The Crawford Roundtable team tackles the growing outrage over Russiagate and the potential for a treason charge against former President Obama. John, Bob, and Neil dissect the mounting evidence that the Steele Dossier was a hoax knowingly propagated by U.S. intelligence officials. They also discuss the ongoing drama surrounding the Epstein files, whether the MAGA base is chasing shadows, and what Trump’s PR team should’ve done differently. Plus: Cringeworthy AI memes, legal double standards, and some light moon landing conspiracy banter.
SPEAKER 01 :
Welcome to the National Crawford Roundtable podcast, a view of culture, current events and politics through a biblical lens brought to you by Preborn, saving babies and souls. Join us in the fight to save babies from abortion. Your gift provides a free ultrasound for a mother in need. 80% of the time she will choose life. Visit CrawfordMediaGroup.net and click on the Preborn logo to donate to save babies now. and by SunPower LED light therapy devices. Bring light to your pain. Visit CrawfordMediaGroup.net and click on the SunPower LED logo to get out of pain and improve your overall wellness. And now, here are your hosts, Neil Boron, Bob Duco, and John Rush.
SPEAKER 04 :
Welcome to the National Crawford Roundtable Podcast. My name is Neal and I’m the host of Neal Boron Live, heard weekdays on WDCX Radio in Buffalo, New York. Every week we gather to talk about important issues that impact the church, impact our nation, impact the world. I’m joined as always again by my colleagues here, John Rush, host of Rush to Reason on KLZ in Denver, And the esteemed Bob Duco of the Bob Duco Show on WMUZ in Detroit. Interestingly, before we even start, I just want to mention this is recorded on Wednesday, July 23rd. This coming Sunday, which will be Sunday, July 27th, 2025, Bob will be the featured speaker at Church on the Beach, which happens. at Crystal Beach in Fort Erie, Ontario, Canada. Begins at 845 a.m. So any of you listening in southern Ontario who happen to catch this before Sunday, July 27th, come on out. You get a chance to meet Bob Duco in person. And frankly, it would be my first chance to meet him in person. I always talk to him here over. Yeah, I always talk to him over the Zoom thing or whatever we call this clean feed when we’re doing the podcast. By the way, if you want details on that, it’s churchonthebeach.ca. But we’re looking forward to that, Bob. You know, there’s a lot of folks in our listening audience that has been listening to you for years because of your program, Defending the Truth. And, you know, they hear you on a regular basis here on the podcast and not Defending the Truth. So, you know, John, pack your bags because you’ll be next, but go ahead. Oh, there we go.
SPEAKER 03 :
No, I look, I’m looking, I’m looking forward to it. I’m looking forward to seeing you, Neil, and everybody there. And it’ll be a great time. Of course, You know, but the truth is, you know, I’m not steamed about it. I’m not really mad. I mean, you said, you know, the esteemed Bob Duco. So I’m not mad. I’m not angry or anything. I just want to make sure that we’re clear on that. So I know how many people right now are going, is he being serious or did he not hear that it was esteemed?
SPEAKER 04 :
Yeah. Who knows exactly?
SPEAKER 03 :
Who knows?
SPEAKER 04 :
Yeah. But it’ll be a great opportunity to get together. And I’ve proposed long term that the Crawford Media Group ought to get all three of us together somewhere so that we can actually meet face to face. We may find out that John is better looking than we assume he is just because of the sound of his voice. Not.
SPEAKER 03 :
The old face for radio. You know, I know we all do speaking engagements at places, and I’ve got the same lame joke, but it gets a laugh every time. Whenever somebody says, oh, I’m glad to finally put a face with the voice, I always say, well, please keep listening anyway. And it always gets a laugh. Exactly. It’s the same laugh. You know, I know my assistant is like rolling, you know, rolling her eyes off. There we go. Same old lame joke. I’m like, look, as long as it works with a new crowd, what do I care? So, you know, but I’m going to use it.
SPEAKER 04 :
I’m not I’m not attributing it to you, but I’m going to use it because I’ve gotten that one for years as well. And we all get it. No, I know. Well, today we’re going to talk about what’s in the news. And there’s a lot of stuff in the news, but kind of narrowed it down to a couple of key topics. If we have time, we might get into some other things. But we will be talking about the Epstein files today, God willing. During the first part, though, I wanted to touch on this, you know, Obamagate thing. Russiagate is probably a better way to say it. But, you know, throughout the first Trump presidency, there was this idea that there was this Russia collusion thing. And individuals are trying to pin all that on Donald Trump, the Steele dossier. Those terms kind of ring a bell, I think, for most people. But the implication was that Donald Trump somehow colluded with Russia to win the election. And What’s interesting is that most of this ramped up after he was already president of the United States, but it looked like an awful lot of effort was made to try to take him down in terms of public relations, certainly, but then to undermine his presidency by indicating that maybe somehow he’d been nefariously involved. with russia to get elected in the first place and there’s a lot to unpack here i’m not sure we’ll get to all of it but um let me just start with uh john first i don’t know if you’ve been talking about this on your program so many different facets so many different angles but you know i mean this has gone as far as donald trump coming out essentially to say that that obama is guilty of treason and should be arrested um where are you at with this bring us up to speed from your perspective
SPEAKER 02 :
I feel like this is, you know, some of the other stuff we’ve talked about in the last couple of weeks in regards to Epstein and so on, which we may get to today as well. But to me, this is a bigger story, and this is the kind of stuff that, yes, I want to see more digging into what really went on, and I want to see what the DOJ has found and some of the documents that they have found that were suppressed back in those days, which is really what this amounts to, is, you know, and, you know… By definition, did Obama commit treason? I can’t say right now whether he did or didn’t, but it’s sure pointing to the fact that he did. Now, with all that being said, would I approve of him going on trial or past president being on trial? I mean, I think there’d have to be some really solid damning evidence there for me to get on board with that. I want to see as many of his minions and others that would be involved in this thing, you know, really brought to light. I want the American people to see what that presidency and by the way, I think Joe Biden and his presidency had some things to do with this as well. And I want to see as much of this uncovered as possible. To me, this is a much bigger story than Epstein.
SPEAKER 04 :
Yeah, and I agree with you on that. And we’re going to have an opportunity to dig in to some of the details. Before we go much further, I just want to make this tie-in right here that seeing documents, seeing evidence of what has transpired in the past is powerful. It can change narratives in a dramatic kind of way. And Preborn, one of our sponsors, Bob, is is excellent at helping women pregnant you know in a very difficult pregnancy situation where maybe they uh were on you know it’s an unplanned pregnancy they’re not sure where to go but they’re thinking that maybe abortions are only option when they see the baby that they’re carrying many of these women change their mind and thanks to pre-born women have an opportunity to see the truth about what’s really going on so i’ll give you an opportunity here to talk about our sponsor pre-born
SPEAKER 03 :
Absolutely. I mean, this really is about saving babies’ lives. I mean, it actually really does stop abortions. When a mom sees a picture of her baby, an ultrasound image of her baby, that’s the first time she’s ever seen what her baby looks like. Statistically, they choose life almost all the time. And by the way, very commonly accept Jesus Christ as Savior. Preborn is set up in pro-life centers all across America. And they show these ultrasound images. The problem is not every pro-life center has an ultrasound machine. And even the ones that do, it costs money to operate these machines. That’s where you folks in the audience come in. Many of you have given to Preborn in the past. We appreciate that. But, you know, if I can be blunt, we need you to keep giving. Okay? What you’re doing is saving babies’ lives by paying for ultrasound images. So here’s what you do. If you can buy an ultrasound machine, they’re 15 grand a piece. Nice tax write-off for you. And if you can’t do that, pay for an individual number of ultrasound images.
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$28.
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They’re 28 bucks a piece. And you can save a baby’s life for 28 bucks. How many babies’ lives will you save? Take $28 times fill in the blank. You know, pray about a number. And everything you give to Preborn, every dime goes to ultrasounds, not a penny for overhead because that’s all covered by private donors. So here’s how you give. Go online to CrawfordMediaGroup.net and click on Preborn. CrawfordMediaGroup.net, click on Preborn. You can also give them a call at 833-850-BABY, and they answer the phones 24-7. So call right now, 833-850-BABY. We appreciate you giving. Support Preborn. Support SunPowerLED, you know, our other sponsor. And, I mean, Neil, the great work that they do with this photobiomodulation helping people.
SPEAKER 04 :
Yeah, photobiomodulation just means light therapy. That’s all it means. It’s using the very light God himself created to promote healing in our bodies. What it does is it reduces pain and swelling, energizes the cells. Those light waves hit the mitochondria, begin to, it’s like putting new batteries in some kind of electronic device. energizes the cells to do what the cells were created to do, and that’s to heal our body. This past weekend, I was at an event where Tom Kerber of Kerber USA, the makers of SunPower LED light therapy devices, was present. He had a number of his different, you know, he had the Palm unit, he had the I call it a solar panel. I forget what exactly what he refers to it. Very different, you know, different, larger and smaller devices. He had the helmet unit that you can put on your head. One woman who had some kind of swelling in her face and on her lips used the palm unit on her face And after about 15 minutes, one of her kids said, Mom, have you looked in the mirror? She said, no. Said the swelling’s gone. It was unbelievable. One treatment. And, you know, that’s exactly what light therapy can do for you. So I want to encourage you if you want to learn about sun power LED using the very light God created to help heal your body. then go to crawfordmediagroup.net click on sun power led and by the way if you purchase a unit use the promo code roundtable10 for a 10 discount roundtable10 at uh at crawfordmediagroup.net click on sun power led well bob i wanted to get your input john already provided some regarding what’s going on with the you know russia gate kind of situation And anybody, if you really stop and think about it, in the first term of Donald Trump, when he was president number 45, just after the 2016 election, he continually said fake news, fake news. We heard about Russia, Russia, Russia, and this whole Russia hoax. He put out a statement recently based on some of the things that Tulsi Gabbard is saying as director of national intelligence, calling this a treasonous conspiracy, that there’s some evidence or there’s some compelling reasons why we ought to think This really was a hoax and perhaps perpetrated by people close to or directly associated With the Obama administration. So Donald Trump puts out a tweet that says Obama himself manufactured the Russia, Russia, Russia hoax. That’s what he wrote on Truth Social. He went on to say Crooked Hillary, Sleepy Joe and numerous others participated in this. And then in all caps, the crime of the century, irrefutable evidence, a major threat to our country. Donald Trump’s taking this very seriously. What are your thoughts about what’s going on right now?
SPEAKER 03 :
I think we all should take it very seriously. I do believe that this is – when you think about the size and the scope of how big of a scandal this is, and you’ve got the mainstream press and you’ve got the Democrats trying to downplay this as some kind of nothing burger or political revenge or whatever. Don’t fall for the feeble Jedi mind tricks of these aren’t the droids you’re looking for. OK, this isn’t that big of a deal. Yes, absolutely. It is. You have, first of all, the opposing candidate, Hillary Clinton and her campaign. We know that they manufactured – they’re the ones who actually originated the creation of this Russia collusion hoax to distract attention away from her email server scandal. And so she’s the one who paid millions of dollars of campaign finance money to pay for this debunked Russian dossier to falsely claim that Trump was colluding with the Russians, our geopolitical enemy, by the way. And if I can say on a side note, she also listed those millions of dollars as legal expenses, not campaign funds, even though she used campaign funds to pay for them. Way different than Donald Trump and Stormy Daniels for a legal nondisclosure agreement where he didn’t use campaign funds. He used his own money. Big difference. But anyway, so to me, the troubling thing that we’re really seeing here with the Tulsi Gabbard release is that. Barack Obama’s intelligence minions, these people, Clapper and Brennan and Comey, they knew this is the problem. This is the really, the smoking gun here, that we now know that they knew from their own intelligence assessments that this was not credible, this was not plausible, that this, in other words, was a fake thing. There was no Russia collusion. And they decided to go ahead and run with it anyway. They decided to go ahead and pour gasoline into the engine of the investigations from the FBI, from the House, from the Senate, the Mueller investigation, all of this. This was an effort to literally unseat a duly elected president of the United States through a manufactured, made-up scandal that he colluded with one of our foreign enemies. And I look at this, this is a thousand times bigger than Watergate itself. ever was if this were the other way around. I would just encourage everybody, if you’re talking to one of your Democrat voting friends, just ask them, what would your reaction be if Donald Trump and Tulsi Gabbard and Kash Patel, okay, and Donald Trump’s own intelligence agencies, what if they in 2028 took whoever the Democrat nominee was and made up, manufactured, and pushed a hoax story that isn’t true, but used the United States government and intelligence agencies to make the claim that it’s true to push this kind of investigation in an effort to derail that person’s campaign. And if they get elected, to try to derail their presidency. That’s third world banana republic attempted coup kind of stuff. And it actually happened in real life here in America. This is a major scandal. No matter how many times the media says, these aren’t the droids you’re looking for. You know, no, this is huge.
SPEAKER 04 :
Yeah, I agree. It’s unbelievable. If, you know, these documents are made public. And by the way, I always wonder, like, if somebody could find a document that says, oh, yeah, we know it’s false, but let’s go ahead and push it anyway. And it appears like there are some of those. That’s what we’re being told.
SPEAKER 03 :
But they do have some of that. Not the word false. Okay. But we recognize this is not credible, not plausible. Okay. So their own intelligence assessments are. In investigating this, it showed that this is not a credible accusation. And they just decided to treat it like it’s credible anyway. Oh, and while we’re at it, spy on the Trump campaign through Carter Page. Come on. Tap wire. Even CNN finally admitted that they did, in fact, tap the phones of the Trump team.
SPEAKER 04 :
Yeah. So, and what I’m saying here is that, I mean, this is a side point. It’s just crossed my mind in all of this that if that was going on, and they know what was going on because they were participating in it. They were the ones creating these documents that are now, you know, Tulsi Gabbard’s looking at them and indicating that more than 100 pages of records that show that Obama’s national security officials, you know, tried to purport that this was somehow real when they knew it wasn’t um okay why don’t these conversations happen on a park bench with two guys with trench coats sunglasses and fedoras sit down talk to each other and walk away why in the world would you put this in writing if it could come out you know during the next administration from whoever, you know, if your Democrats are in power, then you worry that the Republicans are going to get a hold of this or vice versa. I don’t know why they put this stuff in writing, but… Arrogance. Yeah, but talk about exoneration. I mean, if we get a chance to really see this up close and personal, if all of this checks out, it looks like it’s going to, it’s a tremendous scandal. And John, I don’t know if this… would change the minds and hearts of the american people to look at donald trump somewhat differently because all along he said it’s a hoax and i got to believe that some people are like oh right yeah it’s a hoax okay but good lord this would be complete exoneration hard left will never change as we talk about all the time they are you know they’re literally
SPEAKER 02 :
uh, brainwashed and they, they’re going to believe a certain way, no matter what, no matter what you show them, no matter what you can, you know, try to convince them of their, they’re not going to change their minds, but that middle in which anymore, depending upon what state you’re in, you know, here in Colorado, our middle is over 50% of, of all of our voting. And in other words, uh, there’s, you, you can’t win Democrat or Republican in this state. You cannot win without them being on your side. So in those cases, Neil, yeah, I do think there’s folks in the middle, uh, you know, that, that, uh, you know, unaffiliated is what we call them here, that unaffiliated voter. I do think there are some in the middle that they look at some of this and say, gosh, well, I guess that, you know, Donald Trump wasn’t so wrong after all. And a lot of the things that he was being accused of just in fact, aren’t true. In fact, the opposite is true. You know, the people that were pointing fingers at him had three pointing back at them. And the reality is that’s the case. And that’s why I said earlier, I want to see more and more of this uncovered and really get down to it and let the American people see this stuff firsthand. So that to your point, they can make some of these decisions for themselves.
SPEAKER 04 :
Thank you, John. And Bob, if I’m not mistaken, over 22 months, this went on and on, this idea that, you know, Donald Trump had colluded with the Russians, that he was in bed with Vladimir Putin somehow about all of this, and that he used, you know, these kind of connections to somehow get elected fraudulently. $40 million was spent on investigations, and they knew, I mean, at least the allegations are here, that they knew that this was false from the beginning. That’s what Donald Trump was saying. Media, of course, didn’t believe him, the mainstream legacy media. i mean that in itself is a crime i mean just the idea that that people continued to purport lies when they knew it wasn’t true spend american taxpayer dollars and waste all this time when we as the american people generally speaking sit back and think well these elected officials are taking care of government business and they’re operating in our best interest this was a direct attack on the president of the united states go ahead
SPEAKER 03 :
In an effort to unravel and undo a duly elected president. Correct. I mean, in any other country, we would call this a coup. Look, a coup is not always just a bunch of armed militia people storming a presidential palace, okay? You do have political coups also. And this is exactly the kind of thing that you would expect – okay, Vladimir Putin – he has, quote unquote, elections. All right. Well, you know what? This is the kind of thing that wouldn’t surprise me to see Vladimir Putin and his KGB do to try to undermine or throw out of power somebody who may have beat him in an election in the future sometime. You expect stuff like this in China or in Iran or in North Korea. You don’t expect stuff like this in the United States. And if we’re not going to take this seriously, it’s a new day in America. America can never again claim any kind of moral high ground when it comes to election integrity, rule of law, things like that with third world countries around the world. We have to clean up our own act and acknowledge that these Democrats tried to unseat a duly elected president using the United States intelligence agencies as a weapon to try to destroy him and undermine his presidency. That is so massive. Compare that to Watergate and a couple of knuckleheads, kudos to John, that sneak into the hotel room of the Democratic National Headquarters to try to take a peek at what the Democrats are planning strategically. That’s wrong. I’m not defending that, okay? But that and that’s Watergate in the history books for all time. This makes Watergate look like a grain of sand on Church of the Beach. Absolutely.
SPEAKER 02 :
yeah john no i agree with bob i mean you you look at what happened in a you know sitting president having to resign you know back when we were kids basically watching a lot of that stuff on the news i remember coming home in the evenings and that would be you know there wasn’t that many channels to watch and you know what several of them would be dedicated to the you know to the proceedings that were happening regarding watergate and now looking back on what actually happened there compared to what happens in politics today this one you know this one in particular Yeah, we should all be apologizing. I know he’s passed. We should all be apologizing to Richard Nixon.
SPEAKER 04 :
Yeah. Yeah. I mean, we’ll see how it all plays out. But I wanted John, let me ask you this first and I’ll throw it to Bob. But I got to get your opinion on Donald Trump posts a video on true social media. And it has about a dozen Democratic leaders, Democrat leaders say no one’s above the law. They’ve all said it right. And it was always talking about Trump with all these indictments against him and so forth, none of which stuck, none of which came to any fruition. No one’s above the law. No one’s above the law. And then an AI generated clip of Obama being arrested in the Oval Office as the song YMCA plays in the background. OK, just got to get some reaction on that.
SPEAKER 02 :
I mean, would I do that? No. But is that something Donald Trump does and is known for? That’s Donald Trump. I mean, love him or not, like him or not. That’s just his personality and what he does. And in you know, I will say this in his defense, knowing everything that he has gone through in regards to what the left has thrown at him, having his own home raided and so on. Can you blame him?
SPEAKER 04 :
Yeah. Well, no, you can’t on that.
SPEAKER 03 :
Yeah, go ahead, Bob. No, I agree. I think people tend to forget exactly what he has been dragged through. Donald Trump.
SPEAKER 02 :
I mean, for the last 10 years, his wife’s underwear drawer being gone through, mind you.
SPEAKER 03 :
Yes, exactly. I mean, his house raided, him being falsely accused of being in a treasonous espionage kind of relationship with Vladimir Putin, the Ukraine phone call, him being accused of a quid pro quo. when it turns out that it was actually Joe Biden that engaged in a real quid pro quo with Ukraine, threatening to withhold a billion dollars that didn’t fire the prosecutor that was investigating Burisma that was paying millions of dollars to Hunter Biden with 10 percent going to the big guy, Joe Biden. I mean, my goodness. And just to look at that, to look at Adam Schiff, who headed up the Impeachment hearings in the House in this. This very same Adam Schiff, who now it turns out that he committed mortgage fraud, it appears, by claiming the Maryland residents as his primary residents for better interest rates. You know, we got to remember, this is the same guy. This is the same Adam Schiff. He was the ranking member, the highest ranking Democrat on the House Intelligence Committee. So he had access to intelligence information. Adam Schiff used to go on CNN and MSNBC and claim, look, I have access to the intelligence. I have seen the intelligence and the top secret reports that show that Donald Trump did collude with the Russians. But I can’t talk about it because that’s classified. But I’ve seen it. Trust me, the evidence is there. We now know he was lying and he knew he was lying at the time. And this guy’s a United States senator now out in California. Yeah.
SPEAKER 04 :
Makes you wonder what you can believe, if you can believe anything at all about what goes on in Washington. And particularly whenever, you know, people like Adam Schiff open their mouth, they begin to have, they’re leaving a legacy of being untrustworthy and liars, bottom line liars. I want to ask you, Bob, if you don’t mind to talk about our sponsor Preborn while we still have time here.
SPEAKER 03 :
Absolutely. We just want you folks to give to Preborn and save babies’ lives by paying for ultrasound images. It’s really that simple, okay? The problem is the demand is higher than the supply. We don’t have enough ultrasound machines around the country. Not every pro-life center has one. And the ones that do, it costs money to operate them. So that’s where you folks come in. Preborn pays for these in pro-life centers, but the money doesn’t fall out of the sky. It comes from us. And so we need to pay preborn so that preborn can operate these machines in the pro-life centers and save babies’ lives. $28 is the average ultrasound expense to stop one abortion, to save one baby’s life. How many babies’ lives will you save? Take $28 times fill in the blank. And whatever that number is, that’s your forever legacy of the amount of abortions that you stopped. And hey, if you can buy an ultrasound machine, we need some of you to do that. They’re 15 grand apiece. Your forever legacy is you’re stopping thousands and thousands of abortions year after year. But anything you give to Preborn, every penny goes to ultrasounds, not a penny for overhead. That’s all covered by private donors. So would you give to Preborn right now? If you have already, would you give again? Just go to CrawfordMediaGroup.net and click on Preborn. CrawfordMediaGroup.net, click on Preborn. Or they answer the phones 24-7. So you can call and give over the phone. 833-850-BABY. That’s 833-850-BABY. Just mention National Crawford Roundtable when you call. And, you know, it’s important. pre-board and support SunPowerLED, Neil, and the great work that they do with photobiomodulation.
SPEAKER 04 :
Yeah, this is a technology that has tremendous benefit for people that utilize it. And, you know, sound waves have power. That’s why an opera singer can sing a certain note and sustain it, and then you see a champagne glass explode. You know, sonic booms created by hypersonic jets going by or whatever can knock people out of bed. Well, light waves have power as well. And utilizing, harnessing certain wavelengths of red or near-infrared light uh and juicing it up to the highest level possible can literally penetrate your body get deep inside your body and help reduce pain and inflammation and swelling that prevents people from healing so a lot of folks are dealing with migraines they’re dealing with tinnitus joint problems vision problems spinal stenosis back and neck pain of course knee pain i’ve been dealing with a lot of that myself and i was using my sun power LED unit just a few minutes ago and my knee is feeling better. It’s unreal, by the way, how quickly the swelling can go down. But you need to learn about the value, the power of using the very light God created. That’s all it is. It’s light. It’s not pharmaceuticals. It’s not invasive surgery. It’s light that God created. how it can be utilized to reduce pain and swelling and promote healing in your body. So check it out for yourself. Go to CrawfordMediaGroup.net. Click on Sun Power LED. There’s videos there. You can learn all about how this works. And by the way, if you purchase a unit, use the promo code Roundtable10 to save 10%. Well, we’re going to change gears in the second half. We’re going to talk about the Jeffrey Epstein files and some of the implications of what’s going on there with that story. My name’s Neil Boron. Bob Ducco and John Rush are with me as well, and we will continue with the second half of the National Crawford Roundtable podcast next.
SPEAKER 01 :
This is a Crawford Media Group production.
SPEAKER 04 :
You’re listening to the National Crawford Roundtable Podcast and grateful to have you with us. My name is Neil Boron, host of Neil Boron Live on WDCX Radio in Buffalo, New York. Happened to mention during the first half that Bob Duco, one of our colleagues here on the roundtable, host of the Bob Duco Show on WM Museum Detroit, will be a featured speaker this weekend. in Fort Erie, Ontario, Canada. For especially all of you listening in Southern Ontario, and those of you in Western New York that come over across the bridge for Church on the Beach each week at Crystal Beach in Fort Erie, Ontario, you get a chance to meet and see Bob Duco, hear him speak. He’s going to be sharing his testimony. He’ll have some of his apologetics materials with him. You’ll get a chance to spend some time with Bob Duco. Sunday morning, 845 at crystal beach in fort erie ontario and if you’ve never heard of church on the beach just go to church on the beach dot ca you’ll get details and times and directions and all of it but it begins early 8 45 a.m that’s bob duco and then over there closer you know to the west coast is john rush host of rush to reason we’re grateful that he hasn’t gone that far left he’s just in colorado right now he hasn’t made it to california yet He’s the host of Rush to Reason on KLZ in Denver. Guys, I want to talk a bit about the Epstein files. In fact, I’m interested to hear what you have to say because I want to learn your perspective on this. Boy, we’ve been around the block a couple of times on this. We’ve talked about it several times here on the roundtable. But the implication was that this guy, you know, Jeffrey Epstein, who was an accountant, I guess, by trade, was kind of a big wig hobnobbing with important people, politicians and dignitaries from all over the world. But that he and his sidekick, Elaine Maxwell, were actually involved in. some pretty bad stuff, including potentially human trafficking. We certainly know young girls were involved. He’s got a private island. There’s so many details we can talk about. But in some cases, apparently, individuals went to that island to get massages from underage girls. And, you know, this represents criminal activity. Who went there? Who he knew? How many people were involved? There’s speculation about all that, but some people say it’s well over 100. Most have thought there’s some kind of a list. We certainly know something is absolutely wrong about the situation. When you talk about abusing underage kids, you got my attention immediately. It’s something we need to take very seriously. But on top of that, you know, just… There may have been people who hobnob with Jeffrey Epstein that were not responsible for any kind of criminal activity. Who was? Who wasn’t? How did Jeffrey Epstein die? We’re led to believe that somehow he committed suicide in his jail cell, but there’s a lot of speculation about the fact that maybe he was murdered. There’s questions about all this. And this is the kind of stuff that, you know, sleuths love, but on top of it, conspiracy theorists. And like… The question has been, can we see the files? Will you release the files? And there was early indication that all the information about Jeffrey Epstein would be made public. Then all of a sudden, the Trump administration reverses course and says, nope, nothing to see here. We’re not going to release the files. Now it appears some of the files will be released. i don’t know about the pr whoever’s handling the pr thing on this i think it’s creating a lot of confusion but this is a huge story as well and it’s obviously created a great deal of turmoil for the trump administration so let me jump in first with john again i’m sure you’ve discussed this on your show i don’t know that i did a great job setting it up but the point is this is a real mess and i My feeling is that releasing as much information as you can is really the only remedy to get people to stop talking. But even though we know things about the JFK assassination, the MLK assassination, even the things we know have only led to more speculation. So I don’t know if you ever really shut down the conversation about what exactly happened with Jeffrey Epstein. But the real push right now, even from some people in Trump’s MAGA base, is Show us. We want to see for ourselves. We’re not going to believe what you say. Show us the materials. John, this is a mess. Talk about it from your perspective.
SPEAKER 02 :
Yeah, and for all those that are going to talk about this in my program, to the point where I’ve decided we’re not talking about it anymore because we’ve actually done it to the point that I’m just not going to do it any longer. There’s other things that are more important, in my opinion, to talk about. All that being said, Neil, A, some of those that are on the hard right, some of the hardcore MAGA supporters are wishing for something that, frankly, I don’t think is there. I don’t think there’s a list. I’ve talked about that before here and on my program. So for all of you out there that are thinking there’s some sort of Epstein list, I don’t believe that there is because had there been, trust me, and if there had been really important, especially Republican names like Donald Trump on that list, that thing would have been released prior to the last election and they would have done everything they possibly could. I mean, you got to remember things we talked about even in the first half of this podcast in regards to Trump, the things that the left did to attack him. Trust me. If there was something in any of the Epstein files that would have implicated Donald Trump or anybody even close to Donald Trump, trust me, that stuff would have already been out there. I think that, you know, the biggest mistake, and I’ve said this before, that I think Trump made in all of this is and I love the guy dearly, but. He gets amped up by his own supporters, and that’s great. The problem is that he feeds that amping up of those supporters. And in some cases, some of that amping up are things that quite honestly may not be exactly what they think they are, but they still get all amped up over it. I mean, people have to remember the Epstein story. Not just the files, but what he did and what he was going to be, you know, on what he was actually on trial for is what I should say, you know, happened between 2002 and 2005, I believe. So it’s it’s two decades ago plus that we’re talking about here. And the reality is, again, they may release some things in the grand jury indictment, you know, in the grand jury investigation things, which, by the way, you know, they always say, you know, you could indict a ham sandwich with a grand jury. So even that doesn’t necessarily happen. You don’t mean a whole lot when it’s all said and done. Point being, I again, I think we should move on. The hardcore MAGA supporters are wishing for something that frankly isn’t there. They’re looking for a smoking gun that will take the left down. And the reality is this isn’t it.
SPEAKER 04 :
OK, interesting perspective. Bob, what about you?
SPEAKER 03 :
Well, I’m actually with John on this. I look at it very much the same way. And to me, a big issue is that we got to remember if Donald Trump or any MAGA people or right wing people, Republicans, if they were on some mythical list. Who was in possession of the so-called client list on the Epstein files for the last four years? It was the Democrats. You don’t think that they went through that with a fine-tooth comb looking for anything that they could implicate Donald Trump with? Of course they did. And nothing was played from that in the 2024 election, in the 2020 election. That tells me the Democrats, when they had control of these files, couldn’t find anything to play.
SPEAKER 02 :
Really quick, Bob, to jump in. They had control of these files from 2008 on.
SPEAKER 03 :
Right. And eight years of Barack Obama.
SPEAKER 02 :
This isn’t something that just happened, folks.
SPEAKER 03 :
That’s right. And so in 2015, when Trump announced that he was running, and then especially in 2016 when he started becoming the frontrunner, guess what? They had those files. They already had them for eight years at that point. There’s no way in the world that they wouldn’t have played any kind of anti-Donald Trump card in there. But, yeah, look, I’m with you, John. I think we need to move on from this. It really is a distraction to the most important things going on right now. Jeffrey Epstein got what’s coming to him. Maxwell is in prison. This was a sick, evil thing that they were doing. And this guy was an ultra-rich billionaire financier that was hobnobbing with everybody that’s anybody and who’s whose lists. And so if you’re a politician, if you’re whatever, of course there’s pictures of him and Jeffrey Epstein together at big swanky parties just like there’s pictures with Epstein and Bill Clinton and whoever else and Hollywood celebrities as well.
SPEAKER 02 :
Really quick, Bob.
SPEAKER 03 :
That doesn’t mean that Trump was involved in any of this prostitution stuff. What?
SPEAKER 02 :
Really quick, Bob, just like when you guys are talking about an event that you’re going to be having at Church on the Beach here coming up this weekend. I do remotes and things like that all the time. Listeners come up. They want pictures. They want things done, things along those lines. Sure, there’s lots of people that I’ve had pictures with that I have no idea who these people actually are. But if something ever came out where these were some really bad people and my picture’s with them, does that really mean anything at the end of the day? Given the circumstances, no, it doesn’t.
SPEAKER 03 :
Well, it doesn’t. But in all fairness, though, an anti-Trumper would say, yeah, but Jeffrey Epstein isn’t some obscure guy you’d never heard of who asking for a picture. He was a known financier and these guys hobnobbed with each other.
SPEAKER 02 :
And got thrown out of Mar-a-Lago, by the way.
SPEAKER 03 :
That’s right. And that’s another thing that the media doesn’t talk about, that when all this started uncovering with Jeffrey Epstein, Donald Trump ended their friendship, broke ties and banned him from Mar-a-Lago. And that was before there was any kind of big explosion of, hey, the Epstein files is Trump on the list.
SPEAKER 04 :
I’m thinking about the guy that asked for a selfie with Bob on Sunday at Church on the Beach. And then a couple of years from now, somebody’s like, you knew Bob Duco?
SPEAKER 03 :
Like I was a serial killer. Hey, pal, I’ll dig up the pictures of you and that guy at a previous speaking engagement of yours. Somehow, someway. You want to go to war? Yeah, exactly.
SPEAKER 04 :
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SPEAKER 03 :
Boy, they sure are. And, you know, you think about pro-life centers all across the country. And in those pro-life centers are ultrasound machines. And Preborn supplies them. And when moms see a picture of their baby, it’s the first time they’ve ever seen what their baby looks like. They don’t go across the street to Planned Parenthood. They choose life almost all the time, and they let their baby live. So we got to get these ultrasound images shown to the moms. Problem is, we don’t have enough of them. There’s a lot of pro-life centers that aren’t equipped with ultrasound machines. And the ones that are, it takes money to operate them. That’s where you folks come in. We’re asking you to give to pre-born to pay for ultrasound images. $28 is the average ultrasound expense to stop one abortion, to save one baby’s life. So how many babies’ lives will you save? Take $28 times fill in the blank. Pray about a number. Maybe you’ve given to pre-born already. Would you do it again? And, hey, we need some of you out there to buy ultrasound machines. They’re $15,000 apiece. Nice tax write-off for you. Your forever legacy is you’re stopping thousands and thousands of abortions year after year. But for everybody else, how many abortions will you stop? $28 times fill in the blank. Either way, 100% of what you give to preborn goes to ultrasounds, not a penny for overhead that’s all covered by private donors. So here’s how you give. Go online to CrawfordMediaGroup.net. Click on Preborn. CrawfordMediaGroup.net. Click on Preborn. It’s that simple. They also answer the phones 24-7, so you can give that way. Call 833-850-BABY. That’s 833-850-BABY. And just mention National Crawford Roundtable when you call, Neal.
SPEAKER 04 :
Thank you, Bob. And thanks to our sponsors. Again, Crawford Media Group dot net is where you can find all of this. So we’re talking about the Jeffrey Epstein thing, the Epstein files, whatever you want to call it. But it’s created a lot of confusion. And I don’t disagree with what you guys were saying earlier. But let me be the devil’s advocate by raising a couple of the things that I think some of our listeners are thinking. OK, number one, if no crimes were committed, if this is all just, you know. yeah stuff happened but it wasn’t important let’s move along there’s nothing to see here folks you know why is glaine maxwell in prison for 20 years what’s what’s that about secondarily if there’s nothing there just release the stuff and and you know guys like kash patel and dan bongino in the fbi patel’s the fbi director bongino’s the assistant director use this to kind of get to where they’re at politically speaking talking tough saying we’re going to get to the bottom of in other words We want to drain the swamp completely and fully. If there’s something nefarious to be seen in any place, we’re going to shed light on it. We’re going to let you know what’s going on. Pam Bondi says, oh, the you know, she was asked about this whole thing. The Epstein files. Well, they’re on my desk implying I’m going to look at those things and we’re going to do something about it. But then I mean, picture the teenager, you know, he’s got friends over and there’s a huge crash in his room. Parents are like, what was that? They run to the door. open the door kid opens it you know one inch and goes nothing to see here mom and dad no nothing happened we’re all good nothing to see well what’s that do to mom and dad mom and dad like wait what are you hiding well when you all of a sudden say we’re going to pull it back we’re not going to release anything now you’ve got speculation running rampant which is why i’m wondering who’s handling pr on this if if there’s nothing to worry about so A lot of people are asking these kind of questions, and I would love to find out how you guys are responding. Bob, maybe we’ll start with you this time, but I’m sure you’ve talked about this on your program. What’s your response to that kind of stuff?
SPEAKER 03 :
You know, I… My best guess is – and it’s just speculation, right? But when you have somebody like Jeffrey Epstein who was the financier with all this money and all these connections and a lot of money and a lot of deep pockets that he could donate to people’s campaigns and hobnobbing with celebrities and everything else and politicians, the Epstein files probably – list a whole bunch of different names, not a quote-unquote client list, but just the files probably include a whole bunch of people that’s attended his parties, that’s been to his island, that’s flown on his jet, things like that, okay? Everybody that’s been associated with him. Well, the problem is a huge percentage of all of those people are probably perfectly innocent, and it’s nothing more than, hey, you know, there’s a rich guy that I don’t run in his circles, but you know what? I show up at his event because I want to tap into his donor base and whatever. And so the associations thing here, I think it’s very plausible That Pam Bondi and Donald Trump or any of the rest of them are like, wow, this opens up such a massive can of worms. There’s going to be a whole bunch of people, yes, on the left, but also on the right that are going to get smeared with a guilt by association. And all the headlines are going to be is look at Ted Cruz and Donald Trump and whatever conservatives we can find or Republicans we can find. The media is only going to hyper focus on them personally. with any kind of loose connection that they had to Jeffrey Epstein and turn it into something bigger than it is? Do we really want to open up this can of worms like crazy? It’s going to get distorted. And so there’s a difference between somebody who’s an actual client who’s going to the island for the purpose of having procured for them some underage girl versus somebody who’s merely part of his circle of association because he’s a rich guy with deep pockets. And I think everybody gets swept up in that. And I think it’s very plausible that they’re like, let’s just not give a bunch of fodder to the media because they’ll hyper focus on this for the next three and a half years of Trump’s presidency when the focus should be other places.
SPEAKER 04 :
I see what you’re saying. And I, again, don’t disagree with you, but I want to jump in for a second and say, you know, Prince Andrew was taken down over this thing. He’s now looked at as a pedophile because as you mentioned, there were underage girls involved here. That’s statutory rape. That means crimes were committed. And if you’ve got law enforcement, you know, like the FBI and DOJ and others sort of turning a blind eye to the fact that crimes were committed, Doesn’t anybody want to get to the bottom of who these abusers were? And I think obviously you can’t release everything in every file because if there are names of underage girls or women that were abused somehow, they have a right to privacy, but they also have a right to justice. And somebody needs to say, well, look it. This may affect Senator so-and-so or entertainer somebody or other. Their lives may be deeply affected by word getting out that they were somehow involved in this. But what about the girls that were abused? That’s an issue that will not go away.
SPEAKER 03 :
Let me address that real quick, and we’ve got to get John in on this too, okay? Alan Dershowitz, who is the longtime Democrat Harvard University law professor emeritus, okay, and a Hillary Clinton supporter and blah, blah, blah. He says, look, he was Jeffrey Epstein’s attorney. And he’s coming out, Dershowitz, and declaring, look, I have seen – I knew everything that was involved. And I know the players that are involved here. And I can tell you right now that there is nobody that is currently an elected officeholder that is part of any of the kind of, you know, bad stuff that you’re talking about here, OK? There’s no smoking gun for anybody that’s an officeholder, and that would certainly include Donald Trump.
SPEAKER 02 :
Some of the people are even dead.
SPEAKER 03 :
Exactly. And so I don’t think that Pam Bondi is saying, hey, if we got somebody that we know was engaged in sex with an underage girl, we’re just going to give them a pass. No, I think they would absolutely go after those people, but they go after those people individually and not as part of some big sweeping. OK, let’s give the media something to hyper focus on for the next three and a half years and twist into something bigger than it is in an effort to try to take down Trump.
SPEAKER 02 :
Well, really quick, Neil, the other thing you have to remember, and listeners have to remember this as well, and Bob talked about it earlier, look at their chain of command on evidence, and the reality is how would you even prove through all of these years, again, He was originally arrested back in 2008. So for all of you that are listening, I think people forget that they all think for some odd reason this just happened a year or two ago. And the reality is this is two decades plus ago, and now you’re going to go through and spend all the manpower necessary to – Look at chain of command and who had this document and was this document altered and on and on and on we go. Honestly, there’s better things for us as a country to do that we can spend my tax dollars on. And I will tell you right now as a taxpayer, I don’t want it spent on that.
SPEAKER 03 :
And what do the files look like after the majority of the time it was spent in Democrat hands? How much have they sanitized it? How much have they turned it into Swiss cheeses? I’ll bet you those pages are a bunch of Swiss cheese pages that the Democrats in their 12 combined years of being in control of that, those files, their 12 combined years out of 12 out of 16 years, Democrats were in control of those files.
SPEAKER 02 :
And so the problem is Trump played into and he has a habit of doing this. He played into what supporters wanted, what they were screaming and yelling about. He fed that. He fanned the flame, if you would. And in the end, there’s really nothing there. And I’m with Neil on this one. The PR side of this hasn’t done well. They didn’t do that correctly. They should have handled that much differently. Same thing, Bob, you and I complain about all the time. The messaging stinks. And the reality is that is one thing. And I love Donald Trump dearly, but if there’s anything I could be critical of is that fact right there.
SPEAKER 04 :
so he said now and i forget the word i think he said to pam bondi all right go ahead release all the pertinent files there was a word he used maybe you know it could be a different word but the point is if it’s meaningful release it um so now is he creating a monster because any information is going to be gobbled up by people that want to hurt donald trump and the trump administration or or others who feel that additional information is being withheld i i don’t see it going well If you said you’re not going to release anything, maybe stick with that and move along. I don’t know if he’s just afraid of losing his MAGA base over that and how that could affect the mid. Okay.
SPEAKER 02 :
I’ll just say it. I don’t care. I’ll get hate mail on this. I really don’t care. They’re cray cray. They’re crazy. These are people that don’t know reality sometimes, and they’ve got to look at things differently and understand that winning is the most important thing we can do moving forward. And the way they look at it doesn’t allow us to.
SPEAKER 04 :
What percentage of MAGA supporters across the board are big fans of Bob Duco? I just don’t care. Cray cray. Not much of me. I can tell you that one. Just remember, John said cray cray before I did. That’s incredible. I mean, the whole thing’s a mess. It’s just a mess. And I don’t know. I don’t know that it’s ever going to happen.
SPEAKER 02 :
And I mean this seriously. On the same token, it’s those hardcore on the far right that are creating the mess. They are the ones that have created this. And I will blame them for this all day long. Yes, Donald Trump shouldn’t have played into that hand and probably should have handled things much differently than he did. But they’re the ones that are still screaming for blood. It’s them you have to blame, no one else.
SPEAKER 04 :
I’ve been shocked. We’re not getting into this, but I’ve been shocked myself. I mean, I grew up in the 60s watching the so-called moon landing. Right. But how much evidence is coming out or at least questions people are asking now that look really plausible. And like I thought the moon landing was 100 percent true. Now, I’m not so sure. But the point is.
SPEAKER 02 :
Really? yeah it’s true wow it’s 100 you’ve got one of the one of the most well-known christian astronauts that was the first man to walk on charlie duke the guy was as dedicated i interviewed him i talked to charlie duke i know yeah so i mean at the end of the day If he wasn’t there, do you think he would have allowed that to go on as long as it did?
SPEAKER 04 :
My point is, we can’t get into this because we’re running out of time, but you’ve got the big moon rover thing they were driving around in this truck or this little thing, whatever it is, that supposedly fit inside the lunar module and stuff. The point is, people are now asking credible questions like, how come my cell phone service isn’t as good as the audio that they had when they were 90 million miles away from Earth?
SPEAKER 02 :
Because cell phone works off of terrain and that was going to space. There’s nothing in between it.
SPEAKER 04 :
But, John, I’m only saying that questions create common sense, people. Yeah. All right. So we’re going to talk about some of these things in the days ahead. But we are grateful for each and every one of our sponsors. And let me talk briefly here about SunPower LED. Photobiomodulation just means light therapy. And we know that sound waves have power. You’ve ever sat in the front row at a, you know, Black Sabbath concert before you knew Jesus. You probably felt that.
SPEAKER 03 :
Way to bring in the Aussie reference.
SPEAKER 04 :
There you go. Yeah. So. I mean, then you know for sure that sound waves have power. You can feel the beat of subwoofers in your chest. Sometimes it’s overwhelming if you’re at a certain kind of a concert, but either way. Light waves have power as well. And certain wavelengths of light that have no UV stuff, you’re not going to get skin cancer, but can be utilized. Red and near-infrared light can be utilized to penetrate the body, literally get to places where there’s pain and swelling and And it can energize the mitochondria in the cells to wake up and begin to do what they’re supposed to do, and that’s to heal our body and promote healing. If you want to learn about what photobiomodulation could do for you, we’re not talking about big pharma or pharmaceuticals. We’re not talking about invasive surgery. We’re talking about simply using light to reduce pain and swelling in your knees, your back, and your spine. Take away joint pain, migraines, arthritis, tinnitus. I mean, check it out for yourself. Look at some of the videos by going to CrawfordMediaGroup.net. Click on Sun Power LED. And by the way, if you use the promo code Roundtable10, you can get yourself a 10% discount just because you’re a faithful listener here to the Roundtable. Bob, another one of our sponsors, of course, Preborn.
SPEAKER 03 :
That’s right. And I know a lot of you have given to Preborn over the years. We appreciate that. Many of you give to Preborn on a regular basis. Thank you so much. And we just want to keep it going because we’re saving babies’ lives by paying for ultrasound images. That’s really that simple, folks. So we’re asking in the audience, do we have some of you? that could buy an ultrasound machine. They’re 15 grand a piece. This gets placed in a pro-life center. Your forever legacy is that you are stopping thousands and thousands of abortions year after year after year. Think about that, okay? Nice tax write-off for you, too. Now, the rest of you are like, oh, I can’t buy an ultrasound machine. Okay, well, you pay for an individual number of ultrasound images to save babies’ lives. 28 bucks saves one baby’s life. How many babies’ lives will you save? Take $28 times fill in the blank. Pray about a number, whatever that is. That’s your forever legacy. And you know something? 100% of what you give to pre-born goes to ultrasounds, not a penny for overhead. Private donors cover all of that. Here’s what we’re asking everybody to do right now. Go to CrawfordMediaGroup.net and click on Preborn. CrawfordMediaGroup.net, click on Preborn, pray about a number, give right there. And if you want to give over the phone, they answer the phones 24-7. So call 833-850-BABY. That’s 833-850-BABY. Just mention National Crawford Roundtable when you call. And when you’re talking with them, maybe you can ask them about Neil and the moon and… Actually, Neil, that is a discussion maybe for us to have sometime. Oh, let’s do it. Discussion. Flat Earth. Did we go to the moon? Things like that. By the way, I do have to say about the lander. Okay. Look at mattresses. They cram them inside of something the size of a wallet these days. So I’m not concerned about that.
SPEAKER 04 :
All right, we’ve got all kinds of stuff to talk about in the days ahead. Thanks to our sponsors, John Rush, host of Rush to Reason, Bob Duco, The Bob Duco Show. Thank you for joining us. My name’s Neil Boran, and hopefully we’ll see you next time on the National Crawford Roundtable.
SPEAKER 01 :
You’ve been listening to the National Crawford Roundtable podcast, a view of today’s culture through a biblical lens, brought to you by Preborn, saving babies and souls. Join us in the fight to save babies from abortion. Your gift provides a free ultrasound for a mother in need. 80% of the time she will choose life. Visit CrawfordMediaGroup.net and click on their logo to donate. And by SunPower LED light therapy devices, bring light to your pain. Visit CrawfordMediaGroup.net and click on the SunPower LED logo to get out of pain and improve your overall wellness. You can download this podcast from Apple Podcasts, Stitcher, and more. from your local Crawford Media Group station’s website or at CrawfordMediaGroup.net. And please give this podcast a five-star rating on your Apple app. Look for the notification on your app for when the next weekly edition of the National Crawford Roundtable podcast is ready for you to download. This is a Crawford Media Group production.
