynthia is here this morning. It’s the first time she’s ever been on radio. And I’m just so grateful, Kim, for your support and bringing her on to have this story heard.
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Well, Cindy, thank you for sharing your story because I think most people think this could not happen to me. This is not happening in my school district. This was in Durango. As Laurie Gimmelstein mentioned, Erin Lee was up in Little Wellington. And this whole transgender indoctrination of our children, it’s really everywhere. And I really think that these transgender activists target… vulnerable children and I remember when I was in junior high and high school my mom and I were not getting along that well and so for an activist to come in and insert themselves into that because that happens a lot Cindy you’re not alone on that but what happened with this is is tragic and here you are going through your own health challenge and then this happens so walk us through this journey Okay. Yeah. Thank you.
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Again, speak to some of what Lori said. Yes, I was dealing with cancer and treatment. And I really wanted to protect my children from how hard that was for me because it was aggressive. It was aggressive treatment. And I think it was the catalyst for my daughter. And I just wasn’t able to help her deal with the idea that mom might not be okay. And I think, again, Joanne Smotherman stepped in, whether it’s malicious in the beginning or not, and kind of took her under her wing. Initially, I thought all of the time that Jocelyn was spending with this teacher was innocent. And then I noticed in her junior year that she really started to pull away from the family. And like you said, I never, ever would have thought that in small-town Durango that we could have these kinds of problems.
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So when did your daughter meet Joanne Smotherman before this? Has this been a progression to get to this point, or did it start in her junior year? What about that, Cindy?
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Yeah, she actually met her her sophomore year. at Durango High School. And the funny thing is, her sophomore year, she couldn’t stand this woman. She was a very openly gay lesbian teacher who had pride flags in her classroom, who spoke openly about her alternative lifestyle. And yeah, Jocelyn did not like her the first year that she had her as a teacher.
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What is the subject that Joanne Smotherman is ostensibly supposed to be teaching at Durango High School?
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Yeah, I have to mention she’s no longer at Durango High School. Her teaching contract was apparently not renewed, but she is a math teacher, and she is currently at the Durango Adult Education Center, which is a nonprofit and does not play by the state of Colorado’s rules.
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Okay.
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She’s tutoring children and teaching outside of the school district.
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Okay, so parents beware on that one. So you are going through your own health challenges, and I have a friend that’s going through aggressive treatment for cancer right now. I know what that looks like. Just keeping it together is pretty difficult. So you have your kiddos there. Your daughter is vulnerable. That’s all I can say about it. So then what happens, Cindy Stein?
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So through her junior year, she’s starting to pull away from the family, and she’s starting to want to dress in men’s clothes. At first, it started with, like, jackets, and then it turned into pants. And then, you know, I noticed that she’s got men’s briefs on, boxer shorts, and then she’s wanting to shave her head. And, you know, I’m thinking, okay, well… I’m allowing this because I’m thinking maybe she’s just experimenting and trying to spread her wings, figure out who she is, which I don’t want to stifle. I definitely want her to experiment and have that safe space here in my house. I just didn’t realize how far this had gone and how much Joanne Smotherman was apparently whispering in her ear. And I’m guessing she was telling her, my daughter, that all of these problems of being a misfit, of being an outcast, all of those kids who ever told her she was a freak, all of these external problems are because she was born into the wrong body. And that’s what I started hearing. And I started hearing the name Onyx. And I refused to call her by this new name. And we had some big clashes. And eventually, when I told my daughter that I was going to take her up to Denver for my purposes to get her away from the Durango influences. That resulted in her kicking out the screen of her window and running away. And she went straight to Joanne Smotherman’s house.
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Okay. So then when was this, Cindy Stein? This was this past November of 2024. Okay. So the Joanne Smotherman and I don’t quite understand trans husband what that is exactly.
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But anyway, your daughter is there.
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And so then what happened, Cindy?
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So for 24 hours, I had no idea where my daughter was. She left everything here, including her phone. And so I couldn’t trace her. I couldn’t track her. She wasn’t communicating with me. She didn’t leave a note. I didn’t know if she was okay. I didn’t know if I was going to get a call from the hospital telling me to come identify my child. I just had no idea. And Joanne Smotherman didn’t have the courtesy and the ethical backbone to contact me and say, hey, I’ve got your kid. And then, you know, let’s let the situation cool down and I’ll send her home. Nothing. I had no communication. I finally went to her place, my daughter’s place of employment the next day. I didn’t say anything to her because, but she knew I was there. She saw me. And her response was to go to the manager’s office and have the security guard escort her out of the building.
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Okay. So we’ve got just about three and a half minutes left on this, Cindy. So you are on this journey. You’ve contacted at some point Lori and her team at Colorado Parents Advocacy Network. Also, you contacted the authorities, the police as well. So what happened there?
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Yes. So, yes, we had police involvements. We had CPS involvements. I have to say Lori was amazing in helping me navigate and trying to figure out which way to turn next. We went through a pretty intense journey with mental health facilities and gender affirming care in the home or lack of. And ultimately, at the end of the day, my daughter chose to leave the house on December 21st. And Joanne Smotherman’s house was never an acceptable place to go, but that’s where she went. And I have not been able to get her to come home since. Okay. She ignores my calls and texts, and Joanne Smotherman has not been cooperative in sending her home.
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Okay. So, Lori, what do you think next steps are for Cindy?
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Well, yesterday, Cindy filed a complaint with the La Plata County Deputy Sheriff to investigate the fact that the deputies that were called on scene on January 5th to help Cindy retrieve her daughter because the Smothermans are harboring her. They do not have permission from her mom to house her. And then the police went on scene. They basically mocked Cindy, and we, Cora requested the body cam footage. It’s so alarming to watch how callous, how completely disengaged they were when they got to this motherman’s house to check, they called it a welfare check on her daughter. and they they went in and they basically it sounds like they excuse me they said words to her daughter you know you’re good right you’re good that’s all i need to hear is that you’re good thanks for helping me check the boxes and then when they walked outside one of the deputies said like we’re going to have to go speak to them referring to cindy and her two friends that joined her to help retrieve her daughter And the other officer made a joke about it. Yeah, they’re going to basically freak out. And they started laughing before they drove down the driveway to go talk with Cindy and inform her that not only were they not going to help her, but there was nothing law enforcement can do. And so we’ve got a parent. She is a custodial parent. She did not get permission to this person who is harboring her child. And the people that are supposed to help us, the police failed to do so. And they mocked her.
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Okay. We have one minute left. Lori, thank you. This has gone quickly. Cindy, next steps. First of all, I’m sure prayers for your family, for your daughter, for you. Your next step.
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I can, again, only pray that my daughter… sees the situation differently and she sees the harm that the Smothermans have done to her and my family unit with her.
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And she comes home and has a huge change of heart. Okay. Well, Cindy Stein, thank you for sharing your story with us. Lori Gimbelstein, Colorado Parents Advocacy Network, thank you for all that you do. We certainly will put you in our thoughts and prayers.
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Thank you so much. Have a wonderful day.
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And we have these important discussions because of our sponsors. They realize that we need to be engaged in this battle of ideas. This is a battle for our children. And I so appreciate all that Lori Gimmelstein does over at the Colorado Parents Advocacy Network. And I appreciate Cindy Stein breaking this story on the local level with us. You can find it at The Daily Wire. LGBT activist, teacher, trans husband, house minor, teen girl in Colorado against mom’s wishes. And I appreciate all our sponsors.
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And welcome back to The Kim Monson Show with Kim Monson. Be sure and check out our website. That is KimMonson.com. Sign up for our weekly email newsletter there. You can email me at Kim at KimMonson.com as well. Thank you to all of you who support us. We’re an independent voice on an independent station searching for truth and clarity. As we look at these issues through this lens of freedom versus force, force versus freedom, something’s a good idea. You shouldn’t have to force people to do it. And I think somebody that agrees with me on this whole force issue is Jay Davidson. He is the founder and CEO of First American State Bank, which is a community bank located right here in the metro area. Jay Davidson, I think you agree with me on this force issue, yes?
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I totally and absolutely 100% agree with you.
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I had a feeling you were going to say that. So that was a little bit of a softball question like, what’s your favorite ice cream? But it is actually there are people that really do like force. And what we’re seeing is the veil is being pulled off on this, Jay Davidson. And we’ll talk about that in just a moment regarding Doge. But before we do that. First American State Bank is a sponsor of the show, which I really greatly appreciate. And I’d always thought First American State Bank just worked with very high net worth individuals, but that’s not the case, right?
SPEAKER 16 :
No, not at all. We have a lot of high net worth folks who appreciate community banking, the personal relationship that exists, but not at all. We’re a In fact, we’re expanding as fast as we possibly can into the millennial and Gen X folks, the younger folks. And my daughter is helping me with that by getting us into these mobile apps. I can say these words. I just don’t know a thing about it, but I can say the words. But you can do all your banking online now on your iPhone if you want to, or you can come in. I mean, we’re still the same community bank. We’re still involved in our community. We’ll still consult with you as an individual. And I would recommend that these young business people or young entrepreneurs that are coming up, I know it’s easy for you to go to your corner bank and get a commodity product, but Consider the added advantage of the kind of knowledge that we have after all our years in banking and how we might be able to impart some of that knowledge to you as you make your decisions on your investments and lending and borrowing and so forth.
SPEAKER 06 :
Personal relationships are so important, and that’s what First American State Bank offers. Jay Davidson, millennials have gotten, I think, a bad rap. But as I am seeing these young people around their 40s, coming into their 40s or a little over, I am seeing a move towards, and I’m going to put this in air quotes, conservatism. And that is that conserving this idea of our declaration that all men are created equal with these rights from God of life, liberty, and pursuit of happiness. So what that means is creating businesses, being a creator. And I am seeing an amazing amount of creativity from, you and I can both call them young people, but they’re approaching middle age. And that’s our millennials. And I know you’re seeing that as well.
SPEAKER 16 :
Very true. The reason I started pivoting into the millennial business person is the friends I met through my children, who are obviously millennials, have their own children now, my dearly and beautiful beloved wife. grandchildren and so I’m meeting these people I was very impressed with them they come at business differently than I did mine was much more structured and I started in a giant corporation and worked my way through and then I went the entrepreneurial route well these young people are starting the entrepreneurial route right away and they’re quite successful quite intelligent but I think I would be careful about the term conservative because it now has a connotation that probably does not appeal to a millennial that much. And I would recommend the term principled, perhaps. And by that, I mean somebody who lives according to a principle. And I think the principle that you and I can agree on, because you’re very much a constitutionalist, is the sanctity of the individual, the right of the individual to decide for him or herself in whatever topic is there. Now, the decision obviously has to follow the laws of the land, and we all agree with that, and it also has to follow a moral and ethical code, and that’s a personal decision, whether it’s a Catholic, a religious, a Jewish, a non-denominational, non-secular decision. I mean, philosophers are also quite principled as are religious leaders, so I like to call it principled, and the principle is the sanctity of the individual.
SPEAKER 06 :
Okay, I’m going to take that. Thank you for that comment on that. When you mentioned an ethical code, and I remember hearing Dennis Prager many years ago talking about the Ten Commandments. And he said if there was one commandment that was greater than any of the others, that he thought it was thou shalt not steal. And what we have seen with a bigger and bigger government is that we use government policy to, in essence, control. steal, I think, from one person to give to another because government finds it, and I used this word altruistic earlier in the week as our word of the day, and altruistic has been, I think, co-opted to use government to take from one person for the betterment of the other, but the decision maker there is the one that’s considered altruistic. So What do you think about Prager’s thought about stealing? Because I think it’s unprincipled to steal from one to give to another.
SPEAKER 16 :
Absolutely. It is a commandment. You can argue about commandments, but I think it would be unwise to break them. There’s a reason that they’re there, and stealing is certainly at the top of the list. Stealing can entail money or goods. It can also entail freedom. And if we’re if our freedoms are restricted by a arbitrary bureaucratic government decision, our freedoms are being stolen. And when you look at all the regulations that exist and the rules and regulations that exist that were not passed and according to our Constitution, therefore they’re not lawful, you become surprised. You become shocked. One of the biggest complaints I hear in banking from young folks, and older obviously, is that getting a permit to build a building, take the risk of building a building, whether it’s a condo or an office or mixed use, doesn’t matter. The permitting process is horrendous. Well, what happened to our ability? If I’m willing to invest my capital into a project and take all the risk, why is some bureaucrat telling me that I have to put pink toilets in the men’s bathroom? It’s none of their business. I’ll do what I want. And, you know, we’ve got to think down the terms of if you are an individual. then you, by our Declaration of Independence, have inalienable rights. That means rights that are bestowed on you by a creator, by something greater than man, greater than government, greater than even our Constitution. And that’s what Thomas Jefferson was saying, is that you do have inalienable God-given or creation-given rights to life, liberty, and the ownership of property. Well, the ownership of property comes right into the concept of stealing, as you indicated.
SPEAKER 06 :
Well, and to your point, is with all of these hoops that individuals have to jump through to get this business open, that is, it’s stealing an intangible. It’s stealing opportunity. And I think it’s important that people understand that, Jay.
SPEAKER 16 :
Very good point. Yeah, freedom of action and freedom… of opportunity that devolves therefrom. revolves there from. Yes, very good point.
SPEAKER 06 :
Well, and the other thing, Jay, is I think all of us learn, we believe that in America, justice is supposed to be blind, right? And we look at the vision of the Declaration that all are created equal. To me, that means that we are all to be treated equally under the law. And so mentioning this opportunity to build a building or whatever, when I was on city council, And now also as the president of this volunteer group, Colorado Union of Taxpayers, which were watching legislation, I’ve seen different policies and I did see some legislation down at the statehouse that wants to fast track projects that these PBIs, politicians, bureaucrats and interested parties like. So, for example, a green policy. could be fast-tracked through the permit process, whereas just a regular person wanting to build a building, they might have to jump through all these different hoops. That is antithetical to the American idea, Jay Davidson.
SPEAKER 16 :
Well, it absolutely is. This is a bureaucrat making a rule for us and stealing our freedom to choose. our inalienable right to make a choice. And it’s absolutely unconstitutional. And yet this regulatory bureaucratic creep that has existed since Woodrow Wilson was president over 100 years ago has just gotten worse and worse. And I’ve got to say that this is not necessarily a Democrat, although they tend to do this more. But I’ve seen big government Republicans do the same kind of thing. And to me, it’s not a Democrat or Republican decision. It’s are you for more government or limited government? And by limited government, we mean limited by the Constitution. And if you’re in favor of limited government, I’m on your side and you’re on my side. That is the issue.
SPEAKER 06 :
Well said. One other thing before we go to break, and that is we were talking about this creep, if you will. And you and I both lived through political correctness where we might not say something because we were concerned that we might offend someone. As I look back at that now. That was an affront upon freedom of speech. But through kind of this cultural pressure, I was self-censoring myself. And it was a journey for me to understand that and another journey to say, certainly I want to be judicious and want to have discernment when I’m speaking. But I had decided once I realized that I was no longer judicious. going to self-censor myself because my concern that somebody else might not like what I’m saying. Your comments on that, Jay Davidson?
SPEAKER 16 :
Well, this goes into the whole concept, and forgive me if I go astray here and cut me off if I do, but this is the whole concept of a democracy versus a constitutional republic. And by that I mean a constitutional republic says that we are not ruled by the majority. that we as individuals have certain inalienable rights. Now, there is a democratic process in our government every two, four, and six years that is democratic. One vote, one person, majority makes a decision. But after that one instance on election day, then we revert back to our constitutional republic, which says that you have the right and obligation to make your own way. And so when the majority rules, democracy is the tyranny of the majority over the minority. If there’s 50% plus one vote, then that mass of people can make a decision that affects me that I don’t like. And that is not the intent of a constitutional republic. That is the intent of a democracy. So when all these people spew out this whole concept of democracy, yes, there is an instant in time every two, four, and six years when there is a democratic activity called a vote, an election day. But after that, we absolutely have to go back to the concept of the Constitutional Republic, which is the sanctity of the individual, the right of the individual to make a decision on his or her own. So I don’t know if I’ve answered your question. I’ve kind of gone astray here. But I’m trying to get to the point where it is the right of the individual to make individual decisions. It is not the right of the government to infringe on our freedoms.
SPEAKER 06 :
And we are at such an interesting time right now, Jay Davidson. So we’re going to go to break. We’ll continue the discussion with Jay Davidson. He is the founder and CEO of First American State Bank, a community bank, personal relationships. Those are so important. And another great sponsor of the show is Lorne Levy for Everything Mortgages.
SPEAKER 13 :
If you’d like to explore what a reverse mortgage can do for you, call Lauren Levy at 303-880-8881. That’s 303-880-8881.
SPEAKER 14 :
Call now. All of Kim’s sponsors are an inclusive partnership with Kim and are not affiliated with or in partnership with KLZ or Crawford Broadcasting. If you would like to support the work of The Kim Monson Show and grow your business, contact Kim at her website, kimmonson.com. That’s kimmonson, M-O-N-S-O-N dot com.
SPEAKER 13 :
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SPEAKER 06 :
And welcome back to The Kim Monson Show. Be sure and check out our website. That is KimMonson, M-O-N-S-O-N.com. Sign up for our weekly email newsletter. You can email me at Kim at KimMonson.com as well. Thank you to all of you who support us. We’re an independent voice, and we search for truth and clarity by looking at these issues through the lens of freedom versus force, force versus freedom. If something’s a good idea, you should not have to force people to do it. Two things, as you know, I totally support the USMC Memorial Foundation raising money for the remodel of the marine memorial to make that a reality they’re going to have their second golf tournament in may and this is kind of early bird there’s only going to be a certain number of golfers so great way to support the foundation and to meet some new people and play a great golf course it’s the ridge and more information on that go to usmcmemorialfoundation.org And then the other nonprofit that I feature on a regular basis on the show is the Center for American Values, located down in Pueblo. And they’re going to have a great On Values presentation, middle part of April, with Norma Donland, who is the widow of Roger Donland. And Roger was the first Medal of Honor recipient from the Vietnam War. And so you can get more information on that by going to AmericanValuesCenter.org. Talking with Jay Davidson, he’s the CEO and founder of First American State Bank, a community bank located right here in the metro area, and really personalized service. And so be sure and check that out. What is that website, Jay Davidson?
SPEAKER 16 :
FASbank.com.
SPEAKER 06 :
Okay, FASBank.com, standing for FirstAmericaStateBank.com. And Jay Davidson, a lot is happening in our world. Wanted to get your thoughts about Elon Musk and Doge. And I find it so interesting that people are protesting in the streets. To me, it seems like they’re saying, we want more waste, fraud, and abuse. But what’s your thoughts about Doge, the Department of Government Efficiency?
SPEAKER 16 :
Interesting concept to form a government agency to eliminate other government agencies. And I know that Elon works for no pay. But anyway, I was kind of blown away by Trump’s first few weeks in office. It’s like he had taken the four years when he was sitting out when Biden was president. and planned this to the nth degree, to detail, to an absolute detailed degree, because he was up and running in very short order. He had the people in place, and he had the policies in place, the ideas in place, and he just started implementing right away, characteristic of a really good business person. Now, whether what he’s doing is right or wrong, time will tell. I have long railed against the waste and the cost bureaucracy, government agencies, the administrative state, the deep state, the incursion of a bureaucrat into my life and your lives has been horrendous and has gotten worse and worse. Granted, I see more of it than a lot of people because I’m in a highly regulated industry, and we should be regulated. I’m fine with that. But I see arbitrariness in the way that these regulations are implemented. And it’s very hard to run a business on an arbitrary basis. So I’ve been really against that situation forever. And all my friends in oil and gas and medicine and so forth feel the same way. The regulatory agencies have invaded their turf. So the point I’m trying to get at is that Musk is pretty astonishing. I appreciate how methodical he is in going after all this waste, which we knew was there. I just didn’t realize the extent of it. It blows my mind. I mean, at first I thought, well, USA must do some good stuff. And, you know, Elon blew it out 100% in the first couple of weeks he was in position. I thought, what is going on here? Then I look at where they were spending their money and how much money they were spending. I mean, millions of dollars for Hamas training on transgenderism. Are these people? I mean, it’s the whole mentality of the administrative state of the bureaucrat not to conserve capital because they don’t have any capital in the deal. But their job is to spend every dollar they can get. So next year they can get more. Now, this is antithetical to the benefit of the people whose money they are spending. And if you really think about it, we taxpayers are paying for USAID’s $100 million to Hamas transgender training. Give me a break.
SPEAKER 06 :
Well, and I saw or somebody mentioned a meme to me is why are we paying other countries to hate us? If they want to hate us, they can hate us for free.
SPEAKER 16 :
Yeah, that’s true. A lot of good it’s doing now. My friends in the Foreign Service will tell me that it does some good. And I’m saying, okay, fine, then prove it and live according to it. I mean, in a business world, and I know that I can’t apply my business ethics to a bureaucrat, but I’m paying for it. You know, I just spent a horrendous amount of money on taxes. And I’m saying, I’m tired of this, people. You keep saying, oh, it’s just a little bit here, a little bit there. We’ll just tax the rich. And now it’s to the point of breaking our backs. And the other point I’d like to make is that when you hear about the news, when Kyle Clark talks about Doge, what Kyle and the whole left-wing machine that’s out there is going to talk about is the harm that Elon Musk is doing to an individual. And you know what? I can’t argue with him. That poor person, that bureaucrat, is going to have a life-changing event. And I can feel empathy for that person. However, what the Kyle Clarks of this world don’t ever talk about is the effect, the net effect, of a government spending more and more and more of our gross domestic product, more of our income. They’re And we started the conversation with the word steal. Well, when taxation gets to the point of 50 percent of your income, that is absolute theft. And that’s where we are right now at the very high end of the scale with all the state, local, regional and federal taxes. So I’m tired of the stealing.
SPEAKER 06 :
Well, and yes, I think that we, the American taxpayers, have been fleeced by all of this. I think the good Lord asked for 10%. I think government all in should be able to operate on 10%. Just think what would happen regarding creativity and innovation if we all had an additional 40%. in in our pocket but jay you bring up an an interesting point i think all of us on a micro level we do we think about the individual that it may be a family they have a house payment uh i i know that i’m concerned about that however And Daniel Turner with Power the Future, and I had a conversation about this, is no Kyle Clark, none of those on the left gave a flying rip about any of those oil and gas workers that lost their jobs on day one with the Biden-Harris administration, where Joe Biden died. stopped the Keystone Pipeline, 8,000 people lost their jobs at that particular point in time, and there was no tears for them whatsoever.
SPEAKER 16 :
Yeah, it’s all pretty one-sided, isn’t it? It’s all directed to a political goal. And the only goal that I can see, that I can understand, is total control. And that’s why I differentiate the two camps. One believes in tyranny and control, and they do it through the regulatory or bureaucratic state. And the other believes in freedom. And we believe in a constitution. We believe in limited government. Now, we may be small in number, but the message that we have, that you have, and that you’ve been bringing forward is the idea that you as an individual have freedom to choose not from a government, not from a law, but from your creator. It’s intrinsic in who you are and what you are, but you’ve got to exercise it. Now, we talk freedom all the time, but the other side of freedom is responsibility. They don’t exist one without the other. So what is your responsibility to freedom? You need to know what’s going on. That’s why you’re listening to this radio show and other ones like it and reading what you do read. You’re involved. And I’d say… Speak out in your own way. Find your own voice and articulate. You don’t have to follow what some bureaucrat tells you to do in Washington. It’s not legal in any way, shape, or form. And do your silent revolt. Like you said, I don’t need to be politically correct. That’s no way to think. That’s just brainwashing. Well, let’s get some more information out there.
SPEAKER 06 :
Well, and we need to be engaging, to your point, and that’s why we do the show, is for people to get their brains around these issues, find their voices, engage in conversation, and we change the culture on this. We have about three minutes left, Jay Davidson, and I think you and I both, we’ve had these conversations about this out-of-control government debt, this out-of-control spending. I Not sure that I ever thought we could get this ship turned around. But I think Donald Trump, with his team and with Doge, when Musk says he may find a trillion dollars in savings, my gosh, that’s half of the deficit. I think we can get this ship turned around. I’m very encouraged. Your thoughts?
SPEAKER 16 :
Yeah, and we’re $36 trillion in debt. And if you add in the unfunded commitment, it’s more like $70 trillion. So the number is horrendous, and it’s unsustainable, absolutely, totally unsustainable. And you and I won’t pay for it. Our grandchildren will pay for it. That’s the horrendous thing. That’s why we must be involved here to stop this government spending. Because if you think debt, the next thought should be spending. The spending exists. The debt exists because the spending is happening. And why are they spending all this money? They’re buying votes from people that don’t want to work for a living. And they’re using our money to buy votes. That’s why they’re spending all this money on welfare and entitlements. So, you know, you can talk about the poor guy that’s losing his job in the government. Well, what about you losing your job and your money and your grandchildren being crushed by this kind of debt? You’ve got to balance it out.
SPEAKER 06 :
Absolutely. And that is what I have said is where we were headed off a cliff. And I know that it’s a little bit pain. Well, it’s painful now. But if we don’t get this turned around, it’s going to be really, really painful. Jay Davidson, as always, it goes way too quickly. What’s your final thought you’d like to leave with our listeners?
SPEAKER 16 :
You have you have the inalienable right to freedom of choice to your own decisions. This is gratitude by your creator, whether you call him God or Jehovah or Elohim. I don’t care. So you have that right. And I would ask you to exercise it judiciously, but do exercise it.
SPEAKER 06 :
Well, absolutely. Jay Davidson, thank you so much. It’s always a riveting conversation. Thank you.
SPEAKER 16 :
You’re welcome.
SPEAKER 06 :
And that’s Jay Davidson, CEO and founder of First America State Bank. That website is FASBank.com. Our quote for the end of the show is James Madison. He said, it is of great importance in a republic not only to guard the society against the oppression of its rulers, but to guard one part of the society against the injustice of the other part. So my friends today, be grateful, read great books, think good thoughts, listen to beautiful music, communicate and listen well, live honestly and authentically, strive for high ideals, and like Superman, stand for truth, justice, and the American way. My friends, you are not alone. God bless you. God bless America. And stay tuned for our number two.
SPEAKER 08 :
Talking about freedom Talking about freedom I will fight
SPEAKER 02 :
The views and opinions expressed on KLZ 560 are those of the speaker, commentators, hosts, their guests, and callers. They are not necessarily the views and opinions of Crawford Broadcasting or KLZ management, employees, associates, or advertisers. KLZ 560 is a Crawford Broadcasting God and country station.
SPEAKER 15 :
It’s the Kim Monson Show, analyzing the most important stories.
SPEAKER 06 :
I find that it takes work to get your brain around these ideas, and it takes work to engage in these conversations.
SPEAKER 15 :
The latest in politics and world affairs.
SPEAKER 06 :
With what is happening down at the Statehouse, I used to think that it was above my pay grade to read the legislation, and it’s not.
SPEAKER 15 :
Today’s current opinions and ideas.
SPEAKER 06 :
I see big danger in as much as we will be giving an unelected bureaucrat the power to make rules about what we inject into our bodies.
SPEAKER 15 :
Is it freedom or is it force? Let’s have a conversation.
SPEAKER 06 :
Indeed, let’s have a conversation. And welcome to our number two of the Kim Monson Show. Thank you so much for joining us. You’re each treasured, you’re valued, you have purpose. Today, strive for excellence, take care of your heart, your soul, your mind, and your body. My friends, we were made for this moment in history. Thank you to the team. That’s Producer Joe, Luke, Rachel, Zach, Echo, Charlie, Mike, Teresa, Amanda, all the people here at Crawford Broadcasting. Happy Thursday, Producer Joe. Happy Thursday, Kim. Great show planned. Lots in the first hour, and we’ve got Professor Kurt Gerwitz in studio for the second hour. Great to have you, Professor.
SPEAKER 12 :
One of your fan favorites, I’m sure.
SPEAKER 06 :
Absolutely. We always get a lot of interaction on the text line, which is 720- 720-605-0647. Be sure and check out our website. That is Kim Monson, M-O-N-S-O-N.com. Sign up for our weekly email newsletter that goes out on Sundays. And you’ll get first look at our upcoming guests as well as our most recent essays. You can email me at Kim at KimMonson.com. And again, that text line is 720-605-0647. I do want to hear from you. And I am fighting my… Don’t you say anything about… Anything on that, Kurt Gerwitz, about AI. I’m getting the finger point already. I may actually have to do that.
SPEAKER 12 :
If you want to be productive, it can help.
SPEAKER 06 :
I do want to be productive. We’re talking about my email inbox. And Kurt Gerwitz says I should use AI to help me with that. Yes. So we’ll talk about that at some point. Anyway, be sure and, well, first of all, you can hear the show 6 to 8 a.m. Monday through Friday on all KLZ 560 platforms. The first hour is rebroadcast in the afternoon 1 to 2, second hour 10 to 11 at night. Those platforms are KLZ 560 AM, KLZ 100.7 FM, the KLZ website, and the KLZ app. And I thank all of you who support us, all of our great sponsors, and all of you. We are an independent voice on an independent station searching for truth and clarity. by looking at these issues through this lens of freedom versus force, force versus freedom. If something’s a good idea, you shouldn’t have to force people to do it. It should be able to stand on its own merits. And that’s why we do this show is because force comes around in a lot of different ways. Now, it used to be, Kurt, in the old days, it was… The bad guys riding into the village and plundering and raping and all those things because they had weapons. But now what we see is that they’re using the terms compassionate and altruistic to take your stuff. And that would be your property, your rights, your freedom, livelihoods, opportunities, childhoods. You did listen to the first hour. This…
SPEAKER 12 :
We’re shaking that off. We’re taking that heavy topic. It’s scary. There’s a dark cloud over that conversation.
SPEAKER 06 :
There is. This LGBTQ activist teacher in Durango befriends a vulnerable student and encourages the student that is a female, that she is not a female, that she’s a boy. I hadn’t really thought of it. That probably is… A sign that something is happening if your girl says she wants to wear boxer shorts. I hadn’t even thought about that. But this is happening in our little towns here in America. And people think, oh, I live in a little town. It’s not going to happen. There’s Durango. We broke the story with Erin Lee and her daughter up in little old Wellington, Colorado. And so I know I’m getting off a little bit on my way they take things, but they’re taking our children’s childhoods and focusing on and hopefully next week we’re going to have one of the talk show hosts from one of the other stations reached out and asked me if I would get this particular guest on. So just stay tuned on that regarding what’s happening in our schools. But so anyway, force can be obviously a weapon. And, Kurt, I know this is heavy. I have to say this, though. And when I did my testimony down at the statehouse on one of Scott Bottom’s bills, which was forcing insurance companies, he wanted to prevent insurance companies from being forced to have to provide malpractice insurance for physicians that are doing trans surgeries and trans pharmaceuticals on kids. And I began with my surgery with when the bad guys used to ride into the village. If they would have lined up our children and cut off the breasts of our adolescent girls and cut off the penises of our boys, we would have said, enough. You’re not doing that. That’s not good. But we have that happening in America right now, Kurt Gerwitz.
SPEAKER 12 :
Yeah, what came to mind, oh, gosh, was a few things. My mind’s already racing around, Kemp. It’s a riveting subject.
SPEAKER 06 :
It is.
SPEAKER 12 :
Yeah, I don’t think we know what childhood is – like what an ideal childhood is supposed to be like. I had a therapist in my past tell me that – and he had a number on it. He said 11 percent of children get out of childhood without trauma. And when someone says that to me, I think, do you mean – this happens a lot when you’re in the middle of the – when you’re not thinking as international as I – want my students and clients to think. When someone says that, it’s like, oh, is that a statistic on planet Earth? Or is that a statistic of Americans? Because the population of America, we’re only 4% of the world. So I assume it means Americans, that 11% of Americans get out of childhood without trauma. And I just throw my hands in the air and throw my pencil across the room and I say, well, that should be our metric on society, right next to how do we treat our prisoners, right? That’s a famous… The measure of a society or a civilization is how are the prisoners treated. And now I’m thinking, well, no, now we have a percentage on how many children escape childhood without trauma. You and I both have trauma.
SPEAKER 06 :
We talked about it at lunch.
SPEAKER 12 :
Lowercase t, nothing too serious, I hope.
SPEAKER 06 :
Yeah, so we’ll talk a little bit more about it. I think life, though, has trauma. It just does, and so we have to learn how to deal with that trauma. So let’s get into that more as we’re talking about legacies and things in the second and third segment of this. But force can obviously be a weapon, but it can be policy, unpredictable and excessive taxation, fear, coercion, government-induced inflation, this agenda by the World Economic Forum, the globalist elites. United Nations, what’s happening down here at the Colorado State Legislature with the approval of this Colorado governor. He’s no libertarian. Land use codes, zoning regulations, force fees, conservation easements, national monument designations. The list goes on and on and on. And we need to pull that back. On the show, there are several things that we focus on. We have all of these great guests and interesting stories today. But I want to make sure that we are always focusing. First of all, these elections are super important. And at this point in time, I am sending out update letters to all of our funders for our two lawsuits. And there’s more to come on these elections. But if we don’t have elections, free, fair, honest and transparent elections, we’re just spinning our wheels. We can spend all the money that we want. We can get all the great candidates that we want. We can try to get these candidates elected. We can stand against many of these bad issues. And we have had some success, but we must make sure that we have free, fair, honest, and transparent elections. And we need to make sure that we understand the issues and we have good candidates. And I’m committed to work on that. And also we focus on our children, protecting our children, climate change, and particularly with the movie that I was involved in, ClimateConversation.com, which you can watch for free. And then also property rights. And property rights are inherent in the American idea. And if we don’t have property rights, we really don’t have freedom. And those property rights certainly are tangible. Property rights are intangible. But another person. that stands up for property rights diligently. She’s worked at the local, the county, the state, and the national level. And she is a award-winning realtor, great sponsor of the show, great friend. And hopefully she doesn’t know I’m talking about her, Kurt Gerwitz. But that’s Karen Levine. Karen Levine, welcome to the show. Good morning, Kim. It seems like a lot to live up to, but that really is you. And you and I have known each other a long time, and you walk your talk. And I really appreciate it.
SPEAKER 04 :
Well, thank you. Thank you. And that was quite the segue from all the other conversations you’re having, which are many and very valuable. But yes, private property rights and homeownership is the key to building wealth in America. And as you were referring to public policy, what our legislators are doing over time have taken away many of those rights and have made affordability very complicated and difficult. I would say difficult in Colorado and really nationwide, but more so here at home. And that’s why the work you’re doing and the work I am and the Colorado Association of Realtors is doing is trying to protect those rights.
SPEAKER 06 :
Well, and this legislature is in session until May 6th, although what they do – and so many times we think, oh, we could have a sigh of relief that the legislature is finally out of session. But no, no, no. What they’ve done is they have then implemented – what I call PBIs, politicians, bureaucrats, and interested parties, to go out and continue this onerous stuff that they’re doing. And so that’s why shining and shedding light on this is so important. But it’s, gosh, it’s March. Easter’s late this year, I think, but we’re in the spring selling season. I’m seeing houses, signs around the community saying, So tell us inventory. We talked with Lauren Levy yesterday about mortgages to be pre-qualified. He said that well-priced and well-maintained homes are moving. But there’s things that people need to do if they’re going to be selling their home, particularly during this selling season.
SPEAKER 04 :
Correct. If you’re interested in getting your home on the market over these next I would say 30 days to six weeks, maybe 60 days, but that is the height of our selling season in the front range. And the things you need to do is hopefully pick up the phone, give me a call and we can have a consultation and talk about getting your home ready. But what I’ve experienced over the last couple of weeks is, as Lauren stated, homes that have been prepared and in many cases, I provide what’s called a walk and talk consultation with a professional stager who walks in and goes room by room and helps you configure each of those rooms so that it highlights your home in the photographs. And then when people walk in, they know what to expect, but also they see the home. And that’s what we want is that we’re selling a home. We’re not, we’re not selling furniture. all the activities and collectibles and those types of things that we have in our home when we’re living in our home. But what we’re seeing is really good buyer activity, and whether it’s sad or good, I think it’s good for the marketplace is multiple offers, again, because those good homes, people want to buy them, and they are willing to pay market value or maybe a tad above that to get that home despite interest rates being higher than they were, you know, three to five years ago. So homeownership is still a dream that people are achieving, and that’s exciting.
SPEAKER 06 :
So, Karen, have you looked at all, and I didn’t mention that I would mention this to you, but the Trump proposal about using some public lands to make freedom cities. Now, I talked to Trent Luce yesterday. He said he thought they were going to be smart cities. Of course, I think smart cities are a bad idea, but I do like the idea that of opening up land for single-family homes for property ownership. I think the National Realtors had at least made comments on it. Have you looked into that much at all, or shall we talk about that next week?
SPEAKER 04 :
I haven’t looked into it at all with regards to what Trump is suggesting, but I do know when I was the National Association of Realtors director, we talked about utilizing public lands to bring more product to the marketplace. And if you have more product, the product should become more affordable. And so we started looking at that as a National Association of Realtors of how can you do that. So it kind of excites me to hear that President Trump is thinking that might be something that would be beneficial. I DON’T KNOW WHAT THE PERCENTAGE OF LAND IS THAT’S OWNED BY THE GOVERNMENT. IT’S A LOT. IT’S A VERY LARGE PERCENTAGE. AND THE STATE OF COLORADO, OUR PERCENTAGE IS EVEN HIGHER THAN OTHER STATES. SO I THINK THERE MAY BE OPPORTUNITY THERE, BUT WE NEED TO BE WISE IN MAKING THOSE POLICY DECISIONS, RIGHT? AND WE NEED TO THINK ABOUT LONG-TERM EFFECTS IF WE MAKE THOSE DECISIONS BECAUSE WE SEE THAT SOMETIMES Policy that is well-meaning, that is to protect the consumer, to protect the homebuyer, to protect the homeowner, can be harmful down the road. And we’ve seen that with affordability or lack thereof here in Colorado.
SPEAKER 06 :
Oh, correct. And one other question, going back to staging, if you’re selling your home, I’ve heard that it’s great to have a candle or something that smells like cookie dough or something like that in your house. Is that true to make it more homey?
SPEAKER 04 :
Actually, it can be detrimental. And I say that because we’ve become a society of allergies. And what I did learn is that vanilla is very offensive to a lot of people. But the safe scent is a citrus. Citrus is a clean scent, and it can give you a fresh scent in your home. But the cookie idea is really good if they’re actual cookies. And for someone who showed… close to a dozen homes last Friday, and we did not really have time to stop for a meal. The house that had the freshly baked chocolate chip cookies certainly warmed my heart and my tummy.
SPEAKER 06 :
Aha, okay. Well, that’s your nugget of wisdom today from Karen Levine, Remax Realtor. People should reach out to you. It doesn’t cost anything. What’s that phone number, Karen Levine?
SPEAKER 04 :
The phone number is 303- 877-7516.
SPEAKER 06 :
And for everything real estate, reach out to Karen Levine. And I know each of these sponsors personally, and they all strive for excellence. And another sponsor that strives for excellence is the Roger Mangan State Farm Insurance Team. And they can create a personalized insurance plan to cover all your needs from protection for your cars to your home, condo, boat, motorcycle, business, and renter’s coverage. Don’t forget that, Producer Joe. That is really, really important. So contact the Roger Manga team now at 303-795-8855 for a complimentary appointment. Like a good neighbor, the Roger Manga team is there.
SPEAKER 19 :
It seems like we are getting squeezed everywhere. Inflation, high taxes, at the gas pump. Where can you save money? Well, when you bundle your insurance coverage with the Roger Mangan State Farm Insurance Team, you may save money on your insurance premiums. The Roger Mangan Team will help you with a personalized plan to cover all your insurance needs. for your home, auto, boat, and renter’s coverage. For a complimentary appointment, call the Roger Mangan team now at 303-795-8855. That number again is 303-795-8855. Like a good neighbor, the Roger Mangan team is there.
SPEAKER 13 :
We’ll be right back. Knowledge is power and preparation leads to success. Call Lauren Levy at 303-880-8881 so that you are prepared for the opportunities in the mortgage market. That’s Lauren Levy at 303-880-8881.
SPEAKER 20 :
You’d like to get in touch with one of the sponsors of The Kim Monson Show, but you can’t remember their phone contact or website information. Find a full list of advertising partners on Kim’s website, kimmonson.com. That’s Kim, M-O-N-S-O-N dot com.
SPEAKER 06 :
welcome back to the kim monson show check out our website that is kim monson m-o-n-s-o-n.com sign up for our weekly email newsletter you can email me at kim kimmonson.com as well thank you to all of you who support us we’re an independent voice and we search for truth and clarity by looking at these issues through the lens of freedom versus force force versus freedom something’s a good idea you shouldn’t have to force people to do it we focus on the issues on the show and we’ll talk about the people pushing the issues we’re trying to stay out of the eighth grade girl fighting And there’s a lot of that that happens in politics. But we work on focusing on the issues so you can stay disciplined in your conversations with people. Yeah, I may expound upon that. I’ll just leave that hanging out there. But thank you to the Harris family for their gold sponsorship of the show. And also Hooters Restaurants is a great sponsor of the show as well. And how I got to know them, it is one of those important stories about freedom and free markets and capitalism and pesky PBIs, politicians, bureaucrats, and interested parties that want to control our lives. And Hooters Restaurants has five locations, Loveland, Aurora, Lone Tree, Westminster, and Colorado Springs. Great lunch specials. My guest, Professor Kurt Gerwitz, you and I are going to – have lunch at Hooters restaurant a little bit later.
SPEAKER 12 :
I’m probably going to have those fish tacos again every time.
SPEAKER 06 :
You have the same thing.
SPEAKER 12 :
I actually mixed it up. Yeah, you ventured out. I was so proud of you.
SPEAKER 06 :
Yeah, I think I’ll go back to the great fish and chips, though. I’m kind of hungry for that, so we’ll see. But great, great location. And March Madness, we’re in the middle of March Madness. What a great place to watch the games with your friends is Hooters Restaurant. So, again, check out their locations. That’s Loveland, Aurora, Lone Tree, Westminster, and Colorado Springs. Are you a basketball fan?
SPEAKER 12 :
You know what I love about March Madness is the probabilities. Of course you would because you’re a professor. I think that math helps so many people.
SPEAKER 06 :
So did you do a bracket? Did it help you?
SPEAKER 12 :
No. Well, yes and no. The probabilities of your team winning from the beginning are astronomical. And Warren Buffett, he says, like, I’ll give you a million dollars if you pick the winning team or something like that. And I saw a good one that you’ll like. You know, I love these prediction markets. It’s a new thing.
SPEAKER 06 :
Of course you do.
SPEAKER 12 :
I remember you saying that. Well, I lost money. I don’t know if I should say this on the air, but here it comes. I gambled, I bet, money that Donald Trump was going to lose the popular vote. It’s not ideological. I was just trying to – I thought I saw – group of people who were gambling and it was a 30 they gave it a 30% chance that Trump would win the popular vote okay and so I was like I only put down a couple hundred bucks and this was introduced to me by a bartender who could probably less afford the money to because gambling money is always just entertainment dollars it should be in your budget there and And he was talking about putting thousands on it because he really believed that we hadn’t had a Republican win the popular vote in – since Reagan, I think. And so I lost like $100. That’s entertainment money. I could afford to lose that. But I – these prediction markets are – you can just – you go up against – other people are just saying what they think is going to happen. And you say what you think is going to happen, and then there’s probabilities placed on it based on how much people are gambling on that. And they become prediction markets because they become very – what that does, that free market conversation creates like a probability of what’s going to happen in the future. And there’s one that says there’s a greater – the probability markets say there’s an 11% chance, which is higher than any of the single teams in the – March Madness, that alien life will be discovered in, I assume this means bacteria on Mars or the moon. But yeah, so there’s a greater chance of alien life being discovered than your team winning the whole bracket.
SPEAKER 06 :
Well, okay.
SPEAKER 12 :
Because the number one team never wins, right?
SPEAKER 06 :
Well, sometimes it does. So a couple of things. First of all, you were talking about the probabilities. And typically I try not to be an emotion girl. However, my bracket was emotion. It’s like, oh, I know somebody in that state. And so I’ll go with that one.
SPEAKER 12 :
I always cheer for Marquette or Gonzaga because they’re Jesuit schools. And I went to a Jesuit school and I teach at a Jesuit school. Yeah. So it’s that emotion.
SPEAKER 06 :
And then I chose KU and Houston in the finals. And KU had a terrible record. They were struggling. And I thought, well, maybe. Well, they got, they didn’t even make it through the first round. So again, emotion is not the way to make your decisions. That’s for sure.
SPEAKER 12 :
Right. For the probability markets, the prediction markets will help you figure out the real odds of the probabilities of what’s going to happen.
SPEAKER 06 :
Next year. Next year, that’s what I’m going to do. So my $10 and my pool is gone. But I just blew right through our word of the day and our quote of the day. And so let’s do that. Your challenge will be to use this word of the day in a sentence, Kurt Gerwitz, as well as all of you out there. And it’s reciprocity, R-E-C-I-P-R-O-C-I-T-Y. Thank you to Eric for his suggestion on that. And this I always think is a little lame when they use the word in the definition.
SPEAKER 12 :
So reciprocity. We were taught in grade school you’re not allowed to do that.
SPEAKER 06 :
Yeah. A reciprocal condition or relationship. But next, mutual understanding. Or cooperative interchange of favors, privileges, especially the exchange of rights or privileges of trade between nations. Well, I think we see a lot of the cooperative interchange of favors or privileges in politics. And then lastly, a mutual action and reaction. So I think that as I look at PBIs, politicians and bureaucrats and interested parties that are pushing some of this legislation down at the statehouse, I think there must be some reciprocity. And at this point, you all have a to-do thing, and that is to go to Colorado Union of Taxpayers. That’s coloradotaxpayers.org. And at this point, I want to say thank you to the team. That’s Steve Dorman, Greg Golianski, Russ Haas, Bill Hamill, Rob Knuth, John Nelson, Wendy Warner, Marty Nielsen, Ramey Johnson, Mary Jansen, Dave Evans, Corey Onizorg, Paula Beard, and Ray Beard. These are all volunteers. We’re taking positions on legislation down at the Statehouse. And as of this today… There are 561 pieces of legislation or resolutions that have been introduced down at the Statehouse. Your volunteer group of the Colorado Union of Taxpayers has taken positions on 216 of those. And we just invested significant funds for us because we’re an all-volunteer organization. That’s why we’d love to have you join us. It’s only $25 a year or $2.08 a month. But we rolled out yesterday cut engaged. And this is a great opportunity. You can go to our website, coloradotaxpayer.org. And at the very top, it says cut engaged. Click on that. We have selected three bills to begin with. Two of them are being heard today. So this is very timely. You will be able to send an email directly to the bill sponsors. And if you want to add in your senator and your legislator, we’ve got links to make that happen. Super easy. And this is a way for you to easily make your voice heard. And the three bills that we selected… House Bill 1269, building decarbonization measures. This is all in piling on the Green New Deal and the Green New Deal. Do you know what the Green and the Green New Deal is, Kurt Gerwitz?
SPEAKER 22 :
Dollars.
SPEAKER 06 :
It’s dollars. Ding, ding, ding. Next, Senate Bill 25, coal transition grants. And so what happened here in Colorado, they said, we’re going to shut down those that that clean burning coal fired plant that’s providing reliable and efficient and affordable and abundant energy for people. And those people are going to lose their jobs. You know what? All these people that have been so whacked. about Doge and people losing their jobs there. They haven’t given a flying rip about the people working in these coal-fired plants on the western slope that are losing their jobs. So then, to make themselves feel good, they said, we’re going to have a transition program. And lots of money’s been spent on it. Maybe one person’s got a job. And so we are opposing this coal transition grants bill. And you can, too, by just going to coloradotaxpayer.org and let the sponsors know what you think about that. Maybe they might pull it. And then the last one, and this is one that Ramey Johnson talked about last week. I don’t think it’s scheduled for hearing yet, but I wanted to put that on there. And these are these tap fees for special districts. This is a special deal that legislators, particularly the one that was elected out in the Lakewood area in Jeffco, Rebecca Stewart, is pushing as a special deal for developers for the federal center out there. And so, again, no special treatment. That’s what this is. And so you can go to ColoradoTaxpayer.org. Kurt, that’s going to be your homework while we’re sitting here. And go in and make your voices heard. And, again, we at Colorado Union of Taxpayers have put significant money into this. All of these things happen because of our sponsors. And one of those is Lavaca Meat Company. It’s located at the corner of Maine and Nevada. It is a premium beef product, and it’s really good for your protein source for your diet, and it tastes really good, too.
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SPEAKER 21 :
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SPEAKER 06 :
Welcome back to The Kim Monson Show. Check out our website. That is Kim Monson, M-O-N-S-O-N.com. Sign up for our weekly email newsletter. You can email me at Kim at KimMonson.com as well. Thank you to all of you who support us. We’re an independent voice. We search for truth and clarity by looking at these issues through the lens of freedom versus force, force versus freedom. If something’s a good idea, you should not have to force people to do it. Professor Kirk Gerwitz is in studio. with me and we’re going to talk about legacy. But a perfect thing to talk about regarding legacy is to buy a brick to honor your loved one’s military service that will be on one of their pathways of service. And you can do that by going to USMC Memorial Foundation, Mother’s Day, Father’s Day is right around the corner. Plan early. Get that done. Also, they are going to have their second golf tournament May 15th. And you can get more information about that by going to USMCMemorialFoundation.org as well. Professor Kurt Gerwitz, first of all, tell us what you’re up to and your students. Tell us a little bit about, you know, all that you’re doing.
SPEAKER 12 :
Yes. So this is the season. Twice a year, I teach a class at DU. on the, it’s the business certificate program. So it’s not a, it’s not a typical undergrad class. It’s out of their university college. And I teach the business of the financial planning for business. I call it, I shortcut that. I call it startup finance. So I’m teaching startup finance. A hundred percent of my students are immigrants. A hundred percent of my students are, um, So that means – actually, I couldn’t say that 100% are ESL, meaning English as a second language. But it’s so inspiring to me to talk to immigrants. If you want to love America, talk to an immigrant. Like, they are – Now, are they legal? Yeah. Well, you know, I’m not – I’m not asking that question. I don’t care, Kim. If they’re here, I’m going to help them. If they’re in my – you know, it’s like – We’re going to go deep real quick here. That happens, doesn’t it? Yeah, sorry. But, you know, I was living in the South, and I learned this thing about the difference between Southern racism and Northern racism. Okay, now, we’re so far West, I’m not sure how this applies. But in Southern racism, they would say that they hate the race, but they love the individual. And in Northern racism, it’s the opposite. You would say that they… They hate the individual.
SPEAKER 06 :
They love the race. Right.
SPEAKER 12 :
They love the race and hate the individual.
SPEAKER 06 :
Never thought about that. Yeah.
SPEAKER 12 :
And it’s it’s interesting because it’s like, you know, like I’ve seen my Yankee friends who would like if a black person moved next door, they they’d leave the neighborhood. Right. We’re in the south. That doesn’t happen because they coexist. The races coexist. And and my dad was, you know, he he was he he hated the race and loved the individual. But my father was a southern racist.
SPEAKER 06 :
So but you grew up in St. Louis, right?
SPEAKER 12 :
Yeah, I grew up eating grits and saying y’all, even though even though St. Louis is kind of Missouri was a slave state. The governor fought for the South. The legislature voted to stay with the union. So it was actually there were more Civil War battles in Missouri than any other state except for Virginia. It was a border state. It was the place where families were divided, where brothers were shooting guns against other brothers. So we’re not actually as divided in this country today as we were then. Knock on wood. But we’re probably where it feels like a close second place. So my point about this, though, is that like if I’m face to face with a human being, Kim, I don’t care if they’re documented or undocumented. Now, I care if they’re a violent criminal or not.
SPEAKER 06 :
Okay, but I have to ask this question, is how is it that somebody that could be undocumented or illegal would have the money to be going to college? I don’t understand that.
SPEAKER 12 :
Well, because they work. They actually pay a lot of taxes, too. But this is not supposed to be an argument about immigration. I’m telling you, these immigrants are great. My student immigrants are amazing.
SPEAKER 06 :
Okay, we’ll leave it at that.
SPEAKER 12 :
They are great.
SPEAKER 06 :
They want to learn.
SPEAKER 12 :
Your family has immigrants in it.
SPEAKER 06 :
I know.
SPEAKER 12 :
Okay. And they are great people and they left you here in America to live your best life possible. They chose America as the best country in the world. They had reasons to move here and they were industrious and entrepreneurial and my students are all of those things. And they’re all from crazy all over different countries, right? Like Africa and there’s a few from from europe even and um there’s even less than less spanish speakers than you might expect and So I’m teaching them how to – I’m teaching them the American dream. And it is so great because I’m teaching them also like a little bit of American business culture, like you have to show up on time. And you can call someone in business in America. You can call some – you call people by their – adults call each other adults by their first name. And you come from these cultures where there’s like the hierarchy – is more firm, the social hierarchy is so rigid, and there’s not as much social mobility, and that’s what makes America great is our social mobility. And economic mobility. That’s what I mean, yeah. Yes, that too. And so I’m doing that. So I’m teaching startup finance there. And I’m going to give a presentation at Regis University where I teach the other class. And the innovation challenge will be April 18th. And I’m giving a presentation before that to the – there’s four competing businesses. And they get to go before – it’s kind of like a – I shouldn’t say it’s like a shark tank because they don’t really have products and they’re not pitching for investment. But they are – they’re going to convince a panel of judges that they’ve got the best business idea. So I love a good business competition. Yeah. Yeah. It’s really great.
SPEAKER 06 :
Can people, is it open to the public?
SPEAKER 12 :
It is open to the public. April 18th, you’d have to Google Regis Innovation Challenge to go watch these. They have to have a connection to Regis, but they’re taking businesses from the community and you can just grab a student to join your team and and compete that way. And a lot of schools have these competitions. In fact, the end of that DU class is a pitch competition that’s a graduation. I don’t know if that’s open to the public or not. I’d have to check. But it’s, yeah, so lots of good things going on. And I’m the legacy catalyst speaker. I’m a professional public speaker. And so that’s why I wanted to come in and talk to you about legacy. You and I, we’ve always talked about, well, you dragged me into politics. But I always want to talk about the economy and finance and the transformative power of financial education. And one of the things, the overlap between the two, the biggest overlap between legacy and financial education is kind of like what you leave behind because you can’t take it with you. Right, Kim?
SPEAKER 06 :
Never seen a hearse with a U-Haul, right? No.
SPEAKER 12 :
That’s a great line. Oh, I’m stealing that line. I’m going to say that on stage.
SPEAKER 06 :
You like that? Okay, you can use that. Thank you. So let’s go to break a little bit early on this, Kurt Gerwitz. And we want to hear from you as well, 720-605-0647, to talk a bit about legacy. And we have other email or text messages that are coming in as well that I’d like to try to get to. But I want to make sure we get to this subject on legacy. I think it’s super important. And these discussions, we have them because of our – wonderful sponsors if you’ve been injured you want to make sure that you take prompt action action and you work with great people on this as well it’s a difficult time so reach out to john bosin with bosin law for a complimentary appointment if you’ve been injured
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SPEAKER 14 :
All of Kim’s sponsors are an inclusive partnership with Kim and are not affiliated with or in partnership with KLZ or Crawford Broadcasting. If you would like to support the work of the Kim Monson Show and grow your business, contact Kim at her website, kimmonson.com. That’s Kim Monson, M-O-N-S-O-N dot com.
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SPEAKER 06 :
Welcome back to the Kim Monson Show. Be sure and check out our website. That’s Kim Monson, M-O-N-S-O-N.com. Sign up for our weekly email newsletter. You can email me at Kim at KimMonson.com as well. Thank you to all of you who support us. We’re an independent voice. We search for truth and clarity by looking at these issues through the lens of freedom versus force, force versus freedom. In studio is Professor Kirk Gerwitz. Hold our thought on legacy. We’ve got Ron on the line. Not sure what he’s going to weigh in on. Ron, what’s on your radar?
SPEAKER 07 :
Yeah, Kim, the gentleman that you had speaking as a guest, I strongly disagree because my big brother was African-American, black. He took me in when my family broke up. And no white people wanted to move away when he moved in. And The racist that I’ve seen is when I went to North Carolina and I tried to go into a bar and they said I couldn’t go in because I was white. So I think he’s skewed, I guess. Okay.
SPEAKER 06 :
Okay. Ron, and thank you because this is your own personal experience. And so, yeah. Do you have any comments on that, Kurt?
SPEAKER 12 :
Well, I appreciate anybody who calls in and has anything to say. I don’t think that I was trying to say anything that would contradict what I just heard.
SPEAKER 06 :
Okay.
SPEAKER 12 :
I’m speaking in generalities.
SPEAKER 06 :
Yeah, in generalities. Ron, I thank you for that. Let me just share a story about, I think racism, Ron, is learned. And I’ve shared this story on the air before. But I had gotten to know a guy, and we were on a board together. And he had played football at, I think, Iowa State. And big guy and black. And he was always talking about his wife. And when I met her… She was like this Irish redheaded, you know, very, you know, fair skinned woman. And and so the two of them together, they got married in the 70s. They both were attending Iowa State. And that was pretty unheard of, Ron, at that time. interracial marriages. So they were really groundbreaking. So Ron, my friend, told me, no, his wife, Mary, told me the story that her little niece had come home from school and had said to her mother, she was probably kindergarten, first grade, that something derogatory about black people. And Mary’s sister, the child’s mom, said, well, what about uncle ron he’s black and she’s like he is and she goes well haven’t you looked at the family pictures and i thought that was absolutely precious ron that here this little one didn’t see color whatsoever and that was where i decided that racism is taught ron yes yeah it’s just
SPEAKER 07 :
It’s all in being in the military. I just look at people as dark green, light green. So I don’t look at race. So that’s just me.
SPEAKER 06 :
Oh, I love that. Ron, thanks for calling in on that. And so let’s get over here, Kurt, to you regarding legacy. And I had never really thought of the word legacy. We hear that about legacies of presidents. And a number of years ago, my cousin was in town. We had lunch, and he said something about your legacy. And I’ve never really thought about legacy. So it was interesting that you brought this up.
SPEAKER 12 :
Yeah, it came to me from my business coach who said, you know, if you were to brand myself as a professional public speaker, what would you most want to just sit around the coffee table with your friends and talk about? And for me, it’s long-term thinking. It’s that… You know, the thing I do in the transformative power of financial education shows up with the It shows up when I say like do you have a relationship to your future self? And legacy is just what are you going to leave behind? And usually – the name of the game is that long-term thinking beats short-term thinking. So my favorite question and one I will propose to you, Kim, is like what advice would the best version of yourself five years from now give you? Matthew McConaughey gets teased. He was receiving an award one time, and he said, people ask me who my hero is. And he says, my hero is myself in five years. Oh, that’s cute. And it sounds comical because it sounds egotistical. It sounds selfish. And, you know, like my hero is myself sounds like a silly thing to say. But there’s real wisdom in that because what he meant was he’s always challenging himself individually. to be the best version of himself and to have a connection to his future self. And so there’s a real power in thinking about the future. Now, it’s, you know, the spirituality part of me says, and mental health piece says, when you’re thinking about the past, you can get depressed. When you’re thinking about the future, you can get anxious. And yet there’s also a real utility to putting on that hat and saying, what would Kim Monson… What advice would she, you know, what would she say about this decision? What advice would you give yourself looking back from your future self when you’re 90 years old and you’re happy and you’ve lived a good life? What would you say about what you should be doing with your time now?
SPEAKER 06 :
Okay. And Gammy, hold on here because we want to give you a minute and a half here in just a minute. Okay. Legacy. First of all, I have in my will where I would want my ashes. to be buried i to me i i like a gravestone i like i like something out there that says this person lived so i i’ve i’ve determined where i want that to be it’s it’s in my happy place and of course my real happy place will be um with christ again on the other side um but um I like that idea versus just my ashes in a jar in the pantry. And I don’t want to discount anything with anybody, but that is something part of the legacy. The other legacy is I really go back to our founders, and I find great heart when I look at the Declaration of Independence, when they said that they are pledging their lives, their fortunes, and their sacred honor. Because the legacy that they wanted to live is liberty for our next generations. And that’s why I’m doing what I’m doing is when it’s all said and done, when my kids, my grandkids look at it, they may disagree with me on things that I do in life, but I want them to know. She left it all on the field. She did everything that she could because she felt this duty, this great American idea that you are teaching your students about, that we are making sure that we pass that on to the next generation. So does that answer your question?
SPEAKER 12 :
I like it. You know, when I thought about your legacy, you put a lot of words out into the universe. And when they’re on podcasts, they’re being recorded. And people will be able to listen to you. You and I, we can’t listen to our great, great grandparents. But your great, great grandchildren will be able to listen to you.
SPEAKER 06 :
That’s a very interesting point. So with that, I do want to get over and give Gammy a minute and a half because I know that she has been she’s a prolific maybe should be our next word of the day. She’s a prolific writer as she is working in public policy. Gammy, you’ve got a minute and a half. Welcome to the show.
SPEAKER 23 :
Good morning. All due respect to everybody. Love you guys. But let me tell you something. I was brought from Germany to America in Norfolk, Virginia. And let me tell you something. You know about the talk in the South when you come from Norfolk, Virginia. And there were a lot of racist attitudes, but I didn’t embrace them. I grew up with friends from all cultures because there is only one race, the human race. Everybody gets that wrong. Number two, the Marxists, they could not destroy us on economy because of our robust middle class, so they pounded the racism. And it’s bull hockey. Yes, it exists in pockets all over, sure. Planned Parenthood, abortion clinics are more racist. They kill more black babies than anybody. And now as to teaching and the future, hon, we are cutting off weenies and boobs. There’ll be no future if we don’t wake up and quit the justice warring into colleges and universities, teaching kids to fight. And the trans children are all taken advantage of. They’re the innocents. It is such a crime when you talk about what ought to be done. But illegal people should not come before legal citizens. And right now, there are citizens all over America who can’t pay their student debt. And there are legal Americans fighting for the country. And we’re trying to pay for millions of people that don’t belong here. I apologize. I’m not cruel. But this has to stop, and it has to stop from the justice organizations, the communist organizations like the Denver Commies, and the religious groups who are promoting the wrong part of this.
SPEAKER 06 :
Gammy, thank you. And thank you for all of the writing that you’re doing as well. I really appreciate it. And Gammy, she puts it all on the line as well. She’s leaving a legacy because she cares so much. She did bring up an interesting point. And Kurt, I was going to mention this on a headline. Right now, there is many of the news stories, there’s a family story. The parents looks like a lovely family. They’ve been here for 35 years. Apparently they were recently deported and they’re seeing family pictures. You’ve seen pictures of the couple hugging each other and says family or parents here 35 years deported. I’m saying if you’re here for 35 years, why didn’t you go to work to make yourself legal? I don’t understand that.
SPEAKER 12 :
That’s an interesting question. I’m sure they would want to. I’m not sure there’s a path for it.
SPEAKER 06 :
I don’t know, but it doesn’t seem to me like they should be able to jump the line. I have a number of friends that are paying big bucks trying to become citizens, but we didn’t want this to be a – we’ll do that maybe next time.
SPEAKER 12 :
We’ll do immigration next time.
SPEAKER 06 :
Yeah, so we – gosh, we only have a minute left.
SPEAKER 12 :
So legacy, give us your – My favorite question to ask when I get on stage – hand me the mic and I’m going to say – What do you want people to say at your funeral? I actually got a better version of that recently. What do you hope people will say about you at your 80th birthday party? Okay. What’s your answer? I’ll go while you think. For me, it’s like I just want to have lived the fullest life that I could. I helped people feel free from their own inhibitions and anxieties because I was free from mine. And I helped others live their fullest life by doing it myself.
SPEAKER 06 :
Can I keep that as a homework assignment on what I want to have set at my 80th birthday?
SPEAKER 12 :
I’ll come back in May or April.
SPEAKER 06 :
Yeah, April is right around the corner. I do currently think 85 is middle age, just so you know.
SPEAKER 12 :
So I’m going to move that 80 to 120.
SPEAKER 06 :
Okay, that sounds good. Hey, Kurt Gerwitz, it’s always a great discussion. It goes way too quickly.
SPEAKER 12 :
Yeah, we do. You know, we should invite your audience to our lunches.
SPEAKER 06 :
We should. We’re going to have to do that. We should just bring the mics. Bring the mics to lunch. That’s a great idea. So we’ve got something really big that I think is going to roll out at the end of April. So stay tuned on that. But our quote for the end of the show is James Madison. And he said this. It is of great importance in a republic not only to guard the society against the oppression of its rulers, but to guard one part of society against the injustice of the other part. That’s why I think that House Bill 1211 is really important for you to weigh in over there on cutting gauge. So my friends today, be grateful. Read great books. Think good thoughts. Listen to beautiful music. Communicate and listen well. Live honestly and authentically. Strive for high ideals and like Superman, stand for truth, justice, and the American way. My friends, you are not alone. God bless you and God bless America.
SPEAKER 09 :
Talking about freedom Talking about freedom I will fight
SPEAKER 02 :
The views and opinions expressed on KLZ 560 are those of the speaker, commentators, hosts, their guests, and callers. They are not necessarily the views and opinions of Crawford Broadcasting or KLZ management, employees, associates, or advertisers. KLZ 560 is a Crawford Broadcasting God and country station.
