Join us as we navigate through the tangled web of political nominations with Dr. Kelly Victory and Steve (guest commentator), providing a candid look at the processes that shape our national healthcare leadership. The episode takes a critical turn as John Rush and his guests question the broader implications of appointing individuals to significant health roles without practical experience. This discussion reveals the challenges faced by healthcare systems and exposes the potential future of America’s health policies amidst a sea of political maneuvering.
SPEAKER 14 :
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SPEAKER 14 :
Are you crazy? Am I? Or am I so sane that you just blew your mind?
SPEAKER 16 :
It’s Rush to Reason with your host, John Rush, presented by Cub Creek Heating and Air Conditioning.
SPEAKER 13 :
All right. Happy Thursday, everyone. Rush to Reason, Denver’s Afternoon Rush, KLZ 560. Dr. Kelly Victory with us. I’ll start with her as usual. Dr. Kelly, welcome.
SPEAKER 04 :
Thank you for having me, as always. Happy Thursday.
SPEAKER 13 :
It is a great Thursday as we head into Mother’s Day weekend. Both you and Steve, happy Mother’s Day. Steve, welcome as well. Thanks. Glad to be here. Always, always glad to be here with you guys as well. Always look forward to Thursday. And by the way, we get a lot of listeners that do as well. Always hear from folk either during or after we’re done. And even when we’re not here and I do our replay shows, I get lots of questions even during those. So people really do enjoy this time that we have together. So where where should we start? Dr. Kelly, let’s start with you. A new surgeon general. Let’s talk about that if we would.
SPEAKER 04 :
Well, Jeanette Nashwat, who was the original name put forward for the position of Surgeon General, was withdrawn from the committee due to some issues around her qualifications and whether or not she’d been fully forthcoming with them. I think it was a… a good decision to pull her. The person who has now been nominated is Dr. Casey Means, who sort of parachuted in out of nowhere into this administration and into the Maha movement, as well as Bobby Kennedy’s circles, relatively recently, along with her brother, Callie. It remains to be seen whether or not she can be confirmed. And Casey Means is a physician. She has an M.D. She did not. She went to medical school at Stanford and then went on to do a residency in Oregon that she did not complete. So she is not residency trained. She does not have a medical license. And she has never practiced medicine, nor can she as a result of not having completed a residency, which is a requirement to get hospital privileges in the United States. So while she has been a champion, as it were, recently for things related to health and wellness and really focusing on things like chronic disease and the way that we can address those things through medicine, better nutrition and exercise and those sorts of things I find it hard to imagine that she will have the confidence of 350 million Americans as America’s doctor when she’s never practiced medicine a day in her life.
SPEAKER 13 :
I can’t argue with that, Steve. I think Dr. Kelly is spot on. And, you know, you and I can’t practice medicine because we, like her, don’t hold any kind of a medical degree and what have you. And I don’t know this individual personally, although, although, As long as you and I and what we have done here on Thursdays and even what we do outside of this and the communication that three of us have and have had going back and forth the past five years, I don’t think I’m going to step out on a limb by saying that, Steve, I think you and I probably have about as much experience to be Surgeon General as this person does. Am I wrong?
SPEAKER 15 :
Well, I probably have more, to be honest with you. I’ve been in clinical spaces many more days than she has, that’s for sure. I mean, just because she went to school and she spent some time in the hospital. I’ve been doing this for 42 years. That’s not to say that I’m the right choice. Here’s where I get into a struggle, and several people pointed out today that there have been nurses who performed the role of Surgeon General. In fact, there was a nurse in the Trump administration. And say, if there’s a nurse, then why not Casey Means? Well, the difference is The nurses that were surgeon general, much like Kelly’s talking about, actually worked in nursing. They saw what happens in a hospital. They saw what happens in practices. They saw how patients react and respond to different coaching and treatment and therapeutics and things like that. Casey, with all due respect, she’s famous. And I’m really, really disappointed in this. I mean, I can tell you, I’m not going to take any advice from Casey Means. I haven’t been taking her advice on the supplements she sells online any more than I’ll take her advice as Surgeon General, because I’ve had enough of celebrities taking jobs in government that aren’t capable of doing the job. Quite frankly, most of the Trump cabinet is solid. They have good people working in positions that can do the jobs. This is one position, while not a cabinet-level sort of position, it’s It’s one position I’ve really been disappointed in, and it’s a doctor, and we just came out of a pandemic. And we’ve got chronic disease problems that are so significant.
SPEAKER 13 :
Absolutely.
SPEAKER 04 :
I also would add that I have concern always about somebody who, as I said, parachutes in out of nowhere. Steve and I have been involved in this fight for decades. I ran a health and wellness company back in the year 2000 where I was preaching that we cannot manage health care costs if we don’t manage health. uh cali means was 12 years old when i was doing that um you know she is she does not have the gravitas in my estimation furthermore the fact that she quote wrote a book uh means nothing uh the book is not well referenced and i don’t know that she herself wrote it furthermore her father her and her brother Kelly’s father is a big time pharmaceutical executive. So it really makes me wonder then to add to all of this sort of concerning choice. Nicole Shanahan, Bobby Kennedy’s former vice president’s choice when he was running for president, has come out with a scathing review online. saying that she was promised if she backed Bobby and stood with Bobby as his VP that the Means siblings, meaning Callie and Casey Means, would be nowhere in HHS. In other words, Nicole Shanahan had grave concerns about these two way back in the fall of last year. So I think there’s something, there’s a piece missing here that I don’t understand this choice other than you have to start to believe that there’s something else at play here. And I don’t, unfortunately, Bobbi Kennedy, as smart as he is and as well-intentioned as I believe he is, he’s not a physician. I don’t think he understands the importance of actually having completed a residency, passing your boards, being board certified, becoming a fellow of your respective college. and actually practicing medicine as an independent physician and what that gains you, not only in credibility, but in true real life experience. This would be tantamount to, you know, elevating somebody to be attorney general who had graduated from law school, but had never practiced a day of law. It would be preposterous.
SPEAKER 13 :
Which I’m going to just jump in for a moment, Dr. Kelly. Steve, I’ll let you have a comment in a moment. And while I have a lot of respect for RFK Jr., and I know you do as well, Dr. Kelly, I guess I just have to question, okay, time out. I don’t think he’s that naive. In other words, he knows far more about this than probably even I do, Dr. Kelly, and there’s no way that I would sit in his position and appoint somebody like this knowing they don’t have any real medical background whatsoever. I also am not a doctor, although, again, I’ve been with you guys long enough now to where I feel like I know a lot of elementary things and no i’m not going to go operate on anybody or prescribe anything to anybody or do anything along those lines at all because i don’t have the authority nor the wherewithal to do so although the basic premise of how things work i would not have appointed this individual dr kelly and i’m not him and he is way smarter than i am by the way at the end of the day the question i guess i have to ask is who’s really pulling the strings
SPEAKER 04 :
I think that that’s a legitimate question. And if, in fact, Bobby Kennedy and his staff have been bamboozled such that they don’t see that there’s something awry here, then that speaks for itself as really problematic. But I might remind people that while the surgeon general position is not really one of making policy, it really is one to be of communication and to lead right that is true but that person is in charge of more than 6 000 volunteer medical corps highly trained working healthcare professionals and i hate to tell you i simply don’t think you are going to garner the respect of thousands and thousands of people who have leagues more experience than she does i mean i i just don’t see that happening so i’m concerned about it it will remain to be seen what happens during the confirmation hearing as i said i think she may face some tough questions like you know you don’t have an active medical license and you didn’t finish your residency you’re not you know you’ve never practiced independently and i Although she will tell people and she says in her book that she dropped out because she learned that the system was corrupt and wasn’t focusing on the right things. And something about it just doesn’t quite pass muster to me. She had one more year to do to finish her residency. I’m not sure why she wouldn’t have done that so that she could complete her residency, get a medical license, and at least then she could go out and change the world as she saw fit. But to drop out and lose all credibility as a physician, I think is somewhat problematic.
SPEAKER 13 :
Steve, and I know you’ve got thoughts on this as well. We were texting a lot, you know, back and forth and around this morning. And you know my pick for this, and I know your pick as well, Steve. And I’ve got people texting in right now that, you know, their pick would have been, you know, Dr. Kelly, of course. And so I’m telling people back, those of you that are texting in, by the way, you know what? Voice your opinions. You have representatives. You have people that you can talk to. You have the ability to send things off. If that, in fact, is your feeling, then send those things off. Am I wrong, Steve?
SPEAKER 15 :
No, I don’t think you’re wrong. And with all due respect to my friend Kelly Victory, I think she possesses one problem that’s getting in the way here, and that is that she’s too damn strong. You know, she has too many credentials, too many things figured out about how this should work. She understands disease. She understands patients. She’s practiced medicine a lot. She’s been on the front edge of what works, especially during the COVID process. For politics, you know.
SPEAKER 13 :
Well, hang on. I want to add one more thing to that, Steve, as to what you’re saying there, too, because I believe you’re correct on all of that. One more thing. all of the things the three of us have talked about for literally now the past five years regarding COVID, the mRNA jab, all of those different things. Yeah, Steve, I would even layer that in our three’s position on all of that. I would layer on top of what you just said as well.
SPEAKER 15 :
I would agree. So let me just give you one example of where Surgeon General Means is not going to do something that I want Surgeon General Victory to do, which is She’s going to look at American health and she’s going to determine that chronic disease is, in fact, rampant. We all know that. But Kelly understands things like why people don’t take their drugs because they’re too expensive and what that means when PBMs are running rackets and what it means when you can’t get access to care. All of those things. I mean, Casey’s never been involved in. Now I realize that’s Bobby Kennedy’s job in HHS and it’s Mehmet Oz’s job in running Medicare and Medicaid, but the Surgeon General is in more aspects than anybody else in any of those roles. They are standing in front of the patient to the system. And so you need somebody who believes in patient rights, who understands what patient problems are, understands what the problem of the system is. You stand looking inward toward HHS, representing the patient, telling people what to do. I can think of nobody better than Kelly, and I think the problem is that anybody who’s hired on the other side looking outward is not going to get the job done.
SPEAKER 13 :
No, you’re right, and Steve, I think you’re 100% correct. Dr. Kelly, just like I think there’s a lot of times – people like myself might be asked to do certain things, even speaking engagements and things along those lines. Unfortunately, though, because I don’t mince any words, I sort of blurt out the truth, if you would. I research everything to make sure that it is, in fact, truthful. I mean, you and I are very much the same, so is Steve, along those lines. Unfortunately, when it comes to things along these lines, probably doesn’t bode real well for us, or am I wrong?
SPEAKER 04 :
No, I think that’s exactly right. And two things. Number one, the reason it’s so important from my perspective for the surgeon general to have experience as a practicing physician is for the reason Steve intimated, because I know firsthand what it is like to try to get surgery. a patient pre-approved for a procedure, for example, to go through the insurance process, to understand what it is for patients to face crushing medical bills, not be able to fill their prescriptions, what it means to have a backup in the OR for your hospital to go on bypass. I know what those things are because I’ve lived them and I know how to deal with them. I know where the problems are in the system. Frankly, to be very honest, and I think, you know, you two are certainly aware that I was very, very close to this nomination. And I think, if anything, probably sunk that ship in the 11th and a half hour. It’s that it was very clear that I was going to stand staunchly for the immediate withdrawal of the mRNA injections from the market. This is something that should have happened years ago. And I think that that stance in and of itself was going to ultimately be intolerable, if not to the president, certainly to the confirmation process, meaning that they thought they would never get somebody through. Casey means has never. ever made a negative statement about the mRNA shots. She has never suggested that they should be pulled from the market. She has only focused on other things regarding metabolic health and those sorts of things and has taken no hard stance on the issue of vaccines. And I think that has helped her become the darling.
SPEAKER 13 :
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SPEAKER 11 :
No liberal media bias here. This is Rush to Reason.
SPEAKER 13 :
All right, we are back. Rush to Reason, Denver’s Afternoon Rush, KLZ 560. Thanks for joining us today. We appreciate it very much. Talking about the Surgeon General nomination. Now, Dr. Kelly, they don’t go through the same process and confirmation that RFK Jr. went through, but they still have to go through some questioning and so on. Am I correct in that?
SPEAKER 04 :
Oh, absolutely. She still will go through a committee, and has to go through the confirmation process in front of the Senate, I do think that she will face some element of questions where Dr. Nashuot, I think, would have been easier to get through the Democrat side. I think that Casey Means may face some tough questioning from some of the Republicans in there. Despite all that, I can guarantee that they will not put her in front of the confirmation hearings unless they are darn sure that they have the votes to get her confirmed. You know, this is going to be already it’s sort of a black mark on President Trump to have a second or third. You know, you have it with, you know, you already had it with Matt Gaetz. You’ve had other people withdrawn. And so you want to limit the number of those because the optics are bad. I just am concerned really somewhat about the vetting process here. in conversations with people, including Bobby Kennedy recently, it makes me wonder if they truly understand exactly what these people’s credentials are or aren’t and really understand the process. They seem to not understand exactly what’s required to do things like practice medicine. So it’ll be interesting to see what happens. I guarantee they won’t put her in front of the committee unless they’re sure they have the votes.
SPEAKER 13 :
Interesting. Steve, go ahead. And I’m I am surprised at some of the things Kelly is. I guess maybe I’m not surprised because there’s times I wonder, you know, and you and I’ve talked about this one on one outside of Dr. Kelly. You know, I have a firm belief that the majority, not in this case with RFK Jr., but the majority of politicians themselves, Steve. Frankly, and I’m sorry, maybe I’m wrong in saying this, but I think a lot of politicians, frankly, just don’t have a lot of wherewithal outside of getting elected and raising money and knowing who to pander to outside of that. I’ll be straight up honest. I don’t think that the brightest bulb out there.
SPEAKER 15 :
Well, I mean, I think there’s there’s truth to that. I mean, think about it this way, first of all. Trump wanted a bunch of outsiders. I don’t think there’s any doubt about that. I mean, the whole Doge concept itself was an outsider concept. You know, you need outsiders. Well, there’s a healthy mix where you need a healthy mix of outsiders politically, but you also need people who understand how the system works so you can break it and fix it properly. Because if you don’t understand how it works, then you don’t know what to break, and you end up falling in a line with certain things. I mean, anybody in the HHS who takes a while to figure out how the system works means with a four-year period time you’re gonna get a little done right you have to bring people with a who’ve got a plan an agenda all of that’s important in the process now politicians in general but i was in politics i mean i think that if you’re the person who decides that you’re gonna take your great big brain and you’re gonna spend it in twenty or thirty years making a hundred and seventy five thousand a year in congress or thirty thousand years of state legislator of the state You either have a huge benevolent heart or you’ve got the math wrong. It isn’t the greatest place in the world to make a difference and to do it in a way that you can support your family in a positive thing. That’s the problem I think we have.
SPEAKER 13 :
I can’t argue that. Dr. Kelly, again, you’ve been around a lot of politicians just like Steve and I haven’t. And I’m doing my best. I mean, I’m trying to ditz all politicians. And I know there’s some out there that are definitely more bright than others. But I’m sorry to say, Dr. Kelly, on a… you know, across the board basis from your local politicians that run for city council, mayoral situations, commissioners and so on, all the way up to, you know, not Trump as a president, but, you know, most of the people that are in politics. I’m sorry, I’ve interviewed a lot of these people. I’ve had, you know, conversations. I’ve rubbed elbows with them at dinners and so on. And I’m just sorry to say they’re not that bright.
SPEAKER 04 :
Of course they’re not. And listen, the way the system is set up does not attract the best and the brightest. I actually was approached by the Republican Congressional Committee years ago to see if I would run for a congressional seat in California. And what they wanted me to do was drop everything. They told me I needed to have somewhere in the range of $250,000 of my own money. That I was willing to put into a campaign, and once they saw that I could actually win, then they would consider putting money behind me. Now, why would anybody worth their salt, anybody who’s got a decent job, anybody who’s already successful, drop everything in order to do that? Then you see the process, the system. Look at what these people have had to go through to get confirmed. You get raked over the coals. They destroy your personal life. People smear you up one side and down the other with no repercussions whatsoever. So what you get in Congress… I hate to say it, are people who have nothing else that they could do successfully, people who are looking for their 15 minutes of fame, and people who without a ton of support and a lot of… They can’t work more than maybe 50% of the time. How many hours a week do you think your average person in Congress actually works? My gosh, look at their schedules compared to your average physician or lawyer working Or somebody else. It’s insane. So the system attracts people who are relatively low IQ, people who don’t have a lot of other options, frankly, or they wouldn’t choose to do what they are doing. That’s the sad truth.
SPEAKER 13 :
Yeah, and Steve, again, you and I have had some of these conversations even outside of Dr. Kelly. And again, I’m not trying to be rude, and I know there are some people and there are some folk that have done well financially. There is some benevolence there. I get that, although I think sometimes Steve, even some of those look at it and say, okay, at the end of the day, yeah, I can give my time. I can give my energy. I’ve made pretty good money through the years. But on the same token, what am I gaining when it’s all said and done, and how can I even further myself along once this is all said? Because at the end of the day, if they do it right, even what they put in initially, they will get back tenfold or more when it’s all said and done. And I don’t think I’m wrong in saying that.
SPEAKER 15 :
No, and I think, you know, there’s sort of a natural politician out there. And that’s, you know, former military, retired, you know, around 40, 45 years of age. You’ve served, you understand leadership, you move into politics. And there’s a fair number of people that fit that category that have been pretty good at what they do. as we go along, but there’s still a whole bunch of other people who must think we are stupid, and that’s what drives me nuts, right? Because a congresswoman up in Minnesota doesn’t know the difference between her brother and her husband. You have one in New England who is run as if she’s some sort of a Native American and constantly says stuff that just makes zero sense. It’s political. It is all about do you have the political strength to say stuff you know isn’t true to be able to further your own cause. That’s unethical to me. They’re not all like that, but there certainly is a fair number of them.
SPEAKER 13 :
You know what? Well said. I appreciate what you said a moment ago along those lines. I think that was a good… Description circling back around, though, Dr. Kelly, when it comes to some of these things to where in this case, Surgeon General, really not a, you know, out of the box, a political position, although it is, although it’s not something you actually vie for and run for. And like you, I’m with you. Your comment earlier about how, in this case, somebody just parachutes in kind of in the, you know, 11th plus hour and now all of a sudden is going to go through the process. You’ve got to wonder, OK, wait a minute. Time out. Where did this come from?
SPEAKER 04 :
Exactly. And as I said, I think if you really look at this, you know where this woman came from, what she did, what motivated her to in the 11th hour, quote, drop out of her residency, write a book. She’s claiming that she practiced medicine, functional medicine up in Oregon, which is interesting because she doesn’t have a medical license. I mean, that’s easy enough to search. And we have her medical license is listed as inactive, has been since 2019. So there are just too many unanswered questions. But she very, very quickly, I mean, within nobody’s ever heard her name or her brother’s name yet in a matter of months. They came in, wrote a best-selling book on Joe Rogan. They’re with Hillary Clinton and Chelsea Clinton. And on all of these shows, they’re meeting with the president in the Oval Office. And they have multiple times. They’re meeting with Bobby Kennedy. They’re all of a sudden all over the place. And it really makes you wonder when that happens where these people came from. Nobody had heard their names during the entirety of the pandemic. When the rest of us are out there risking our medical licenses on a daily basis, taking it on the chin in the court of public opinion, fighting, fighting, fighting for what’s right, trying to get rid of the mandates, get rid of the lockdown, fight the masks, fight the social distancing, fight the jabs, all of this. And this person’s nowhere to be found. And all of the sudden ascends to the top position in medicine in the country?
SPEAKER 13 :
Mm-hmm.
SPEAKER 04 :
I smell a rat.
SPEAKER 13 :
Well, I think, too, at the end of the day, and I agree with you, Dr. Kelly, Steve, and I’m sorry. This is a predictor on my part, and I’m sorry, and I have a lot of respect for a lot of those individuals, RFK Jr. himself. Unfortunately, though, Steve, and I’ll get both of your opinions on this, I will be absolutely shocked. If some of the things that even RFK Jr. said he was going to do gets done, i.e., let’s reduce the amount of pharma ads that are actually on television. Let’s do some of the things you guys talk about with PBMs. On and on we go. Steve, maybe I’m wrong, and I’m not trying to be super cynical, but I’ll just be completely, utterly shocked if some of those things actually come to fruition now that these things like this are happening. Am I wrong?
SPEAKER 15 :
No, and you’re not wrong for a couple of reasons. Let me go back to Dr. Means for a second. I actually think that someone who stands up to the system and says, you know, it’s so unethical, it’s so bad, I can’t be part of it, even though I’ve spent all my time in medical school, etc., There’s value in that. It just doesn’t belong in the surgeon general’s role. I mean, I think you could take Callie Means, put her in MAHA, you know, working with Bobby Kennedy, talking about nutrition and the other things that she’s aware of, talking about the problems of the system. But the surgeon general role is not that place. And I wonder, you know, why pick that role for her? When is it the only job that was open? I don’t think so. I mean, why not make her some sort of a new role in Maha because she is, you know, nutrition and alternative medicine focused? I don’t get the Surgeon General. In terms of the other question, you know, he’s only got, you know, three and a half years fundamentally to get this done. This is a system that was built and has been talked about for decades. decade, fast growing, double the cost of the next closest country for medicine. We’re one of the least healthy countries. We’ve lost years of life since COVID. You couldn’t fix this thing if you tore it completely down and rebuilt it starting tomorrow in three and a half years. The question is, will he have an impact on health? by what he does with dives and all. Will they just kill the mRNA vaccine? I mean, what are we waiting for? I still see commercials on TV. I do, too. What are we waiting for? What are we waiting for?
SPEAKER 13 :
Dr. Kelly, again, I’m not trying to be cynical. I’m just being – you know my show. I’m very realistic. We have conversations ongoing, and you know my take on things. And, again, I’m not trying to jab at RFK Jr. by any means. I’m just getting less and less – excited that some of these things you and I and Steve have talked about over the course of the past couple of quarters now, I will just be shocked if those things happen now that we’re seeing these sorts of things happen.
SPEAKER 04 :
I agree. And the reason, to be very clear, the reason I was so interested in taking the position and getting the position in this administration was not because I don’t have a great job and a great life. The last thing I wanted to do was to move to Washington. My interest was in doing everything I could to regain, to rebuild the trust and confidence that has been lost in health care and in medicine. There’s been so much damage done, and certainly the death knell was sounded during COVID, but it started way before that. It started with all of the problems with… Physicians being motivated by insurance reimbursement, by insurance companies running the show, by big pharma’s inclusion into all of it. All of, you know, big medicine, big industry, the fact that 85% of physicians are now employees and on and on. And then along comes COVID and whatever remaining credibility physicians had was lost during that. I was really going to try to work to reestablish that, to say that there are ethical physicians out there. We are going to make those changes. Now, when you see this, when you see nominations that appear to be motivated by everything that is anathema to what we have stood for, it is all about big pharma and big ag and big food. You have people who, you know, Dr. Oz and Dr. Macri and people who are truly didn’t stand up for what was right during the pandemic. You know, Casey Means has posted on her previous Twitter account that you’re getting her COVID shot live on Clubhouse. I mean, she bought into it. She drank the Kool-Aid. And so I do worry, as you’re saying, John, that any of it’s really going to get done, that it’s not going to be just a lot of lip service. You know, Maha is turning into Haha.
SPEAKER 13 :
I’m afraid you’re right, Dr. Kelly. We need to take a break. We’ll come back. Steve, I want to get your thoughts on a little bit more of that. And I’ve got a couple of things I’m going to add to that that I really feel like prove what we’re talking about, you know, is there. So give me a minute. We’ll come right back, guys. Roof Savers of Colorado coming up next. And if you want to extend the life of your roof, Roof Savers of Colorado can do that for you. Their RoofMax product, which they’re now teamed up with 30 Jobs Mike Rowe. Find out what Dave can do for you, 303-710-6916.
SPEAKER 09 :
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SPEAKER 13 :
All right, we are back. Rush to Reason, Denver’s Afternoon Rush, KLZ 560. Dr. Kelly Victory, Steve House with us as well. Steve, I want to start with you because we had a question come in. Charlie asked the same thing, so I had a couple of text messages along these lines, and we talked earlier about how do you push back against some of these things. So, Steve, for those that are listening where they would think, listen, I would like to push back. I’d like to see some of the changes being made that Dr. Kelly talks about, and I don’t like this particular nominee at all. Who do they contact to push back, Steve?
SPEAKER 15 :
The best thing to do would be to write your senators and your congressmen, all right? I mean, the senators are going to be the ones who ultimately have to confirm her. So, you know, if you want to take that on, the first step would be to write to every senator in the country you can get to, but especially the Colorado ones, and say, guys, I don’t support this. You know, if you’re a Republican, say I’m a Republican because we’ve got two Democrat senators in Colorado. Right. And I do not support this nomination. Please do not vote yes.
SPEAKER 13 :
Okay.
SPEAKER 15 :
And please push her in a different direction. Push them in a different direction.
SPEAKER 13 :
Okay. Again, there’s people asking that question, so there’s your answer, folks, that are asking. And, Steve, I appreciate that very much. Again, maybe this isn’t a confirmation that I’m very nervous about things and maybe this stuff was already in the works and so on. But I sent both of you, Dr. Kelly, I’ll start with you, CSU. And again, it’s only a million bucks. And again, I say it’s only a million because, you know, a million is a lot of money. Although in today’s world, it’s not as much as it once was. But CSU lands a $1.2 million loan. funding from NIH to advance work on a new tuberculosis vaccine. And if I’m not mistaken, I read through this, I believe this is more of a gain of function type research than anything else. And Dr. Kelly, if that’s the case, then my fears are probably solidified. Am I right?
SPEAKER 04 :
Yeah. Not only are they funding hand over fist, research on being hundreds and hundreds of mRNA vaccines. But although Trump has stopped doing any gain of function research out of the country, they are allowing it to continue on U.S. soil. So there are so many things that are wrong with this. The idea that there’s been not a single mention of revoking the 1986 Childhood Vaccine Injury Act, which is the thing that promoted the explosion of vaccines and the vaccine religion, which is exactly what it is. But protecting these different manufacturers, there’s been zero talk about actually pulling the mRNA shots for COVID off. So although it’s important to stop, you know, yes, I agree 100% with getting the food additives out, with changing the fluoride in the water, stopping the toxic food dyes. But what’s killing people today are the mRNA shots.
SPEAKER 06 :
Right.
SPEAKER 04 :
Today.
SPEAKER 06 :
Right.
SPEAKER 04 :
Yes, people have chronic illness related to highly processed foods, but the thing that is killing people today is that there are kids and babies getting these shots right now. So we have to address those things, and there hasn’t even been lip service about it.
SPEAKER 13 :
Yeah, I can’t argue that at all. And, Steve, again, I sent you the same article, which, by the way, for those of you listening, it’s not just CSU that’s landing the $1.2 million. They’re just a portion of what’s going on in regards to what Dr. Kelly talked about, Steve.
SPEAKER 15 :
They are a portion. And, I mean, I don’t know where it goes from here, to be honest, John. I just think that this, I mean, I don’t know. Like I said, I’m not sure where it goes from here, and I think Kelly’s absolutely right.
SPEAKER 13 :
Yeah, and for those of you listening, again, this is a much larger amount of money that’s going out to other institutions as well. It’s not just CSU. CSU is one of the beneficiaries of, but Dr. Kelly is correct. We basically have said, yeah, we’re not going to do this offshore anymore, but let’s go ahead and continue to do this onshore. I mean, I guess, Dr. Kelly, let me ask you this, because in this particular article, it talks about how there’s still many, many more vaccines needed. Is that really true?
SPEAKER 04 :
No, it’s not true. And that’s the falsehood. We did just fine before we had any vaccines. You, Steve, and I grew up having an average of six to eight vaccines between birth and age 18. Now that number is up to 84.
SPEAKER 1 :
84.
SPEAKER 04 :
Really? What has that delivered us between our generation and the current generation? astronomical rates of autism, ADHD, asthma, food allergies, psoriasis, neurologic complications, and on and on. That’s what more vaccines have delivered us. So the idea that we need to vaccinate ourselves to good health or can vaccinate ourselves to good health is preposterous. So this is all being fueled by big pharma.
SPEAKER 13 :
Okay, so for those that maybe haven’t listened to us for the past five years, some of these things, you know, I feel like at times we talk so much about, I wonder, can we continue down this path any longer? But then I realize that, geez, I’ve been talking about how often to change your oil on Drive Radio for 25 years, and people still don’t get it. So the reality is I don’t know that we can ever stop talking about some of these things. So, Dr. Kelly, for those that maybe haven’t been listening to us for those five years, You know, OK, why can’t we vaccinate ourself to good health and why shouldn’t we vaccinate ourself to good health?
SPEAKER 04 :
Well, the human immune system was never intended to be flogged incessantly with immune challenges, which is what a vaccine is. You have a God-given immune system that functions really very, very well. There’s a reason we aren’t all in bed constantly with viruses and bacterial infections. And we weren’t before the vaccines, okay? This is absolutely – I had chickenpox, measles, and mumps. OK, all of those things. The average healthy immune system fights those things. There isn’t a single vaccine out there where the disease that it prevents. is more deadly than the risk from the vaccine the vaccines are riskier than the actual disease there is not a single take something like rubella the mmr measles mumps rubella vaccine is a combined vaccine so everybody gets it 100 people get it there isn’t a single justification for a male ever to get a rubella shot rubella if you catch rubella is indistinguishable from a common cold The only justification for vaccinating a female for rubella is when they become adults and are of childbearing age, if a woman should by some off chance get rubella while she is pregnant, she could transfer that to the baby in the form of a birth defect. So you could make the argument that young women who are going to have children should get a rubella vaccine when they get to that age where they’re thinking about starting a family. For males, never. Likewise, hepatitis vaccines in newborns. We’ve talked about this before. Hepatitis B is a sexually transmitted disease or by IV drug use. What in the world could the possible explanation be? There is none other than money. It is money being made by the pharmaceutical industry.
SPEAKER 13 :
Yep. It’s funny, really quick, before I go to Steve, you talk about mumps, and I had forgotten that I was probably, I don’t know, Dr. Kelly. seven, eight, maybe nine years of age, probably eight years of age. My mom has passed, or I would ask her, and she’d probably remember to a T because she remembered dates like no tomorrow. But, yeah, you say that, and I remember having it, and I didn’t die. Neither did my brother and sister. We all three had it, Dr. Kelly.
SPEAKER 04 :
Yeah, exactly. And I think that that’s the reality of anybody who’s already does, you know, a very, very small fraction. Could some kids get significantly ill with this? Yes, they can. That does happen. But you don’t put the entire population at risk to take a vaccine for something that a fraction of one percent of children could have a problem with. Let’s focus on treating those kids differently. who might end up getting significantly ill, not vaccinating everybody and their brother. I’ve never had a flu vaccine in my life, yet I know a lot of my fellow physicians, my colleagues, have had 30 or 40 of them because they were, quote, required to get hospital privileges. That’s preposterous. Why? Why? You know, it’s just insanity. And truly, if you I promise you, if you revoked the 1986 Childhood Vaccine Injury Act so that the vaccine manufacturers faced liability, should somebody have an adverse reaction or, God forbid, die, the number of vaccines on the childhood schedule would plummet.
SPEAKER 13 :
Steve, I mean, I’ve got so much respect for Dr. Kelly, the things we’ve learned over the past, you know, five years. And it’s funny, I forgot all about mumps until Dr. Kelly said that a moment ago. And I can remember even as a kid, Dr. Kelly, where, you know, somebody would get chicken pox and you’d have almost like these chicken pox parties where others would go around to actually get, you know, quote unquote, infected. So your kid could get chicken pox and be done and over with it. We didn’t vaccinate for that stuff when you and I were kids.
SPEAKER 15 :
No, in fact, part of this, I think, and I welcome, Kelly, in your reaction to this, I think that a lot of times what we’re trying to do is we’re trying to prevent people from suffering from anything. And when you try to prevent suffering, I mean, which, so first of all, people don’t end up being resilient as much as they should. They’re You know, their brains are a little bit less reliable. You know, they don’t critical think. They just do what they’re told. But we’re trying to prevent people from suffering. Well, unfortunately, the way the human body works, a little bit of suffering when you have a cold, the flu, measles, mumps, you know, whatever, that suffering helps you build a system that prevents further problems down the road. Frankly, I don’t know for sure, but there’s part of me that believes if you get all these vaccines and you prevent yourself from getting all of these different potential viruses… do you make yourself more susceptible to things like cancer and other variations of what goes on in your system? Because your immune system didn’t have to be that strong if it was being prevented from dealing with suffering and recovery from any virus.
SPEAKER 13 :
Dr. Kelly, I think Steve is correct. We’ve talked about that a lot again over the past five years, and the reality is, yeah, I think he’s spot on. You’re basically making everybody’s life easier while at the same time making it much more difficult as they age. Am I wrong in that, or is Steve wrong in that?
SPEAKER 04 :
Yeah, I don’t think we’re making people’s lives easier. We’re giving them this false sense of security that because you’re vaccinated, you’ve somehow done something good for your health. It’s really quite the opposite. As I said, I believe that part of the reason that I do so well and I’m rarely ill with an infectious disease is because I’ve been exposed to so much of it. I see sick people all the time. You know, you have people inches from your face. You can’t put your stethoscope on somebody’s chest and without getting within three inches of their mouths, okay? That’s how it works. I am not one bit worried about what I’m going to contract. My immune system is very good. If I’m concerned about anything, it’s about having some ill effect from an unnecessary vaccination. So the idea is that we are way, way crazy. And then the bottom line is, if you look at the data, Between vaccinated and unvaccinated populations, and they are out there, the Amish community, for example, the Mennonite communities that are entirely unvaccinated, they have almost zero incidence of childhood disease. They have zero, zero incidence of autism, for example. almost no asthma very few skin disorders no food allergies so what do you want to attribute that to do you think it’s because they don’t drive in cars if you if that’s what you think then promote an idea promote the premise you know what would be the the you know the pathophysiology of that because i can tell you exactly why i believe it’s related to vaccines you may have an alternate idea that you think because they’re not exposed to television. Okay, how would that work? How would that decrease their risk of asthma? So I’m open to the debate, but the data don’t lie. The reality is unvaccinated populations are healthier than vaccinated populations by orders of magnitude. And we are obligated as scientists to come up with an explanation for that.
SPEAKER 13 :
Guys, as always, this hour goes by fast. I appreciate you two so, so much. I can’t say enough about what you’ve done for not only me, but our audience. And Dr. Kelly, I’ll start with you, let you go first. Thank you, as always. I appreciate it so much.
SPEAKER 04 :
Thank you. Now you know why I’m not church in general.
SPEAKER 13 :
Well, thank you, Dr. Kelly, and I wish you were going to be. Believe me, I say that with all due respect. Steve, as well, thank you. Thank you for setting this up some five-plus years ago. You’re the man.
SPEAKER 15 :
Yeah, and you know what? Kelly’s probably dropped off, but I would say to her right now, thank you for being willing to go through a very difficult process to be Surgeon General because it’s not easy. And guess what? Kelly’s got a great life. She doesn’t need this any more than either of us do.
SPEAKER 13 :
Amen. Steve, you’re spot on. Appreciate you so much, man. Have a great night. You too. All right, man. I mean that sincerely. What a great couple of individuals, by the way. We are very blessed to have them on a routine basis. Veteran Windows and Doors is next. Dave Bancroft, find out what he can do for you and your home with your Windows and Doors today. Go to klzradio.com.
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SPEAKER 13 :
All right. Welcome back. Just a few seconds left here of this first hour. And, yes, if you really feel inclined to try to make a difference when it comes to the Surgeon General end of things, by all means, do what Steve said. Contact, in this case, contact our two senators. Let them know exactly what your thoughts are. They will be integral in this. the quote-unquote approving of the current Surgeon General nominee. And if you are so inclined to do that, please contact them. And those of you that are out of state, you can do the same thing in your own state as well, because a lot of you listen to us all around the country, especially during this particular hour. All right, Hour 2 is next. Rush to Reason, Denver’s Afternoon Rush, KLZ 560.
SPEAKER 14 :
Average guys. Ordinary average guys.
