Join the hosts of the National Crawford Roundtable as they dive into the pressing issues surrounding a recent controversial incident in Minnesota. With a focus on real-time police decision-making, they explore the implications of this event on both law enforcement and community narratives. As discussions unfold, the importance of understanding the nuances in such high-tension scenarios becomes clear, highlighting the challenges officers face and the diverse reactions from the public.
SPEAKER 02 :
Welcome to the National Crawford Roundtable podcast, a view of culture, current events and politics through a biblical lens brought to you by Preborn, saving babies and souls. Join us in the fight to save babies from abortion. Your gift provides a free ultrasound for a mother in need. 80% of the time she will choose life. Visit CrawfordMediaGroup.net and click on the Preborn logo to donate to save babies now. And by SunPower LED light therapy devices. Bring light to your pain. Visit CrawfordMediaGroup.net and click on the SunPower LED logo to get out of pain and improve your overall wellness. And now, here are your hosts, Neil Boron, Bob Duco, and John Rush.
SPEAKER 03 :
Welcome to another edition of the National Crawford Roundtable. Myself, John Rush, Bob Duco, Neil Boron. Good morning, guys. How are you? Howdy. Pretty good, John. How are you? I say good morning because it’s no secret we record this on Wednesday mornings, meaning that sometimes some of the things we talk about, there may be developments in some of the stories that we might cover as the days go on. So I just always want to preface that, yeah, we record this on Wednesday mornings, and, yeah, some things could change, and there may be more details on a particular topic that we talk about as the week goes on because in some cases you may not hear this for weeks. A few days after our recording. But, guys, Minnesota.
SPEAKER 05 :
There’s not really anything going on in the news anyway.
SPEAKER 03 :
Yeah, not a thing. Absolutely nothing. And it seems like for the past several weeks now, because it’s still hot in the news and after this past weekend, of course, really hot in the news is Minnesota. Bob, I’m going to throw it to you. There’s so much there. I covered it Monday pretty much in depth on my program. I believe there were lots of mistakes made on both sides of the aisle, by the way, from the individual himself to Ice itself. I’m not criticizing or pointing blame because I don’t want to be in those guys’ shoes. But I think this is a very unique situation. And, I mean, I guess as time goes by, we’ll learn more. But at the end of the day, it’s not a good situation. Sure.
SPEAKER 05 :
Well, and it’s not. And I guess there are so many branches on this tree. There really is. And one of them that I’d like to kind of address is this notion that there’s only one way to look at this, that if the guy, if Alex Preddy did not have the gun in his hand and he was shot, end of discussion, that means he was murdered, he was executed, he was, you know, whatever.
SPEAKER 03 :
No, I don’t see it that way either. No. No, we got to look at it.
SPEAKER 05 :
Okay. The, the ice officer who fired first at pretty, right. He’s an eight year veteran who, and do you know what his job is with a customs border patrol? His job is actually firearms training. He’s the training instructor to train them on when to, and not to shoot. Okay. So you can’t say this guy is like some inexperienced mall cop, right? This is his, his area of expertise. He’s a trainer. Now, Here’s what a lot of cops don’t understand. I’ve talked to cops this week about this, okay? That what makes something what’s called a righteous shoot or a justifiable shoot is not what the polls say or public opinion or even a video with 20-20 hindsight. And it’s certainly not what Whoopi Goldberg or Jimmy Kimmel say, all right? It’s what the officer perceived at the moment. If he perceived, if he believed, genuinely believed that that his life or the life of others was in danger, then it is justifiable to shoot in that case. And so here’s what we got to remember. And this is what, when the investigation unfolds, this is what I think is probably going to end up being uncovered, all right, even though none of this is confirmed yet. that we do know that the guy had a gun, he absolutely had a gun, and he had two extra magazines of bullets. So he came there loaded for bear.
SPEAKER 03 :
And really quick, I want to step in as somebody that’s more into guns than probably you two are. It wasn’t even a concealed carry type gun. I want to make sure we’re very clear on the type of weapon that he was actually carrying in. This isn’t something that any of us, even concealed carry folk, would carry for that purpose. It was a 9mm Sig Sauer. Yeah, very large weapon, 20-round magazines, and so on. So basically meaning he had 60 rounds with him, meaning that what are you doing in that case is my question.
SPEAKER 05 :
I know. You’re taking it into a powder keg situation, which you don’t do. So he is impeding. He’s trying to be traffic cop to basically try to impede the ICE agents. He shoves a couple of ICE agents. And then when they attempt to arrest him, he resists and fights them. And it takes several agents wrestling him down to the ground. Now, as they’re wrestling him down to the ground, you have a couple of agents that yell out, gun, gun, gun. All right. This is something anybody who knows law enforcement knows. As soon as you recognize that the person that you’re tussling with has a gun, you yell out, gun. That now heightens the tension of the moment, okay, because he’s got a gun. That’s right. Now, what I think we’re going to end up finding when the investigation is complete is that one of the ICE agents managed to get the gun away from him and move away from them, okay? But that doesn’t mean that the other officers saw that that’s what happened. It’s not like, okay, time out, everybody. I now have his gun, all right? This is in the midst of chaos at that moment in the middle of the melee, all right? So here’s what the the ICE officer who originally fired. OK, here’s what he hears, because it appears that the the Preddy’s gun accidentally discharged. OK, because the the it was already cocked back. It was slid back. OK. And so it accidentally discharged apparently. That’s not for sure. But an officer on the scene told New York Post 100 percent that gun misfired and it fired. Whether the officer who took it accidentally had his finger on the trigger, we don’t know. OK, but a gun fired, a gunshot happened before the ICE officer fired his gun. So from his perspective. You’re wrestling with somebody, a bunch of people wrestling with him. We’re trying to get control of them. Everything is spinning around so fast, you don’t know what’s happening. You got a split second to hear, and then you hear, gun, gun, gun. He’s got a gun. And then you hear, boom, a gunfire, all right? Right. An officer at that moment, it is reasonable that they would think that the gun was fired by the person who had the gun, and that if you don’t pull the trigger on him now, do you wait until he shoots two, three, four more ICE agents? From the officer’s perspective… In a situation like that, you hear gun, gun, gun, and then fire. You fire at the person that has the gun.
SPEAKER 03 :
And I think one thing to remind everybody of, too, is you don’t live real life in slow motion, Bob. In other words, all of these things are happening in real time. You’re making decisions in literally nanoseconds, split-second decisions that – Yes.
SPEAKER 05 :
If you’re data from Star Trek, OK, fine. All right. But these are human beings who has a split second decision to make. And what if it had gone the other way? What if the gun wasn’t wrestled away from him? And what if the gun firing was actually pretty shooting one of the ice agents? And then here’s the trainer standing there pointing his gun, and he gets timid. He freezes. He doesn’t fire until he hears shot two, three, four, and now three of his comrades are dead if he had only pulled the trigger first. So you’ve got to put yourself in the position of the cop. 20-20 hindsight with a video is great. But you’re right, John. We don’t live life in slow motion. No, we don’t. And so, you know, is it tragic this guy got killed? Absolutely. Was it necessary to shoot him? No. But in the heat of the moment, in the fog of war at that particular moment, you have a split second decision to make a life and death decision that could make the difference between you being dead, your fellow officers being dead, or the guy that brought the gun to the powder keg is dead. You got a split second decision. I don’t think the left is giving cops enough of the benefit of the doubt and stuff like that.
SPEAKER 03 :
I agree. Neil, I’ll get your opinion on this, but let’s talk about pre-borns. Speaking of decisions, life and death decisions, Bob, that’s where pre-born comes in.
SPEAKER 05 :
These are. And you know what? Women get pregnant, very often unplanned pregnancies, and they’re grappling with this decision. They got to plan parenthood across the street saying, hey, come on in here, get an abortion, we’ll take care of the problem. But you have pro-life centers all across the country that are saying, we’ll help you, we’ll love you, we’ll pray for you, we’ll provide your needs, let’s let the baby live. And those pro-life centers have ultrasound machines in them. And what they do is they show an ultrasound image of the baby to the mom. Statistically, a mom usually chooses life when she sees a picture of her baby. She commonly accepts Jesus Christ as Savior, too. Problem is, folks, we don’t have enough ultrasound machines. We don’t have enough money to operate them all the time. That’s where you folks in the audience come in. Many of you give to preborn. You’ve given to preborn many times. I thank you for that. Keep on giving. We need some of you to keep on giving to Preborn right now today. $28 is the average ultrasound expense to save one baby’s life. How many babies’ lives will you save today? Take $28 times fill in the blank, and that’s what you give to Preborn. And what’s nice about this, 100% of what you give goes to ultrasounds, not a penny for overhead. That’s all covered by private donors. So here’s how you give. Just call them right now at 833-850-BABY. That’s 833-850-BABY. They answer the phones 24-7. You can give right over the phone. You can also give online at CrawfordMediaGroup.net. That’s CrawfordMediaGroup.net. Click on Preborn. Give right there. And while you’re at CrawfordMediaGroup.net, check out SunPowerLED, too, because, Neil, they do great work with this photobiomodulation.
SPEAKER 04 :
Absolutely. And photobiomodulation is kind of a big word. It just means light therapy. It means taking certain wavelengths of the light God created and and then using that, harnessing those wavelengths of red and near-infrared light, using them to penetrate to the cellular level of the body, which, by the way, at that level, you’re talking about light that’s undetectable to the human eye, just like a dog can hear a sound wave that we can’t hear. These are light waves at that level that are undetectable to the human eye, but they penetrate to the cellular level, they excite the mitochondria in the cell to do what, guess what, God created a cell to do, and that’s to heal our bodies to reduce pain and swelling and get about the business of healing our bodies. And there’s a woman named Linda who tells how photobiomodulation from SunPower LED set her free from pain and discomfort associated with cervical spinal stenosis. People are using this for arthritis, pain, migraines, joint pain, problems, healing, epilepsy, seizures, tinnitus, all kinds of stuff. You can check it out for yourself by going to CrawfordMediaGroup.net. Click on SunPowerLED and learn about what light therapy can do for you. By the way, if you get a chance, if you’re going to order something, use the promo code ROUNDTABLE10 and save yourself 10% on any purchase. CrawfordMediaGroup.net, SunPowerLED.
SPEAKER 03 :
And it works. I talked about that last week, folks. It really does. It’s a technology that works wonders. Neil, your turn. I mean, a lot going on in Minnesota. Bob did a great job of really explaining a lot of what went on there. And I want to remind everybody before you talk, Neil, that… And, again, there’s always a tragedy when somebody dies. I understand our ability and our rights, you know, to peacefully, keyword, peacefully protest and assemble and all of that. I want to talk about a little bit of that, though, once you guys are done, you know, after we break some of this down. But the key here is did he go in and peacefully protest? When you’re loaded for bear, Neil, are you really heading in to peacefully protest or are you looking for a different outcome? And for me, that’s one of the larger questions because, you know, i don’t know nobody ever wants to blame in this case is he the victim potentially yes i i think i’m putting quotes around victim because i believe in a lot of ways neil he started this and not not saying that he deserved to die but he started this and no it didn’t end well for him but i guess for me common sense says why are you there in the first place yeah i you know these things are so nuanced and multifaceted and i
SPEAKER 04 :
Very grateful for the way Bob, you know, described that potential situation. I’ve told the story before and it doesn’t matter in this context, but to me it does. The idea that I went to a gun range one time where they did, you know, simulated training of what it’s like to enter a home or to have, you know, somebody enter your home and you’re in a self-defense kind of situation and all of a sudden somebody’s in the room, you think they have a knife, you shoot them and you find out that they didn’t have a knife. And that’s actually what I did in that situation because the adrenaline level is off the charts. And, you know, you’ve got a split second to make a decision. Now, obviously, all of that was simulated, but I didn’t want to be the goofball that got laughed at later because I wasn’t prepared to defend myself or defend my home in that, you know, simulation. But in the end, I got laughed at because I pulled the trigger on a guy who wasn’t even armed. It’s amazing how under the heat of the moment, things can look very different. But I also, you know, I think it’s imperative that we be very consistent. And sometimes two things can be true at once. Bob, you’ve eloquently described that in the past. Maybe we can talk about it more later. But, you know. I myself, I asked the question, why is this guy bringing a gun to a protest? Because in my mind, that automatically makes him an agitator, not a peaceful protester. On the other hand, somebody could say, no, he’s got a right to defend himself. Second Amendment. We believe in the Second Amendment. OK.
SPEAKER 03 :
Yeah. i do um okay but um you know but as i explained it really quick on jumping because the way i explained it on my program is just because something’s legal and something is lawful you know sometimes common sense comes into play and just because it’s legal does that mean you should still do it and that’s the question that i have in this particular case because there’s times where just because it’s legal doesn’t mean you should do it
SPEAKER 04 :
I agree 100%. And yet, we’re so quick to write our narrative. Like Kristi Noem was saying, all of us, she was asking the question, what’s a guy coming to a peaceful protest with a gun, blah, blah, blah. Well, Kyle Rittenhouse did that in 2020. And we all hailed him as a hero and a champion for standing up for freedom. And people got killed in that instance. He didn’t set out to kill them. I don’t want to get into the whole Kyle Rittenhouse thing. But I’m just saying that sometimes in one situation, we can be all for a guy bringing a gun. to a Black Lives Matter protest in that case in Kenosha, Wisconsin. And we can be all about it. Hey, look, he’s got a Second Amendment right. Well, no one on the conservative side right now is arguing for this guy’s Second Amendment right, except apparently me and you, John. But I’m just saying, uh i’m very skeptical of why he brought this gun to this thing and why he had a couple of extra magazines i mean was he planning on uh doing some damage with the gunner where was he headed and secondarily he wasn’t standing 100 feet away from these guys holding a sign he was interjecting himself into the situation which to me is really sketchy i mean he was he was an agitator he was getting in the face of an agitator Police officers who are doing their job. That’s right. This is their job.
SPEAKER 05 :
You know what? When you’re being arrested, okay, you don’t fight the cops, let alone while you have a gun on you. I agree. You don’t fight the cops and not even reveal to the cops that you have them. And I do got to say on a side note – with Kyle Rittenhouse. Kyle Rittenhouse was there because you had rioters, lawless people, criminals that were burning down buildings, and he wanted to help protect the building of one of his friends, a guy that he knew. So he was there to basically be kind of a civilian security guard for his friend’s business. That’s what that was about. That’s entirely different
SPEAKER 03 :
He wasn’t protesting.
SPEAKER 05 :
…than trying to impede law enforcement. Kyle Rittenhouse was trying to protect a friend of his business against law-breaking rioters. Okay, this guy, Preddy, was basically trying to protect the rioters against ICE arresting them.
SPEAKER 04 :
Well, let me be clear. I’m not campaigning against Kyle Rittenhouse and for… You know, this guy in, what’s his name again? Alex? Alex Preddy. Okay, so, but here is what I am saying. Like, I just think that we, as human beings, need to stop and consider the nuances of any particular situation. And by the way, is there other information that we’re not privy to yet? Is there something on one of those body cam videos that would completely change our understanding of what happened? Because each side, I guess what I’m getting at is each side immediately wants to write their own narrative. I think Kristi Noem was way out of line all of a sudden just doing everything she possibly could to demonize this guy. I think he was wrong. He shouldn’t have been in there agitating the way that he was. But on the other hand, I think it’s horrendous that he ended up getting shot in the process. And maybe that’s what you get when you do that. Not that that was justified in any way, but those kind of problems can occur in hyped up adrenaline fueled situations like that. In a sense, and you got you know ice agents are macho dudes in the sense that when something starts going down somebody starts agitating know adrenaline goes up people start getting tense the situation elevates and then anything could happen and and to the detriment of everyone nobody needs that and it’s horrible what happened absolutely i agree i think the one thing that we have to remember with all of this and maybe this is partly where you know christy gnome was was coming into play and i wish she would have said it more in this way again one of the issues that i feel like our site has at times is we just
SPEAKER 03 :
don’t communicate as well as we should. Everything that happened there on that particular day, and this is not a joke, and I’m not just saying this to say the same thing over and over again, but it is the same thing over and over again. This is the left’s playbook. They are there to agitate, to create chaos. It is 100% out of the Marxist playbook. Exactly what happened there is exactly what they want. And I have to remind everybody, those of you that do listen to us that are on the left, and I know you do because I get emails and text messages from you, keep in mind, your side cares nothing about people. Absolutely nothing. They don’t care that this gentleman was killed. I mean that sincerely, guys. The left does not care. This is basically a casualty for their cause. They don’t care about people. It’s proven with the abortion topic we talk about with pre-born. It’s proven in this particular case. Bob, the reality is the left doesn’t care about people at all.
SPEAKER 05 :
John, I know that sounds very cynical, but that’s exactly what I was telling my audience here in Detroit this week, that I hate to say it, but a lot of people on the left, as soon as they saw that this guy got killed by ICE, started high-fiving each other, thinking, oh, good, now we got some ammunition, no pun intended, on our side. You know, we got a card that we can play now against ICE. It’s unfortunate. This death is a prop to so many of them on the left. But, you know, we got to remember, though, okay, that the use of force procedures, okay, This guy firing is within the use of force procedures, not just for ICE and Border Patrol, but for sheriff’s departments and police departments all across this country, all right? This is consistent with use of force justification in this particular case in the fog of everything. Now, it wouldn’t be the case if the firing officer actually really could see the that the gun was taken away from him. If that officer is like, oh good, his gun’s taken away, and then he fires, okay, then that’s not proper use of force procedure. He would get in trouble. He shouldn’t get in trouble. But, you know, as far as the messaging goes, John, you and I have talked about this many times as well. Yeah. One of the things I also told my audience this week is, look, I think Kristi Noem of Bovino and even Trump to a certain extent, they mismanaged the messaging of this early on because the answer is not to in the heat of the battle. to use exaggerated hyperbolic words like assassin, domestic terrorist. He was there to massacre. We don’t know. He might have been. He might have been. He had a lot of extra ammunition for that purpose. But you’ve got to be careful. To me, the best thing would have been for them to, from the very beginning, say, we are investigating this. We are going to follow the facts where they lead. But let’s remember something. In the fog of war, in the melee that’s going on, OK, These kinds of things happen when you bring a gun to a dangerous situation like this and you don’t even inform anybody that and you fight law enforcement. But let us do the investigation and then we’ll come out with our conclusions and answers after that. That would have been the best thing instead of instantly taking sides in a hyperbolic way. I do think that they were wrong in the messaging.
SPEAKER 03 :
Yeah, I do too. And by the way, I’m not saying that they’re wrong in what they said because, by the way, it could very well come out that this guy was on the signal chats and he was very much there to be an agitator, and maybe they knew a lot more about this guy. You talked about this on Monday. Maybe they knew a lot more about this guy internally than they’re leading on. But again, I think the initial messaging, to your point, Bob, and what Christy said, yeah, I would have handled that much differently. Sorry, guys, I hate to say this, but there are times where I just wonder, why don’t some of these administrations get a hold of people like us. No offense, but when you’re on radio and you do the things that we do on a daily basis, we have to message very well because we don’t have visual aids even like television does. So we have to do things even different than what news commentators, which by the way, they’re reading from a script anyways. They’re not even news people at the end of the day. They’re not even journalists. But I always have wondered… You know, Bob, why don’t they tap into people like us that do this for a living on a day-to-day basis?
SPEAKER 05 :
Actually, John, I guess I’d be surprised if they don’t. The only reason I say that is because the people that they do have internally, you know, the advisors, I’ve got to imagine that a bunch of those advisors are talk show hosts. Dan Bongino certainly was. So I agree with you.
SPEAKER 03 :
And nothing against Dan, but keep in mind. You know, Dan did a lot of TV. TV’s not the same as what the three of us do. Yes, he’s now doing a podcast. He did radio, though. He took over for Rush Limbaugh’s radio slot. Yeah, I get that. But, again, nothing against Dan, but Dan has a different type of show than even the three of us do. Dan runs on a lot of hype and things like that. And I’m not saying anything bad about Dan because I know a lot of our listeners like Dan. But, truthfully, Dan runs on a lot of hype, conspiracy theories even sometimes, and so on. The three of us don’t do that. Right.
SPEAKER 05 :
I know. And so and that’s why to me it would make sense if they had as part of their inner circle. Anytime something like this happens, let’s go to our messaging team. And the messaging team are people that, yes, they’re mega conservatives. I’m not talking about getting rhino centrist mushy people, but rhino. But real conservatives who at least understand proper messaging and communication and basically a little bit of Dale Carnegie 101 of here’s even some salesmanship.
SPEAKER 03 :
Bob, how do you sell this story?
SPEAKER 05 :
Exactly. You know what? Yes, salesmanship. Actually, salesmanship is a better word to use in this case because this is a thing where how do we sell this to the public in an effective way? And that’s where, yes, I agree with you. They should talk to people like us that do have a pulse on talking with the public on a regular basis to get a sense of, okay, let’s be careful with the imaging and the messaging here. Democrats are really good about that. Democrats know how to control perception. Republicans tend to stink at controlling. And by the way, if I can, on a side note, kind of compliment, give a backhanded compliment to Republicans, a lot of the problem is Republicans are not the chameleon manipulators who merely say what people want to hear. They tend to be a little bit more honest, a little bit more direct. And well, here’s what I’m thinking. And so I’m just saying it. So sometimes that works against you in PR purposes. But this is a product of republicans tend to shoot from the hip much more off honestly and democrats tend to say uh let’s wait let’s look at the polls and let’s figure out what lie we can tell what story we can make up that’s going to make us look the best that’s a big difference between the two parties speaking of which bob when it comes to the abortion topic there are masters at that not that we are bad at it in this you know pre-born and what they do is a really great way to message to the moms that are carrying a baby but it’s another area we could do better at Well, we do need to do better at it because really what you’re talking about is saving babies’ lives. I mean, it actually really is that simple. Babies are being killed every single day, and we can do something about that. We really can. You know how you do it? You pay for ultrasounds at pro-life centers around the country. Preborn is the pro-life company that supplies these ultrasound machines, but it does take money to operate them. That’s why we’re asking you folks, save some babies’ lives by paying for more ultrasound images, plain and simple. If you’ve given a pre-born already, please give again. Make this part of your regular giving budget, your missionary budget in your home. $28 is the average ultrasound expense to stop one abortion, to save one baby’s life. Mom sees a picture of her baby, she very rarely goes through with an abortion. She lets the baby live, commonly accepts Jesus Christ as Savior too. So $28 stops one abortion. How many abortions will you stop? Take $28 times fill in the blank. Pray about a number. That’s your gift to pre-born. And hey, we need some of you out there to buy ultrasound machines. They’re 15 grand a piece. It’s a great tax write-off for you. And you get to go to bed every night knowing you’re stopping thousands and thousands of abortions over the years. Okay. But what’s great about this, no matter what you give to Preborn, 100% goes to the ultrasounds, nothing for overhead. That’s all covered by private donors. So this is Preborn. Here’s how you give. Go right now to the phone and call 833-850-BABY. That’s 833-850-BABY. Just mention National Crawford Roundtable when you call. The answer to the phone is 24-7. Now, if you want to give online, go to CrawfordMediaGroup.net and click on Preborn. CrawfordMediaGroup.net. Click on Preborn. And after you give to Preborn, check out SunPowerLED. And Neil, see what they can do through light therapy that’s a completely natural way of healing that God created.
SPEAKER 04 :
Absolutely. Using light waves to heal our body. It’s incredible. You say, well, what power do light waves have? Well, let me back up first and say, what power does sound waves have? And all of us have seen… you know, footage of a opera singer who hits a particular note and sustains it for a few seconds, and all of a sudden the champagne glass explodes. How is that possible? Because sound waves actually have power. And, you know, to affirm that, if you don’t believe me, go sit in the front few rows of a skillet concert sometime. All of a sudden you’ll see how much power sound waves have. Well, light waves have power as well. By harnessing certain wavelengths of red and near-infrared light, you can literally excite the mitochondria in the cells, energize the mitochondria to wake up the cell to do what a cell was created to do, and that’s to heal our body. It’s being used for all kinds of things like arthritis pain and tinnitus and wound care, back and neck pain, knee pain, plantar fasciitis, vision problems. You can learn all about the power of light to heal our bodies. It’s officially called photobiomodulation or light therapy. By going to CrawfordMediaGroup.net, clicking on SunPowerLED, and find out how light can be used to heal your body. By the way, use the promo code ROUNDTABLE10 and save yourself 10%. CrawfordMediaGroup.net, click on SunPowerLED.
SPEAKER 03 :
That’s it for the first half of the National Crawford Roundtable. Again, find us at CrawfordMediaGroup.net. We’ll be back with the second half in just a moment.
SPEAKER 02 :
This is a Crawford Media Group production.
SPEAKER 03 :
Welcome back, National Carver Roundtable. And if you heard the first half, you know what we got into in regards to Minnesota, this last shooting that was there, which dovetails into a previous shooting. And, Bob, I’ll go back to you again on this particular topic, which is it’s a powder keg. Holman is now there. You know, Trump, I think, is doing whatever he possibly can to de-escalate this whole situation. I am one, and there’s a lot of conservatives that might disagree with me on this one because I’ve heard from some of them that just feel like, you know what, pull out, leave it alone. let them have their mess, their cesspool that they have, and just move on to another location. I am not one of those. I think this is a situation where, yes, it needs to be dealt with delicately, but I’m not one to say pull out. Pull out says you’re showing defeat and the other side wins, but I do feel like you need to handle this in a different way than it’s been in the past.
SPEAKER 05 :
Well, you know something? There are across the country right now, it’s not just Minneapolis that illegal aliens that committed additional crimes are being arrested. You do realize that’s happening in Republican red states as well.
SPEAKER 01 :
That’s right.
SPEAKER 05 :
In the year 2025, Trump’s first year in office, do you know that in Republican red states, there have been over 150,000 criminal illegal aliens arrested in Republican red states in 2025? And you know something? There was no chaos. There were no melees. Nobody had to get shot and killed. Nothing like that happened. In other words, it’s happening peacefully. And these are the very same… ICE agents, the very same governmental organization that’s doing it. So for all the people who say, oh, ICE is bringing chaos, they’re the reason for the chaos. If they’re the reason for the chaos, why don’t you have chaos in Republican red states? Because those Republican governors are not inciting people to riot and resist and fight back against ICE and demonizing ICE like they’re the bad guys. So you have to be logical about this, all right? Why is there no chaos in Republican states where illegal aliens are being arrested? Why is there only chaos in these Democrat-run areas where ICE is being basically attacked and threatened on a regular basis? And if I can throw one more thing in this, okay? When Barack Obama was president, Barack Obama also had a border czar. He didn’t call the title border czar. It was different. It was the immigration director for enforcement and deportations, okay? But it’s the same position. That particular person was praised by the media for the job that they did in deporting illegal aliens. Washington Post even ran a feature story. He’s really good at deporting people, okay? He was praised in the press for this. And this very same person for Obama’s received a presidential rank award from Barack Obama himself. And so he was all of the… You know what that guy’s name was? His name was Tom Homan. The very same Tom Homan that the media was slobbering over for doing such a great job that received a presidential award from Barack Obama is the very same Tom Homan now that’s working for Donald Trump. The difference is now Tom Homan is a Nazi for trying to deport illegal aliens and arrest those that have been committing additional crimes. That’s the side of the story the press isn’t telling you. Mm-hmm.
SPEAKER 04 :
You know, can I just jump on that? Absolutely. Go ahead. You’re absolutely nailing a major inconsistency on the part of the left when talking about stories like this. I mean, the Tom Holman thing is beyond belief, really, when you think about it, that he was hailed as a hero under Obama. And today he’s a demon under Trump. Does that tell you something? Like if you’re. and i don’t i don’t think i’m even talking right now to anybody who’s on the left who’s listening to this like the far left i’m talking more to the people in the middle who maybe are kind of undecided like well yeah we gotta stop these illegal you know immigrants some of whom are criminals those are the ones that they’re going after by the way we’ve got to stop them because they’re going to be a danger to us i mean these are rapists and murderers and child abusers and we need to find these individuals and get them out of our country that’s what ice is working on right now In the process, horribly, Renee Good is shot in Minneapolis a couple of weeks ago, whatever the official time date was, about two weeks ago. And, you know, the left is weeping and wailing in the street. They’re just broken over her death. It’s a horrible thing. You know, God didn’t create her for the purpose of being shot to death in this particular fashion. However… She shows up, she involves herself in this law enforcement, you know, activity where they’re trying to do their job, parks her car sideways in the middle of the street, interjects herself into a situation, then drives her vehicle at an ICE officer hitting him and ends up shot and killed. And they just can’t believe it. They’re beside themselves. Where was the outrage when Lake and Riley was killed? by an illegal. Where was the outrage for her? What about, was it Irina Zarutska, I think was her name? You know, this Russian woman, she leaves work, she gets on a train, she’s going home. She did her job. She’s going to go home to her family or wherever, you know, and she gets stabbed to death. Where was the outrage there? Why in the world are we not hearing that side of the story? And I just want any of you, especially if you’re in the middle, kind of undecided to stop and ponder that for a second. All of a sudden, Renee Good is like the star of this conversation. No, illegal immigration has created a bunch of chaos in our country, and it’s led to the murder of some of our innocent citizens like Lake and Riley and Irina Zarutska and many others. So, you know, maybe check yourself on that before you jump too quickly on one side or another regarding immigration. the involvement of ICE to protect us as U.S. citizens.
SPEAKER 05 :
That’s an excellent point. And while you’re doing that, ask the very same question. Why are we not seeing chaos in red Republican states where ICE is also arresting hundreds of thousands of illegal aliens?
SPEAKER 03 :
Speaking of red, Neil, SunPower LED.
SPEAKER 04 :
Yeah, SunPower LED. It’s a product that’s put out by an organization called Kerber USA and Kerber Applied Technologies. What they’ve done is they’ve harnessed certain wavelengths of light and then put them into a unit that can be used to have that light penetrate our bodies. And by the way, you’re not going to get cancer. There’s no UV rays or anything like that. It’s harnessing certain wavelengths of red and near infrared light to get into our bodies to the cellular level and wake up the mitochondria in the cells. It’s kind of like replacing the batteries on your remote. And all of a sudden, it works better. When your cell is energized, it can do the work that it was created to do. And all of a sudden you see healing happen. Well, you know, our cells were created to heal us. That’s how God created us. Well, Caleb learned about SunPower LED. It helped him recover from a pickaxe accident. I’ve told the story before. Poor guy put a pickaxe into his ankle tendon. Doctors told him it was going to be six to eight months before he could walk again. Well, he was walking in four weeks with the help of SunPower LED, and he didn’t need any medication. That’s unbelievable. It’s an incredible story. But I encourage you to go to CrawfordMediaGroup.net. Click on SunPowerLED. Watch some of the videos. Learn about how light can be used to heal our bodies. And guess what? God is the one who created the light. If you end up ordering any of the products there, use the promo code ROUNDTABLE10 to save yourself 10% because you’re a listener to the National Crawford Roundtable Podcast. podcast. Again, it’s SunPowerLED at CrawfordMediaGroup.net, which is also, Bob, where you’re going to find Preborn, another one of our major sponsors.
SPEAKER 05 :
You will. And I know a lot of people in the audience have given to Preborn. Many of you have given multiple times. And I’m just asking everybody, whatever missionary budget you have in your home, make part of that missionary budget regular giving to Preborn. Because we’re talking about saving babies’ lives. We’re protecting them from being killed through abortion. The way you do this is you pay for ultrasound images in pro-life centers across the country. It takes money to operate these ultrasound machines. It can be expensive to operate. But when a mom sees a picture of her baby, an ultrasound image, she chooses life almost all the time. She doesn’t go across the street to Planned Parenthood. She lets her baby live and very commonly accepts Jesus Christ as Savior. So this is about paying for ultrasound images, plain and simple. $28 is the average ultrasound expense to stop one abortion. How many abortions will you stop? Take $28 times fill in the blank. Pray about a number, that’s your gift to pre-born. And hey, if you can afford it, we need some of you to buy ultrasound machines. They’re 15 grand a piece, great tax write-off for you, but you get to know you’re stopping thousands and thousands of abortions over the years. But for everybody else, it’s 28 bucks per child that you save. So what do you say? How much will you give to pre-born? Right now, go to CrawfordMediaGroup.net and click on Preborn. CrawfordMediaGroup.net, click on Preborn. Every dime you give, 100%, goes to ultrasounds. Nothing for overhead. That’s all covered by private donors. So CrawfordMediaGroup.net, click on Preborn. And if you want to give over the phone, they answer the phones 24-7. So you can call right now, 833-850-BABY. It’s 833-850-BABY. We appreciate you folks doing that and supporting our sponsors. And John, I’ll throw it back to you.
SPEAKER 03 :
Yes. All right, well, regarding Minnesota, Trump, the administration, we’ve talked a lot about what’s going on there. In some cases, maybe incorrect messaging and how we’re handling that situation. So given all of that, and by the way, I think it was a good move on bringing Holman in, mainly because of his history with the Obama administration and so on, which, again, the left forgets, as you guys pointed out, which thank you for doing that, because I think sometimes the left needs a reminder of those things, especially, Neil, those folks that are in the middle. But, Bob, on top of that, what else should the Trump administration do to get that situation settled down? Because I don’t think we should pull out. To me, that’s not the answer.
SPEAKER 05 :
No, no. Pulling out is not the answer at all because then that basically sends a message that the anarchists win if you guys make a big enough stink. So, no, what they need to do – and, John, it’s beating the same horse you and I have talked about many times – They need to sit around and basically have a marketing and messaging war room discussion about what is a consistent way that we frame this. Let’s frame the narrative and let’s be consistent with it and let’s go forward with it. So I would argue, yeah, I mean, show some compassion for the lives that are being lost, but then turn it around and say, you know something, when Democrats encourage American citizens to inject themselves into a dangerous situation and then to take dangerous actions themselves, they are encouraging them to put their lives in dangerous positions. But also remind people of some of the talking points I was talking about before. You know what? Caroline Leavitt did this the other day. It was great. Caroline Leavitt to the press. She’s like, can I remind everybody of something? Tom Holman was Barack Obama’s border czar and he received a presidential medal for this. And then she pulled up a headline from Washington post. And let me read to you what the Washington post said about this very same Tom Holman nine years ago when Obama was in the white house. Okay. And so some of that kind of stuff. And, and also the other things about, uh, I think they all consistently ought to get out there and say, you know something? Here’s how many illegal aliens that ICE has arrested over the course of the last several months in Republican red states. And guess what? Nobody got shot. Nobody got killed. There was no chaos. There was none of that stuff. The ICE agents, when you’re not fighting against them, you’re not in danger. But if you’re fighting against a law enforcement officer and you’re using a deadly weapon or carrying one, then you are putting your own life in danger and other people’s as well. Why do we not see chaos in the Republican red states across this country? There’s been hundreds of thousands of them arrested and there’s no chaos. Why is that? It’s the same ICE, the same Tom Homan, the very same officers. You tell me why. I would get consistent with that because, you know, I think people in the middle, the mushy middle, I think they’ll be like, That is a good point. That is a good point. Maybe ICE isn’t the creator of the chaos. Maybe it really is the Democrats that are creating the chaos.
SPEAKER 03 :
I agree. And, guys, the reason why – and, Bob, I think you’re spot on – the reason why we need to do this is – keep in mind, this is midterms coming up. The left knows this. They’re working very, very hard to try to upset as many elections this coming November as they possibly can. They’re using these things right now along those lines. We have to counter that with correct messaging because, trust me, I know individuals. I know – I know kids of individuals whereby they’re really questioning what’s going on in Minnesota and why are we doing this and why is the government doing this and, you know, government bad. And by the way, I’m not saying government’s always good. But in this particular case, you know, what’s happened so far, I’ll just say it straight up, has not been, quote unquote, government’s fault or ISIS fault. These are people that are interjecting themselves into situations that. quite frankly, you shouldn’t be interjecting yourself into. I’ll talk about that in a moment, maybe. I mean, real quick as a kid, one of the first things I think my dad taught us, or I remember him teaching me is, listen, if you see trouble, go the other way. In other words, you don’t want to interject yourself into anything that might make things worse when it’s all said and done. You’re best off. I mean, now, if there’s somebody that’s being abused and somebody is is in a situation where you need to go lend a hand. That’s not what I’m talking about. But in situations like this where it’s just trouble happening, go the other direction. And Bob, I’ll start with you. Why is that such a hard lesson for people to understand?
SPEAKER 05 :
It’s not. And you know something? Democrats know this too. They know this.
SPEAKER 03 :
True.
SPEAKER 05 :
Good point. This is about what can we possibly use strategically to try to make the Democrats look good and the Republicans look bad. And anything that they – they know, unfortunately, that there are a growing number of Americans that have kind of an anarchy mentality. True.
SPEAKER 01 :
True. True.
SPEAKER 05 :
coming out and saying, you know, but we love our immigrant communities and our immigrant communities are something that we gladly welcome in this country. He doesn’t say illegal immigrants committing crimes. He says immigrant community to create the false perception that Donald Trump and ICE have hate foreigners, hate immigrants, and are going after immigrants, okay? I hate to say it, but if you lie to the American public like that, you’re going to get at least a few percentage of people in the middle that are going to believe the lie. You’re going to get some of them that just believe that. Why do they hate foreigners and immigrants so much? You mean like Melania Trump? I don’t think Donald Trump hates her. She’s an immigrant. So they tell these lies and they make it look like ICE is going in there after people that are just here trying to look for a better life. And it’s like, no, people looking for a better life don’t want to be raped by an illegal alien criminal that’s in the same community. So it’s messaging. Democrats message with dishonesty.
SPEAKER 03 :
That’s right. And Neil, we’ve talked about this many times on our program. And I think, again, part of the messaging and Bob’s talking about it is the simple fact that we love immigrants. I mean, legal immigrants, more the merrier. I mean, I’ll tell you right now that I am one where I know lots of folks that immigrated here to this country correctly. They’ve done very well. They’re business owners. Love them dearly. Some of them I even coached today. I mean, at the end of the day, Neil, I love people that come to this country along those lines. The key word there is legally. Right.
SPEAKER 04 :
Well, exactly. And, you know, if you were a business owner, would you hire somebody that was coming for the sole purpose of destroying your business? Of course. Like, I want to take over your business. I want you gone. And I want to destroy what you’ve been working on for the last. By the way, this is going to be the 250th anniversary of the United States of America. Right. I mean, that’s right. I don’t know that we’ve ever been more divided than we are right now. And it’s who knows how.
SPEAKER 03 :
Civil War. So, yeah, we have been actually. I need to remind everybody of that. Yes, we have been.
SPEAKER 04 :
Okay. It’s been worse than it is now. And by God’s grace, we survived it. And by God’s grace, maybe we’ll survive this as well. But, I mean, it’s interesting timing. Anyway, a couple things. Let me go back to something I said earlier. I don’t think I got a chance to chime in, but Tom Holman, right? I think every time he gets in front of a camera— He ought to throw in an example of what happened while he was working for Obama. In other words, you know, I think what we’re going to do in this situation is something that I learned while I was working for Barack Obama as the director. He ought to throw that in every single time so people understand that, that this has been a concern that we’ve been working on for a long time as a nation. And Democrat presidents have been in favor of deporting illegal immigrants. Legal immigrants, great. Come on in. Be a part of what’s going on here. Help make the United States a better place. If you’re illegal, and especially if you’re an illegal criminal, we want you out until we can get this thing straightened out. A couple things I wanted to say. John, you said that your dad said, if you see a problem, run from it. I think that we need to pray that God would open the hearts and minds and the eyes of people that think that becoming an agitator and showing up at one of these events and disrupting law enforcement is the way to go, that this is exactly what democracy is about. This is what we do. We stand up for what’s right and what’s right is to interject ourselves in these things. But the bottom line is, Rene Good is dead. Alex Preddy is dead. What the Democrats are actually saying is, hey, your lives don’t really matter. Come on out and get involved in these things. And if you end up dead, who cares? But the bottom line is, we’ll get votes in the midterms. We’re going to get sympathy votes in the midterms. Your lives don’t really matter. We just want to get elected. We want to make sure that we take over the House or the Senate or both and get Trump impeached, etc. I think it’s horrible what Democrats are doing and they’ll go to no, you know, there’s no end in sight for how far they’ll go to make sure that they get their way in the end. Secondarily, I don’t even know what question you asked me in the original, but I just wanted to say this. Martial arts, you know, in self-defense, any self-defense teacher will tell you that that you never lose a fight that you don’t get involved in that’s right like if you get involved you could lose um but if you don’t get involved you’ll you’re not going to lose there’s many other ways to let your voice be heard as opposed to interjecting yourself and becoming an agitator in one of these situations and i think You know, we need to continue to stress that.
SPEAKER 03 :
Well, and that leads me to kind of probably my final topic. I didn’t even put it in my notes for you guys, but I want to throw this out there because it’s something I’ve talked about in my program many times. Now, let me preface everything for those of you before you get too excited and want to send a lot of nasty emails. Do I believe in the right of assembly? Absolutely. Do I believe in free speech? Absolutely. But guys, I’ll just tell you straight up, in all of my observations over all of the years of watching different things happen, both sides of the aisle, even our side when it comes to protesting and so on, I’ll just tell you straight up. Do protests ever accomplish anything? And my answer to that is, not that I can see. It does a lot of agitating. It gets people’s backs up, I guess you could say. But I’ll just tell you straight up, at the end of the day, even some of the things that we protest against on state capitals at times and so on, at the end of the day, is there any change of outcome of whatever it is we’re protesting? And I’ll tell you guys, find me an example where it did, because I can’t think of any. I’m not saying that nobody should protest, but isn’t there better ways to handle things and get your voice heard and we have an election system we live in a republic whereby we can fire the people that work for us i have to remind everybody too by the way it always drives me crazy when even christians talk about you know well these are our these are our elected leaders no these are our elected servants it’s opposite we are the leaders of the country we are the ones that are in charge our elected officials are simply hired hands to do the work that those of us that are citizens cannot do and i think as christians at times bob even we get that so backwards we we revere these guys i don’t they work for me and my point is instead of protesting let’s change the guard uh i partially agree with you because give me an example of where a protest works
SPEAKER 05 :
Okay. I don’t know that I can give you an example where this particular protest happened, and so therefore here was the result that was the direct result of that particular protest. To me, the protests have more of a nuanced secondary benefit in that if you get enough people protesting something, as long as they do it the right way— Then the people that are kind of in the middle who haven’t really formed an opinion, not really sure which side they come down on this. There is a sense of, OK, well, you know, there are a lot of people that care about this and maybe they make it a good. I hate to say it, but there are a lot of people that are crowd followers. All right. A hundred people look up in the sky. That will start looking up in the sky, too. And so they will tend to follow what the masses say. And opinion polls, all right? If a president is doing high in opinion polls, it’s almost like a snowball effect because a bunch of people are like, well, everybody else likes the job he’s doing, so I guess I do too. Everybody else hates the job he’s doing, I guess I do too. While everybody else is going out there to say this is wrong, well, I guess I agree with them. So I do think it can have some some measure of effect on weak-minded people, but they still vote. And so I’m not saying there’s no effect from protests, but I would agree with you that it’s not as big of an effect as I think a lot of people believe it is.
SPEAKER 03 :
And by the way, I can’t disagree with that as far as the sheeple factor in the way people do follow others. I can’t argue that. Before I run out of time, before we move on, Bob, talk to us about Preborn. Or sorry, you’ll talk to us about SunPower. I’m sorry, SunPower.
SPEAKER 04 :
Yeah. All right. Well, there was an opportunity I had to utilize sun power LED, what’s often referred to as photobiomodulation or light therapy. Because in 2021, I came down with COVID. I had a pretty intense version of the Delta variant of COVID. It was my first time getting COVID. Since then, I’ve had it several times, but not a big deal. going on, but I was in a situation where I literally couldn’t breathe. I mean, I would take a very deep breath. I was inhaling, but none of the oxygen was getting into my bloodstream. And my blood oxygen saturation was like in the range of 79 to 82. It was hanging around 82. And if I got up and took three steps, it was dropping to 79. I had to call the paramedics three different times. And they begged me not to go to the hospital saying, you know, listen, this is the height of COVID. If you go to the hospital, you’re going to sit in the hallways and not get treated. i was in a pretty desperate situation i needed to be able to breathe again and i was told about sunpower led in fact the owner of sunpower led tom kerber heard about my situation sent me a unit and said use this on your lungs and see what happens in a matter of two weeks my situation had turned around and by three weeks i was back to 100 oxygen saturation 99 to 100. it was incredible what happened Why? Because light can be used for healing, and you need to learn about it by going to CrawfordMediaGroup.net, click on Sun Power LED, and learn how the light God created can be used to help heal your body. It’s an incredible thing. If you go there, by the way, use the promo code ROUNDTABLE10 and save yourself 10%. But also, if you get a chance, spend some time looking at Preborn. Bob, Preborn is one of our major sponsors, and they’re doing everything they can to save innocent human lives.
SPEAKER 05 :
They are. And it’s really you folks paying for it, okay? Because when a mom sees a picture of her baby, an ultrasound image, it’s the first time she’s ever seen what her baby looks like. And it’s very rare for her to go through with an abortion at that point. She usually lets the baby live and commonly accepts Jesus Christ as Savior. So we’re asking you folks in the audience to pay for as many ultrasound images as you can. I know a lot of you have given to preborn. You’ve given on a regular basis. We just keep on giving, right? You’re saving babies’ lives. You’re paying for ultrasound images. $28 is the average ultrasound expense to stop one abortion. So how many abortions will you stop? Just take $28 times fill in the blank, pray about a number, and then that’s your gift to Preborn. So would you do that right now? Just go to CrawfordMediaGroup.net, click on Preborn. That’s CrawfordMediaGroup.net, click on Preborn. You can give right there. Or you can give over the phone, 833-850-BABY. It’s 833-850-BABY. They answer 24-7. Just mention National Crawford Roundtable when you call. And don’t forget, every penny that you give goes to fund ultrasounds. Nothing for overhead. That’s all covered by private donors. So 833-850-BABY. John?
SPEAKER 03 :
With a minute left, I’m going to give each of you just one minute to comment on it because I was going to spend some time on this. Maybe we can cover this next week. And that is… Some of the stories coming out about some of the doctors and nurses that are not only refusing to work on folks that are conservative, Christian, MAG, or whatever you want to call it, but then on top of that, trying to instruct others on how to even go against ICE with different types of chemical agents and so on. I mean, Bob, these are medical practitioners. They’re supposed to be there saving our lives, and yet they’re activists.
SPEAKER 05 :
I know. It is insane. And there are certain professions that you should not be a political activist on. And it seems to me that that’s one of them. I mean, you have nurses, you have even OBGYN nurses that are out there trashing Caroline Leavitt and Donald Trump and ICE and everything else.
SPEAKER 01 :
Sickening.
SPEAKER 05 :
Really? This is the person that you’re going to trust to deliver your baby? So, no, it ought not be that. I mean, I would like sports to be apolitical, and certainly medicine should be apolitical. And I think that hospitals need to come down. The administrators need to come down on their employees and say, look— If you want to be an activist, go be an activist. This is America. But it’s inconsistent with your job as a medical professional that needs to put people’s comfort and well-being at ease because their mental well-being is just as important as their physical. And if they don’t trust you, then their physical well-being is going to be damaged. So you decide. You want to be an activist? You want to be a nurse? You can’t be both.
SPEAKER 03 :
That’s right. Neil, I apologize because Bob took your minute.
SPEAKER 05 :
See how I am, Neil? Hey, nothing new there. Just take Neil’s time. You know why?
SPEAKER 04 :
Because I’m an anarchist, and if I want it, that’s what I want. Let me just say, you only get so many breaths during your lifetime, and Bob, I’ve got a lot more left than you do right
SPEAKER 03 :
There we go. Guys, great addition. Another great addition, I should say, of the National Crawford Roundtable. All of you listening, just go to CrawfordMediaGroup.net. Find our sponsors there. Support them. They’re the ones that make this happen on a weekly basis. We appreciate all of you listening very, very much. Again, another edition of the National Crawford Roundtable.
SPEAKER 02 :
You’ve been listening to the National Crawford Roundtable Podcast, a view of today’s culture through a biblical lens, brought to you by Preborn, saving babies and souls. Join us in the fight to save babies from abortion. Your gift provides a free ultrasound for a mother in need. 80% of the time she will choose life. Visit CrawfordMediaGroup.net and click on their logo to donate. And by SunPower LED light therapy devices. Bring light to your pain. Visit CrawfordMediaGroup.net and click on the SunPower LED logo to get out of pain and improve your overall wellness. You can download this podcast from Apple Podcasts, Stitcher, and more from your local Crawford Media Group stations website or at CrawfordMediaGroup.net. And please give this podcast a five-star rating on your Apple app. Look for the notification on your app for when the next weekly edition of the National Crawford Roundtable Podcast is ready for you to download. This is a Crawford Media Group production.
